Australian Gov't decides to dehydrate the nation to death.

[tim31]

So is Sydney, but the plants are generally facing absurd opposition by Bogan idiots for no real reason that makes sense in all cases.

The people of Kurnell just don't like all the construction work. I found this out firsthand when visiting family there recently. I reserved my judgement that it was bizarre that people who happily lived next to an oil refinery were het up about a water plant going in.

Just a lot of fucking morons with zero long term planning or actual understanding of the issues. The NIMBY anti nuclear brigade are just fucking staggering, I blame Bob Brown and the fucking Greens.

Hilariously, Brown was slamming the Gov't for the Murray/Darling situation in his usual monotone earlier today.

On topic, if you want to put more water in the system, then fucking make it ILLEGAL to grow crops as insanely water demanding as RICE, fucking RICE in the middle of this system! Look at opening Rice Paddies in the ares the damn crop is DESIGNED to grow, the tropical north coastal areas or something, where there is more rain then you know what to do with! We need to look at getting rid of the sick joke that is growing rice in the worst drought affected areas, then have farmers come crying when we start to take away their water...

I agree with you. Those huge farms in south central Queensland that have had the same effect as damming the rivers have had it too good, too long. Yes, we're a huge rice exporter, but is it worth it?? My brother in law's farm is *near* the Castlereagh River in northern NSW; but he pretty much relies on rain, and hasn't had any since the beginning of the year.

[Twoyboy]

And, just quietly to all those bleating about how Australians want to die out and are ruled by a bogan majority blah blah blah: Perth has a desal plant, Adelaide and Melbourne are getting one. But why let the facts get in the way of a bit of hysteria amirit?

However, as I said, many people still have irrational reservations to the desal plan here in Perth. What it seems to come down to is, people suddenly get over their phobias when forced to. Water was scarce, we're getting either a desal plant or a huge fucking canal. Oh fine, we'll take the desal plant. I wouldn't go as far as "wanting to die out", but we certainly seem to stonewall progress.

It's actually made more amusing by the Opposition. They say hilarious things like 'Kevin Rudd isn't making oil cheaper using his genie powers' and 'holy shit inflation Labor sucks, what global economic crisis'.

The funny thing is, now the reserve bank has said the economy is slowing and there's no need for another rate rise just yet, there's people saying "OMG! Economy's slowing! Recession!" and "well that's because they copied off of Liberal's budget". Seriously. These are probably the same fucktards who complained inflation was out of control and blamed the rate rise about 2 weeks after Labor took office on Rudd. *fucking sigh*

you should announce that you've created a non-nuclear way to slame oxygen and hydrogen together to created water from AIR. siphon eleventy billion dollars off of the budget for building loads of the magic facilities under gigantic tarps, then unveil them all at the same time and go "Psych, they're nuclear and desal plants. You're welcome, dickheads."

In addition to my first point, perhaps we need to work out a deal with the major parties. One says "Nuclear and Desalination for all!" and the other says "We're going to have to kill of 10 million people so we have enough water and electricity for the rest of you". It's amazing how quickly these whiners shut up when given a worse choice... like a giant fucking canal.

[bobalot]

I working for one of the Australia State Rail companies. The short sightedness of governments, private industry and local people is amazing, you don't know when to laugh or cry.

Example One : selling off the workshops (which are basically natural monopolies) and then wondering why repair costs have soared instead of falling due to the "magic" of the free market. The private operators are now doing enormous amounts of unnecessary "repairs". In some cases, simply taking off perfectly working parts (basically stealing), adding a new coat of paint and selling it back to us at a inflated price (under the guise of "repairing" it).

Example two: The private fright operators have not been training enough people over years, soon there will be considerable skill shortages (some would argue, there are already are). These same tight arse private operators now complain What are the government going to do about the skill shortage?. What the fuck? I thought the "magic" of the free market would solve it?

Example three: The state government (for once) had a good idea for a rail link, which would take considerable pressure off the other lines. It was a brilliant idea, really, even the greenies for all for it. As it was being built local NIMBY's took an injunction out on the work. Line fell through. Now we have half a line. The cost to taxpayers was incredible, at least a billion dollars. These twits want all the luxuries of living in a city but none of the cost. One of the best infrastructure projects in a decade scuttled by local NIMBYs.

[bobalot]

To be fair Bob Brown and the Greens are pushing for massive water recycling and storm water reclaim nation. States like NSW only reclaim 3% of their storm water.

[bobalot]

Correction:storm water reclamation

[Vympel]

I working for one of the Australia State Rail companies. The short sightedness of governments, private industry and local people is amazing, you don't know when to laugh or cry.

Example One : selling off the workshops (which are basically natural monopolies) and then wondering why repair costs have soared instead of falling due to the "magic" of the free market. The private operators are now doing enormous amounts of unnecessary "repairs". In some cases, simply taking off perfectly working parts (basically stealing), adding a new coat of paint and selling it back to us at a inflated price (under the guise of "repairing" it).

Example two: The private fright operators have not been training enough people over years, soon there will be considerable skill shortages (some would argue, there are already are). These same tight arse private operators now complain What are the government going to do about the skill shortage?. What the fuck? I thought the "magic" of the free market would solve it?

Example three: The state government (for once) had a good idea for a rail link, which would take considerable pressure off the other lines. It was a brilliant idea, really, even the greenies for all for it. As it was being built local NIMBY's took an injunction out on the work. Line fell through. Now we have half a line. The cost to taxpayers was incredible, at least a billion dollars. These twits want all the luxuries of living in a city but none of the cost. One of the best infrastructure projects in a decade scuttled by local NIMBYs.

What state are you talking about? Surely it's NSW.

[Lusankya]

I know little about this problem, what future is Australia in general looking at if they dont get their heads out of their asses and starts to do things about the water shortage?

I presume it varies by state: Adelaide currently gets 20-90% of its drinking water from the Murray-Darling system, depending on rainfall. This comes out of the city's water allocation which is in a sort of five-year bank. Since we've had a few more drought years than usual lately, we've had to create an extra emergency Adelaide city water allocation, because we're pretty much used up our allocation. This comes out of a 6,000GL/year allocation (I think - there could be extra zeros there) which is guaranteed South Australia by the constitution.

The Riverland is also facing problems due to the shortage of Murray water. While most irrigators along the Murray use annual plantings, the guarantee of water for South Australia means that irrigators in SA have permanent plantings - mainly oranges and grapes. Even though the irrigators in SA have used the most water-economical irrigation techniques available during the last century, the drought is hitting them hard, since it costs a lot more to lose or replace a permanent planting than you lose from a bad year for wheat etc.

The problem with the lower Murray lakes at the moment stems from a few sources: first of all, less water has been coming down the Murray in recent years (the 6,000GL is a minimum, not a maximum). Secondly, the average temperature in South Australia has risen due to global warming, which results in increased evaporation. Thirdly, the lakes are actually a naturally estuarine environment, and are only kept fresh because of the Hindmarsh weir. It's a little-advertised fact that the vast majority of South Australia's water allocation is actually caused by evaporation from Lake Alexandrina and Lake Albert. The lakes could actually be rescued quite easily by simply removing the weir and letting ocean water in. Since the water levels in Lake Albert are so low at the moment that the farmers who rely on irrigation from the lakes can't pump water from them, this solution may no longer be politically unfeasible, since the farms are going to go broke anyway. Finally, a large amount of the water from the Coorong was actually originally run-off water from the South East. Then this water was tapped for irrigation, so now the Coorong's gone to the shitter.

One issue in SA, actually, is that global warming is giving us decreased rainfall. Goyder's line, which marks the boundary between farmable and non-farmable land is moving south. That's actually a quite significant decrease in our arable land.

[Dendrobius]

Example three: The state government (for once) had a good idea for a rail link, which would take considerable pressure off the other lines. It was a brilliant idea, really, even the greenies for all for it. As it was being built local NIMBY's took an injunction out on the work. Line fell through. Now we have half a line. The cost to taxpayers was incredible, at least a billion dollars. These twits want all the luxuries of living in a city but none of the cost. One of the best infrastructure projects in a decade scuttled by local NIMBYs.

Dear Lord don't get me started on this one. Had this link actually been fully completed, I'd be merrily cycling to my local train station, hopping on, then getting off at Macquarie Uni and cycling to work. It'd make my life a lot easier, driving home after a 12hr shift sometimes just isn't fun, at least if I cycle/train I can't possibly fall asleep at the wrong time...

[bobalot]

What state are you talking about? Surely it's NSW.

Yep, NSW.

[bobalot]

You know many of the stations and lines are not all that profitable. The busier lines subsidize the other lines. The Parramatta to Epping to Chatswood would have:

- Been profitable
- Taken the pressure off the lines going from Parramatta to the City.
- Really allowed train use to be practicable for many more people.

Thank the the local NIMBY's. Quite honestly, if our older generations had the same attitude we do, we would be totally stuffed. We would have never built the old rail systems (They were quite a feat for their time) or any other useful piece of infrastructure. Good times have spoiled us.

[Vympel]

You know many of the stations and lines are not all that profitable. The busier lines subsidize the other lines. The Parramatta to Epping to Chatswood would have:

- Been profitable
- Taken the pressure off the lines going from Parramatta to the City.
- Really allowed train use to be practicable for many more people.

Thank the the local NIMBY's. Quite honestly, if our older generations had the same attitude we do, we would be totally stuffed. We would have never built the old rail systems (They were quite a feat for their time) or any other useful piece of infrastructure. Good times have spoiled us.

Nevermind the holiday on infrastructure spending that have thrown everything into disrepair. Isn't the signal system archaic on our train system or some such? The continued emphasis on fucking tollways especially grinds my gears.

[tim31]

My sister lives in St. Leonards, and walks to work in about ten minutes(not driving or using public transport offsets the huge rent she pays). According to her, the north shore line has been getting more and more crowded at peak times in the time she has been living there. Amazing that, even with increasing passenger numbers, they can't increase services. And look at all the regional rail services that have died in recent years.