SDNWorld Redux - Casting Call & Planning

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Siege
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Post by Siege »

Assuming we're sticking with Coyote's outline (which I'd be fine with), this would be the setup for San Dorado:
Coyote wrote: Stock Nation: Post Count = GDP, in millions.
17% Military Professionalism
27% Industrial Capacity
25% Population
6% Land Area
25% Science and Education
A Brief History of San Dorado

The city of San Dorado was founded in 1819 as a trading post by the famous trader-explorer Sir Siegfried Schrom in the name of the Shroomanian Settlement Syndicate. The Syndicate was an early joint-stock company that had a monopoly on all Shroomanian colonial trade and virtually ruled the Shroomanian colonies. Under its rule San Dorado rapidly grew in size and influence, until it was one of the most important commercial and military centers of the Shroomanian Empire. It was a bustling trading port, a military fort and a place to dump the Empire's criminals, all rolled into one. Suffice it to say, San Dorado was a rather chaotic place from the get-go.

Throughout the first half of the 19th century the city continued to grow, becoming more and more of a self-sufficient entity and less and less of a dependent colony. After the revolution that swept through the Empire in 1861, the Shroomanian colonial empire saw a far-reaching reorganization. San Dorado first became a self-governing state within the Shroomanian Empire, and then declared independence from the empire unilaterally in August 1901.

The city-state's independence changed little in the grand scheme of things however: Shroomania remained one of San Dorado's most important trading partners, the city remained a tumultuous place, and the specter of aggressive capitalism still haunts the streets. "The business of San Dorado is business", the immortal words spoken by Sir Schrom, the founder and first governor of the city, remain the city's official motto to this very day.

Political system

San Dorado is not a democracy, but a corporate state of which every citizen is a shareholder. That is to say, every citizen holds at least one share of San Dorado stock. At birth, a citizen must receive at least one share from either parent. If the parents have only one share each, then the child is awarded one share from the reserves. Citizens can buy or can be awarded many more shares as bonuses and dividends. They are free to sell their shares to any other citizen or back to the corporation as they please. They may not sell their shares outside the corporation without special permission. This permission is never given.

Among other things, every share entitles the citizen to one vote in San Dorado's many elections and referendums. Since it is obviously impractical for every citizen to vote on every issue, the citizens elect representatives to speak for them on the Board of Directors. This is done every four years.

In the corporate state there are far more shares than there are voters, and individual citizens are free to sell all but one of their shares. (They are actually free to sell that last share too, but if they do they cease to be citizens.) Because shares can be bought and sold freely this means that political influence is not evenly distributed. Indeed there are electoral districts where 90% of the votes are controlled by a single individual or group of individuals.

Although officially only citizens are employed by San Dorado's industries, the fact of the matter is that there are teeming masses of illegal immigrants and other non-citizens employed in the city-state. These people form an underclass whose cheap labour profits the corporate state immensely. They are essentially unrepresented and unprotected, and typically toil in sweatshops or on the mechanized farms and mines that provide the cities with the natural resources it needs. In theory they can, through various bureaucratic processes, eventually gain permission to buy San Dorado shares (thus becoming citizen-shareholder), but in practice this remains an unattainable dream for most.
Last edited by Siege on 2008-07-13 07:25am, edited 1 time in total.
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SDN World 2: The North Frequesuan Trust
SDN World 3: The Sultanate of Egypt
SDN World 4: The United Solarian Sovereignty
SDN World 5: San Dorado
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Post by Shroom Man 777 »

Utterly ruthless!

Aw, mang! Now I must create some sort of complex imperial history of Shroomania!

EDIT:

HEY! Duchies and Principalities! Who wants to be a former Shroomanian colony?

We can once again form the Fungal Union of Nations - but this will be a Commonwealth type of deal.
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Post by Raj Ahten »

I'm not sure I like having the GDP equal post count in millions. The duchies would all have third world economies. I'd have a smaller GDP than Sierra Leone, which is beyond pathetic. For a while the only thing keeping their government in power was a single Hind helicopter.

And Shroom, sign me up to being a former colony.
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Post by Shroom Man 777 »

What are you talking about? The revamped system gives Duchies starting monies of 500 billion!

Awesome. I get to be Little Britain! Come to me, Commonwealths! FUN FUN FUN!
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Post by PeZook »

I'm thinking of starting the game with a violent revolution in the satellite republic of PeZookia where it liberates itself from its former masters :)

And I'm game for javing Syria and Egypt and other shitholes on our (not)Eastern-European continent :P
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Post by Raj Ahten »

I want to be in our Africa anolog. so much more opurtunity for brushfire wars. Well I'm going to go with economy being around 500 billion for now and try to write up a country overview soon.
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Post by Shroom Man 777 »

You can be South Africa. EXECUTIVE DECISIONS! Or was that EXECUTIVE OUTCOMES?

PeZook... what happens to King Paul? :(
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shroom is a lovely boy and i wont hear a bad word against him - LUSY-CHAN!
Shit! Man, I didn't think of that! It took Shroom to properly interpret the screams of dying people :D - PeZook
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Post by Raj Ahten »

Shroom Man 777 wrote:You can be South Africa. EXECUTIVE DECISIONS! Or was that EXECUTIVE OUTCOMES?
(
That was pretty much the idea.
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Post by Fingolfin_Noldor »

PeZook wrote:I'm thinking of starting the game with a violent revolution in the satellite republic of PeZookia where it liberates itself from its former masters :)

And I'm game for javing Syria and Egypt and other shitholes on our (not)Eastern-European continent :P
It will spice up our continent a little, that's for sure. :D
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Post by Shroom Man 777 »

It can be so cool for Indhopal Mk.2 if, eventually, a lot of African warlords get pissed and try to overwhelm him. It will be a Six Day War.

He beats their asses.
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Shit! Man, I didn't think of that! It took Shroom to properly interpret the screams of dying people :D - PeZook
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Post by PeZook »

Shroom Man 777 wrote:You can be South Africa. EXECUTIVE DECISIONS! Or was that EXECUTIVE OUTCOMES?

PeZook... what happens to King Paul? :(
He gets dicked around by Q and eventually accepts the burden of leading a new country, again, sacrificing his own needs for those he sees as deserving of a good life? :P
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JULY 20TH 1969 - The day the entire world was looking up

It suddenly struck me that that tiny pea, pretty and blue, was the Earth. I put up my thumb and shut one eye, and my thumb blotted out the planet Earth. I didn't feel like a giant. I felt very, very small.
- NEIL ARMSTRONG, MISSION COMMANDER, APOLLO 11

Signature dedicated to the greatest achievement of mankind.

MILDLY DERANGED PHYSICIST does not mind BREAKING the SOUND BARRIER, because it is INSURED. - Simon_Jester considering the problems of hypersonic flight for Team L.A.M.E.
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Post by DarthShady »

I hope we all do a better job this time.
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Post by Setzer »

Shroom Man 777 wrote:What are you talking about? The revamped system gives Duchies starting monies of 500 billion!

Awesome. I get to be Little Britain! Come to me, Commonwealths! FUN FUN FUN!
I'm up for it. I've got a few ideas to shape for my background. I'll PM you when I get the details the way I like.
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Post by Mr Bean »

Speaking of Moderators, this time around rather than running my own country, I think it better if we copy what happened with Terra Libertia, IE I wrote up three personalities ran them for awhile then once their type was written I handed them off to people who had significant influence on them

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Post by Sea Skimmer »

Coyote wrote: But you can take those points and take away from some catergories to buff up other categories. I was thinking--

Stock Nation: Post Count = GDP, in millions.


That would mean as basically the top of the pack of participants I’d only have a GDP of 27 billion and most people would have less money then Haiti. Even in a 1930s that’s totally inadequate, punt Austria had a GDP of about 24 billion in 1938 for example. Now if you made it post count = GDP in billions, then I’d be perfectly happy to have over 27.6 trillion, making me nearly as wealthy as the United States and EU combined, or for an alternative comparison the US/Japan/China/Germany and the UK combined, but other people might not like that. Once I have my 25 x CVBGs and enough amphibious shipping to move 40 armored divisions the world will fall before me.

A tiered system is going to work out better, and a max of 5 trillion works fine, it pretty much allows someone to either have a really big state that’s a China like state, or a smaller but very highly developed state like Japan, or some balance in-between those two extremes. In both cases 5 trillion would make the state wealthier, but whatever, its a close enough comparision.

20% Military Professionalism
20% Industrial Capacity
20% Population
20% Land Area
20% Science and Education
That system doesn’t work; it’s not enough variables and they are a bit contradictory. Higher science and education will naturally lead to higher professionalism for example, and what does land area even matter? Its what kind of land you have that counts.
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Post by Beowulf »

I think the system should still be tiered based on post count, not just straight linear post count system. Also, modifications based on moderator/senator status may be in order. Zor's system didn't work so well, since pretty much every moderator/senator already has the post count to make it moot.

The given variables aren't orthogonal to each other. Science and education typically have a strong correlation with industrial capacity, for example.
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Post by Steve »

Did a cheap re-do of my map. :P


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Post by Shroom Man 777 »

PeZook wrote:
Shroom Man 777 wrote:You can be South Africa. EXECUTIVE DECISIONS! Or was that EXECUTIVE OUTCOMES?

PeZook... what happens to King Paul? :(
He gets dicked around by Q and eventually accepts the burden of leading a new country, again, sacrificing his own needs for those he sees as deserving of a good life? :P
Good man.
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Shit! Man, I didn't think of that! It took Shroom to properly interpret the screams of dying people :D - PeZook
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Post by phongn »

Actually, what would be awesome is if Lonestar was the buffer between Shep and Sea Skimmer:mrgreen:
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Post by Coyote »

Sea Skimmer wrote:
Coyote wrote: But you can take those points and take away from some catergories to buff up other categories. I was thinking--

Stock Nation: Post Count = GDP, in millions.


That would mean as basically the top of the pack of participants I’d only have a GDP of 27 billion and most people would have less money then Haiti.
UYeah, I realized how truncated that would be after I logged off. It would have to be in billions, probably, rather than mere millions. Sooner or later, you're talking real money, after all.


20% Military Professionalism
20% Industrial Capacity
20% Population
20% Land Area
20% Science and Education
That system doesn’t work; it’s not enough variables and they are a bit contradictory. Higher science and education will naturally lead to higher professionalism for example, and what does land area even matter? Its what kind of land you have that counts.
It is arbitrary and it is not necessarily supposed to reflect properly balanced and complimentary assets. It's just a very quick and dirty way to address getting some variety to the nations, rather than just stamp-milling them out, and it addresses the types of things that I've noticed people are interested in.

It'ds the old playability-vs-realism canard; the more realistic something is, with all the variables for educated, economic classes, university availability, etc, to the nth degree and it becomes clunky and unwieldly, unless you're a professional number-cruncher who does this stuff for kicks. Most of us do not fall in that category. If it gets too complex, it becomes a chore.
Something about Libertarianism always bothered me. Then one day, I realized what it was:
Libertarian philosophy can be boiled down to the phrase, "Work Will Make You Free."


In Libertarianism, there is no Government, so the Bosses are free to exploit the Workers.
In Communism, there is no Government, so the Workers are free to exploit the Bosses.
So in Libertarianism, man exploits man, but in Communism, its the other way around!

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Post by Beowulf »

My suggestion:

Imperium 20k posts
$5 trillion GDP (PPP)
1 million km^2 (natural resources)
120 million population - 1st world living standard
240 fleet points
russian equivalent army
1000 planes (As opposed to helicopters, which typically will fall under either army or navy. All planes count, regardless of type. Tankers, transports, trainers count. Carrier aircraft count.)

Tsardom 5k posts
1/2 imperium

Kingdom 2.5k posts
1/2 tsardom

Principality 1k posts
1/2 kingdom

Duchy 50 posts or negative CT
1/2 principality

Modifiers:
+1 for mods & senators (including mini-mods)
+1 for longevity (only if really close to breakpoint)
-1 for dicks (looking at you, Shep)

adjustments:
You can shave off parts of one category to boost other categories. May not lower any category to below 50% of it's base. You may accept a lower standard of living in exchange for increased population.
Categories are:
Industry
Military
Natural resources
Population

fleet points:
carriers - 8
cruisers - 4
destroyer - 2
frigate - 1
attack submarine - 1
nuclear costs double (yes, this means a CVN costs 16 points)

Nuclear infrastructure, but no nuclear weapons

Weapon systems must either currently exist in service, or be straightforward extrapolations of in service weapon systems. Bonus: systems that are in prototype status can be taken in limited quantites. Example: F-35 can be acquired in low numbers, but can't be in widespread service. Ballistic and cruise missile submarines don't exist.

You can choose any nations weapon systems for your own. You can mix and match (have Russian tanks and American IFVs)

Time scale: 1 month = 1 year. Year begins on the first of the month.
Last edited by Beowulf on 2008-07-13 10:20pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Coyote »

As for a Moderator, I nominate...

STEVE

And as Mod, he gets his pick of nation level.
Something about Libertarianism always bothered me. Then one day, I realized what it was:
Libertarian philosophy can be boiled down to the phrase, "Work Will Make You Free."


In Libertarianism, there is no Government, so the Bosses are free to exploit the Workers.
In Communism, there is no Government, so the Workers are free to exploit the Bosses.
So in Libertarianism, man exploits man, but in Communism, its the other way around!

If all you want to do is have some harmless, mindless fun, go H3RE INST3ADZ0RZ!!
Grrr! Fight my Brute, you pansy!
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Post by Coyote »

Beowulf wrote:My suggestion:

Imperium 20k posts
Tsardom 5k posts
Kingdom 2.5k posts
Principality 1k posts
Duchy 50 posts or negative CT....


Modifiers:
+1 for mods & senators (including mini-mods)
+1 for longevity (only if really close to breakpoint)
-1 for dicks (looking at you, Shep)

adjustments:
You can shave off parts of one category to boost other categories. May not lower any category to below 50% of it's base. You may accept a lower standard of living in exchange for increased population.
Categories are:
Industry
Military
Natural resources
Population

fleet points:
carriers - 8
cruisers - 4
destroyer - 2
frigate - 1
attack submarine - 1
nuclear costs double (yes, this means a CVN costs 16 points)

Nuclear infrastructure, but no nuclear weapons

Weapon systems must either currently exist in service, or be straightforward extrapolations of in service weapon systems. Bonus: systems that are in prototype status can be taken in limited quantites. Example: F-35 can be acquired in low numbers, but can't be in widespread service. Ballistic and cruise missile submarines don't exist.

You can choose any nations weapon systems for your own. You can mix and match (have Russian tanks and American IFVs)

Time scale: 1 month = 1 year. Year begins on the first of the month.
I dig on all this.
Something about Libertarianism always bothered me. Then one day, I realized what it was:
Libertarian philosophy can be boiled down to the phrase, "Work Will Make You Free."


In Libertarianism, there is no Government, so the Bosses are free to exploit the Workers.
In Communism, there is no Government, so the Workers are free to exploit the Bosses.
So in Libertarianism, man exploits man, but in Communism, its the other way around!

If all you want to do is have some harmless, mindless fun, go H3RE INST3ADZ0RZ!!
Grrr! Fight my Brute, you pansy!
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Post by Mr Bean »

Coyote wrote:As for a Moderator, I nominate...

STEVE

And as Mod, he gets his pick of nation level.
Coyote I thought the whole idea of a dedicated Moderator this time around was to avoid all the issues we had with crazy ass shit going into the game with no lead-up because we had no one to moderate the game who was not also in the game(Conflict of interest!)

I tried my best to keep things going in the last game despite also being a part of it(And still trying to "win" IE archive my goals at the same time, COI!) and I kept it going and stopped two nuclear wars and the real thing never kicked off until I stopped watching the game 12/7.

We need a moderator this time around who's not taking direct part of the game, that's by default no matter who ends up with the job.


OAN, are we decided on a Re-do of modern day or a revisit to January 1st 1930?

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Post by Coyote »

Mr Bean wrote:
Coyote wrote:As for a Moderator, I nominate...

STEVE

And as Mod, he gets his pick of nation level.
Coyote I thought the whole idea of a dedicated Moderator this time around was to avoid all the issues we had ... because we had no one to moderate the game who was not also in the game(Conflict of interest!)

...We need a moderator this time around who's not taking direct part of the game, that's by default no matter who ends up with the job.


OAN, are we decided on a Re-do of modern day or a revisit to January 1st 1930?
Having a Mod who is not involved is, indeed, a plus.

And I thought that the modern/near-modern tech level had been the more popular option in the poll.
Something about Libertarianism always bothered me. Then one day, I realized what it was:
Libertarian philosophy can be boiled down to the phrase, "Work Will Make You Free."


In Libertarianism, there is no Government, so the Bosses are free to exploit the Workers.
In Communism, there is no Government, so the Workers are free to exploit the Bosses.
So in Libertarianism, man exploits man, but in Communism, its the other way around!

If all you want to do is have some harmless, mindless fun, go H3RE INST3ADZ0RZ!!
Grrr! Fight my Brute, you pansy!
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