Annoying jehovah witness

Biddybot · Post by **Biddybot** » 2003-01-25 03:22pm

Getting back to the JWs, here's something else that might be worth discussing, specifically their interpretation of what's good and right in the world...

During one time that I did talk to them, they gave me one of their little handbooks. Now, I am not personally religious--I don't even see any difference between religion and mythology, except that one has a LOT of current followers and the other doesn't anymore. That said, I do have an interest in both and have tried to acquaint myself with the basics of the most popular faiths if only to get along with people. I THINK I know what Christianity is supposed to be about and I thought that the JWs were Christian-based. But there are some disturbing elements I've discovered about their faith...

First, if I were to become JW, then start having doubts about the religion and voicing them, I would be shunned. Not helped or supported, shunned. Now I ask this, does this sound very Christian to you? Isn't one of the basic tenets of the Christian faith that you're supposed to help your fellow man through times of trouble, not turn your back on them, literally?

Second reservation: All good JWs go to heaven, but only the best, most devout 144,000 of them (I forget the exact number, but it's somewhere around there) get into the inner sanctum and get to smooze with God himself. Again--huh? What about the basic principle of all men being created equal? That not apply in JW heaven? Isn't this just the old four legs good/two legs better scenario all over again?

If any good Christians or even JWs would like to comment further, would love to hear from ya!

kheegster · Post by **kheegster** » 2003-01-25 04:46pm

Darth Pounder wrote:The last time a JW was on Xmas day. I told them i was too busy celebrating the birth of the true god and that if they wanted to join me they were welcome. The declined. But they shot me a look of pure hate when i wished them a Merry Christmas

WTF? Don't JWs celebrate the birth of Christ?

Anyway, I would have thought that between the Unionists and Republicans, JWs would have been an endangered species...

Post by **Gandalf** » 2003-01-25 11:33pm

Whenever we saw some JW's coming down the street (Or Mormons), my uncle who lives with us used to blast Ozzy Osbourne stuff VERY loud, we got complaints from a neighbour but the music protected her too, we were forgiven.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-01-25 11:37pm

Just to respond to a couple questions, JWs are not Christians. They don't believe Christ was God, and their belief structure centers around a deity named Jehovah (which is a mistranslation by a German scholar of ancient Torahs). I don't recall their exact beliefs (don't have my encyclopedia of religions with me), but they're rather odd IIRC, even for a religious group.

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-01-26 02:28am

JWs do not celibrate any holidays, or birthdays for that matter. Any celebration that isn't a celebration of Jehovah is a no-no. And apparently the act of celebration in and of itself is somehow wrong to them.

Biddybot · Post by **Biddybot** » 2003-01-26 06:49am

The way it was explained to me is that you're supposed to be grateful every day that you were granted life and that celebrating your birth is an act of arrogance. Whatever...

PS: Isn't Jehovah just an old name for the Christian God? From my secular perch, the three major monotheistic religions currently popular in the Western world all seem to revolve around worshipping the exact same deity, tweaked a bit or equipped with various middlemen (like Jesus) to satisfy varying interpretations. Please feel free to correct me if this is wrong... (And wasn't it uttering the name Jehovah that got that scrawny guy clobbered in THE LIFE OF BRIAN?

)

Sektor31 · Post by **Sektor31** » 2003-01-26 10:39am

Biddybot wrote:PS: Isn't Jehovah just an old name for the Christian God? From my secular perch, the three major monotheistic religions currently popular in the Western world all seem to revolve around worshipping the exact same deity, tweaked a bit or equipped with various middlemen (like Jesus) to satisfy varying interpretations. Please feel free to correct me if this is wrong...

Jehovah is another name for God, but somewhere along the line it must've changed without me noticing. =o

You're correct, they're all more or less the same. Judaism started with Abraham, Christianity is a modified Judaism by Jesus, and all those other branches are basically mangled attempts at getting religious and political power. This is all assuming that such people actually existed back then, barring all supernatural nonsense.

Biddybot · Post by **Biddybot** » 2003-01-26 11:47am

I've always liked the name Yahweh, the old Hebrew name for God. It sounds quite...Lovecraftian, somehow...

Coalition · Post by **Coalition** » 2003-01-26 11:48am

I had some fun with them too.

http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?p=135464

Biddybot · Post by **Biddybot** » 2003-01-26 12:16pm

Heh heh, funny, Coalition...

Here's a cute one: One of the guys in my office turned JW and had to quit because working for the military is sinful. He got a transfer to the CBC instead, Canada's government-funded national TV (and radio) network. It's somehow okay for him to work there even though the CBC is the equivalent of some countries' major propaganda disseminating outlet.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-01-26 10:00pm

Biddybot wrote:<snip>
PS: Isn't Jehovah just an old name for the Christian God?
<snip>

I'll explain this one, since it came up in my Basic Christian Beliefs course. The first thing to explain is that the "name" for God used in Hebrew writings most often is YHWH. However, this name is considered too holy to be said, even in scripture readings. The word used instead is "adonai", which means "Lord". Hebrew used to be written only in consonants (thus YHWH). However, after the Babylonian/Persian Exile, Hebrew was not as well udnerstood, and vowels were added to the scriptures to aid in reading. To remind the rabbi that he was not supposed to say YHWH, the vowels for adonai ("a" "o" "ai") were added. A German "scholar" found one of these old scriptures, and translated the name of God as Jahowaih, pronounced Yehovah, mistranslated again by bad linguists and bastardized as Jehovah in English. And that's how YHWH became Jehovah to the Witnesses.

ArthurDent · Post by **ArthurDent** » 2003-01-28 10:46am

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi wrote:I believe they need young virile males to have 12 kids, so they have more people who can go door to door looking for "viable breeders".

That couldn't be farther from the truth. Mormon missionaries have no list of requirements for people to convert. Indeed the only thing they want to do is share their beliefs. If you don't want to listen just tell them you aren't interested and they'll leave you alone. And if by chance they don't leave you alone, then just give it a month or two and they'll have transfers and new missionaries will come into the area and you can tell them not to come to your house anymore.

Korvan · Post by **Korvan** » 2003-01-28 03:37pm

I was once approached by a JW who wanted to sell me a book (a comparison of different religons with JWism). I remarked that if he was really interested in making a convert he would just give me the book. He wasn't too happy about it, but i did get a free book.

Reading it taught me a few interesting points about JWism. It's supposed to be a truely international relgion and they advocate the renoucning of nationalism and will not serve in any military. Racism is a no-no, but discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation is allowed (and probably demanded).

Based on my understanding, absolutly everyone who ever lived will be physically resurrected and offered eternal life. Answer yes and you live forever in a earthly paradise, no and you get oblivion(sp?).

144,000 people (those who get the highest scores by converting, bashing gays, etc) get to asscend to heaven where they assume an administrative role for all time (sounds like hell to me).

After reading that, I thought what the hell is the point of even being a JW? Since everyone gets the choice of eternal life, why join a restrictive religion?

Being a beaurocrat for all eternity does not really sound like a lot of fun. I'd rather spend my mortal days having pre-marital sex and getting blood transfusions.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-01-28 07:38pm

And if I remember, they say the 144,000 have already been chosen.

Korvan · Post by **Korvan** » 2003-01-28 08:04pm

So as far as I can see it, the only reason to join the JW's is to see how fast you can get shunned. Maybe living a "righteous" life gets you free concert tickets in the afterlife

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2003-01-28 08:12pm

ArthurDent wrote:
Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi wrote:I believe they need young virile males to have 12 kids, so they have more people who can go door to door looking for "viable breeders".
That couldn't be farther from the truth. Mormon missionaries have no list of requirements for people to convert. Indeed the only thing they want to do is share their beliefs. If you don't want to listen just tell them you aren't interested and they'll leave you alone. And if by chance they don't leave you alone, then just give it a month or two and they'll have transfers and new missionaries will come into the area and you can tell them not to come to your house anymore.

No, they dont leave you alone. I live in arizona, there is a kindom Hall down the street from me, and 3, count them 3 mormon churches within a mile of me. I get missionaries every couple weeks, They have even started singing AFTER i slammed the door in their face.

Utsanomiko · Post by **Utsanomiko** » 2003-01-28 08:19pm

I preferred it when Jehovah went by 'El-Shaddai' and wasn't all hush-hush about being just a mountain deity among many other deities. I think they liked to wrassle and burn things. Things like people.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-01-28 08:38pm

You know, not all Jehovah's Witnesses are assholes. However, after coming to my door, most walk away with two or three.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-01-28 08:50pm

Heh, I don't think you can use the same joke in two threads, Hemlock.

Biddybot · Post by **Biddybot** » 2003-01-28 10:57pm

Anyone ever have any experiences with the Pentecostals? For a fairly extreme sect, I've always found them to be quite likeable people and I've never had any make pests of themselves trying to convert me. Some I was friendly with once took me to one of their churches which was still undergoing construction, a huge deal for them since it was the first in the area and they'd been collecting funds for it for years. They were just installing the immersion tank they use for baptisms and my friends were already planning all kinds of gags to pull, like slipping some goldfish into the tank before a service. The fact that they could joke around about their rituals was a nice surprise. All the JWs I've ever met have seemed rather uptight, nervous and defensive by comparison.

It was also thanks to my Pentacostal pals that I once went to one of those old-fashioned tent rivival meetings. They had a fundamentalist preacher from Sweden and set up a circus-like tent out in the boonies by a river and held the meeting after dark. It was wild, like a real-life version of the old Neil Diamond song 'Brother Love's Travelling Salvation Show', the only time I've seen people really cut loose in a religious frenzy. Also the only time I've seen people speak in tongues--yow! And while the Holy Spirit did not invade my Godless soul, it did give me a greater appreciation for why this style of religion appeals to some...and why people must've gotten off on Nazi rallies, to be perfectly honest!

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-01-28 11:01pm

Pentecostals tend to be quite friendly as long as they believe you are either one of them or willing to convert (which they tend to assume is the case by default, for some reason). Tell a Pentecostal flat-out that you're an atheist (or better yet, that God is a primitive superstition), and you're likely to see an amazing transformation from Pentecostal into Pentehostile. At least, that's been my experience.

Post by **Lagmonster** » 2003-01-29 09:42am

Any Christian can be annoying if you dare to discuss religion with them. I make it a point to only annoy those who annoy me first, but I've been caught off guard by even the most moderate of Christians, who take the time to thank God for every little thing that happens in their life.

Frankly, what pisses me off more is not people who knock on my door at 6:00 am on a Sunday, because I can cut into them like butter if I feel like it. What pisses me off are the people who survive dangerous surgical operations or house fires or whatever natural or unnatural tragedy or ordeal and the FIRST THING they say to the media or whoever's listening is, "I want to thank God for saving me/making this possible" - they never, never, NEVER would think of thanking the people who saved their life, or developed the technologies that saved them, or allowed them to do something wonderful, or whatever. No one who ever survived anything ever thanks the engineers and researchers and whathaveyou who developed the technologies or procedures that made what they did possible, the ungrateful bastards. Nothing makes me angrier than people who refuse to recognize that only PEOPLE make anything possible in this world, and ignore people when they give their thanks.

Rant off. Thanks. Whew.

Utsanomiko · Post by **Utsanomiko** » 2003-01-29 11:04am

The problem is that many people who believe in God or heaven do so either because they're irrational or haven't really thought about it since they were too young to argue it.

So either way, any time you argue religion with one for any drawn out time or amount of debate, you're either going to hear some moronic arguments, be given a wall of ignorance, or dig up some long buried, rather infantile emotional outbursts. They've all been quite sad to watch in my experience, really.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-01-29 02:06pm

You can't discuss religon with a christian. I remember when i was working in politics i was talking with my bosses brother. He is the nicest man you'll ever meet, approachable about most things. Mention the flaws of christanity you will physically see his face redden and "No" seems to become his favourite word.

irishmick79 · Post by **irishmick79** » 2003-01-29 03:04pm

Montcalm wrote:Two jehovah witness came at my door this morning and instead of bugging me with their reading they started about the war with Iraq and will the forces of good will win over the forces of evil.

so like everyone does i shut the door in their fucking faces.

they should be in the witness relocation program.

That's too bad. If they started on the war with Iraq and said that, I would have responded with,

"You are quite right. Allah will triumph over the infedels."

If anything, the look on their faces would be entertaining.

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