This week, Newsweek covered a new HBO documentary on film director Roman Polanski, in which the infamous case where he was charged with drugging and raping a 13-year old girl is discussed. Interesting language Newsweek decided to use to describe the crime:
There was champagne and a Quaalude for refreshments before a trip to the bedroom. When Samantha's mother found out, she called the police. Polanski never denied he'd had sex with her but maintained it was consensual. Samantha said it was not. She also told detectives she'd been drunk before. And she'd had sex before.(Emphasis mine)
Not surprisingly, the general language of the piece has a similar tone, describing the case as Polanksi being charged for "having sex with" a 13-year old. The article ends with:
This deft and subtle film is a fitting tribute to a man—like him or not—whose life deserves more than tabloid headlines.
It absolutely drives me insane how Polanski and other high profile sex offenders like Woody Allen are treated like martyrs for having to endure the tabloids for heinous crimes, and labeled as these brilliant, tragic and fascinating men. Is it just me or is there something really disturbing about this?
Here's the link to Newsweek's whitewashing of the drugging and anal rape of a child:
This reminds me of when Bill Maher made fun of Rat-Pope for his role in covering up for pedophile priests in the Catholic Church. The media made Maher out to be the bad guy, instead of the Pope who is an accomplice to child molestation after the fact. Now it's not the fault of a creepy little child rapist, but the judge who was (rightfully) going to punish the slimy piece of shit.
A guy who drugs and rapes a child needs to be locked up or executed, not excused by pedophile apologists like the scumbags at Newsweek.
If you are rich and famous, if you do a crime, you'll suddenly find some people going out of their way to present it in a language that won't be ever used if that crime was done by a commoner.
Lì ci sono chiese, macerie, moschee e questure, lì frontiere, prezzi inaccessibile e freddure
Lì paludi, minacce, cecchini coi fucili, documenti, file notturne e clandestini
Qui incontri, lotte, passi sincronizzati, colori, capannelli non autorizzati,
Uccelli migratori, reti, informazioni, piazze di Tutti i like pazze di passioni...
...La tranquillità è importante ma la libertà è tutto!
Hell you should hear Natasha Kinsky and his current wife talk about him. Including the "If we have a daughter I'm leaving you before she hits puberty." lines.
The scariest folk song lyrics are "My Boy Grew up to be just like me" from cats in the cradle by Harry Chapin
Stas Bush wrote:If you are rich and famous, if you do a crime, you'll suddenly find some people going out of their way to present it in a language that won't be ever used if that crime was done by a commoner.
You mean how people will be outraged and suggest ludicrous penalties for petty theft or drug use, but accept it as part of 'celebrity culture' and idolise them anyway? It's HILARIOUS.
Especially there. Its amazing the derision and clueless cruelty heaped upon people who merely accused of crimes and regardless of outcome, on but a moment's thought, even though those crimes may be victimless and even though they may wave them off endlessly in the service of celebrity worship.
"You know what the problem with Hollywood is. They make shit. Unbelievable. Unremarkable. Shit." - Gabriel Shear, Swordfish
"This statement, in its utterly clueless hubristic stupidity, cannot be improved upon. I merely quote it in admiration of its perfection." - Garibaldi in reply to an incredibly stupid post.
The Fifth Illuminatus Primus | Warsie | Skeptical Empiricist | Florida Gator | Sustainability Advocate | LibertarianSocialist |
I read the Newsweek article in question, and it doesn't seem that offensive to me. It describes it as a crime up-front and mentions how he was "creepy"; I suppose they erred in not ensuring that every single paragraph drips with contempt and disgust for the man?
Seriously, what the fuck is this moral outrage about? The article's language isn't harsh enough, even though it gets all the facts straight? Is that all it takes to create so much outrage?
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
Elfdart wrote:It's the fact that they described him as "having sex" with a 13-year-old, which implies consent on her part.
"Having sex" is the most factual possible way to say it.
This part also pissed me off:
But the film is more about his punishment,
What punishment? He had to miss the Oscars? Awwwwww.
not his crime—and it paints a far more complex picture of what happened than most of us know.
What's so complex? He drugged and raped a kid, then fled the country.
The kid didn't want to testify against him, he copped a plea bargain, then he found out that the judge was bragging to all his friends (and the media) that he intended to put him away for life anyway. It's hardly surprising that he fled the country under those circumstances.
The whole thing reeked of special pleading for Polanski.
He should have gone to jail, no doubt. Nobody; not in the Newsweek article and not me, is disputing that. The problem is that the judge was clearly fancying himself the vigilante cowboy and did not intend to honour the plea bargain.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
While a judge can reject a plea bargain, he can't agree to it and then change the terms (if they could, there wouldn't be any plea agreements). So either the judge was going to reject it (in which case the attorneys could either come up with a new plea bargain, or go to trial) or Polanski's apologists and his lawyer are talking out of their asses.
Darth Wong wrote:
Seriously, what the fuck is this moral outrage about? The article's language isn't harsh enough, even though it gets all the facts straight? Is that all it takes to create so much outrage?
While I haven't read the article, I'll comment solely on the quoted material, which as per Elfdart's post seemed to have sparked the outrage. And I have to admit that that part is eerily similar to the innumerable "blame the victim" rape cases. Because unless that angle is present, there is no fucking reason for anyone to mention the victim's sexual habits as some sort of mitigating factor. She could have had regular sex with a pride of hyenas, and that would have absolutely no bearing on the fact that Polanski drugged an underage girl and fucked her up the ass.
So yeah, I fully understand why this kind of suggestive non-sequitur arouses the ire of certain people. As for myself I won't deny being pissed that such memes are still being perpetuated, and I'm pretty sure the others had similar reasons for their anger.
Björn Paulsen
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
Darth Wong wrote:I read the Newsweek article in question, and it doesn't seem that offensive to me. It describes it as a crime up-front and mentions how he was "creepy"; I suppose they erred in not ensuring that every single paragraph drips with contempt and disgust for the man?
Seriously, what the fuck is this moral outrage about? The article's language isn't harsh enough, even though it gets all the facts straight? Is that all it takes to create so much outrage?
I might agree, except for this quote:
"...can you separate an artist's personal life from his art?"
When someone uses that as an argument against prosecution for the raping of a barely-teenager, either they are a drooling idiot or something is seriously fucked up.
Elfdart wrote:While a judge can reject a plea bargain, he can't agree to it and then change the terms (if they could, there wouldn't be any plea agreements). So either the judge was going to reject it (in which case the attorneys could either come up with a new plea bargain, or go to trial) or Polanski's apologists and his lawyer are talking out of their asses.
To be exact Nicholson and Pulanski were in the Sauna and heard the judge say he was going to go back on the deal anyways. Guess what Elf, this state has a bad record with honoring it's plea arrangements. Not to mention we have accepted people abducting fugitives from non-extradition countries before.
sorry, the man is scum, but he did what was logical.
The scariest folk song lyrics are "My Boy Grew up to be just like me" from cats in the cradle by Harry Chapin
Darth Wong wrote:I read the Newsweek article in question, and it doesn't seem that offensive to me. It describes it as a crime up-front and mentions how he was "creepy"; I suppose they erred in not ensuring that every single paragraph drips with contempt and disgust for the man?
Seriously, what the fuck is this moral outrage about? The article's language isn't harsh enough, even though it gets all the facts straight? Is that all it takes to create so much outrage?
I might agree, except for this quote:
"...can you separate an artist's personal life from his art?"
When someone uses that as an argument against prosecution for the raping of a barely-teenager, either they are a drooling idiot or something is seriously fucked up.
No it's NOT!
That's the exact same statement that was rejected when Isreal unbanned Wagner, as when they unbanned Leni Reifenstal's other works (her documentries on Africa, and her work with former French Resistance commando turned oceanographer Jaques Coustou)
great I guess I just broke Godwin's law, by citing the fact that the two biggest Nazi artists are now unbanned in Isreal.
The scariest folk song lyrics are "My Boy Grew up to be just like me" from cats in the cradle by Harry Chapin
Molyneux wrote:I might agree, except for this quote:
"...can you separate an artist's personal life from his art?"
When someone uses that as an argument against prosecution for the raping of a barely-teenager, either they are a drooling idiot or something is seriously fucked up.
I don't see how that's an argument against prosecuting him. The fact of the matter is that the guy made movies. Am I allowed to watch his movies even though he's a pedophile, given that the films have been made and the crimes have already taken place? I think he should definitely go to jail, and I wish that he would be extradited so he could face justice, but that doesn't mean that I want his movies to be burned. It's the same way I treat every other criminal artist.
"Sometimes I think you WANT us to fail." "Shut up, just shut up!" -Two Guys from Kabul
Latinum Star Recipient; Hacker's Cross Award Winner
"one soler flar can vapririze the planit or malt the nickl in lass than millasacit" -Bagara1000
Molyneux wrote:I might agree, except for this quote:
"...can you separate an artist's personal life from his art?"
When someone uses that as an argument against prosecution for the raping of a barely-teenager, either they are a drooling idiot or something is seriously fucked up.
I don't see how that's an argument against prosecuting him. The fact of the matter is that the guy made movies. Am I allowed to watch his movies even though he's a pedophile, given that the films have been made and the crimes have already taken place? I think he should definitely go to jail, and I wish that he would be extradited so he could face justice, but that doesn't mean that I want his movies to be burned. It's the same way I treat every other criminal artist.
Reread my post. When did I say that I was in favor of his art being banned or censored?
Darth Wong wrote:I read the Newsweek article in question, and it doesn't seem that offensive to me. It describes it as a crime up-front and mentions how he was "creepy"; I suppose they erred in not ensuring that every single paragraph drips with contempt and disgust for the man?
Seriously, what the fuck is this moral outrage about? The article's language isn't harsh enough, even though it gets all the facts straight? Is that all it takes to create so much outrage?
I might agree, except for this quote:
"...can you separate an artist's personal life from his art?"
When someone uses that as an argument against prosecution for the raping of a barely-teenager, either they are a drooling idiot or something is seriously fucked up.
They didn't use that as an argument against prosecuting him, you fucking moron. Find me one line in that article where they said he should never have been prosecuted, or where they used this line as justification for that argument they never made.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
Darth Wong wrote:I read the Newsweek article in question, and it doesn't seem that offensive to me. It describes it as a crime up-front and mentions how he was "creepy"; I suppose they erred in not ensuring that every single paragraph drips with contempt and disgust for the man?
Seriously, what the fuck is this moral outrage about? The article's language isn't harsh enough, even though it gets all the facts straight? Is that all it takes to create so much outrage?
I might agree, except for this quote:
"...can you separate an artist's personal life from his art?"
When someone uses that as an argument against prosecution for the raping of a barely-teenager, either they are a drooling idiot or something is seriously fucked up.
They didn't use that as an argument against prosecuting him, you fucking moron. Find me one line in that article where they said he should never have been prosecuted, or where they used this line as justification for that argument they never made.
now TESS is one movie he made that creeps me out seriously. it's very true to the novel, and has all of the sex and bloody betrayal included, it was made a few years after he fled to France with a fifteen year old Natasha Kinsky in the title roll.
now this is still available, on video or DVD, and even available in european uncut version.
The scariest folk song lyrics are "My Boy Grew up to be just like me" from cats in the cradle by Harry Chapin
