Obama joins the rest: Vaccine-autism link

[Ghost Rider]

Obviously this issue is smaller in America than it is over here in Britain considering that apologists such as Ghost Rider are willing to overlook it so readily.

So you have actually present other points correct?

Wait, no you didn't. You just screeched like a bitch over a single point and declared that this makes him on par with the other noted candidates with no proof other then your personal supposition.

Over here there have been huge scandals involving the issue in recent years. Right wing scare newspapers such as the Daily Mail absolutely love to pretend that there is a link to autism.

Gee, whiz...you mean it hasn't been happening here as well?

I was delighted when scientists came out and called the bullshit on it. I remember a BBC parorama show [which I assume Vlad has also watched considering his reaction] with some 'experts' a few years back talking about the possible link ... 'experts' funded by religious groups and right wing retards.

Anything new here? No wait, still nothing on any other points, just parroting older shit.

I could totally understand McCain having to preach to the fundies about this one, and Hillary because she is a moron and appeals to morons: but I thought Obama was above this shit?

Ah, and the meat of the moron's point. It's OKAY for the others to do it, but how dare Obama not. I mean how dare he lower himself on this particular!!

If it truly is a minor issue in the US, then fine, just pretend it doesn't exist and move on if it is potentially going to cost Obama the White House: but for those of us in enlightened parts of the world, such as the UK, it is a cockpunch for the future most powerful person on the planet to go down the fundie route and claim that there might be a link, ignoring what the scientists have found. This means that there are children out there who will still miss out on potentially life-changing prevention due to PSEUDO-SCIENTIFIC BULLSHIT.

Yes, because the US is filled with retards and the UK is the land of the enlightened.

And now in fact you are slippery sloping Obama to going the fundie route?

Jesus fuck dumbass, try to actually present proof.

I mean for fucks sake, it's 2008 and this myth is still doing the rounds ... gimme a break!

Wow, and people are still enamoured with ID.

So c'mon dumbfuck, you called me the apologist, but haven't presented anymore proof then a googlefuck dumbass could to demonstrate that Obama fails on one point this automatically places him in the same league as Hillary or McCain.

Better still you have demonstrated that you literally are like much of American public regardless of where you're from by painting the candidate with a giant broad stroke over a single issue.

So are you going to actually present a point, or spew more cum stained spittle?

[Connor MacLeod]

I don't normally care to post in N&P, but lets look at his response:

"We've seen just a skyrocketing autism rate. Some people are suspicious that it's connected to the vaccines. This person included. The science right now is inconclusive, but we have to research it."
(Note: The Washington Post reports that when Obama said "this person," he pointed to someone who had asked an autism question).

Can someone PLEASE point out to me where the fuck he actually said that he believed in the link between the two? He's basically saying (unlike Clinton and McCain) that there needs to be "more research" to prove it one way or another. That's not taking a position, that's avoiding taking a position.either way, which frankly is quite smart to do, because it allows him at a later point to refute it (If he doesn't THEN feel free to criticize him.)
The article itself, however, is choosing to interpret Obama's statement as "jumping on the bandwagon", which is not even remotely the same thing.

And before people start criticizing him for NOT taking a position, recall who he is saying this to (IE Americans, the same Americans who allowed GWB to remain in office for 8 years. and believed in the whole "War on TError" nonsense.). Obama has to do this because, as others have noted, America has some very stupid people in it (Anyplace with a "Bible Belt" or a "creationist Theme Park" or places where ID is considered a "Viable theory" would have to be, by definition, idiotic.) And Obama is a politician, which means that you have to be careful what you say or piss off the stupid people without good reason.

[Connor MacLeod]

This has hurt my view of Obama I have to say. This bullshit needs to end NOW. Paranoid parents != immunologists.

Right. And you think that the American public, considering all the OTHER bullshit Obama has had to put up with from the media, would respect or listen to him if he came out and actually SAID he thought it was crap? This is the same American public that has believed George W Bush for YEARS.

Frankly, if anything, that would hurt him more than anything else. Why else do you think Hilary and McCain took more definitive stances? It wins points with a stupid public. Doing anything more than this would simply give his detractors and opponents yet another thing to villify him with.

Hell, ,as it is, I'm willing to bet they might try to spin this out into "Obama doesn't care about protecting children from Autism!" and enough of the American Public would believe it.

[Rye]

The sad thing is, if Oprah did an episode on it where she had a couple of experts on that said it was bullshit, you'd probably see a massive change in both the public opinion and political opinion.

[Cairber]

The sad thing is, if Oprah did an episode on it where she had a couple of experts on that said it was bullshit, you'd probably see a massive change in both the public opinion and political opinion.

She DID do an episode on this wherein Jenny McCarthy talked about her belief of the autism/vaccine link. However, she didn't have an MDs talking I do not believe. It was just a couple moms with different opinions. This has also been on Larry King, Dr Phil, and tons of other popular talk/news shows. This story really is not as rare as people think it is anymore, as I posted about earlier.

USA Today ran a anti vaccine full page ad by Generation Rescue just last month...

[Zixinus]

What is to say about this is already have been said: Obama didn't agree with this because he personally believes it, but because it gets him a vote among many worried moms that otherwise would not vote or vote for a different person.

If I had the power, I would make it a rule that kids that were not vaccinated by the choice of the parents, to be unworthy going to public school. I don't care how the stupid soccer moms scream or that even if there is a link, such children are potentially hazardous to the public safety.

[TheKwas]

I don't normally care to post in N&P, but lets look at his response:

"We've seen just a skyrocketing autism rate. Some people are suspicious that it's connected to the vaccines. This person included. The science right now is inconclusive, but we have to research it."
(Note: The Washington Post reports that when Obama said "this person," he pointed to someone who had asked an autism question).

Can someone PLEASE point out to me where the fuck he actually said that he believed in the link between the two? He's basically saying (unlike Clinton and McCain) that there needs to be "more research" to prove it one way or another.

No one is claiming that he actually believes it fucktard. I make that point in the very first thread. The problem is that he's taking the link seriously to begin with, when the link has been disproven countless times by the scientific community. He's manufacturing doubt about the current science and there is no justification for doubt. The science is conclusive.

It's like him saying "Some people think that we evolved from apes, while others believe we were intellegently designed by a higher being. The science right now is inconclusive, but we have to research it".

No doubt it's good politcal pandering, but we don't tend to praise political pandering.

[starfury]

No doubt it's good political pandering, but we don't tend to praise political pandering.

Unfortunate it is necessary as People stated before, otherwise the hordes of People who really do believe in Creationism will simply elect another Republican who outright belives and panders to this. Dirty indeed but otherwise you get nothing at all.

I rather have unfortunate but neccesary Political pandering for a decent candidate then those who actually belive that garbage and is elected because they stated that they Believe it.

[TheKwas]

I'm not really sure how necessary it really was (I have no real clue to what degree the soccer-mom crowd takes this issue seriously, but from what others have said I guess it's pretty serious), but overall I agree. Obama is still the best canidate by a pretty significant margin, but it serves as a pretty good reminder that he's still an american politican. Furthermore, it's extra unfortunate since his entire campaign is based on the notion that he's 'different' from the rest of the washington crowd.

Although this thread may seem as a stab at Obama (which it is in part, since I tend to have a higher expectation of Obama), it really serves more as another "The state of the american politics blows" thread.