Teacher to Austistic Boy -Ignorant, Pathetic, Self-absorbed

[Darth Lucifer]

Teacher Caught on Tape: Kindergartner 'Ignorant, Pathetic, Self-Absorbed'
Parents Sent 5-Year-Old to School With Tape Recorder
By JONANN BRADY
May 27, 2008

------------------------

Ignorant. Pathetic. Self-absorbed.

A recording catches a teacher berating a kindergartener. Those are some of the harsh names an Indiana kindergarten teacher called one of her students, and the boy's parents captured it all on tape.

Five-year-old Gabriel Ross complained over the school year that his teacher, Kristen Woodward, was being mean to him, said his mother Tabitha McMahan and stepfather J.R. Edwards. Gabriel told them other kids didn't like him because he was "bad and stupid."

When he began acting out at home, they decided to take action and try to find out what was going on in the classroom. So in mid-April, McMahan and Edwards sent Gabriel to school with a tape recorder in the pocket of his cargo pants.

What they heard over four hours of tape shocked them. Woodward can be heard telling Gabriel that he had "tortured and tormented" her and other teachers all year.

"I've been more than nice to you all year long and you've been ignorant, selfish, self-absorbed, the whole thing! I'm done!" Woodward says to Gabriel on the tape.

She continues: "Something needs to be done because you are pathetic! If me saying these words to you hurt, I hope it does because you're hurting everyone else around you."

Gabriel can be heard crying on the tape.

"You think it's bad when you see it on paper, but when you are hearing the way she says it to him. I can't even talk about it," McMahan told ABC affiliate WHAS, breaking into tears.

Edwards said that the worst part of the tape was when Woodward singled Gabriel out in front of the whole class. "So you guys think, is that somebody you want to be with?" Woodward asks the class.

In unison, the other students reply, "Noooo."

"See, your friend doesn't want to be with you. I don't know what else to tell you. So you're not going to have friends because of your actions."

Teacher Suspended

After 13 years of teaching, Woodward has been suspended indefinitely, according to the Indiana State Teachers Association.

The teachers' association is defending Woodward, saying that she "lost her cool" that day and hasn't had a chance to tell her side of the story.

Carol Mooney, a spokeswoman with the Indiana State Teachers Association, told the New Albany News and Tribune newspaper that Woodward is well liked by co-workers, parents and students and that she had trouble with Gabriel all year.

"What do you say to a kid who's rolling around, punching, biting, kicking? What can a teacher do?" Mooney said to the newspaper.

Woodward did not respond to phone messages from ABC News.

The New Albany-Floyd County Consolidated School Corp. issued a statement saying, "Privacy issues and policy prohibit school officials from discussing ongoing investigations of employee misconduct."

Parents Worry About Long-Term Effect

Gabriel's stepfather, J.R. Edwards, told ABCNEWS.com that all the children in the class are given weekly progress reports and have frequent meetings with the teacher. He said Gabriel's reports had both "smiley faces" for good behavior and "frown faces," which indicates the student needs help in a certain area.

Gabriel's reports said he was sometimes "disruptive" and didn't keep his hands to himself.

Two weeks into the school year, Edwards said Woodward talked about setting up a "behavioral plan" for Gabriel, but when he approached Woodward to discuss the plan, she allegedly said, "I don't have time for this."

Edwards also said that Gabriel's behavior at home didn't make them think he was acting up at school.

"He's not perfect, but he's not out of control," Edwards said.

After hearing the tape, Edwards and McMahan pulled Gabriel out of school and are trying to figure out which school to send him to next year.

They are also exploring the possibility of pursuing a civil or criminal action against Woodward and the school district.

But Edwards said they are most concerned about the psychological impact the entire situation has had on Gabriel.

"I hope this doesn't affect him long-term, in his feelings about school or teachers," Edwards said. "We're going to seek some kind of help for him."

(emphasis mine)

Source

Considering the line of work I'm in (Special Ed Asst.), I find this article especially revolting.

[Darth Lucifer]

Ghetto Edit: Someone told me this was on Bill O'reilly tonight and they're playing the tape. I missed the 8pm show, but I think they replay the Factor at 11pm (EST). That's less than an hour from now.

[That NOS Guy]

I might be going crazy, but where does it say the boy is autistic?

[Big Phil]

What the teacher is described as doing is horrible, but this article is also completely one-sided. Assuming there's some truth to the comment that Garbriel "didn't keep his hands to himself" and was "rolling around, punching, biting, kicking," why was nothing done by either the parents or the school, especially if the kid was that out of control?

I hate to argue Golden Mean here, but either this teacher is just a bitch, who picked on this kid because she perceived him as a good target, or he's got some behavioral problems and parents who are turning a blind eye to the situation.

[18-Till-I-Die]

I dont think they can kick the kids out for doing crazy shit if it's part of their "disease" to do crazy shit. Or something like that.

I remember, back when i was in highschool, there was this kid names Alex. He had this bizarre habit of staring at you like a zombie and then if you said anything or even looked at him, he'd laugh like a madman and accuse you of being "gay" and trying to "rape" him. Well needless to say i made my opinion of the little brat clear, but i was told they couldnt do shit, for some similar reason to the above.

Later me and a few of my friends were just sitting around, talking you know. He suddenly "appears" behind my friend Willie and starts staring, with this wierd grin. So Willie finally told him to GTFO and he runs off laughing. So then a few minutes later, he runs back and wraps his arms and legs around Willie from behind, i think he was trying to take off his clothes or something. Well, me and my other friend, we beat the living fuck out of Alex and he finally let go, Willie was needless to say terrified and so was i so we all told are parents and demanded something be done to deal with the little shithead.

I dont know what happened but finally he disappeared and that was the end of it. But i know that the ONLY thing that got them to get rid of him was when we threatened to make a big stink about it, cause the kid was clearly dangerous and crazy, and thats me being generous.

And for the record, in another situation i recall from my childhood, there was this kid in my kindergarten class named Jamal who would always, ALWAYS, try and bite me no matter what happened. He would track me down and try and bite me, i dont know why to this day. I still have a scar on my arm from one of those incidents. My mom took me out of that school, cause they wouldnt do anything, for some reason they thought he wasnt dangerous...


I'm sure both Jamal and Alex are either in prison now or somewhere with eighty faces in their freezer.

[Gandalf]

I dont think they can kick the kids out for doing crazy shit if it's part of their "disease" to do crazy shit. Or something like that.

Surely they'd be placed in some sort of special class with special ed teachers?

[18-Till-I-Die]

I dont think they can kick the kids out for doing crazy shit if it's part of their "disease" to do crazy shit. Or something like that.

Surely they'd be placed in some sort of special class with special ed teachers?

Everything i say is based PURELY on Detroit Public Schools so, if it's different elsewhere in the country, i wouldnt know...

However...

Here, as far as i know, weather you're in Special ED or not is purely subjective. In fact my mom--a teacher--told me about how she has kids in her class that are CLEARLY either insane or retards, and yet they're considered "mainstream". However in the SED class, there are at least three kids who are perfectly normal...they were put there because they pissed off a teacher who wrote them up as "mentally disturbed" or some nonsense.

Again maybe outside of Detroit things are different, but in my experience this is pretty much precisely what happens (e.g., the Alex and Jamal examples above).

[Darth Lucifer]

I might be going crazy, but where does it say the boy is autistic?

Shit. That's me with my head up my fucking dumb ass. It's been a long day and I wanted to say kindergartener. I actually work in special ed now and I still had work on the brain.

Still, whether the kid is autistic or not, I don't think he deserves to be hauled up in front of everybody like that and subjected to that kind of humiliation.

[Stormin]

Surely they'd be placed in some sort of special class with special ed teachers?

Hell no, that costs money. It's so much better to stick them in normal classes where they can drive the teachers to do stuff like this and get themselves fired. The classes can then be merged into some other teacher's saving lots of money.

[Darth Wong]

What the teacher is described as doing is horrible, but this article is also completely one-sided.

Nonsense. They gave her argument.

Assuming there's some truth to the comment that Garbriel "didn't keep his hands to himself" and was "rolling around, punching, biting, kicking," why was nothing done by either the parents or the school, especially if the kid was that out of control?

I don't know, but that doesn't excuse her behaviour.

I hate to argue Golden Mean here,

Somehow, I doubt the sincerity of this statement.

but either this teacher is just a bitch, who picked on this kid because she perceived him as a good target, or he's got some behavioral problems and parents who are turning a blind eye to the situation.

Why can't both be true, fucktard? Let's suppose the kid does have serious behavioural problems: how does that justify abusive behaviour? If the kid is acting out, you send him to the principal's office. If he keeps doing it, you keep sending him to the principal's office until the administration starts getting the hint that something needs to be done. You don't take it upon yourself to abuse him in order to exact your revenge upon him for making your job difficult, for fuck's sake. HE IS A KINDERGARTENDER, for fuck's sake.

[SylasGaunt]

Sounds like the kid was being a pain in the ass with little help from the parents, but the teacher most definitely crossed the line here.

[Sidewinder]

I dont think they can kick the kids out for doing crazy shit if it's part of their "disease" to do crazy shit. Or something like that.

Surely they'd be placed in some sort of special class with special ed teachers?

Everything i say is based PURELY on Detroit Public Schools so, if it's different elsewhere in the country, i wouldnt know...

However...

Here, as far as i know, weather you're in Special ED or not is purely subjective. In fact my mom--a teacher--told me about how she has kids in her class that are CLEARLY either insane or retards, and yet they're considered "mainstream". However in the SED class, there are at least three kids who are perfectly normal...they were put there because they pissed off a teacher who wrote them up as "mentally disturbed" or some nonsense.

Again maybe outside of Detroit things are different, but in my experience this is pretty much precisely what happens (e.g., the Alex and Jamal examples above).

I can say FROM PERSONAL EXPERIENCE that schools do the same fucking thing, i.e., NOTHING, in response to sadistic students. It's the school administrations' "Just ignore [the bullies]," attitude that allowed the Columbine and Virginia Tech Massacres to happen (see here).

If we're lucky, the kid will receive psychological counseling to help him overcome the trauma caused by the teacher's abuse. If we're not lucky, we'll read about the kid committing a school shooting next decade.

[Sidewinder]

Ghetto edit: I'm referring to schools in Southern California.

[Napoleon the Clown]

Utah has the same problem, though not quite as bad. The abuse I received receded largely from me being rather quiet, laid back, and thoughtful. With school shootings still fresh on the mind, a lot of bullies decided to not risk it, I'd guess. My senior year of high school was the easiest, with regards to bullies, as I was dealing with being an unmedicated bipolar a large portion of it and thus looking the part of the "soon-to-be-psycho" stereotype. That's my guess, anyway. I just know that senior year was when I was left alone the most.


Having had experience with abusive teachers, I'm decidedly irritated with this teacher. There's a difference between criticism and being cruel. Telling a kid that their behavior is unacceptable is one thing, calling them "ignorant", "pathetic", "self-absorbed", etc., especially if front of their whole class, is a completely different thing. I am of the opinion they should can the bitch, though that may be influenced by having had a teacher that was a cruel bitch to me when I was a wee lad.

[Superman]

snip

I can't believe you're making a serious statement. Oh wait... Yes I can.

The kid is what, five? Think about this for a second, dude. An adult saying these things to a five or six year old kid. Jesus Christ, do society a favor and never have kids.

Heard this tape on Adam Carolla's show this morning. Downright pathetic.

[Zixinus]

That's pretty horrible to hear (the news, not one of the above posts). The kid might have actually been mad and wild (I can understand not understanding unwritten social rules, hell I did some pretty stupid and embarrassing stuff that got me into trouble) but for a kindergarten to be such a bitch requires effort. My guess that (s)he didn't believe or know about autism. But that's not even near to an excuse to his/her behaviour. When a kid is acting beyond bad, you kick it upstairs and not take it upon yourself to correct him, especially not by abusing him.

I guess this is something of the "insanity doesn't exist, (s)he's just like that" concept that does somehow spread about a little. It's not something very clearly expressed, just something that people unconsciously exist. After all, its more comfortable to believe that people can just decide their actions and brain chemistry is not an issue. It's partially even religious: the idea that an immortal human soul controls your actions and not a wetware computer that may malfunction.

[Superman]

snip

He wasn't autistic, but at any rate, it's irrelevant. She called a 5 year old, among other things, "self absorbed." Isn't that sort of normal at this stage of development? Let me help out here... the answer is "yes."

[Darth Wong]

I guess this is something of the "insanity doesn't exist, (s)he's just like that" concept that does somehow spread about a little.

It's a common right-wing belief (which means that the majority of Americans believe it, since the entire country leans right). Probably best expressed in the South Park episode where they made fun of ADD, implied it didn't really exist at all, and then recommended that parents smack their kids around in order to cure it.

South Park is actually a very good barometer of how the typical American "centrist" thinks: in this idiotic redneck beer-swilling mindset, there is no child psychology problem which can't be solved by smacking kids around.

[Big Phil]

snip

I can't believe you're making a serious statement. Oh wait... Yes I can.

The kid is what, five? Think about this for a second, dude. An adult saying these things to a five or six year old kid. Jesus Christ, do society a favor and never have kids.

Heard this tape on Adam Carolla's show this morning. Downright pathetic.

I haven't the slightest clue what your point is - are you suggesting I'm justifying the teacher's behavior, because if you are, go back and read my post. The only thing I'm suggesting is it isn't quite as black/white (teacher is mean to innocent child) as the title and article suggest.

And please, enough with the Internet tough guy "don't ever have kids" garbage. I have a son, and if he was getting into trouble at school and/or the teacher was treating him like this, it wouldn't be going on for months before I did something about it

[Darth Wong]

I haven't the slightest clue what your point is - are you suggesting I'm justifying the teacher's behavior, because if you are, go back and read my post. The only thing I'm suggesting is it isn't quite as black/white (teacher is mean to innocent child) as the title and article suggest.

That is justifying the teacher's behaviour, fucktard.

And please, enough with the Internet tough guy "don't ever have kids" garbage. I have a son, and if he was getting into trouble at school and/or the teacher was treating him like this, it wouldn't be going on for months before I did something about it

What the fuck are you talking about? How does "don't have kids" mean that someone is a posturing Internet tough-guy? You claimed that it was "one-sided" to accuse the teacher of being abusive just because she was ... abusive. You're either an imbecile or a deceptive apologist who thinks that teacher abuse is at least partially justified if the kid deserves it in your opinion.

[Illuminatus Primus]

I guess this is something of the "insanity doesn't exist, (s)he's just like that" concept that does somehow spread about a little.

It's a common right-wing belief (which means that the majority of Americans believe it, since the entire country leans right). Probably best expressed in the South Park episode where they made fun of ADD, implied it didn't really exist at all, and then recommended that parents smack their kids around in order to cure it.

South Park is actually a very good barometer of how the typical American "centrist" thinks: in this idiotic redneck beer-swilling mindset, there is no child psychology problem which can't be solved by smacking kids around.

Mike, be tough. Be no nonsense. Worked for mah daddeh!

[RedImperator]

I dont think they can kick the kids out for doing crazy shit if it's part of their "disease" to do crazy shit. Or something like that.

Surely they'd be placed in some sort of special class with special ed teachers?

Everything i say is based PURELY on Detroit Public Schools so, if it's different elsewhere in the country, i wouldnt know...

However...

Here, as far as i know, weather you're in Special ED or not is purely subjective. In fact my mom--a teacher--told me about how she has kids in her class that are CLEARLY either insane or retards, and yet they're considered "mainstream". However in the SED class, there are at least three kids who are perfectly normal...they were put there because they pissed off a teacher who wrote them up as "mentally disturbed" or some nonsense.

Again maybe outside of Detroit things are different, but in my experience this is pretty much precisely what happens (e.g., the Alex and Jamal examples above).

Current practice is to "mainstream" special education students as soon as possible (possible being defined as the point a special education student can survive in a mainstream class with an individualized education plan, or IEP). The reasoning behind this is that when the process is done properly, mainstreamed special ed kids do much better once they've finished school than kids who spend their entire academic careers in special ed. It is something of a subjective process, because nobody has managed to devise hard-and-fast rules for deciding if a student needs special education and if so, how much, but a good policy will seek the input of all relevant individuals--psychological professionals, the student's teachers and family, and the student himself.

Doing it properly is the key. There are plenty of ways to fuck it up, and I've seen most of them: mainstreaming a kid too early, or not having a proper IEP, or not executing the IEP, or not putting a kid who needs special ed into special ed in the first place. As for putting kids there as retaliation for pissing a teacher off, that's supposed to be impossible--teachers aren't qualified to diagnose learning or behavioral disabilities in the first place, and even a lousy special ed policy should require input from a school psychologist before a student gets put into special ed--but in a school district that's run badly enough, it could happen.

[Zixinus]

It's a common right-wing belief (which means that the majority of Americans believe it, since the entire country leans right). Probably best expressed in the South Park episode where they made fun of ADD, implied it didn't really exist at all, and then recommended that parents smack their kids around in order to cure it.

South Park is actually a very good barometer of how the typical American "centrist" thinks: in this idiotic redneck beer-swilling mindset, there is no child psychology problem which can't be solved by smacking kids around.

And Americans (USAians, but let's admit it, it just doesn't sound right at the mental level) wonder why they have school shootings and so much violence.

[Superman]

I haven't the slightest clue what your point is - are you suggesting I'm justifying the teacher's behavior, because if you are, go back and read my post. The only thing I'm suggesting is it isn't quite as black/white (teacher is mean to innocent child) as the title and article suggest.

And please, enough with the Internet tough guy "don't ever have kids" garbage. I have a son, and if he was getting into trouble at school and/or the teacher was treating him like this, it wouldn't be going on for months before I did something about it

I don't need to repeat what D. Wong wrote because he covered all of the relevant points. When you say things like

or he's got some behavioral problems and parents who are turning a blind eye to the situation

it does sound a lot like you're justifying what this teacher did. She insulted him and tried to turn the class against him. On what fucking planet is it okay to say these things to a kindergartener?

I wasn't being an internet tough guy, and I'm sure you are a much better parent than those in this article. I was disturbed at what seemed like you justifying what this teacher said because there is no justification.

[Big Phil]

I haven't the slightest clue what your point is - are you suggesting I'm justifying the teacher's behavior, because if you are, go back and read my post. The only thing I'm suggesting is it isn't quite as black/white (teacher is mean to innocent child) as the title and article suggest.

And please, enough with the Internet tough guy "don't ever have kids" garbage. I have a son, and if he was getting into trouble at school and/or the teacher was treating him like this, it wouldn't be going on for months before I did something about it

I don't need to repeat what D. Wong wrote because he covered all of the relevant points. When you say things like

or he's got some behavioral problems and parents who are turning a blind eye to the situation

it does sound a lot like you're justifying what this teacher did. She insulted him and tried to turn the class against him. On what fucking planet is it okay to say these things to a kindergartener?

I wasn't being an internet tough guy, and I'm sure you are a much better parent than those in this article. I was disturbed at what seemed like you justifying what this teacher said because there is no justification.

Sometimes being on this board reminds me of the Clinton/Obama debate where Hillary bitched and moaned because Obama didn't "denounce" Louis Farrakhan and only "rejected" his statements. Do I really need to come out calling for this woman's head and declaring her evil incarnate, or can we all agree that what she did was unjustifiable and have a discussion about what may have happened here?

I'm simply wondering whether this child was a perfect angel and the teacher just hates him for no reason, or if he has behavioral problems that are not being dealt with. In either case, I am appalled that this went on for nearly the entire school year without being caught or addressed by anyone, including the parents or the school administration.

According to the article, two weeks into the school year there was discussion about setting up a behavioral plan, and nobody followed up on it. I don't know about you, but if I'm told that my child is behaving inappropriately and is being disruptive, I wouldn't drop the issue when the teacher says he/she "doesn't have time" to deal with it. I'd want to hear that either my child has stopped being disruptive, or we'd need to address the issue. Apparently, nobody addressed the issue; everyone just buried their heads in the sand and the kid is the one who suffered for it. That's just shameful...