SD.net's World OOC/Discussion thread MK III

[Mr Bean]

See this is what I'd don't understand. I'm unaligned, non-lined, not bowing to any master but myself. Yet you'd rather spend billions instead of mear millions because FUN kinda sorta does not trust me. Shroom-Sat and the BBC have enough Satellites up to provide TV to the entire world(Even the giant sections of open ocean) The UKB-GPS system is a free to use system now since being payed off, the HISCO system provides cheap high-speed internet to the entire world, especially the giant open ocean bits. With HISCO there is no place on the planet you can't phone home to Qudlivun to.
To boot I also have weather satellites that cover the entire populated planet and then some providing free to the world weather reporting, as well as being part of the SOS beacon system so togther with the GPS satellites the position of any ship in distress can be reported with seconds to it's home country including it's exact position within inches.


Not to put to blunt a point on it, but the IRT is already trying to duplicate parts of my network and fill in niches I've not yet gotten too. As is Tian Xia and the Lonestar Republic.

So why... after three years of a space race is FUN trying to get in on the "fun" now? You face billions of dollars of investment and unless you intend to blockade my and Phongn's country and prevent us from doing any business then our existing networks will have such a massive install base as to make any theoretical install base impossible for local FUN iniatives.

In short, by mid-point 2011 there will be absolutely no viable profitable civilian applications for space technology.

There will of course remain military applications and the occasional scientific application but spending ten billion dollars to launch half a billion dollars worth of satellites(FYI, that half a billion figure is the raw cost of all scientific satellites constructed in the past ten years in every country on the planet.)

[phongn]

The IRT's space program has a large lower-altitude communications satellite constellation which requires a whole lot less power to work than HISCO. While it has less system bandwidth available there are other advantages to it, and we routinely subsidize time and bandwidth for scientific sensors (like those that track megafauna). Same goes for EPIRBs. The HISCO constellation also requires a lot more tracking since there are significantly fewer satellites in orbit and they aren't GEO.

That said, FUN wants in on manned space as well, and IIRC, the UKB's program is mostly unmanned spaceflight.

[RogueIce]

The MESS GPS system was going up about the same time as yours, and it was free well before you stopped charging people for it. So I don't know why you'd assume your system got to be dominant since more people would likely have started using our free system by the time you opened yours up.

Anyway, why shouldn't the FUN be looking into their own communications and the like? Hell a couple game-years ago when Shep started detonating nukes and people got worried, people downplayed it as "oh the OMSK will keep him from getting trigger happy" remember? Well now look what's happened.

Just because the UKB's independent now, who's to say that'll last two, three, or more years from now? Especially since you're Mister "Plans for everything" youself, why wouldn't they plan for a time if you decide to shut everyone else out for some unknown reason?

[Vohu Manah]

See this is what I'd don't understand. I'm unaligned, non-lined, not bowing to any master but myself. Yet you'd rather spend billions instead of mear millions because FUN kinda sorta does not trust me. Shroom-Sat and the BBC have enough Satellites up to provide TV to the entire world(Even the giant sections of open ocean) The UKB-GPS system is a free to use system now since being payed off, the HISCO system provides cheap high-speed internet to the entire world, especially the giant open ocean bits. With HISCO there is no place on the planet you can't phone home to Qudlivun to.
To boot I also have weather satellites that cover the entire populated planet and then some providing free to the world weather reporting, as well as being part of the SOS beacon system so togther with the GPS satellites the position of any ship in distress can be reported with seconds to it's home country including it's exact position within inches.


Not to put to blunt a point on it, but the IRT is already trying to duplicate parts of my network and fill in niches I've not yet gotten too. As is Tian Xia and the Lonestar Republic.

So why... after three years of a space race is FUN trying to get in on the "fun" now? You face billions of dollars of investment and unless you intend to blockade my and Phongn's country and prevent us from doing any business then our existing networks will have such a massive install base as to make any theoretical install base impossible for local FUN iniatives.

In short, by mid-point 2011 there will be absolutely no viable profitable civilian applications for space technology.

There will of course remain military applications and the occasional scientific application but spending ten billion dollars to launch half a billion dollars worth of satellites(FYI, that half a billion figure is the raw cost of all scientific satellites constructed in the past ten years in every country on the planet.)

You seem a tad sensitive about the issue. Why not propose a treaty between your nation and FUN that provides funding support for expanded programs while providing FUN members guaranteed access to your orbital assets?

[RogueIce]

Besides, given the fact we can't seem to go three days without somebody doing something to cause a major international crisis (apparently our world leaders get bored easily or something) having your own independent setup probably isn't a bad thing if you can afford it.

[Mr Bean]

That said, FUN wants in on manned space as well, and IIRC, the UKB's program is mostly unmanned spaceflight.

You miss post I made about a space station and the five planned manned flights to test the various station parts?

You seem a tad sensitive about the issue. Why not propose a treaty between your nation and FUN that provides funding support for expanded programs while providing FUN members guaranteed access to your orbital assets?

See it's lack of awareness again, you already have that through Shroomia. The FUN can invest in Shroom Aerospace which in turn passes it through tax-free to the UKB and various services, personnel and what-not can be sent the other way.

Also I can't deny you the right to Altantis, as long as it's not a Spy satellites(Satellite with greater than 55 Meter resoultion) a high quality radar imaging satellites or a WMD carrying satellite anyone is free to launch Atlantis anything they want.

However if you break it(The Launch pads), your sure as heck paying to fix it

The MESS GPS system was going up about the same time as yours, and it was free well before you stopped charging people for it. So I don't know why you'd assume your system got to be dominant since more people would likely have started using our free system by the time you opened yours up.

The Mess GPS system was completed a few months after my own, and thanks to the domination of OMSK at that time and the partnerships with the FUGAL the only two parties not talking part in that were the Mess and the LUN.

Especially since you're Mister "Plans for everything" youself, why wouldn't they plan for a time if you decide to shut everyone else out for some unknown reason?

Because.... Because... ooh look a puppy awww look at the cute puppy

Yes... look at the cute puppy, see how cute he is and forget your silly questions, aww it's a puppy.



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[Beowulf]

Not to mention that the MESS Lowell GPS constellation also included the equipment to pick up EPIRB transmissions. Lowell was free to use from the very start, unlike the OMSK system, which has almost certainly increased the uptake of the Lowell system.

HSICO is cheap, high-speed, oversubscribed internet to the entire world. Reason why DoCoMo is doing a 4G network now, and will probably attempt to expand to other MESS nations with that network.

The MESS Space Agency is willing to partner with FUN to kick start their space program. This will allow FUN to begin doing launchers sooner than would be otherwise available. Such support includes use of the MSA TDRS system, for telemetry relay, training of personnel, and similar support.

[The Yosemite Bear]

The Republics situation with the sieage. if someone can write this for me because my computer is down for a bit. The bad guy is named MAx Roarke, he's a expiditer of criminal and smuggling operations he's currently bribed the mercs that everyone else hired to try and capture the medical staff of hadrian so thaat he can have people that can make a cleaner workhorse drug for him.

[Lonestar]

Yeah, guess what I forgot was going on today when I went out?

[K. A. Pital]

My position is that the FUN should not rely on either Tonkin or UKB for space research, but instead, develop a network of near-equator launchpads and use so far smaller vehicles, like my own "Soyuz" family with a future aim at better rockets (RD-170 fitted boosters for once), but so far so good. Or Zor's Delta rockets.

If fellow FUNites decide otherwise, so be it.

However, I personally won't sponsor Tonkin even with a single dollar, given the political stunts they pulled earlier, which I remember well - like oscillating to join the Shep-Saddam "brotherhood" and openly admitting they don't give a shit about international anything.

[phongn]

However, I personally won't sponsor Tonkin even with a single dollar, given the political stunts they pulled earlier, which I remember well - like oscillating to join the Shep-Saddam "brotherhood" and openly admitting they don't give a shit about international anything.

We do care about international trade and in that, IMHO, we have been a reliable partner. As for joining the UAR? Er, I never said we seriously considered it, only that the offer was made and rejected.

[The Yosemite Bear]

WEll if you want to launch something really heavy. Hughes/kaiser did build "Lilith" if we lanuch it at new years it should arive at it's site on 2026

[MKSheppard]

And the convoy is underway!

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Shep, are you really looking out for trouble with such a huge escort?

[K. A. Pital]

Ramsley's territory will soon plunge into civil war methinks. Basing on previous real life Orthodox fractures, he'd be hard pressed to maintain control over the populace, much less lead it into a war.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Ramsley's territory will soon plunge into civil war methinks. Basing on previous real life Orthodox fractures, he'd be hard pressed to maintain control over the populace, much less lead it into a war.

Pretty much in line with what I expected. Though I have yet to even excommunicate the bugger!

But hey, the guy got pretty strong denouncements by no less than the 2 big heads of the Orthodox Church. Traitor scum.

[Crossroads Inc.]

Man, inm reminded of why I only play htis game off and on... you guys really are amazing.. its just too much for me to keep up wiht all the time.

Nice to keep Crossroadia mostly by itself...neutral with others, and helpful when somoen needs..

Bah, Ive tried my best to be active. Started the Internation Zepplin Transport Association, Building millions of Electric cars, supporting various Science operations when they come up...

Wanty to make some good mark on things :3

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Man, inm reminded of why I only play htis game off and on... you guys really are amazing.. its just too much for me to keep up wiht all the time.

Nice to keep Crossroadia mostly by itself...neutral with others, and helpful when somoen needs..

Bah, Ive tried my best to be active. Started the Internation Zepplin Transport Association, Building millions of Electric cars, supporting various Science operations when they come up...

Wanty to make some good mark on things :3

Actually, I'm currently working with Bear on his Supercollider and Saffron. We are open to more joining in.

[K. A. Pital]

Check PMs.

Such a move would also allow our Chuches to interact better and some sort of joint action regarding the Diocese could be worked out... mass relief operation? Sending there armed forces?

Not to mention that the Jenova Witnesses and other dangerous cults would be supressed.

Though that would require Shady to ease on the Orthodox culture in his nation a little, and not force absolutely all of them to worship him as God-Emperor

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Check PMs.

Such a move would also allow our Chuches to interact better and some sort of joint action regarding the Diocese could be worked out... mass relief operation? Sending there armed forces?

Not to mention that the Jenova Witnesses and other dangerous cults would be supressed.

Though that would require Shady to ease on the Orthodox culture in his nation a little, and not force absolutely all of them to worship him as God-Emperor

I have been considering the possibility of aid through the Church.

Well genuine aid. We might need to supply weapons to arm the pro-Church factions against the heretics. Especially when Shepnukistan has arms in the area.

[PeZook]

On the issue of a FUN space program:

We can lob several comms satellites into orbit for use by the joint FUN military using Atlantis space centers right away ; It will cost us small change to do, and the payoff will be pretty huge.

These sats will be used for communications and co-ordination of JASD (Joint Air and Sea Defence) military units.

Other than that, we need the capability to loft the SPIRALs to orbit at the very least, or the FUN Space Force is neutered. Scientific probes we can launch from Atlantis. We can later discuss the construction of another GPS system, but it's getting really, really crowded on geo right now.

So, what I propose is kind of a hybrid space program, with limited capability of our own (say, two launch centers as close to the equator as possible) and most launches being done from Atlantis. The goals? Scientific space exploration, manned spaceflight development, communications. Eventually, the moons! Bonus points if we can get an international moon program.

On defence strategy: We should focus on developing the JASD concept. Blackbeard saturation already makes the Central Sea quite secure IMHO, now we need to spam SAMs of various profiles (long-range, short-range, medium-range), construct an ABM shield and develop our air forces. All that while integrating every individual country's defence network into a singular body, so that we can manage the entire FUN battlespace effectively. We'll need data sharing infrastructure, large and small radars all over the pleace, AWACS aircraft, stratellites, satellites, fiberoptic landlines, processing centers...there's a lot of work to do.

Next is energy policy. I suggest we look into expanding our nuclear infrastructure, and if we are to switch to electric cars and the like, we'll need resources and industry for battery manufacturing, maintenance and safe disposal.

Now, an average US household uses about 8900 KwH each year.
In Poland, it was 1624 KwH (hell of a difference, huh?)
Assuming this is true throughoiut the FUN (it's not: some countries will use less), we can get the following electricity needs:

A duchy:

First world:
250 thousand people (around 62 thousand households) - 551 KwH a year plus industry
Second world:
500 thousand people (125 thousand households) - 203 KwH a year plus industry

A principality

First world:
2.5 million people (around 625 thousand households) - 5562 KwH a year plus industry
Second world:
5 million people (1.25 million households) - 2030 KwH a year plus industry

A Kingdom

First world:
15 million people (around 3.75 million households) - 33 375 KwH a year plus industry
Second world:
30 million people (7.5 million households) - 12 180 KwH a year plus industry

A Tsardom

First world:
30 million people (around 7.5 million households) - 66 750 KwH a year plus industry

An Imperium (Bear)

First world:
60 million people (around 15 million households) - 133 500 KwH a year plus industry

As you can see, all we need to make electricity too cheap to matter throughout the FUN are one or two 2GW nuke plants. Build six and we'll have enough for all the radars, cars, industries and whatnot.

On Nukes: FUN policy up to this point was no, we don't need them. I wonder what other countries think of that, though. We've grown large, and have a lot more to lose...

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

I have an FBR reactor which I am willing to share the technology. Last I check, Stas invested a little in the reactor and I will hand the plans over.

[K. A. Pital]

On nukes: some nuclear deterrent probably won't hurt, though in reality we don't have much to start with (my T-4, Tu-95s, Tu-33Ms and Tu-160s have some nuclear armament, which can be installed to ensure a limited deterrent capacity but that's all).

Maybe it's reasonable to keep it that way.

[The Grim Squeaker]

I'm returning temporarily to the game in order to cease the annexation of my annexed state by Shep and to apply for MESS protection. (Or anyone else really, apart from Shep and Sadamistan ).

[Crossroads Inc.]

I'm returning temporarily to the game in order to cease the annexation of my annexed state by Shep and to apply for MESS protection. (Or anyone else really, apart from Shep and Sadamistan ).

oh THIS hsould be fun! *grabs popcorn*