Aratech wrote:In reality, for someone who is by no means an expert at running a campaign, can someone explain to me why the above fact is not being slammed home by democrats, I'd love to see Hillary or Biden have a go with this.
Politico's Carrie Budoff Brown reports: At a press avail in Monroe, Mich., Barack Obama on Palin: "Back off these kinds of stories."
"I have said before and I will repeat again: People's families are off limits," Obama said. "And people's children are especially off-limits. This shouldn't be part of our politics. It has no relevance to Gov. Palin's performance as a governor or her potential performance as a vice president. So I would strongly urge people to back off these kinds of stories. You know my mother had me when she was 18 and how a family deals with issues and teenage children, that shouldn’t be a topic of our politics."
On charges that his campaign has stoked the story via liberal blogs:
"I am offended by that statement. There is no evidence at all that any of this involved us," he said. "Our people were not involved in any way in this, and they will not be. And if I thought there was somebody in my campaign who was involved in something like that, they would be fired."
Obama has always said he would fight a clean election - he would lose a lot if he would start using these types of attack.
Note one thing: This doesn't mean he won't attack McCain (which they have been doing quite strongly ever since the Housing question), it means he won't use the lies and personal attacks used by the Republicans. It also seems to be a strategy that is working - the Media is finally starting to question and criticize McCain. The only reason McCain has been able to keep up with Obama, is because he had the full-fledged support of the Media - once that support is gone (and it is crumbling) - he will be finished.
In two to three weeks from now (once the Convention bounces and VP-bounces have worn off), I'm quite sure Obama will have a noticeable lead.
I see. While part of me is upset at the fact that this will not be used (the realist in me has little doubt that McSame and CO would be hopping around singing the Hallelujah Chorus if somethign of this nature were to befall Obama or Biden) the fact that Obama seems determined to rise above these things is somewhat refreshing.
Perhaps I've simply become jaded by GOP fear mongering and Chimpus' blatant manipulation and exploitation of the tragedy of 9/11 to keep himself firmly cemented in office, despite all the damage he did.
"Impossible! Lasers can't even harm out deflector dish! Clearly these foes are masters of illusion!' 'But sir, my console says we-' 'MASTERS OF ILLUSION! - General Schatten
Yeah, I agree. When the story was about Sarah Palin the V.P. pick lying to cover up her daughter's pregnancy, that was possible news to may hay of because you have a lying, duplicitious V.P. in the mixer and that's meat. But when it's about someone's kid? Like I said earlier, she deserves some respect then, someone's life should not end because their parent or cousin or whatever has gotten a shot at high office. It's not like Bristol has done anything to earn anyone's ire, so they really should be off-limits unless it was like... stabbing someone, or attending a facist rally.
Covenant wrote:Yeah, I agree. When the story was about Sarah Palin the V.P. pick lying to cover up her daughter's pregnancy, that was possible news to may hay of because you have a lying, duplicitious V.P. in the mixer and that's meat. But when it's about someone's kid? Like I said earlier, she deserves some respect then, someone's life should not end because their parent or cousin or whatever has gotten a shot at high office. It's not like Bristol has done anything to earn anyone's ire, so they really should be off-limits unless it was like... stabbing someone, or attending a facist rally.
Normally this would be the case, however had the Bristol thing turned out to be true it would have meant that Palin was lying to protect her daughter. Which no longer makes it solely about her (her being Bristol) and would have rather hefty implications about Palin's honesty and possible willingness to use her position to get things hushed up.
"It's you Americans. There's something about nipples you hate. If this were Germany, we'd be romping around naked on the stage here."
Let me be clear, how old exactly was Palin's daughter when the Down's child was born? Because the Wire services are reporting she's(The Daughter) officially five months pregnant now this very day.
Which looks even worse if true because it would mean the daughter was on her second child at age 17, and boy doesn't that speak of some hard core "traditional"(In the 14th Century sense of the word) family values?
"A cult is a religion with no political power." -Tom Wolfe Pardon me for sounding like a dick, but I'm playing the tiniest violin in the world right now-Dalton
Mr Bean wrote:Let me be clear, how old exactly was Palin's daughter when the Down's child was born? Because the Wire services are reporting she's(The Daughter) officially five months pregnant now this very day.
Which looks even worse if true because it would mean the daughter was on her second child at age 17, and boy doesn't that speak of some hard core "traditional"(In the 14th Century sense of the word) family values?
16.
Manic Progressive: A liberal who violently swings from anger at politicos to despondency over them.
Out Of Context theatre: Ron Paul has repeatedly said he's not a racist. - Destructinator XIII on why Ron Paul isn't racist.
One a year? Reminds me of my own grandmother.
Keep the streak alive!
(If true anyway)
*Edit
For those who don't remember my own family story(I think I've only told it once here), I had a total of twelve aunts and uncles, of which only eight lived past the first year, of which only six lived to adulthood and only five live today. My Grandmother had eleven children in a row, starting in 1937, one per year and a little thing like WWII never ever slowed her.
To be fair she was 22 at the time and a collage graduate of Brown, something very few women of the time people could claim.
"A cult is a religion with no political power." -Tom Wolfe Pardon me for sounding like a dick, but I'm playing the tiniest violin in the world right now-Dalton
GOP Establishment Wrestles With Bristol Palin Pregnancy
Sep 1, 2008(The Politico) The early response among Republicans to the announcement that Bristol Palin, the 17-year-old daughter of GOP VP hopeful Sarah Palin, is pregnant, has been calm and collected, although it has definitely raised concerns for rank-and-file Republicans that more unpleasant revelations may soon follow.
Responding to Internet rumors that Bristol Palin had given birth earlier this year, and that Sarah Palin had claimed the child was her son Trig, the McCain campaign released a statement saying that Bristol Palin is currently pregnant and plans to marry the father.
Republicans have either taken the line that Bristol Palin's pregnancy is a personal matter for Palin and her family, or they are suggesting that it is a situation that lots of normal Americans can relate to, either from their own family history or that or friends and classmates.
"I don't think this is going to be a big deal down the stretch" of the 2008 election, said a top House Republican aide, speaking on the condition of anonymity.
"It's nobody's business but the Palins," added another Senate GOP leadership staffer.
But it does create a level of uncertaintly about Palin, among Republicans and the media, and that can be a huge negative for Palin's candidacy. Combined with Troopergate, the allegation that Palin fired the top Alaska state police official because he refused to fire Palin's former brother-in-law, a trooper.
"Clearly, yes, absolutely," said a GOP strategist when asked about whether Republicans were afraid more negative stories about Palin would emerge soon.
"Palin can get through this, but what you don't want is a level of uncertainty about her, about whether she should be on the [Republican] ticket. That's not a good thing for any candidate."
By the way, I don't ever, ever need to hear "*gate" used as a scandal description again. Ever.
Though I'm happy about the possible political fallout from this, I am worried about the social implications of young women getting the idea that popping out babies at early ages is "okay" and a good idea. First there's Brittneys sister now the VP nominee of the Republican candidate. Though I'm not saying that it's bad she's keeping the kid, I just find it unsettling the number of high profile wedlock pregnancies that have occurred as of late in the media. It's almost like it's going to become en vogue to get knocked up.
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-Ravus Ordo Militis
"Fear and ignorance claim the unwary and the incomplete. The wise man may flinch away from their embrace if he girds his soul with the armour of contempt."
I don't see how this is going to hurt them. The kind of voters who are offended by this will never vote Democrat anyway, and the right-wing "amen chorus" in the media has already demonstrated that they will overlook anything that their Anointed Party does: lies, corruption, breaches of the constitution, even high treason.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
I don't see how this is going to hurt them. The kind of voters who are offended by this will never vote Democrat anyway, and the right-wing "amen chorus" in the media has already demonstrated that they will overlook anything that their Anointed Party does: lies, corruption, breaches of the constitution, even high treason.
I know you love the stock answers but I have ask, who is supposed to be offended by what?
Um...extremely conservative voters who are normally offended by such things as pre-marital sex and teenage pregnan cies, who will still end up voting for McCain/Palin anyways? You know, blue state, Hollywood values?
Is that obvious?
I don't see how this is going to hurt them. The kind of voters who are offended by this will never vote Democrat anyway, and the right-wing "amen chorus" in the media has already demonstrated that they will overlook anything that their Anointed Party does: lies, corruption, breaches of the constitution, even high treason.
Hell, she was the Committee on National Policy's pick. Getting those people behind him may do far more to help McCain then any amount of scandal she brings to the table can hurt him.
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Nuclear Navy Warwolf
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in omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro
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ipsa scientia potestas est
Cecelia5578 wrote:Um...extremely conservative voters who are normally offended by such things as pre-marital sex and teenage pregnan cies, who will still end up voting for McCain/Palin anyways? You know, blue state, Hollywood values?
Is that obvious?
Except for the long standing fact that they don't care so long as there is a shotgun wedding and no talk of abortion they don't give a damn. To quote from the article: "Republicans have either taken the line that Bristol Palin's pregnancy is a personal matter for Palin and her family, or they are suggesting that it is a situation that lots of normal Americans can relate to, either from their own family history or that or friends and classmates."
The "values" voters have never gotten terribly worked over these foolish situations as long as the surface proprieties have been met. Remember, as far as they're concerned the real issue is not the quality of life for this family but the outward appearance. Heck, the article effectively has the Republicans saying well it doesn't matter because teenage sluts get knocked up all the time, she's doing "the right thing" so you can go back to beer and NASCAR.
If anything the people that see a problem with it are the more liberal Republicans, centrists, and liberal Democrats that are not happy to see said girl getting pregnant.
It's impossible for Bristol Palin to have had both children, for the record, as Trig (the kid with Down's Syndrome) was born only 4 months ago, and she is 5 months pregnant.
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The Duchess of Zeon wrote:It's impossible for Bristol Palin to have had both children, for the record, as Trig (the kid with Down's Syndrome) was born only 4 months ago, and she is 5 months pregnant.
Possible but the evidence for that amounts to little more than rumors. And if this verifiable pregnancy story broke, I don't necessarily see why the other wouldn't.
The Duchess of Zeon wrote:It's impossible for Bristol Palin to have had both children, for the record, as Trig (the kid with Down's Syndrome) was born only 4 months ago, and she is 5 months pregnant.
Possible but the evidence for that amounts to little more than rumors. And if this verifiable pregnancy story broke, I don't necessarily see why the other wouldn't.
First of all the picture that everyone keeps talking about ignores the fact that there are pictures of Governor Palin pregnant, or that her daughter doesn't look pregnant in the picture, or that you can't add. If Bristol is 5 months pregnant, then she couldn't have had a child 4 months ago.
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I don't see how this is going to hurt them. The kind of voters who are offended by this will never vote Democrat anyway, and the right-wing "amen chorus" in the media has already demonstrated that they will overlook anything that their Anointed Party does: lies, corruption, breaches of the constitution, even high treason.
But some of them may stay home on election day, and that is what matters. Bush's victories were paved on the road of evangelicals brought out to the polls who'd previously been inactive or electorally apathetic.
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The Duchess of Zeon wrote:It's impossible for Bristol Palin to have had both children, for the record, as Trig (the kid with Down's Syndrome) was born only 4 months ago, and she is 5 months pregnant.
Possible but the evidence for that amounts to little more than rumors. And if this verifiable pregnancy story broke, I don't necessarily see why the other wouldn't.
First of all the picture that everyone keeps talking about ignores the fact that there are pictures of Governor Palin pregnant, or that her daughter doesn't look pregnant in the picture, or that you can't add. If Bristol is 5 months pregnant, then she couldn't have had a child 4 months ago.
I mis-read the Duchess's post and got what she was saying completely wrong. My mistake.
Stormbringer wrote:I mis-read the Duchess's post and got what she was saying completely wrong. My mistake.
Ah Consider any vitriol in my post removed.. As for myself, I don't see how this effects the race. It's a family issue, and I don't like the idea of making people's kids into issues. I wonder what the reaction would be if Governor Palin was a democrat.
"I believe in the future. It is wonderful because it stands on what has been achieved." - Sergei Korolev
Stormbringer wrote:I mis-read the Duchess's post and got what she was saying completely wrong. My mistake.
Ah Consider any vitriol in my post removed.. As for myself, I don't see how this effects the race. It's a family issue, and I don't like the idea of making people's kids into issues. I wonder what the reaction would be if Governor Palin was a democrat.
No worries. I said something pretty dumb thanks to a 180 degree wong reading of what Marina said. I personally don't give any credence to the notion that she was covering a pregnancy, especially now that this one is revealed. More likely it was some one misunderstanding facts or spreading rumors to force the truth out.
As for the actual pregnancy, it only affects it to the extent that it bothers me to see anyone preaching family values and then having their kid get knocked up (or doing the knocking up). Not earth shattering but certainly smacking of misplace priorities and not terribly great parenting.
I wonder what the reaction would be if Governor Palin was a democrat.
"Keep that teenage slut and her inexperienced model of a mother away from the White House."
These people are professional hypocrites, and often misogynists. Think about the kinds of things they have jumped on Michelle Obama and Hilary Clinton for.
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This is the guy they want to use to win over "young people?" Are they completely daft? I'd rather vote for a pile of shit than a Jesus freak social regressive.
Here's hoping that his political career goes down in flames and, hopefully, a hilarious gay sex scandal. -Tanasinn
You can't expect sodomy to ruin every conservative politician in this country. -Battlehymn Republic
Aratech wrote:I see. While part of me is upset at the fact that this will not be used (the realist in me has little doubt that McSame and CO would be hopping around singing the Hallelujah Chorus if somethign of this nature were to befall Obama or Biden) the fact that Obama seems determined to rise above these things is somewhat refreshing.
Perhaps I've simply become jaded by GOP fear mongering and Chimpus' blatant manipulation and exploitation of the tragedy of 9/11 to keep himself firmly cemented in office, despite all the damage he did.
Even if it were to be used, it'd be of questionable use. Dick Cheney's daughter is a lesbian, and that didn't hurt the Republicans one bit 4 years ago. In fact when Kerry brought it up during one of the debates it actually hurt the Democrats. The kind of people that vote for Republicans based on "moral" values tend to be raging hypocrites, so Democrats don't have anything to gain from using these types of attacks.
Jeez, is Palin and her family straight out of the 'Beverly Hillbillies' or what? You can take the trash out of the trailer park, but it seems you can't take the trash out of the white.
Superman wrote:Jeez, is Palin and her family straight out of the 'Beverly Hillbillies' or what? You can take the trash out of the trailer park, but it seems you can't take the trash out of the white.
What are you characterizing as white trash? That she got pregnant at 17, or that she's going to marry the father.
On a different note, if the girl was sick for months, and on antibiotics, can't that seriously screw up how effective birth control is? Given that sex ed in Alaska is run by planned parenthood, I think its reasonable to assume the girl was at least somewhat educated about contraception..
