BBC News wrote:US presidential hopeful Barack Obama has told crowds in Berlin that the US and Europe have drifted apart and it is time for them to come together again.
"If we're honest... we know that sometimes, on both sides of the Atlantic, we have drifted apart and forgotten our shared destiny," he said.
Mr Obama is due to fly to France and the UK as he continues his world tour.
His Republican rival John McCain says that while Mr Obama is in Europe, he is focusing on issues challenging the US.
"I'd love to give a speech in Germany but I'd much prefer to do it as president of the United States rather than as a candidate for president," Mr McCain told reporters.
At least 200,000 people heard Mr Obama make the only public speech of the Democratic Party candidate's world tour.
His words were broadcast live in Germany, where he is a popular figure.
Mr Obama began by paying tribute to the Berliners who held out against Soviet pressure during the blockade in 1948.
Appealing for a renewed partnership with Europe, he identified terrorism, nuclear proliferation, trade barriers and climate change as global challenges.
Mr Obama's appearance had the air of a rock concert in the Tiergarten Park, a place that has become associated with huge feel-good football parties in recent years, the BBC's James Coomarasamy reports.
His rhetorical flights and unusual background have captured the imagination of a country which views its own politicians as rather dour and grey, our correspondent says.
'Intertwined world'
"While the 20th Century taught us that we share a common destiny, the 21st has revealed a world more intertwined than at any time in human history," Mr Obama said.
"In Europe, the view that America is part of what has gone wrong in our world, rather than a force to help make it right, has become all too common," he continued.
"In America, there are voices that deride and deny the importance of Europe's role in our security and our future.
"But the burdens of global citizenship continue to bind us together," he added.
He said that partnership and co-operation among nations was "not a choice".
"It is the one way, the only way, to protect our common security and advance our common humanity," he argued.
He spoke on Afghanistan, a sensitive issue in Germany because of pressure for it to send more troops.
Mr Obama said it was time to renew nations' resolve to "rout the terrorists who threaten our security in Afghanistan and the traffickers who sell drugs on your streets".
"The Afghan people need our troops and your troops... we have too much at stake to turn back now," he said.
Mr Obama addressed many issues in his speech:
World tour
- He said it was time to "defeat terror and dry up the well of extremism that supports it", arguing that Islamic extremism could be defeated just as communism had been in its time
- He urged support for the Iraqis rebuilding their lives as the US passes responsibility to the Iraqi government and "finally brings this war to a close"
- It was the moment, he said, to "renew the goal of a world without nuclear weapons" and not "stand idly by and watch the further spread of the deadly atom"
- He urged all countries to act with "the same seriousness of purpose" as Germany to reduce carbon emissions
- He called for global trade "that is free and fair for all"
Mr Obama's visit to Berlin kicked off the European leg of his world tour ahead of November's US presidential election.
Earlier, he met German leaders including Chancellor Angela Merkel.
Mr Obama flew to Germany after visiting Afghanistan, Iraq, Israel, the West Bank and Jordan, and is due to visit France on Friday, before heading to the UK.
Most Germans seem to believe that an Obama victory in November would do much to improve relations between the US and Europe, our correspondent says.
This speech is being compared to those made in Berlin by John F Kennedy and Ronald Reagan - but they were sitting presidents.
For Mr Obama to become president himself, this event - and the tour of which it is part - must be seen in a positive light by the voters back home in America, our correspondent says.
Obama conquers Europe
Moderators: Alyrium Denryle, Edi, K. A. Pital
Obama conquers Europe
The German police was expecting a few tens of thousands of people to show up; in the end, Obama spoke before a quarter of a million.
- Darth Yoshi
- Metroid
- Posts: 7342
- Joined: 2002-07-04 10:00pm
- Location: Seattle
- Contact:
...Wow. That's quite a crowd. And he's not even president yet.
Fragment of the Lord of Nightmares, release thy heavenly retribution. Blade of cold, black nothingness: become my power, become my body. Together, let us walk the path of destruction and smash even the souls of the Gods! RAGNA BLADE!
Lore Monkey | the Pichu-master™
Secularism—since AD 80
Av: Elika; Prince of Persia
Lore Monkey | the Pichu-master™
Secularism—since AD 80
Av: Elika; Prince of Persia
Damn darky rilling up the Frenchies.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong
But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
- Fingolfin_Noldor
- Emperor's Hand
- Posts: 11834
- Joined: 2006-05-15 10:36am
- Location: At the Helm of the HAB Star Dreadnaught Star Fist
Well, one might assume that they used a translator.hongi wrote:How did the crowd understand Obama?
It's 106 miles to Chicago, we got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark... and we're wearing sunglasses.
Hit it.
Blank Yellow (NSFW)
Hit it.
Blank Yellow (NSFW)
"Mostly Harmless Nutcase"
- Fingolfin_Noldor
- Emperor's Hand
- Posts: 11834
- Joined: 2006-05-15 10:36am
- Location: At the Helm of the HAB Star Dreadnaught Star Fist
Everyone in Europe understands English. Except for the Iberians and Slavs.hongi wrote:How did the crowd understand Obama?
(possibly the French as well, but they tend to feign ignorance of the language Mon Ami)
"The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."
- Fingolfin_Noldor
- Emperor's Hand
- Posts: 11834
- Joined: 2006-05-15 10:36am
- Location: At the Helm of the HAB Star Dreadnaught Star Fist
I was once told that they learn their home language and English and one other. That's the typical number of languages they get tested for the International Baclaurate.hongi wrote:Just makes me want to move to Europe even more...I would imagine that many of these people are actually trilingual.
Do they teach English as an elective in their schools?
STGOD: Byzantine Empire
Your spirit, diseased as it is, refuses to allow you to give up, no matter what threats you face... and whatever wreckage you leave behind you.
Kreia
Your spirit, diseased as it is, refuses to allow you to give up, no matter what threats you face... and whatever wreckage you leave behind you.
Kreia
- Colonel Olrik
- The Spaminator
- Posts: 6121
- Joined: 2002-08-26 06:54pm
- Location: Munich, Germany
I beg your pardon, Portuguese and even the bastardly Spanish understand English quite well since it's taught as the second language for at least 7 years at school, and our TV shows are transmitted in the original language. More, according to your female compatriots my accent gets their panties wet.Lonestar wrote:Everyone in Europe understands English. Except for the Iberians and Slavs.hongi wrote:How did the crowd understand Obama?
(possibly the French as well, but they tend to feign ignorance of the language Mon Ami)
- Dahak
- Emperor's Hand
- Posts: 7292
- Joined: 2002-10-29 12:08pm
- Location: Admiralty House, Landing, Manticore
- Contact:
Generally, it is normal to have English in school.
When, how long, and how intense depends on the federal state and type of school, though.
When, how long, and how intense depends on the federal state and type of school, though.
Great Dolphin Conspiracy - Chatter box
"Implications: we have been intercepted deliberately by a means unknown, for a purpose unknown, and transferred to a place unknown by a form of intelligence unknown. Apart from the unknown, everything is obvious." ZORAC
GALE Force Euro Wimp
Human dignity shall be inviolable. To respect and protect it shall be the duty of all state authority.
I couldn't get a high school diploma without knowing Dutch, French, English and German on a conversational level. Even the most maths-heavy (and therefore language-light) program has a French and English requirement.
As for Germans, I would be really surprised if most, if not all, Germans under 50 did not have a working knowledge of English. On a continent this small, you're basically screwed if you're not at least bilingual.
As for Germans, I would be really surprised if most, if not all, Germans under 50 did not have a working knowledge of English. On a continent this small, you're basically screwed if you're not at least bilingual.
Gah, no edit. The speech was on TV just now, along with McCain's reaction: Obama spoke before a crowd of thousands in one of the most important squares of the German capital; McCain went to a German restaurant and whined about "not wanting to give speeches until he's elected".
It's worth noting that McCain did a euro trip too last March, and... nobody really noticed.
It's worth noting that McCain did a euro trip too last March, and... nobody really noticed.
-
- Jedi Knight
- Posts: 566
- Joined: 2008-04-17 10:09pm
- Location: England
Pretty much every european you'll meet will have learnt English at some point, and more than a few are trilingual if not even more. Theres people I know from Portugal and Holland who speak English better than people I know living here in England, unlike some places its normal for them to know at least their home language and a foreign one (usually English due to the massive prevalence of it as a second language already).
“The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that the English language is as pure as a crib-house whore. It not only borrows words from other languages; it has on occasion chased other languages down dark alley-ways, clubbed them unconscious and rifled their pockets for new vocabulary. “
- James Nicoll
- James Nicoll
I know English as well as my native language, I know Swedish and German well enough that immersion for six months would allow me to speak passably, a year or two and I'd be fluent. On top of that, I know a bit of Italian, but very little.
English is by and large the common language of Europe regardless of borders, especially among younger people.
English is by and large the common language of Europe regardless of borders, especially among younger people.
Warwolf Urban Combat Specialist
Why is it so goddamned hard to get little assholes like you to admit it when you fuck up? Is it pride? What gives you the right to have any pride?
–Darth Wong to vivftp
GOP message? Why don't they just come out of the closet: FASCISTS R' US –Patrick Degan
The GOP has a problem with anyone coming out of the closet. –18-till-I-die
Why is it so goddamned hard to get little assholes like you to admit it when you fuck up? Is it pride? What gives you the right to have any pride?
–Darth Wong to vivftp
GOP message? Why don't they just come out of the closet: FASCISTS R' US –Patrick Degan
The GOP has a problem with anyone coming out of the closet. –18-till-I-die
- Zac Naloen
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 5488
- Joined: 2003-07-24 04:32pm
- Location: United Kingdom
I just watched the speech.
This man needs to be president.
Get to it America.
This man needs to be president.
Get to it America.
Member of the Unremarkables
Just because you're god, it doesn't mean you can treat people that way : - My girlfriend
Evil Brit Conspiracy - Insignificant guy
- MichaelFerrariF1
- Youngling
- Posts: 117
- Joined: 2008-05-07 11:49pm
- Location: Houston, TX
English is the official language of international European organizations, like F1, for instance. On TV they'll sometimes tune in to team radios and the drivers and spotters all talk to each other in English, even if both are Italian, German, etc. If you look at the websites of BMW Sauber of Toyota (both are based in Germany), they don't list speaking German as a requirement for employment, but English.
You need a Ferrari, no, two Ferraris powersliding around a Bentley...that's also powersliding. - Jeremy Clarkson
I couldn't agree more. It feels like for the first time in eight long years, you can in good faith cheer for a US politician. Seeing people waving the stars and stripes without setting them on fire was a weird sight...Zac Naloen wrote:I just watched the speech.
This man needs to be president.
Get to it America.
Well sir I would have to disagree with you.Colonel Olrik wrote: I beg your pardon, Portuguese and even the bastardly Spanish understand English quite well since it's taught as the second language for at least 7 years at school, and our TV shows are transmitted in the original language.
Pff, they do what with all the Euro-accents...cept maybe the more German/Slavic ones.More, according to your female compatriots my accent gets their panties wet.
"The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."
- Zac Naloen
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 5488
- Joined: 2003-07-24 04:32pm
- Location: United Kingdom
The weird part is that even that report doesn't come close to doing it justice.Bounty wrote:I couldn't agree more. It feels like for the first time in eight long years, you can in good faith cheer for a US politician. Seeing people waving the stars and stripes without setting them on fire was a weird sight...Zac Naloen wrote:I just watched the speech.
This man needs to be president.
Get to it America.
It's one of the best speeches i've watched this year from any politician.
Member of the Unremarkables
Just because you're god, it doesn't mean you can treat people that way : - My girlfriend
Evil Brit Conspiracy - Insignificant guy
- Darth Onasi
- Jedi Knight
- Posts: 816
- Joined: 2008-03-02 07:56pm
- Location: On a beach beating Gackt to death with a parasol
- FSTargetDrone
- Emperor's Hand
- Posts: 7878
- Joined: 2004-04-10 06:10pm
- Location: Drone HQ, Pennsylvania, USA
Hey come on now, McCain was also in a supermarket yesterday. And, um, he almost went to an oil rig!Bounty wrote:McCain went to a German restaurant and whined about "not wanting to give speeches until he's elected".
It's worth noting that McCain did a euro trip too last March, and... nobody really noticed.
McCain struggles to be heard in face of Obama trip
By TOM RAUM – 52 minutes ago
DENVER (AP) — In the face of Barack Obama's overseas tour de force, rival presidential candidate John McCain struggled to be heard. Yet amid the awkward moments, he managed to campaign busily in key battleground states and to raise millions of dollars at fundraisers.
Polls in many swing states are close, and some are tightening. The Arizona Republican sought to turn this to his advantage in what was clearly a difficult week to be a stay-at-home candidate.
He repeatedly emphasized his long military and congressional background, scolded Obama from afar on foreign policy, and kept playfully fueling speculation that he was close to picking a running mate.
McCain faced another opportunity to showcase his history as a Vietnam prisoner of war in a speech Friday in Denver to the American GI Forum Convention, a largely Hispanic military group. That also gave him a chance to court the valued Hispanic vote. McCain was also to visit the Dalai Lama in Aspen, Colo., before heading home to Sedona, Ariz., for the weekend. It was to be his first visit with the Tibetan spiritual leader.
Everywhere he went — in New Hampshire, Maine, Pennsylvania, Ohio and here in Colorado — the Arizona senator drew warm and appreciative crowds. No matter that many, if not most, of those in the audiences were senior citizens. Seniors vote in big numbers.
For the most part, the side-by-side images weren't pretty:
_Obama meeting with leaders in Iraq, McCain on a golf cart in Kennebunkport, Maine, with the first President Bush.
_Obama before a sweeping Israeli landscape, McCain holding a news conference in a supermarket in Bethlehem — Pennsylvania, that is — and narrowly escaping an attack from a tumbling stack of mayonnaise jars.
_Obama delivering his trip's keynote speech at Berlin's Victory Column, McCain eating bratwurst and chatting with reporters at a German restaurant in Columbus, Ohio.
McCain responds philosophically when asked about being overshadowed by his rival's overseas trip and outsize attention: "It is what it is."
In the final analysis, McCain said at week's end, "I'm glad Sen. Obama went to Iraq."
However, it would have been better, McCain added in the inevitable dig, had the Illinois Democrat not "announced his policy before he left."
Overall, "I feel fine," McCain said about how the week turned out.
That McCain would be overshadowed seemed inevitable. No opposition party candidate could have shined under such circumstances.
McCain aides showed clear frustration with what they saw as lopsided news coverage, and McCain himself seemed peevish at times.
McCain has inched ahead of Obama in Colorado, come within inches in Minnesota and narrowed the gap in Michigan and Wisconsin, according to Quinnipiac University polls of likely voters in these battleground states. The polls, taken for The Wall Street Journal and washingtonpost.com, showed voters in each state saying energy policy is more important than the war in Iraq.
Obama's "post-primary bubble hasn't burst, but it is leaking a bit," said Peter Brown, assistant director of the Quinnipiac University Polling Institute. "The good news for McCain is that he has improved his standing in Colorado and Michigan, two states that are critical to each man's strategy."
McCain sought to focus attention on energy and the economy, but he kept getting distracted, finding himself continuously reacting to Obama.
He raised the heat of his criticism. Before, McCain had defended his support of the Iraq war by saying he would rather win a war than win an election. This week, he took it a step further, suggesting Obama would rather lose a war to win an election. That subjected McCain to a wave of Democratic criticism.
Then, in an interview with CBS, McCain asserted that President Bush's "surge" had helped inspire the Anbar Province awakening in which Sunni chieftans stopped fighting the U.S. and began to fight al-Qaida. Democrats gleefully pointed out that the Anbar rebellion happened before Bush announced his troop buildup in January 2007 and the extra troops began arriving that March.
McCain backed and filled, suggesting what the administration likes to call the "surge" was a counterinsurgency movement that actually began months before Bush's troop buildup. It was a matter of semantics, he suggested, prompting another wave of Democratic ridicule.
There were other possible disconnects. He suggested he would love to give a speech in Germany, as Obama had. But he said he would prefer touring the U.S. heartland to deal with economic woes affecting Americans. This from the candidate who recently left the country to give trade-focused speeches in Mexico and Canada.
He planned to visit an offshore oil rig on Wednesday to promote his call for more offshore drilling. But rough waters from the remnants of Hurricane Dolly caused a postponement.
That seemed to annoy him the most, aides suggested. And he mentioned his regret at not going to the rig at nearly every stop afterward.