...and the Dumbing Continues

[Kanastrous]

That's hoping for a miracle, not believing that god >>>> medical science.

If you believe in any conception of God that I am familiar with, you must believe that this God is not only >>>> than medical science, but also than all science, all human knowledge and endeavor, etc, etc, etc.

Right?

[docfrance]

It's always amazed me how people can believe that when someone makes a "miraculous" recovery, it's due to God's intervention, but when they don't make it, it's "all part of God's plan." God's got one hell of a racket going if no matter what he does, it's something everyone praises him for. That shit might have flown in the medieval era when we didn't know that diseases were caused by viruses, but nowadays, what's the excuse? People clinging to their silly superstitions like a security blanket.

tl;dr: nothing anybody here hasn't read a million times over by now.

[Darth Wong]

The greatest danger of this kind of thinking is that it makes people susceptible to the next step, which is to reject medical recommendations because of their faith. It is basically harmless for a parent to sit by a child's bedside and pray for a miraculous recovery. It was not so harmless to make an expensive national three-ring circus out of the decision to pull the plug on Terri Schiavo, and those two things are very closely connected.

[PainRack]

That's hoping for a miracle, not believing that god >>>> medical science.

If you believe in any conception of God that I am familiar with, you must believe that this God is not only >>>> than medical science, but also than all science, all human knowledge and endeavor, etc, etc, etc.

Right?

Let's go over what the article says, kay?

More than half of randomly surveyed adults — 57 percent — said God's intervention could save a family member even if physicians declared treatment would be futile. And nearly three-quarters said patients have a right to demand such treatment.

Physicians says treatment is futile, however you believe that its still WORTH it to continue treatment, in the hopes that God will deliver a miracle and save your family member. And its within your rights to demand such treatment.

When asked to imagine their own relatives being gravely ill or injured, nearly 20 percent of doctors and other medical workers said God could reverse a hopeless outcome.

This statement is saying that even if its hopeless, a miracle MIGHT happen despite what the science says.

The survey is simply linking the theological position to the simple pyschological aspect of denial and bargaining. Even if its hopeless, people are hoping for a miracle, and demanding that treatment continues hoping that somehow, they're going to go against the odds and its going to work.
And that even medical workers are vulnerable to this belief. Therefore, anyone working with patients need to take this into consideration so as to develop a more effective patient practioner relationship.

All the talk about God might intervene is just whitewash over the central issue, that people are not emotionally conditioned to accept recommendations and want to believe a miracle might happen, that something might happen against the odds.

[Darth Wong]

Physicians says treatment is futile, however you believe that its still WORTH it to continue treatment, in the hopes that God will deliver a miracle and save your family member. And its within your rights to demand such treatment.

That's why Terri Schiavo's vegetable remains were kept on life support for so long.

[PainRack]

Physicians says treatment is futile, however you believe that its still WORTH it to continue treatment, in the hopes that God will deliver a miracle and save your family member. And its within your rights to demand such treatment.

That's why Terri Schiavo's vegetable remains were kept on life support for so long.

And? No one is saying that such an attitude does create miracles.

The article simply mentions, hey, the majority of people feel this way, so, when you work, you have to consider those feelings. Its no different from any other end of life emotional issue that crops up in the medical profession.

If anything, knowing that such an emotional attitude exists amongst the majority of people means that you can adequately plan and prepare to confront and help people let go, achieving closure in their life.

[darthbob88]

Y'know, this seems an appropriate picture to post here. Apologies if it's too big for formatting.

[Darth Wong]

Physicians says treatment is futile, however you believe that its still WORTH it to continue treatment, in the hopes that God will deliver a miracle and save your family member. And its within your rights to demand such treatment.

That's why Terri Schiavo's vegetable remains were kept on life support for so long.

And? No one is saying that such an attitude does create miracles.

No, but some are saying that this attitude is harmless, and it's not.

The article simply mentions, hey, the majority of people feel this way, so, when you work, you have to consider those feelings. Its no different from any other end of life emotional issue that crops up in the medical profession.

If anything, knowing that such an emotional attitude exists amongst the majority of people means that you can adequately plan and prepare to confront and help people let go, achieving closure in their life.

The fact that you have to take peoples' idiotic beliefs into account as a matter of practicality does not mean that they are any less idiotic, or that they are not wasting time and resources that could have been better used elsewhere.

[PainRack]

The fact that you have to take peoples' idiotic beliefs into account as a matter of practicality does not mean that they are any less idiotic, or that they are not wasting time and resources that could have been better used elsewhere.

Shrugs. When it comes to dying, people emotions usually rank above rational and logical actions.

Arguing that the majority of people should be "rational" about death is impossible. The debate about ethuanasia is proof of that.

[Junghalli]

Shrugs. When it comes to dying, people emotions usually rank above rational and logical actions.

Yeah, buttloads of people thinking divine miracles might help a dying person doesn't surprise me in the slightest. It's human nature to tend to believe stuff you want to think is true, and it's also human nature to really, really want yourself or your loved ones to live. Is anybody actually surprised that huge numbers of people cling to the idea that if all else fails maybe praying will work?

[Kanastrous]

You know, no one's surprised that infant crap their diapers, but at some point one does expect that they will learn better.