Zerg population

[Omeganian]

Well, If Kerrigan has any plans to battle the main Earth colonies, she has probably prepared trillions. After all, if a colony started by thirty thousand people after thirty years of cold sleep gives her so much trouble, imagine what forces exist where a million times as much had thirty more years to multiply and colonize.

Keep in mind, though, that the UED (or rather, its predecessor, the United Powers League) had effective control over almost the entire "primary human area" (meaning whatever colonies were settled that stayed in direct contact with Earth, along with Earth itself - as opposed to the Koprulu), with only some volatile nations staying out. Considering they were a totalitarian state with effective control and no real rivals for many years, it is entirely possible that the quality of their military and military technology really took a nose dive for the most part with some exceptions (like Du Galle and Stukov), and it has been a tough period of trying to re-train and re-build their military as fast as possible (as opposed to the Koprulu Colonies, whose military tech advance was fairly solid since they are constantly fighting with each other).

Well, the UPL controlled most of Earth before the colonization started, but it was said in the Brood Wars manual that a lot of colonies joined it after receiving news of the Zerg. And its tech level is well above that of the Dominion. There might be even some still independent, more liberal, and more developed colonies in the area.

[Guardsman Bass]

I never got the impression that Starcraft's populations were meant to be terribly big. I imagined something far smaller than the UFP for terran space while playing the game.

They're not anywhere near as big as the UFP, at least in terms of the Koprulu Sector. There are, what, 13 primary colonies (the original three - Tarsonis, Umoja, and Moria - plus the bigger colonies like Mar Sara and Antiga), plus whatever tiny colonies happen to be lying about? It's probably not much more than a few solar systems relatively close together (I say "relative" since we know that they have FTL, and probably FTL that is faster than Star Trek, since the original expedition that got lost and ended up in the Koprulu Sector - 60,000 light years from Earth - managed to do that over the space of 30 years in spite of supposedly barrelling around in warp until the ships' fuel and life support was exhausted).

It's more difficult to say with the Protoss and Zerg. The Protoss, at least according to game booklet, established dominion over one-eight the territory of the Xel-Naga, who were said to have held sway over the entire galaxy. However, they seem to be heavily centralized on Aiur before the Zerg invasion, and we have no mention of any existing Protoss colonies. The Zerg seem to be more or less in the Koprulu Sector in the timeline of the original Starcraft, but we have no idea what their total numbers are. The guide booklet lists numbers for the "larger broods" in the low millions at best, but it is written as being from the perspective of Terran scientists' observations on the Zerg attacks on their bases. It says during the original Starcraft Campaign during the Terran Campaign that the psi beacon lured "billions of Zerg" to Tarsonis, but we don't know how much of the Zerg Swarm that that includes (they also have bases on Char, and the Overmind still seems to be in space at that time).

[Guardsman Bass]

Well, If Kerrigan has any plans to battle the main Earth colonies, she has probably prepared trillions. After all, if a colony started by thirty thousand people after thirty years of cold sleep gives her so much trouble, imagine what forces exist where a million times as much had thirty more years to multiply and colonize.

Keep in mind, though, that the UED (or rather, its predecessor, the United Powers League) had effective control over almost the entire "primary human area" (meaning whatever colonies were settled that stayed in direct contact with Earth, along with Earth itself - as opposed to the Koprulu), with only some volatile nations staying out. Considering they were a totalitarian state with effective control and no real rivals for many years, it is entirely possible that the quality of their military and military technology really took a nose dive for the most part with some exceptions (like Du Galle and Stukov), and it has been a tough period of trying to re-train and re-build their military as fast as possible (as opposed to the Koprulu Colonies, whose military tech advance was fairly solid since they are constantly fighting with each other).

Well, the UPL controlled most of Earth before the colonization started, but it was said in the Brood Wars manual that a lot of colonies joined it after receiving news of the Zerg. And its tech level is well above that of the Dominion. There might be even some still independent, more liberal, and more developed colonies in the area.

That doesn't necessarily contradict what I said. While dissident nations did exist (the guide booklet specifically mentions it), we have no idea whether they were considered a threat or not - the UPL may simply have no cared whether they controlled small pockets of independent groups, since they controlled the greater mass. They certainly made no effort to re-take the Koprulu Colonies (even considering them "expendable"), even though they had been monitoring them for decades.

[Guardsman Bass]

EDIT: "Re-take the Koprulu Colonies before the Zerg invasion"

[Straha]

Char was never habitable in any reasonable sense of the word.

Yeah it sure as shit was before the Protoss blew away the surface after the Zerg started infesting the place.

Quoting from the website linked above:

Char was formerly one of the thirteen core worlds of the Confederacy, but it is most notorious as the primary hive planet of the alien zerg. Upon its discovery, Char was found to be an inhospitable volcanic planet with thick ash covering most of its surface and tainting its acrid atmosphere. The hazardous environment is further intensified by extremely high levels of cosmic radiation from Char's volatile pairing of binary stars, a class VI F0 sub dwarf orbiting an M8 irregular variable. Char's elliptical orbit means whole regions of its sunward face can become molten seas during a close approach, with temporary islands forming in them due to rapid cooling as the planet swings away to the frozen outer reaches of the system.

In spite of the hellish conditions, Char was originally settled to exploit its fantastically rich reserves of heavy metals to fuel the rapidly growing Confederate economy. However, the planet became a source of friction between the Terran Confederacy and independent mining guilds operating out of Moria.

That being said, having ten billion zerg at least on a planet that is for all intents and purposes uninhabitable is rather an accomplishment. And begs the question of what their population is on planets that are hospitable to life.

[Guardsman Bass]

Char was never habitable in any reasonable sense of the word.

Yeah it sure as shit was before the Protoss blew away the surface after the Zerg started infesting the place.

Quoting from the website linked above:

Char was formerly one of the thirteen core worlds of the Confederacy, but it is most notorious as the primary hive planet of the alien zerg. Upon its discovery, Char was found to be an inhospitable volcanic planet with thick ash covering most of its surface and tainting its acrid atmosphere. The hazardous environment is further intensified by extremely high levels of cosmic radiation from Char's volatile pairing of binary stars, a class VI F0 sub dwarf orbiting an M8 irregular variable. Char's elliptical orbit means whole regions of its sunward face can become molten seas during a close approach, with temporary islands forming in them due to rapid cooling as the planet swings away to the frozen outer reaches of the system.

In spite of the hellish conditions, Char was originally settled to exploit its fantastically rich reserves of heavy metals to fuel the rapidly growing Confederate economy. However, the planet became a source of friction between the Terran Confederacy and independent mining guilds operating out of Moria.

That being said, having ten billion zerg at least on a planet that is for all intents and purposes uninhabitable is rather an accomplishment. And begs the question of what their population is on planets that are hospitable to life.

The Zerg are pretty hardy. Incidently, considering that it says that Char has no native life forms, does that mean that it doesn't have any resembling an atmosphere? That would mean that the Zerg don't necessarily have to breath, making their metabolism - rather bizarre.

[Balrog]

Yeah it sure as shit was before the Protoss blew away the surface after the Zerg started infesting the place.

Quoting from the website linked above:

Char was formerly one of the thirteen core worlds of the Confederacy, but it is most notorious as the primary hive planet of the alien zerg. Upon its discovery, Char was found to be an inhospitable volcanic planet with thick ash covering most of its surface and tainting its acrid atmosphere. The hazardous environment is further intensified by extremely high levels of cosmic radiation from Char's volatile pairing of binary stars, a class VI F0 sub dwarf orbiting an M8 irregular variable. Char's elliptical orbit means whole regions of its sunward face can become molten seas during a close approach, with temporary islands forming in them due to rapid cooling as the planet swings away to the frozen outer reaches of the system.

In spite of the hellish conditions, Char was originally settled to exploit its fantastically rich reserves of heavy metals to fuel the rapidly growing Confederate economy. However, the planet became a source of friction between the Terran Confederacy and independent mining guilds operating out of Moria.

That being said, having ten billion zerg at least on a planet that is for all intents and purposes uninhabitable is rather an accomplishment. And begs the question of what their population is on planets that are hospitable to life.

The Zerg are pretty hardy. Incidently, considering that it says that Char has no native life forms, does that mean that it doesn't have any resembling an atmosphere? That would mean that the Zerg don't necessarily have to breath, making their metabolism - rather bizarre.

It does - we see Terrans in T-shirts walking around Char (during night) in one of the original SC cinematics, and much of Queen of Blades specifies it has a oxygen-rich atmosphere, along with Raynor and his band walking around most of the time without spacesuits on.

[Guardsman Bass]

Quoting from the website linked above:
That being said, having ten billion zerg at least on a planet that is for all intents and purposes uninhabitable is rather an accomplishment. And begs the question of what their population is on planets that are hospitable to life.

The Zerg are pretty hardy. Incidently, considering that it says that Char has no native life forms, does that mean that it doesn't have any resembling an atmosphere? That would mean that the Zerg don't necessarily have to breath, making their metabolism - rather bizarre.

It does - we see Terrans in T-shirts walking around Char (during night) in one of the original SC cinematics, and much of Queen of Blades specifies it has a oxygen-rich atmosphere, along with Raynor and his band walking around most of the time without spacesuits on.

Just to be sure, that actually -is- Char in the cinematic? I'm saying this because (I believe) the novels actually are not considered canon, which is why I've tried to avoid quoting them as a source.

[Rawtooth]

If this is what Necronlord is talking about, it's not on Char.

[white_rabbit]

They employ that strategy (Using an opponent's native biosphere and subverting it to produce homegrown warriors) to an even greater degree than the Tyranids, which do rely on their fleets for the bulk of their invasion forces.

What do you base the above on ?

[NecronLord]

If this is what Necronlord is talking about, it's not on Char.

You've got me confused for someone else.

[Lord Relvenous]

It does - we see Terrans in T-shirts walking around Char (during night) in one of the original SC cinematics, and much of Queen of Blades specifies it has a oxygen-rich atmosphere, along with Raynor and his band walking around most of the time without spacesuits on.

The cinematic is on Mar Sara. Says right at the beginning of the cinematic.

[Steel]

It does - we see Terrans in T-shirts walking around Char (during night) in one of the original SC cinematics, and much of Queen of Blades specifies it has a oxygen-rich atmosphere, along with Raynor and his band walking around most of the time without spacesuits on.

The cinematic is on Mar Sara. Says right at the beginning of the cinematic.

Then its highly likely he isnt referring to that one isnt it? The one i thought of was the cinematic where they use the big gun to blast the damaged dragoon

at 1:00 in this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUaOu1cXpfQ

[Lord Relvenous]

If he was remembering it, instead of watching it, then its highly likely he could think it was Char. Also, the cinematic you posted gives no indication of the world on which that Protoss assault takes place, making it unlikely that it Char, seeing as how the Protoss and Terran forces cooperated on Char.

Note: looking back at the Starcraft cinematics, they really are quite impressive for the time in which they came out. Sure they look dated, but i can think of PS2 and Xbox games that look worse.

[Darth Ruinus]

If this is what Necronlord is talking about, it's not on Char.

No, he is refering to the last Terran cinematic from Brood War, were we see two dudes throwing dead Zerg bodies onto a pile of more dead Zerg bodies. They are wearing masks, but thats probably for the stench, seeing as IIRC, they are just weaing t-shirts.

[Noble Ire]

If he was remembering it, instead of watching it, then its highly likely he could think it was Char. Also, the cinematic you posted gives no indication of the world on which that Protoss assault takes place, making it unlikely that it Char, seeing as how the Protoss and Terran forces cooperated on Char.

However, if you take the cinematic in the context of the campaign, it almost certainly takes place on Char. If I recall correctly, that cut scene plays after the level in which the player character and Tassadar travel to Char in an attempt to find Zeratul and the other Dark Templar, lost there in a previous battle. The mission involves fighting one's way through a contingent of Zerg and infested Terrans (as well as part of General Duke's fleet), and bringing Tassadar and a few Zealots to the entrance of a Terran base at the rear of the main Zerg base. Its never really explained why there's a huge Terran facility on Char, or why Duke isn't perturbed by the Zerg forces overrunning it.

[The Grim Squeaker]

They employ that strategy (Using an opponent's native biosphere and subverting it to produce homegrown warriors) to an even greater degree than the Tyranids, which do rely on their fleets for the bulk of their invasion forces.

What do you base the above on ?

Agh, "To a greater degree" I mean they rely on it more than the Tyranids, who "merely" sow the rippers in the atmosphere and the known issue of Genestealer cults. (Not that the Zerg are superior in any way to the Nids).
Zerg infesting a planet grow their army for the invasion and expansion there, rather than relying on the homegrown force only as auxiliaries or a "Fourth column" (In the case of genestealers).

Consider the case of the infected Terran colonies, where the first thing the colonists knew was herds dissapearing, with by the time anyone discovered the Creep infesting the ground, it was usually around the time population centres were dissapearing and being eaten. (:"Liberty's Crusade"). As for adapting native lifeforms, we have the entire history of the Zerg, the examples of Infected Terrans, and, Ugh (Damn you for making me use this), the Dog-Zerg strain from "Shadow of the Xel-Naga" (KJA Starcraft book).

This is mostly quite obvious, I have the feeling you were just asking whether I thought the Zerg were better at biowarfare than the Biomass eating (But not using to anywhere near it's "weight") Tyranids. (I don't).

[Omeganian]

If he was remembering it, instead of watching it, then its highly likely he could think it was Char. Also, the cinematic you posted gives no indication of the world on which that Protoss assault takes place, making it unlikely that it Char, seeing as how the Protoss and Terran forces cooperated on Char.

However, if you take the cinematic in the context of the campaign, it almost certainly takes place on Char. If I recall correctly, that cut scene plays after the level in which the player character and Tassadar travel to Char in an attempt to find Zeratul and the other Dark Templar, lost there in a previous battle. The mission involves fighting one's way through a contingent of Zerg and infested Terrans (as well as part of General Duke's fleet), and bringing Tassadar and a few Zealots to the entrance of a Terran base at the rear of the main Zerg base. Its never really explained why there's a huge Terran facility on Char, or why Duke isn't perturbed by the Zerg forces overrunning it.

I think it is specified at the beginning of the cinematic (the one called Ambush) that it is on Char.

BTW, don't forget why the Xel'Naga chose the Zerg to experiment upon. The bugs can live just about anywhere.

[NecronLord]

No, he is refering to the last Terran cinematic from Brood War, were we see two dudes throwing dead Zerg bodies onto a pile of more dead Zerg bodies. They are wearing masks, but thats probably for the stench, seeing as IIRC, they are just weaing t-shirts.

That's Balrog not me! *Twitch!*

[Darth Ruinus]

No, he is refering to the last Terran cinematic from Brood War, were we see two dudes throwing dead Zerg bodies onto a pile of more dead Zerg bodies. They are wearing masks, but thats probably for the stench, seeing as IIRC, they are just weaing t-shirts.

That's Balrog not me! *Twitch!*

Yeah, I know its not you, I was simply replying to whats-his-face over there, who was mistakenly replyling to you.

[avatarxprime]

If he was remembering it, instead of watching it, then its highly likely he could think it was Char. Also, the cinematic you posted gives no indication of the world on which that Protoss assault takes place, making it unlikely that it Char, seeing as how the Protoss and Terran forces cooperated on Char.

However, if you take the cinematic in the context of the campaign, it almost certainly takes place on Char. If I recall correctly, that cut scene plays after the level in which the player character and Tassadar travel to Char in an attempt to find Zeratul and the other Dark Templar, lost there in a previous battle. The mission involves fighting one's way through a contingent of Zerg and infested Terrans (as well as part of General Duke's fleet), and bringing Tassadar and a few Zealots to the entrance of a Terran base at the rear of the main Zerg base. Its never really explained why there's a huge Terran facility on Char, or why Duke isn't perturbed by the Zerg forces overrunning it.

I think it is specified at the beginning of the cinematic (the one called Ambush) that it is on Char.

BTW, don't forget why the Xel'Naga chose the Zerg to experiment upon. The bugs can live just about anywhere.

The cinematic itself does not say it takes place on Char, but as Noble Ire said it just makes sense given its placement in the story. Although based on Blizzard's own artists, it's just a random scene they made before they knew about the campaign story so out of universe we know a bit more about it now.

I had completely forgotten about the UED Terran ending vid, but yeah the entire thing takes place on Char. The Blizzard team commentary on this one is pretty useless so I won't bother linking to it. Can't really say anything now, since it does look like those guys are burning the Zerg corpses outside with very little protection.

[Teleros]

I had completely forgotten about the UED Terran ending vid, but yeah the entire thing takes place on Char. The Blizzard team commentary on this one is pretty useless so I won't bother linking to it. Can't really say anything now, since it does look like those guys are burning the Zerg corpses outside with very little protection.

The guy we see in the clip has only goggles & a gas mask on his head, which is otherwise unprotected. He doesn't seem to have much on his arms either, although I can't be sure.

Another thing with that video is the counter for zerg deaths. Whilst the narrator says the losses were "in the millions", the counter is at something like 1.7 billion when that clip moves to the background. No idea how accurate it is, but when you consider that they'd just taken control of the Overmind it's entirely possible they wiped out a billion or so zerg on Char as pest control after the battle itself.

[Balrog]

True, but then again it is a propaganda video. "Comrade Stukov died valiently with Zerg bodies piled all around him! Ignore the suspicious gun wound to the back of his head!"

But yes, I was indeed referring to the video that takes place between the Char missions; though it doesn't list Char as the planet taken in context it makes sense.

[avatarxprime]

The Zerg are pretty hardy. Incidently, considering that it says that Char has no native life forms, does that mean that it doesn't have any resembling an atmosphere? That would mean that the Zerg don't necessarily have to breath, making their metabolism - rather bizarre.

Well the Zerg don't have to breathe. In the manual it talks about how the Overmind absorbed a race of creatures (most likely the forebears of the Overlord strain) that naturally survived in space and passed that little upgrade on to the rest of them.

The guy we see in the clip has only goggles & a gas mask on his head, which is otherwise unprotected. He doesn't seem to have much on his arms either, although I can't be sure.

He appears to be wearing the same thing as the sentry in the Dragoon clip just with a t-shirt on underneath. He also appears to have something strapped around his left shoulder. Both clips are also supposed to take place on Char, so maybe that really is enough protection. Given its state now (based on the Starcraft 2 fluff) then someone (probably the Zerg) would have actually had to make the planet even worse to live on then it was at the time of the original Starcraft.

[Ford Prefect]

Ten billion on one planet? For a species supposed to be renown for its reproductive capacities and growth rate? That's pathetic.

It is a vast improvement on what things were originally, where Tiamat, the largest, most advanced, most powerful brood, personal vangaurd of the Overmind was made up of ... six million organisms, of all strains. There were broods which were measured in the tens of thousands.