star gate question

[dragon]

Was curios what is the difference between the ancient that they found buried in the ice that caused the carter and them to get sick due to advance nature compared to the ancients in Atlantis. Considering they ran into several of the Ancients in SG Atlantis yet they were not as evolved.

[Solauren]

The Ancients in the Pegasus galaxy were usually the result of either de-ascension, or stasis, or the rare isolated population.

The girl found on Earth is strongly hinted (later in the series) to have been an Atlantis-refugee.

More then likely, the Pegasus Ancients just haven't reached that stage yet, or Earth girl had been studying acension when she got sick, and didn't finish the process in time.

[dragon]

Didn't they say she had been buried for millions of years. Yet the war between the wraith and atlantis was only a few thousand ago. And the technology left behind the ancients in our galaxy seems to be far more advanced than the tech in the Atlantis galaxy.

[NecronLord]

The Ancients in the Pegasus galaxy were usually the result of either de-ascension, or stasis, or the rare isolated population.

The girl found on Earth is strongly hinted (later in the series) to have been an Atlantis-refugee.

Given that she was in the pilot, left behind at the outpost...

As for the difference, there isn't one, really. We didn't see Helia or any of her crew doing the healing kind of thing, but we didn't see them need to.

[Stargate Nerd]

As for the difference, there isn't one, really. We didn't see Helia or any of her crew doing the healing kind of thing, but we didn't see them need to.

Pretty much.

[dragon]

As for the difference, there isn't one, really. We didn't see Helia or any of her crew doing the healing kind of thing, but we didn't see them need to.

Pretty much.

But her advanced nature didn't make the humans sick like the one that was buried in the ice.

[Zac Naloen]

It wasn't her advanced nature that made them sick.

She was carrying a plague.

[dragon]

It wasn't her advanced nature that made them sick.

She was carrying a plague.

Ahh k been awhile so it was a bit fuzzy. That explains the difference

[DesertFly]

The plague is what ended up killing her in the episode, since healing our heroes took enough energy that she wasn't able to keep it at bay in her own body.

[dragon]

Do they ever explain why after miliions of years the people of Atlantis were still there and seemed to have not advanced much.

[Zac Naloen]

Do they ever explain why after miliions of years the people of Atlantis were still there and seemed to have not advanced much.

Seems to have been complacency, and considering the behaviour of the council towards Janes (sp?) in before I sleep unwillingness to experiment with certain technologies that would have made them a pretty much invincible race (i.e time travel) and their peaceful nature in the terms of weapons seems to have held them back in that regard as well.

[Timotheus]

Was curios what is the difference between the ancient that they found buried in the ice that caused the carter and them to get sick due to advance nature compared to the ancients in Atlantis. Considering they ran into several of the Ancients in SG Atlantis yet they were not as evolved.

The Ancient in the Ice could heal. The Ancients we have seen in Atlantis who are not acended have never been in a position where they needed to demonstrate if they have that power or not.

For all we know each of them had the ability to heal and there was just never a reason on-screen for us to see this ability.

[Johonebesus]

The woman on Earth was frozen in Antarctica for some 3,000,000 years, without any technological aid. She revived fully and, if I remember correctly, only died because she weakened herself in saving others. A crew of Pegasus Ancients put themselves in suspensions for a mere ten thousand years, and were almost dead of old age when found. That same crew didn't act any differently than an earthling, and didn't seem to recognize Shepard as one of their neo-humans. The Ancients we've seen in Atlantis have never displayed any psychic abilities. The times they have interacted with earthlings they have spoken and reacted as though they couldn't sense thoughts or feelings. They just don't seem like the highly advanced, almost ascended beings we were led to expect.

I have a little theory, one completely unsupported by the series, but one that could explain the total let down of the Ancients as they have been revealed. The Ancients in the Pegasus galaxy ascended shortly after arriving. Then the Wraith appeared, and some of the Altairans wanted to deal with them. They felt that the Wraith were their fault, since they had seeded the galaxy with their DNA and caused the bugs to become Wraith. Most of the Altairans wanted to stick with their non-intervention policy. Finally the ones who wanted to intervene were allowed to descend, but were limited to neo-human bodies instead of almost ascended Altairans. They still had access to great scientific and technological knowledge, but were lacking the enhanced abilities of the Ancients. Atlantis itself was modified to accommodate them, either by those who remained ascended or by the Atlanteans. Manual controls were added to most systems and the software was simplified to make it easier for normal humans to understand and operate. That's why the Ancients we have seen, except for the first one, have seemed so normal, why their technology looks so very different than the technology seen in the Milky Way, and why the earthlings have such an easy time interfacing with their technology. Obviously this is completely non cannon, but I think it works.

[Themightytom]

Well the girl in the ice left from Atlantis, she was in the recording the expedition found playing when they arrived and Dr Weit met her in "before I sleep". The Lanteans returned to Earth thousands of years ago whereas the girl is determined to have been in the ice for millions of years.

Either someone used a time ship or Radio Carbon dating doesn't work so well on ice.

The girl in the ice could have had portions of her brain shut down incementally, protecting the part that governs self healing and body chemistry to help her survive the cold, the Lanteans ins tasis might have had ALL of their brain functions artificially managed or engaged and nothing was repairing their bodies.

The healing ability seems to be linked to the wiring of the brain. Colonel O'neil was able to do it after sticking his face in that kaleidoscope thing.

I think the pegasus ancients won't interfere because they don't want to babysit. Wasnt there one who DID interfere and as punnishment they made her stand guard over the planet she tried to save?

I WOULD like to know why they haven't picked up the plague from any of the other ancients. orlinm Oma, the city full in before I sleep, the ones on various spaceships.... Apparently they can all keep the plague in check when they are at full strength but put them in a freezer and shit starts breaking down.

[Zac Naloen]

Well the girl in the ice left from Atlantis, she was in the recording the expedition found playing when they arrived and Dr Weit met her in "before I sleep". The Lanteans returned to Earth thousands of years ago whereas the girl is determined to have been in the ice for millions of years.

No she wasn't and no she didn't. She was in Rising and was left behind on Earth in the outposts control room.

I think the pegasus ancients won't interfere because they don't want to babysit. Wasnt there one who DID interfere and as punnishment they made her stand guard over the planet she tried to save?

Pegasus ancients returned to earth 10,000 years ago our time.

I WOULD like to know why they haven't picked up the plague from any of the other ancients. orlinm Oma, the city full in before I sleep, the ones on various spaceships.... Apparently they can all keep the plague in check when they are at full strength but put them in a freezer and shit starts breaking down.

The pegasus ancients left the milky way to escape the plague, i.e leaving all infected behind. It would have a bit stupid of them to leave if they were infected themselves.

The ones left behind took drastic measures and seemed to get more and more desperate in an attempt to survive i.e the messing with time travel stuff (window of opportunity) and the galactic reset button (Dakara).

In the end they focused on ascension. The pegasus ancients returned and then ascended themselves I can only assume after finding the milky way ancients knowledge if ascension that was left behind.

The gap in technology we seem to see between milky way and pegasus ancients can be put down to the desperate nature of the guys in the Milky way in their fight against the plague.

The ones in Pegasus just weren't in any rush until it was too late.

[Themightytom]

No she wasn't and no she didn't. She was in Rising and was left behind on Earth in the outposts control room.

Oh right I was confusing her with the girl from the hologram. that explains how she is so much older, she was left behind BEFORE Atlantis went to the pegasus galaxy.

I think the pegasus ancients won't interfere because they don't want to babysit. Wasnt there one who DID interfere and as punnishment they made her stand guard over the planet she tried to save?

Pegasus ancients returned to earth 10,000 years ago our time.

The unascended ones did. There were still ascended ones, IE: the woman in sanctuary, and the ascended ancients that were preventing her from intering even MORE.

The pegasus ancients left the milky way to escape the plague, i.e leaving all infected behind. It would have a bit stupid of them to leave if they were infected themselves.

[/quote]

not neccessarily, they could have been relocating because the galaxy was mostly dead and they didn't want to be around when they activated Dakara to reshape it.

The ones left behind took drastic measures and seemed to get more and more desperate in an attempt to survive i.e the messing with time travel stuff (window of opportunity) and the galactic reset button (Dakara).

That could just as easily have happened before Atlantis left.

In the end they focused on ascension. The pegasus ancients returned and then ascended themselves I can only assume after finding the milky way ancients knowledge if ascension that was left behind.

There was a colony in pegasus that seemed to know a lot about ascension, as they were on the verge of it themselves, and there was the girl in sanctuary as well.

The gap in technology we seem to see between milky way and pegasus ancients can be put down to the desperate nature of the guys in the Milky way in their fight against the plague.

The ones in Pegasus just weren't in any rush until it was too late

The act of abandoning your city and way of life to live as hermits on a primitive world meets the criteria for abandoning your connections to the physical world.

[Lancer]

The Atlantean Ancients and the Milky Way Ancients diverged significantly. There were periods where Atlantean Ancient activity would overlap with that of the Goa'uld. For example, Merlin would have been around for when Sokar was kidnapping people from western Europe, Janus, upon his return to Earth, was one of the gods of Rome who taught them to build Roads and was active up until a few centures before the present, and both would have been contemporanous with Seth.

Incidentally, this might also explain why the SGC chose to name the Apollo. The Goa'uld don't have a stranglehold on being considered gods, as evidenced by Janus, the Asgard, Nem and Omorocas race, and the cystal-skull aliens. Apollo could very well have been an Ancient rather than a Goa'uld.

[Themightytom]

Apollo as an ancient is just really hard to explain given that Athena is a Goa'uld, although they could ahve been offspring off an ancient from Atlantis (Zeus) and a goa'uld posessed Athena. The goa'uld wouldn't neccesarily have advanced technological knowledge or particularly amazing physical abilities if the mother was baseline human.


If the gate was buried in Egypt and no one had any technology lying around then janus could have been in Italy while Athena et al were in Greece (But jesus christ thats a hike from frigging Antarctica for janus!),

not "knowing" who or what janus was, Goa'uld on other parts of the planet may not have heard or cared who was doing w2hat ina far off land. Even if they were "aware" they might not have had much to work with. Baals notions about controlling the humans were very different from the other Goa'ulds. The Tauri became powerful enough to rival him.

Conversely, if the stranded Goa'uld became weak enough, losing technology and their jaffa servants, they might avhe decided mto use honey rather than vinegar, and pose as relatively benevolent gods in Greece, to get technology and infrastructure moving along for their own purposes.

[Lancer]

Some of the Atlantean Ancients who returned were the "gods" that guided the foundation of Rome and taught them how to be fantastic engineers. Latin is even the bastard offspring of the Ancient language.

Besides, the Goa'uld only came to Earth from time to time to pick up new slaves. Aside from Ra, no other Goa'uld has had a significant presence on Earth; any attempts to do so were likely repelled by one of the many other advanced races that had a presence on Earth (the Asgard or the Crystal Skull aliens).

[Lex]

sorry to interrupt, but who are the "Crystal Skull" aliens?

[CaptainChewbacca]

sorry to interrupt, but who are the "Crystal Skull" aliens?

Also known as 'The Giant Aliens.

[NecronLord]

The pegasus ancients left the milky way to escape the plague, i.e leaving all infected behind. It would have a bit stupid of them to leave if they were infected themselves.

That seems incredibly unlikely. Watch Rising again. There's an ancient man talking to an infected woman, before getting on Atlantis and going with them. It's never been said that they left to flee the plague. They had the plague at that time, and must have taken it with them and cured it later.

The ones left behind took drastic measures and seemed to get more and more desperate in an attempt to survive i.e the messing with time travel stuff (window of opportunity) and the galactic reset button (Dakara).

In the end they focused on ascension. The pegasus ancients returned and then ascended themselves I can only assume after finding the milky way ancients knowledge if ascension that was left behind.

The gap in technology we seem to see between milky way and pegasus ancients can be put down to the desperate nature of the guys in the Milky way in their fight against the plague.

The ones in Pegasus just weren't in any rush until it was too late.

That's a whole lot of fanon right there.


All that's in the canon was; The ancients had a plague, millions of years ago, they built things like the time loop device, and eventually, Dakara, to repopulate the galaxy. Millions of years ago, while one ancient was still carrying the plague, Atlantis left on a colony mission.

Honestly, there are millions of years here, we know nothing about. There's no reason to think that the Ancients on board Atlantis, and the Ancients they left behind (if any, other than Aiyana) were a seperate culture at all; they had stargates, and ZPMs, not to mention all sorts of means of communication. While eventually, they lost interest in the Milky Way (which seemed to have a relative dearth of intelligent life until the Goa'uld began seeding it in earnest) that doesn't make them seperate cultures, even if their capital was in Atlantis. To them, travelling from the Teonas outpost to Atlantis would be much easier than it would be for me to go to London.

I don't see why people need to think of them as different cultures.

[NecronLord]

If the gate was buried in Egypt and no one had any technology lying around then janus could have been in Italy while Athena et al were in Greece (But jesus christ thats a hike from frigging Antarctica for janus!),

SG1's chronology has the gate being buried in 3000 BC. The Ancients left around 8000 BC. Presumably there was an operational gate in egypt.

Amusingly, one of the non-canon books suggests that at least one ancient geneticist remained on Earth paying tribute to Ra, but the book was, all in all, quite silly.

[Zac Naloen]

That seems incredibly unlikely. Watch Rising again. There's an ancient man talking to an infected woman, before getting on Atlantis and going with them. It's never been said that they left to flee the plague. They had the plague at that time, and must have taken it with them and cured it later.

It's already established that they are capable of healing at least one other being without significant risk to themselves. I don't see any practical reason for them to leave the Milky Way UNLESS they have been healed themselves and seperated from the population. Frankly if they left the Milky Way whilst still infected and spawned Humans in the Pegasus galaxy that is fucking stupid because they'd be right back at square one again if the plague got into the general population.

[Johonebesus]

SG1's chronology has the gate being buried in 3000 BC. The Ancients left around 8000 BC. Presumably there was an operational gate in egypt.

Yes there was, under Ra's control. The movie put the date of Ra's arrival at around twelve and a half thousand years ago, and a minimum of ten millennia was given as the age of Osiris' ship in one episode. That could explain why the Ancients didn't establish a new base instead of losing their technology and mingling with the modern humans; most of them were captured and/or killed by Ra or his Jaffa. That could also be how Ra got a ZPM and the Eye of Ra.

Or maybe the writers have decided to ret-con the dates, just as they seemingly decided that the Goa'uld adopted the personas of human gods that already existed in myth, rather of inspiring those myths to begin with as was stated in the movie and assumed in the early seasons.