Books to Avoid

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-01-27 08:21pm

I disagree about Asimov. Salvor Hardin and Hober Mallow were good characters, and Baily I liked...

But avoid 'Prelude to Foundation'.

WTF was Asimov THINKING?

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-01-27 08:22pm

I disagree about Asimov. Salvor Hardin and Hober Mallow were good characters, and Baily I liked...

But avoid 'Prelude to Foundation'.

WTF was Asimov THINKING?

On, and on the topic of virtual reality seeming real- when playing X-Wing Alliance, online or off, I've often found my head swerving to the side as I turn.

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-01-27 10:27pm

Darth Garden Gnome wrote:You can hardly dismiss cyberpunk on the fact that you don't find the girl hot. (btu frankly either do I).

No. My point was that he was trying to get me to like cyberpunk because The Matrix is supposedly cyberpunk. I was just saying that I don't think The Matrix is that great. Nothing to do with cyberpunk at all.

Thats because Neo is the one, he can bend the Matrix to his will. For christs sake he can fly goddamnit!

No, because he wasn't in the chopper and that was before he realize he was "the one." Plus, if he were "the one" he wouldn't have let it explode. He would have let it keep bending.

To quote Morpheus "Your mind makes it real." Something along th elines of it being so real your brain can't tell the difference.

So? That does not mean your brain can actually make physical damage to your body real. As described before by beyond hope, Neo reacted as if he were getting punched when he was moving around and stuff...but that doesn't explain why there was real damage to his body. I vaguely remember there being blood on him. But I don't remember it that well...

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2003-01-28 12:13am

19th century book "Tess and the D'Urbervilles".

JESUS H CHRIST, IT IS THE MOST BORING BOOK EVER.

I couldn't finish reading it for class. I went and read the chapter summaries.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2003-01-28 12:17am

And yes, Neo had blood coming out of his mouth when he was getting the shit beat out of him by the agents. I always thought that was total bullshit, but I suppose the movies don't really work without that.

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-01-28 12:24am

Yay chalk up another one for 'ol Joe.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2003-01-28 12:57am

IRG CommandoJoe wrote:. Secondly, there's a scene which makes no sense at all. The part where the helicopter smashes into the building, but the building bends in before exploding. WTF is that? If computers were powerful enough to generate an entire universe that people live in that is an exact duplicate of the real world, why would that happen? I'm sure if some computers that complex exists, they'd be able to accurately simulate real physics.

Glass distorts when it breaks, which is why you can't piece together broken pieces easily. A large building covered with thin, inter-connected glass windows COULD presumably ripple sort of like that... but it was dramatized for the 'holy shit that's cool' factor.

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-01-28 01:07am

Um...are you serious? The entire area where the chopper met with the building rippled, including the frame, and it looked nothing like what one would expect to see if glass was distorted from impact. I think only bullet-proof glass does that anyway.

EDIT: Maybe if it were in slow-motion, it might have explained it. I saw shots of a bullet hitting bullet-proof glass in slow motion. There WAS a ripple like that, but only in slow-motion. And the ripple would only affect the glass, not the entire region around the glass. So there would be multiple ripples for each window.

Sriad · Post by **Sriad** » 2003-01-28 01:21am

Although "The Girl Who Was Plugged In" was a great story, it was by James Tiptree Jr, not Gibson. (S)he won a Hugo for it, at least... You can tell an author's greatness by their stories names: "The Boy Who Waterskied To Forever," "Love Is The Plan, The Plan Is Death," "The Psychologist Who Wouldn't Do Awful Things to Rats"... You can probably find Tiptree at a used bookstore pretty easily, or if not your library is bound to have some.

As to Trinity's hotness, while I agree that she isn't "OMFGICMP" hot, she's top 5% of population hot at least.

As to the rippling glass... well, the whole movie was stylized, I can't really fault them for going over the top there. And the scene -was- slow mo, just not enough to account for it.

As to the actual topic, I've recommended that no one ever read "The Number of the Beast" before now, but it bears repeating.

Sriad · Post by **Sriad** » 2003-01-28 01:29am

IRG CommandoJoe wrote:
To quote Morpheus "Your mind makes it real." Something along th elines of it being so real your brain can't tell the difference.
So? That does not mean your brain can actually make physical damage to your body real. As described before by beyond hope, Neo reacted as if he were getting punched when he was moving around and stuff...but that doesn't explain why there was real damage to his body. I vaguely remember there being blood on him. But I don't remember it that well...

Neo coughed blood on at least one occasion, but it's worth noting that, for example, when he was shot five times in the chest his heart completly failed to explode into a gooey pulp. There are a few easy explanations: A) he was really tense so he bit his tongue or cheek or somethin'; or B) His brain was "making it real" by contracting his rib-muscles where he was punched. I've exhaled without being hit hard enough to bruise my ribs before, and I was awake with some level of concious control. It wouldn't suprise me terribly if Neo was so into it he cracked a rib or two. And later on he spasamed so hard he stopped his own heart.
I don't remember what damage if any the rest of the crew suffered, but that probably isn't anything that can't be accounted for either.

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-01-28 01:41am

Sriad wrote:Neo coughed blood on at least one occasion, but it's worth noting that, for example, when he was shot five times in the chest his heart completly failed to explode into a gooey pulp. There are a few easy explanations: A) he was really tense so he bit his tongue or cheek or somethin'; or B) His brain was "making it real" by contracting his rib-muscles where he was punched. I've exhaled without being hit hard enough to bruise my ribs before, and I was awake with some level of concious control. It wouldn't suprise me terribly if Neo was so into it he cracked a rib or two. And later on he spasamed so hard he stopped his own heart.
I don't remember what damage if any the rest of the crew suffered, but that probably isn't anything that can't be accounted for either.

Thanks for clearing that up. The rest of the crew, as far as I remember, just slumped over when that guy pulled the plugs out. But I remember their hearts stopped beating. If they were to be yanked out of the Matrix like that, would that really happen or would they just go insane or braindead or what? I think braindead is the most likely thing to happen, but would their heart stop pumping immediately after going braindead?

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-01-28 01:49am

IRG CommandoJoe wrote:Thanks for clearing that up. The rest of the crew, as far as I remember, just slumped over when that guy pulled the plugs out. But I remember their hearts stopped beating. If they were to be yanked out of the Matrix like that, would that really happen or would they just go insane or braindead or what? I think braindead is the most likely thing to happen, but would their heart stop pumping immediately after going braindead?

I believe it would if it killed the hindbrain also. That controls all autonomous body functions, and is the most primitive and most essential (for life) part of the brain.

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-01-28 02:05am

Hmm...but would the whole brain be rendered useless? Because this is just what his brain feels...the parts of the brain that make him conscious. Not the parts of the brain that make up his subconscious, right?

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-01-28 02:17am

I'm not sure. I haven't seen the movie in a while, but I remember thinking the first time I saw the probe that it looked like it would go through the hind and midbrain to reach the forebrain. Someone with more of a neurobiological background is needed to answer this question decisively.

Malecoda · Post by **Malecoda** » 2003-01-28 12:25pm

Thanks Sriad for the clarifiction. I knew Gibson didn't sound right for that.

Commando Joe, how could you sit there and say I was trying to get you to LIKE CP? I was making the point that I DIDN'T like it! Jesus.

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-01-28 12:37pm

I'm sorry, I was going by memory.

Darth Garden Gnome wrote:Aha! You lose sucka. You know you like cyberpunk, as I do. Admit to the healing powers of it my friends! it'll cure what ales ya!

(Glares at Darth Garden Gnome.)
Malecoda, we must join together in arms and fight this...terrifying evil...!!!

Malecoda · Post by **Malecoda** » 2003-01-28 12:55pm

Post by **Zaia** » 2003-01-28 01:22pm

HemlockGrey wrote:
The bible should be a mandatory read in elementary school, along with an explanation as to why it is a vile book. We'd have more atheists that way.
Too bad we in America have that little bit about 'seperation of church and state'.

Yeah, except when that seperation is conveniently forgotten, like when elementary school kids say the pledge of alleigence every morning with "one nation, under God" in it.

As for books to avoid, I'd have to say The Grapes of Wrath by John Steinbeck. Yes, it's supposed to be a classic, but hundreds and hundreds of pages decribing the dust of the dust bowl and exactly how dusty it is doesn't enthrall me. Bleck.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-01-28 01:24pm

Zaia wrote:As for books to avoid, I'd have to say The Grapes of Wrath by John Steinbeck. Yes, it's supposed to be a classic, but hundreds and hundreds of pages decribing the dust of the dust bowl and exactly how dusty it is doesn't enthrall me. Bleck.

My best essay in high school was when I analyzed that book and dismissed it as Communist propaganda. I wish I knew where that paper was now.

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-01-28 01:35pm

The Dark wrote:
Zaia wrote:As for books to avoid, I'd have to say The Grapes of Wrath by John Steinbeck. Yes, it's supposed to be a classic, but hundreds and hundreds of pages decribing the dust of the dust bowl and exactly how dusty it is doesn't enthrall me. Bleck.
My best essay in high school was when I analyzed that book and dismissed it as Communist propaganda. I wish I knew where that paper was now.

LOL

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-01-28 05:10pm

Dahak:

It's TOLKIEN.

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2003-01-28 05:18pm

IRG CommandoJoe wrote:(Glares at Darth Garden Gnome.)
Malecoda, we must join together in arms and fight this...terrifying evil...!!!

Failure is all you will get in return[Palpatine] It is unavoidable.[/Palpatine]

Of course, I'm not nearly as huge a cyberpunk fan as I preach to be. The genre is confusing, the characters and/or plots are often one dimensional, and the fact that it died out long ago (save stuff liek the Matrix) proves it.

None the less.....YOU WILL LOVE CYBERPUNK![Vader]It is your destiny![/Vader]

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-01-28 05:46pm

[Luke]No! I'll never join you![/Luke]
(Hops in X-Wing and starts blasting up the Matrix "servers.")
(Squiddies deploy.)
(Calls in for Rogue Squadron B-Wing and Y-Wing backup.)
(Rogue Squadron disables them with their ion cannons.)
(All starfighters start launching proton torpedoes at the Matrix thermal exhaust port...er...USB ports....err.....BOOM!)
(Neo, Trinity, Morpheus, and all of the agents die when they are in the Matrix, thus screwing up the plot forever.)
(On the way out of the Matrix, the starfighters blast up the "submarine," killing everyone else.)
(Starfighters plot a course from intercepted data to Zion.)

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2003-01-28 05:55pm

IRG CommandoJoe wrote:[Luke]No! I'll never join you![/Luke]
(Hops in X-Wing and starts blasting up the Matrix "servers.")
(Squiddies deploy.)
(Calls in for Rogue Squadron B-Wing and Y-Wing backup.)
(Rogue Squadron disables them with their ion cannons.)
(All starfighters start launching proton torpedoes at the Matrix thermal exhaust port...er...USB ports....err.....BOOM!)
(Neo, Trinity, Morpheus, and all of the agents die when they are in the Matrix, thus screwing up the plot forever.)

NOOOOO!!!!

*throws ceramic garden gnome at IRG's head* STUPID ROYAL GUARD!!!!

*hops in shuttle and escapes the....exploding....Matrix....er....yeah...*

There will be a next time! I'll build a bigger, stronger Matrix. The Matrix II! And I'll tip off those annoying RGs to attack it, BUT IT'LL BE A TRAP! And I'll foolishly let a commandoe team attack my....er....USB port? And THEN I'll foolishly not let my ISDs attack their fleet, only using fighters.

AND THEN! I'll foolishy bring IRG CommandoJoe to my bridge (where there will be a brain-bugish bottomless pit-o-doom) and try to convert him to....to...um...the gnomish side? Er...yeah...ITS A GREAT PLAN! I've seen way too many sci-fi movies to know that this plan is foolproof.

[Palpatine]Now witness the firepower of this fully armed and operational.....USB...port...uh...BOOM?[/Palpatine]

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-01-28 06:01pm

Zaia wrote:As for books to avoid, I'd have to say The Grapes of Wrath by John Steinbeck. Yes, it's supposed to be a classic, but hundreds and hundreds of pages decribing the dust of the dust bowl and exactly how dusty it is doesn't enthrall me. Bleck.

Ugh.

Forced to read.

My English teacher was also a traditionalist who told us we all had to go to church.

You do the math on how much I loved that class.