Armageddon???? (Part Fifty Up)

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2008-05-01 05:38pm

NomAnor15 wrote:Just out of curiosity, did you do that on purpose? Or is that actually a Russian name?

Yes, it is a Russian name.

Phillip Hone · Post by **Phillip Hone** » 2008-05-01 05:47pm

It's too bad that there isn't any easy way to find a certain group of people in Hell. Having millions upon millions of undead Red Army veterans from World War II, for example, would certainly be useful, even if it would almost be impossible to supply them properly.

Stuart · Post by **Stuart** » 2008-05-01 06:07pm

NomAnor15 wrote:Just out of curiosity, did you do that on purpose? Or is that actually a Russian name?

Google is your friend. Look him up, he was quite an interesting character.

Rahvin · Post by **Rahvin** » 2008-05-01 06:42pm

Sidewinder wrote:...the realization that his legions never had a chance.

I'm fairly certain he realized that when he saw our weapons in action first-hand.

Singular Quartet · Post by **Singular Quartet** » 2008-05-01 07:03pm

MKSheppard wrote:
Sidewinder wrote:Actually, my idea of Abigor's reaction to watching the History Channel is this.
Nope, my idea is him watching it and going "What is this crap on UFOs, ghost hunting, Al capones secret vault?"

I imagine this went away pretty damn quickly, as the History channel understands the concept of who their demographic is. Hell, when this mess first started, they probably re-aired all of their specials from when The Da Vinci Code aired, and made new stuff as they went along.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2008-05-01 07:27pm

Singular Quartet wrote:I imagine this went away pretty damn quickly, as the History channel understands the concept of who their demographic is. Hell, when this mess first started, they probably re-aired all of their specials from when The Da Vinci Code aired, and made new stuff as they went along.

They still have to fill in dead space, you realize? And it does take time to do a documentary to their standards.

Darth Smiley · Post by **Darth Smiley** » 2008-05-01 08:05pm

MKSheppard wrote:
Singular Quartet wrote:I imagine this went away pretty damn quickly, as the History channel understands the concept of who their demographic is. Hell, when this mess first started, they probably re-aired all of their specials from when The Da Vinci Code aired, and made new stuff as they went along.
They still have to fill in dead space, you realize? And it does take time to do a documentary to their standards.

They have standards?

Typhonis 1 · Post by **Typhonis 1** » 2008-05-01 08:06pm

Heh the next season of Survivor Hell.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2008-05-01 08:09pm

Darth Smiley wrote:They have standards?

Yup; it has to at least be done to the usual production standards; meaning it don't look like ass on TV.

Col. Crackpot · Post by **Col. Crackpot** » 2008-05-01 08:23pm

MKSheppard wrote:
Darth Smiley wrote:They have standards?
Yup; it has to at least be done to the usual production standards; meaning it don't look like ass on TV.

Come now Shep, you can't tell me you wouldn't want to hear The Gunny wax poetic on the latest anti Baldrick firepower.

"R. Lee Ermey, live from hell with the USO! This is a special LIVE edition of Mail Call!"

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2008-05-01 08:38pm

Col. Crackpot wrote:"R. Lee Ermey, live from hell with the USO! This is a special LIVE edition of Mail Call!"

That only fills about an hour or three's worth of timeslots out of the 168 in a week.

Wyrm · Post by **Wyrm** » 2008-05-01 10:16pm

The delicious chapter! I must read it!

Stuart wrote:“Satan didn’t kill him, we did. Or rather, the people we have fighting in the hell-pit did. Apparently he led some of his army against our guerillas, walked into a trap and they got him. Asmodeus is dead all right. Thoroughly blown up”

Abigor was awed. “You have done the unthinkable. Even in the Celestial War, no Grand Duke was ever killed. Not even Yahweh achieved such a thing.”

Patraeus grinned like the predator. "Yeah. We rock! We rock that hard!"

Post by **LadyTevar** » 2008-05-01 11:52pm

Mongoose wrote:It's too bad that there isn't any easy way to find a certain group of people in Hell. Having millions upon millions of undead Red Army veterans from World War II, for example, would certainly be useful, even if it would almost be impossible to supply them properly.

Wasn't that the problem they had to begin with?

Hawkwings · Post by **Hawkwings** » 2008-05-02 01:20am

Well, I doubt the Red Army cannon fodder would be very useful, but the ones that participated in the great sieges, well, that's a different story.

KlavoHunter · Post by **KlavoHunter** » 2008-05-02 03:33am

Hawkwings wrote:Well, I doubt the Red Army cannon fodder would be very useful, but the ones that participated in the great sieges, well, that's a different story.

What foolishness is this?

Any set of human hands that can operate a rifle is a set worth getting your hands on in the Hell Liberation Front (Or whatever name it is now

).

What could possibly make you think that the "cannon fodder" of the Red Army would be tremendously less valuable in anti-Baldrick resistance in Hell, as opposed to Red Army soldiers who fought in Kiev, Stalingrad, Odessa, Leningrad, and the other cities that were put under siege?

Now, I could understand if you said that there would be a difference between a conscript who had a rifle thrown in his hands and told to kill Germans, who never even got to fire his weapon in anger before a machinegun hacked him down; and someone who survived months of city fighting before being killed.

JBG · Post by **JBG** » 2008-05-02 04:11am

"“Its not Asmodeus. He’s dead.”

“What?” Abigor was stunned. “Asmodeus dead? For all his mania, Satan has never dared kill a Grand Duke before. He wouldn’t even kill me, he preferred to send me where you could do this.”

“Satan didn’t kill him, we did. Or rather, the people we have fighting in the hell-pit did. Apparently he led some of his army against our guerillas, walked into a trap and they got him. Asmodeus is dead all right. Thoroughly blown up” "

If he has been watching the History Channel, or even NatGeo or Discovery, all of which air military docos down under, he's missed, for instance, a doco on the sinking of Yamato. If he could comprehend the size etc of Yamato and the fact that the weapons systems, though the forerunners of much today, used to sink Yamato are relatively simple by today's standards, then he should have not been quite so surprised by Asmodeous' death, unless he is wondering how the "hell" humans were anywhere near Asmodeous.

It doesn't look like an OOB is being considered, just delicious hints - First Shock Army, heavy in armour, artillery and AA! That'll look good if this is made into a movie. Few nations can potentially field corps or army level armoured forces so there would be a lot of mixed corps. That could be potentially interesting albeit probably trivial to the main storyline. eg the exploits of the happy chaps in "I" Corps - Iranian, Isreali, Italian and Indian forces!! Parts and comms would be a nightmare!

Jonathan

Stuart Mackey · Post by **Stuart Mackey** » 2008-05-02 07:43am

JBG wrote:snip

It doesn't look like an OOB is being considered, just delicious hints - First Shock Army, heavy in armour, artillery and AA! That'll look good if this is made into a movie. Few nations can potentially field corps or army level armoured forces so there would be a lot of mixed corps. That could be potentially interesting albeit probably trivial to the main storyline. eg the exploits of the happy chaps in "I" Corps - Iranian, Isreali, Italian and Indian forces!! Parts and comms would be a nightmare!

Jonathan

Only OOB that matters is ANZAC (theives on wheels).

Stuart · Post by **Stuart** » 2008-05-02 07:54am

JBG wrote:If he has been watching the History Channel, or even NatGeo or Discovery, all of which air military docos down under, he's missed, for instance, a doco on the sinking of Yamato. If he could comprehend the size etc of Yamato and the fact that the weapons systems, though the forerunners of much today, used to sink Yamato are relatively simple by today's standards, then he should have not been quite so surprised by Asmodeous' death, unless he is wondering how the "hell" humans were anywhere near Asmodeous.

This is something we run into over and over again. It's one thing to tell people what a weapon is like and give all its performance statistics, it's quite another when people actually see what a weapon can do. For example, people these days dismiss an aircraft dropping a 250 pound bomb as being too small to be worthy of consideration yet when they actually see a 250 pound bomb exploding they change their mind very fast. Likewise with tanks, its one thing to say a bolt can pierce x mms or armor, its another to hear the shriek as the bolt hits armor and watch the tank exploding

Asmodeus has another problem though. Despite being on the receiving end of it, he hasn't quite grasped how humans think of war yet. In Hell, war is almost a game, a chess match played with living pieces where the objective is to establish a winning position. Its the ultimate in limited conflicts for limited objectives. Once one side is at a real disadvantage they concede the game. A "war" in hell is mostly manoeuver and it could easily end without anybody getting seriously hurt. The idea that the enemy "king" might be shattered with a sledgehammer rather than put into check doesn't really register. Until, suddenly, he sees its been done, a Grand Duke he's known for millenia has been wiped out with almost casual ease. It's shocking on a level he can't easily explain

(A tale from the crypt for you. I was at the Dubai Arms Exhibition in '94 when the Russians were trying to sell their tanks. One of the nice things about Dubai is that there is a range day when the exhibitors take their tanks and so on to a firing range and have at some targets. In this case, the targets were old armored vehicles, some T-34s, some Centurions, some M-47s. The Russians did a demonstration firing their 125mm and it was quite impressive, the audience could hear the sound of the bolt hitting armor, watch the target lurch with the impact. Then the Brits opened up on their targets with a Challenger. Much the same thing except the hits were much more impressive, the targets didn't just lurch, they exploded into flames and burned fiercely with a pyre of black smoke reaching skywards. Reason was, the previous night the sales team had gone out and filled their targets with plastic bottles containing a mixture of diesel fuel and gasoline. That's salesmanship.)

It doesn't look like an OOB is being considered, just delicious hints - First Shock Army, heavy in armour, artillery and AA! That'll look good if this is made into a movie. Few nations can potentially field corps or army level armoured forces so there would be a lot of mixed corps. That could be potentially interesting albeit probably trivial to the main storyline. eg the exploits of the happy chaps in "I" Corps - Iranian, Isreali, Italian and Indian forces!! Parts and comms would be a nightmare!

I'll fill in the OOB as we go along. At the moment, the force in Hell is the Russian Shock Army with an Israeli and a European armored division in support. There's more stuff flowing in all the time. The US Corps is outside at the moment regrouping after the first big battle. You're right about the logistics; that would be a big factor in deciding who gets corped up with who. The Europeans can probably corps up quite well since there's a lot of equipment commonality due to NATO etc

Jonathan[/quote]

Ace Pace · Post by **Ace Pace** » 2008-05-02 08:01am

Asmodeus has another problem though. Despite being on the receiving end of it, he hasn't quite grasped how humans think of war yet. In Hell, war is almost a game, a chess match played with living pieces where the objective is to establish a winning position. Its the ultimate in limited conflicts for limited objectives. Once one side is at a real disadvantage they concede the game. A "war" in hell is mostly manoeuver and it could easily end without anybody getting seriously hurt. The idea that the enemy "king" might be shattered with a sledgehammer rather than put into check doesn't really register. Until, suddenly, he sees its been done, a Grand Duke he's known for millenia has been wiped out with almost casual ease. It's shocking on a level he can't easily explain

You mean Abigor

An interesting thing would be Armageddon in an annoted format, with explanations(lifted from the thread) coming alongside plot points.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2008-05-02 08:02am

ray245 wrote: True, but I'm talking about the amount of chinese in singapore following abrahamic religion. They still a minority despite the fact that the chrisitians are the most active religious group singapore.

And you're seriously derailing the discussion. The discussion was why EASTERN peoples are less receptive to Yahweh message in universe, The answer is simple. They AREN"T. Korea and Phillipines are a perfectly good example of how Christian/Catholic preaching has penetrated the population.
Similarly, the various religion China had showed that it is not immune to the religious meme. It just took on different forms due to the fact that unlike the West, paganism in the old format wasn't exterminated. In universe, we could just say that Yahweh won some(Korea, Malaysia, Phillipines, Indonesia) and lost out in Burma and China against Satan.

And given how some singaporeans are starting to view the west as a perfect area on earth...they are following christianity mostly because the west gives them a feeling that it is more liberal in every areas, and because the west is more developed than asia in the modern era.

You simplified and taken a social issue out of context. Christianity is not popular because its "liberal". You may argue that its message of "love" has won converts over from existing religion, but its popularity is much more complicated than just West Worship.

I was also thinking how many people in this fanfic are HAPPY there is a afterlife? Nevermind if it is only limted to hell for now ( the 'liberation of hell' is starting anyway, and in this verse, we can literally make hell a better place ).

Somehow, I doubt that has penetrated yet.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2008-05-02 08:16am

Darth Wong wrote: Are you trying to miss the point? No one is saying that Chinese people are completely immune to religion. However, they is some published research showing that certain ethnicities are less susceptible to religious "out of body experiences".

China has just as rich a religious history and religious indoctrination as the West. Therefore, the original statement, that China or Eastern peoples lack a religious mythology of demons and God is already FALSE.

Since my reply was entirely along those lines, why on earth do I have to address the issue of religious hallucinations? Whether Chinese peoples are less vulnerable to episodes of religious hallucinations have absolutely nothing to do with the fact that yes, they do have a mythology of ghosts, demons and gods. Its just that they developed differently than from the West due to the fact that paganism wasn't exterminated and their religious mythology developed differently. We already knew that religion had an effect on Chinese mythology. The advent of Taoism integrated animinism and shamanism into its clique. Buddhism altered Chinese mythology of hell.

Its not as if mass religious hysteria and legends haven't built up along those lines. The legend of Beijing states that the city was founded along the lines of Nezha, who appeared in spirit form to the two Chinese officials assigned to its construction.

JN1 · Post by **JN1** » 2008-05-02 08:16am

Stu, has the balance of 1st (UK) Armoured Division set off for Iraq yet? I had intended writing a scene depicting it and the German 7th Panzer being loaded aboard ships at Bremerhaven, but I think that the story may have progressed past that point.
The Allied Rapid Reaction Corps could provide an H.Q for European units.

Good work again.

Edward Yee · Post by **Edward Yee** » 2008-05-02 09:20am

I recall Asmodeus being killed though by over 1000 pounds of Semtex followed by multiple Raufoss or SLAP .50 BMG rounds to the head, though, nothing to do with those used against the Yamato.

gtg947h · Post by **gtg947h** » 2008-05-02 10:30am

Edward Yee wrote:I recall Asmodeus being killed though by over 1000 pounds of Semtex followed by multiple Raufoss or SLAP .50 BMG rounds to the head, though, nothing to do with those used against the Yamato.

I think it's more the idea of "look at this gigantic steel boat. We destroyed it two generations or so ago with what is now considered somewhat dated technology. And we have much better stuff these days."

Basically, what we killed Asmodeus with is a firecracker compared to what we could do, even back then. (ok, I exaggerate a bit, but still...)

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2008-05-02 04:41pm

Stuart wrote:You're right about the logistics; that would be a big factor in deciding who gets corped up with who. The Europeans can probably corps up quite well since there's a lot of equipment commonality due to NATO etc

So will it prove feasible to actually lay railroad tracks and pipelines through the hellmouth? Or too much reality warping for that to work? I’d figure with a pipeline at worst you could always just pour the fuel through, and then have something catching it on the other side. Messy, but JP-8 shouldn’t too dangerous, and it would be way more efficient then using nothing but trucks.