SD.Net World Redux Comment Thread II

Fingolfin_Noldor · Post by **Fingolfin_Noldor** » 2008-09-04 06:12am

Norseman wrote:Uhm why exactly do you want to use the Japanistani launch areas in the first place? Just curious mind you, but they don't seem to be right on the equator.

The launch is in Jerusalem. But given the proximity, we are being polite, and attempting to ameliorate any fears and suspicions, by asking.

Siege · Post by **Siege** » 2008-09-04 06:13am

Norseman wrote:Uhm why exactly do you want to use the Japanistani launch areas in the first place? Just curious mind you, but they don't seem to be right on the equator.

San Dorado was apparently 'too unstable', and Tonkin 'not reliable enough'

.

PS: insofar as I can tell now, the FTO Joint Navy and Air Command currently has the following resources contributed to it:

Baerne: 2 CG, 5 DDG, 2 FFG, 2 SSN
Indhopal: 2 DDG, 3 FFG, 1 SSK
San Dorado: 2 DDG, 1 FFG, 1 Mirage 2000-5 Mk 2 fighters.

For a total of 2 CG, 9 DDG, 6 FFG, 2 SSN, 1 SSK and 20 Mirage aircraft. If I missed anything please tell me.

Norseman · Post by **Norseman** » 2008-09-04 06:19am

You know both South Velaria and Astaria would make excellent launchpads!

Fingolfin_Noldor · Post by **Fingolfin_Noldor** » 2008-09-04 06:21am

The other concern was that the rocket manufacturing facilities are in CSR and Jerusalem means you can just cart them there by rail.

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2008-09-04 06:23am

Norseman wrote:You know both South Velaria and Astaria would make excellent launchpads!

Too far from rocket factories.

And we're not using Japanistani launch sites. We asked for overflight permission because it's a real bitch to craft LEO orbits which will never ever overfly Japanistan.

It's much simpler to ask for permission to overfly, especially since the lunar spaceship will have to do 2-3 orbits before leaving for Selene - so we either ask Japanistan for permission and let them take a look around the capsule, or we have to make the capsule X times heavier (so that it can significantly change the orbit), or dick around with direct ascent missions.

Wherever we based the launch pad, we'd have done the same.

Karmic Knight · Post by **Karmic Knight** » 2008-09-04 06:27am

SiegeTank wrote:
Norseman wrote:Uhm why exactly do you want to use the Japanistani launch areas in the first place? Just curious mind you, but they don't seem to be right on the equator.
San Dorado was apparently 'too unstable', and Tonkin 'not reliable enough' .

PS: insofar as I can tell now, the FTO Joint Navy and Air Command currently has the following resources contributed to it:

Baerne: 2 CG, 5 DDG, 2 FFG, 2 SSN
Indhopal: 2 DDG, 3 FFG, 1 SSK
San Dorado: 2 DDG, 1 FFG, 1 Mirage 2000-5 Mk 2 fighters.

For a total of 2 CG, 9 DDG, 6 FFG, 2 SSN, 1 SSK and 20 Mirage aircraft. If I missed anything please tell me.

The Vineyards will provide something, I just need to decide what.

Fingolfin_Noldor · Post by **Fingolfin_Noldor** » 2008-09-04 06:28am

Quick question: Who in the world is in FASTA?

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2008-09-04 06:30am

Fingolfin_Noldor wrote:Quick question: Who in the world is in FASTA?

PeZookia, Shroomania, You, the CSR, San Dorado and uh...Vineyards?

Yeah, we need a tally

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2008-09-04 07:05am

I make rockets and rocket components for any required civilian launches and military satellites, with a possible future eye towards space-based weapons, however this time it's the "Buran" and "Polyus" systems I am looking at instead of the more primitive "Spiral".

I don't know what other people do.

Yea, pulling rockets overseas is bullshit. That's why Tonkin fails hard.

Also, I need to understand just what the hell is our most modern space equipment at the time...

Here's a rough graph I made earlier, could anyone tell me where we are regarding space technology right now?
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=123144

Also let me ask FASTA chiefs if they are basing their heavy missile technology around the UR-500K (Proton-K) rocket - because that makes sense. By 1967 the USSR already had an almost 20 ton capable rocket (the Proton-K). The Titan rocket reached this plank only at year 1989, the Delta - at year 2002, Atlas - by 2003.

Due to the location of our cosmodromes (approximately where Baikonur is) the capacites of Soviet rockets are also roughly the same as in RL (on equator they'd be vastly superior). Whereas US/French rockets when launched not from near-equatorial polygons will have drastic reduction of usefulness.

Especially useless is launching into GEO directly from our location, I'd say we'd have to use the Molniya type orbits due to our cosmodrome locations.

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2008-09-04 08:07am

Wasn't it declared that advanced ICBMs don't exist in this world, hence why FASTA is developing the R-7 basically from scratch?

EDIT: And Coyote, dude...cold this time of year? We're all Mediterrenean!

Post by **Coyote** » 2008-09-04 08:26am

PeZook wrote:Wasn't it declared that advanced ICBMs don't exist in this world, hence why FASTA is developing the R-7 basically from scratch?

EDIT: And Coyote, dude...cold this time of year? We're all Mediterrenean!

I checked our latitudes and positions in the northern tropics, and we're about where Europe really would be. I haven't been paying attention to the passage of time so much, but I recalled someone mentioning Christmas fairly recently... is the planet, overall, just warmer?

Actually, I suppose there's no guarantee that "Christmas" on this world is in winter...

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2008-09-04 09:02am

Coyote wrote: I checked our latitudes and positions in the northern tropics, and we're about where Europe really would be. I haven't been paying attention to the passage of time so much, but I recalled someone mentioning Christmas fairly recently... is the planet, overall, just warmer?

Actually, I suppose there's no guarantee that "Christmas" on this world is in winter...

No, IIRC Marina decreed that New Year's is on the 15th. Even if we were in the temperate zone, we'd be somewhere around the end of summer right now.

And Orena is almost halfway between the equator and the north pole, which means a warmer climate than real-life Poland. Either way, the overcoat is unnecessary

KlavoHunter · Post by **KlavoHunter** » 2008-09-04 09:02am

Karmic Knight wrote:
SiegeTank wrote:
Norseman wrote:Uhm why exactly do you want to use the Japanistani launch areas in the first place? Just curious mind you, but they don't seem to be right on the equator.
San Dorado was apparently 'too unstable', and Tonkin 'not reliable enough' .

PS: insofar as I can tell now, the FTO Joint Navy and Air Command currently has the following resources contributed to it:

Baerne: 2 CG, 5 DDG, 2 FFG, 2 SSN
Indhopal: 2 DDG, 3 FFG, 1 SSK
San Dorado: 2 DDG, 1 FFG, 1 Mirage 2000-5 Mk 2 fighters.

For a total of 2 CG, 9 DDG, 6 FFG, 2 SSN, 1 SSK and 20 Mirage aircraft. If I missed anything please tell me.
The Vineyards will provide something, I just need to decide what.

Klavostan is waffling on providing anything directly from its own navy, but does urge them to instead hire several mercenary ships from a jointly-funded account for the FTO JNAC.

DarthShady · Post by **DarthShady** » 2008-09-04 09:05am

PeZook wrote:Jesus, Shady...

Is NOD that incompetent? You had an intelligence officer staked out and instead of trailing him and trying to smoke out his source, you murder him? What good does that bring the FUN?

Now they will bring in somebody completely unknown to us to handle the operation, and all we know is that they stole the Buzzkill designs (which, BTW, is just an upgraded P-800 )

It would've been far, far better to let them have the plans, and use the guy to feed disinformation to Indophal. Hell, Shroomanians could've easily arrested him, since consuls don't actually have diplomatic immunity from criminal prosecution.

Not to mention, Baylor is gonna be pissed by NOD running an intel operation on Shroomanian soil, without consulting it with him first

This is just a warning to other intelligence agencies, if you go against Nod you end up dead.(Also, that was written last night four hours after midnight so I wasn't at my best.

)

As for Baylor, don't worry I can handle him.

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2008-09-04 09:05am

DarthShady wrote: As for Baylor, don't worry I can handle him.

I really don't think you can

DarthShady · Post by **DarthShady** » 2008-09-04 09:08am

PeZook wrote:
DarthShady wrote: As for Baylor, don't worry I can handle him.
I really don't think you can

Shhh...I plan on bribing Shroom with pictures of kittens.

Siege · Post by **Siege** » 2008-09-04 09:11am

KlavoHunter wrote:Klavostan is waffling on providing anything directly from its own navy, but does urge them to instead hire several mercenary ships from a jointly-funded account for the FTO JNAC.

I doubt there's any mercenary warships out there that we might want to hire. It's not like mercs with Aegis combat systems and Mk 41 VLS are going to be widespread

. Perhaps the occasional merc group with riverine patrol boats or somesuch, but beyond that...

Alternatively though, if we draw enough funds together we might be able to afford a pair of carriers. Anyone interested in pursuing something like that? It's ambitious, but still...

DarthShady · Post by **DarthShady** » 2008-09-04 09:11am

Also dudes I am in FASTA, I'm not giving money away for nothing.

We really need a list of FASTA members and also a list of FUN members, because things are getting complicated.

Stas, how about you launch some military satellites for me?

And I wanted to ask you about these:

-10 Tu-22M3 strategic supersonic bomber (MESS reporting name Backfire)

-4 Tu-95MS-16 (MESS reporting name Bear-H)

Can I consider them delivered already?

KlavoHunter · Post by **KlavoHunter** » 2008-09-04 09:25am

SiegeTank wrote:
KlavoHunter wrote:Klavostan is waffling on providing anything directly from its own navy, but does urge them to instead hire several mercenary ships from a jointly-funded account for the FTO JNAC.
I doubt there's any mercenary warships out there that we might want to hire. It's not like mercs with Aegis combat systems and Mk 41 VLS are going to be widespread . Perhaps the occasional merc group with riverine patrol boats or somesuch, but beyond that...

Alternatively though, if we draw enough funds together we might be able to afford a pair of carriers. Anyone interested in pursuing something like that? It's ambitious, but still...

Dude. My mercenaries ARE operating Burkes and stuff.

You didn't seem to take me seriously, did you, when I said my mercenaries were serious?

Siege · Post by **Siege** » 2008-09-04 09:53am

KlavoHunter wrote:Dude. My mercenaries ARE operating Burkes and stuff. You didn't seem to take me seriously, did you, when I said my mercenaries were serious?

Well I admit that mercenaries operating Burke's are a... novel concept. But an awesome novel concept, so that's ok

. In fact, I'll probably want to contract a bunch of your mercs in the near future, if that's alright with you.

KlavoHunter · Post by **KlavoHunter** » 2008-09-04 10:18am

SiegeTank wrote:
KlavoHunter wrote:Dude. My mercenaries ARE operating Burkes and stuff. You didn't seem to take me seriously, did you, when I said my mercenaries were serious?
Well I admit that mercenaries operating Burke's are a... novel concept. But an awesome novel concept, so that's ok . In fact, I'll probably want to contract a bunch of your mercs in the near future, if that's alright with you.

I was going to write more about the awesome mercs that operate a completely self-contained MEF on a Wasp, but I should probably get some sleep

DarthShady · Post by **DarthShady** » 2008-09-04 10:20am

SNC Members I need to know if you are contributing forces to the peacekeeping operation, and if you are I need to know what those forces are? Just a rough idea so I can get things in order.

Fingolfin_Noldor · Post by **Fingolfin_Noldor** » 2008-09-04 10:27am

DarthShady wrote:SNC Members I need to know if you are contributing forces to the peacekeeping operation, and if you are I need to know what those forces are? Just a rough idea so I can get things in order.

Yes I am. But I'll be committing a Comitentases legion, i.e. more infantry orientated. Legio II will be the one. Legio I will withdraw.

Post by **Coyote** » 2008-09-04 10:35am

Before we go any further, in the Veleria situation, I'd like Marina to issue a proclamation that no more tribes will be pulled out of asses to provide 'legitimacy' for land grabs. I was very tempted to counter the sudden existence of the Zunpuntra with more tribes that professed allegiance to Canissia, but all I see is a domino-effect one one-upmanship in who can produce the most tribes.

Veleria was approved as it was, and the OOB I thought up, with the two predominant tribes in it (Caravo and Katangwan), was approved as well. The interior of Veleria is, I was under the impression, supposed to be a wild, unclaimed, and uninhabitable land ruled by vicious beasts, poisonous plants, and swarming, disease-ridden insects.

Producing another tribe to 'call in' Japanistan, and conveniently line up with them without any backstory, opens up more potential for one-upmanship... and is about as fair in-game as me posting that a long-suppressed Ainu ethnic group in Japanistan rises up in rebellion, overthrows the governemnt, and welcomes Canissian forces with flowers.

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2008-09-04 10:40am

DarthShady wrote:Can I consider them delivered already?

Of course, I basically flew those machines to your nation in a week or so after the deal and transferred them to your pilots.

DarthShady wrote:SNC Members I need to know if you are contributing forces to the peacekeeping operation, and if you are I need to know what those forces are?

I can commit one modern-tech light-mechanized division for peacekeeping in Zagor. The 58th Army 2nd Division, let's say.

DarthShady wrote:Stas, how about you launch some military satellites for me?

4500-5000 kg to very low orbits and ~3000 kg to medium-LEO is the limit of what can be done with "Cyclone" or any other R-36 derivative currently fielded.

Under the SART that I intend to announce with Shroomania (Shroom told me about it before going on leave) I will reduce 5 missiles each year, so I could launch 5 more sats for you next year. This year, launches are off.

Another deal is access to MKRC Legenda (RORSAT) - the access to these RORSATs granted to the USSR under the Joint Air Defense programme we had (under which I supply SAM systems to your nation, as I understood).

If the USSR Navy has any heavy anti-ship missiles to be guided by a RORSAT system, you may find it useful.

PeZook wrote:Wasn't it declared that advanced ICBMs don't exist in this world, hence why FASTA is developing the R-7 basically from scratch?

Duchess of Zeon wrote:...nobody would have extensively developed long range missiles except for a deterrent force

I used the R-36 which is basically a 1960 standoff design, due to me being in Cold War-like situation with Shroomania and other Empires during the last 30-40 years or so.

I suppose that's possible, but the rocket is limited to conversion capabilities and can't be used for manned spaceflight or anything heavier than 3-5 tons depending on orbital height.

I'll wait for Marina's ruling. My RORSATs can wait several months, not a big deal.

The R-7 on the other hand is a civilian missile almost totally useless as an ICBM which is why it's development makes sense In-Universe terms - and it can also, with little modernization, be brought up the food chain to very good payloads.

The UR-500 likewise is a superheavy missile making little sense as an ICBM even in reality, that means Proton is likewise making sense as a standalone rocket family.