Japan to build Space elevator

[Ender]

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From cyborg housemaids and waterpowered cars to dog translators and rocket boots, Japanese boffins have racked up plenty of near-misses in the quest to turn science fiction into reality.

Now the finest scientific minds of Japan are devoting themselves to cracking the greatest sci-fi vision of all: the space elevator. Man has so far conquered space by painfully and inefficiently blasting himself out of the atmosphere but the 21st century should bring a more leisurely ride to the final frontier.

For chemists, physicists, material scientists, astronauts and dreamers across the globe, the space elevator represents the most tantalising of concepts: cables stronger and lighter than any fibre yet woven, tethered to the ground and disappearing beyond the atmosphere to a satellite docking station in geosynchronous orbit above Earth.

Up and down the 22,000 mile-long (36,000km) cables — or flat ribbons — will run the elevator carriages, themselves requiring huge breakthroughs in engineering to which the biggest Japanese companies and universities have turned their collective attention.
In the carriages, the scientists behind the idea told The Times, could be any number of cargoes. A space elevator could carry people, huge solar-powered generators or even casks of radioactive waste. The point is that breaking free of Earth's gravity will no longer require so much energy — perhaps 100 times less than launching the space shuttle.

“Just like travelling abroad, anyone will be able to ride the elevator into space,” Shuichi Ono, chairman of the Japan Space Elevator Association, said.

The vision has inspired scientists around the world and government organisations including Nasa. Several competing space elevator projects are gathering pace as various groups vie to build practical carriages, tethers and the hundreds of other parts required to carry out the plan. There are prizes offered by space elevator-related scientific organisations for breakthroughs and competitions for the best and fastest design of carriage.

First envisioned by the celebrated master of science fiction, Arthur C. Clarke, in his 1979 work The Fountains of Paradise, the concept has all the best qualities of great science fiction: it is bold, it is a leap of imagination and it would change life as we know it.

Unlike the warp drives in Star Trek, or H.G. Wells's The Time Machine, the idea of the space elevator does not mess with the laws of science; it just presents a series of very, very complex engineering problems.

Japan is increasingly confident that its sprawling academic and industrial base can solve those issues, and has even put the astonishingly low price tag of a trillion yen (£5 billion) on building the elevator. Japan is renowned as a global leader in the precision engineering and high-quality material production without which the idea could never be possible.

The biggest obstacle lies in the cables. To extend the elevator to a stationary satellite from the Earth's surface would require twice that length of cable to reach a counterweight, ensuring that the cable maintains its tension.

The cable must be exceptionally light, staggeringly strong and able to withstand all projectiles thrown at it inside and outside the atmosphere. The answer, according to the groups working on designs, will lie in carbon nanotubes - microscopic particles that can be formed into fibres and whose mass production is now a focus of Japan's big textile companies.

According to Yoshio Aoki, a professor of precision machinery engineering at Nihon University and a director of the Japan Space Elevator Association, the cable would need to be about four times stronger than what is currently the strongest carbon nanotube fibre, or about 180 times stronger than steel. Pioneering work on carbon nanotubes in Cambridge has produced a strength improvement of about 100 times over the last five years.

Equally, there is the issue of powering the carriages as they climb into space. “We are thinking of using the technology employed in our bullet trains,” Professor Aoki said. “Carbon nanotubes are good conductors of electricity, so we are thinking of having a second cable to provide power all along the route.”

Japan is hosting an international conference in November to draw up a timetable for the machine.

Stranger than fiction

“Riding silently into the sky, soon she was 100km high, higher even than the old pioneering rocket planes, the X15s, used to reach. The sky was already all but black above her, with a twinkling of stars right at the zenith, the point to which the ribbon, gold-bright in the sunlight, pointed like an arrow. Looking up that way she could see no sign of structures further up the ribbon, no sign of the counterweight. Nothing but the shining beads of more spiders clambering up this thread to the sky. She suspected she still had not grasped the scale of the elevator, not remotely.”

From Firstborn by Arthur C. Clarke and Stephen Baxter
Publisher: Del Ray

Pretty cool if they can do it. I'd like to see it as a big international thing, like ITER or something.

[Admiral Valdemar]

If they can pull this off, then Japan would have a HUGE advantage over any other nation with respect to space applications and more. I only hope this kind of thing forces the EU and US to follow suit, making their own (how Gundam like).

With the economic problems now, and energy problems soon, I do question if such projects, even if feasible engineering-wise, will ever make it through.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

With the economic problems now, and energy problems soon, I do question if such projects, even if feasible engineering-wise, will ever make it through.

Japan is likely uniquely suited among modern societies, though, to keep up with the project. If we have a space elevator we can frankly ultimately evacuate the planet; O'Neil colonies will be possible at that point and so will mass population transfer. And Japan's population is declining very rapidly, whereas its production of non-fossil-fuel based energy is increasing. Like Russia, if enough of the population decline takes place before things get really bad, they should ride it out alright, the main thing being food production. Perhaps, though, they can also get to work on harvesting algae and processing it into food. After all, they already eat it in the unprocessed form...

[Sea Skimmer]

I thought it had already been proven that carbon nanotubes could never be strong and light enough for this purpose? And as I recall that was assuming some very optimistic properties for the nanotubes too, like that they’d be incorporating no other materials at all which might be necessary to improve compressive strength and resist erosion from the cargo lifting rig itself.

[Kanastrous]

"Proving" that something can "never" be or do this or that, seems historically like a kind of bad bet when it comes to chemistry and engineering...

[Gil Hamilton]

Japan is likely uniquely suited among modern societies, though, to keep up with the project. If we have a space elevator we can frankly ultimately evacuate the planet; O'Neil colonies will be possible at that point and so will mass population transfer. And Japan's population is declining very rapidly, whereas its production of non-fossil-fuel based energy is increasing. Like Russia, if enough of the population decline takes place before things get really bad, they should ride it out alright, the main thing being food production. Perhaps, though, they can also get to work on harvesting algae and processing it into food. After all, they already eat it in the unprocessed form...

Japan is heading toward a nuclear economy currently and their population is well suited for surviving. After all, the Japanese population will listen to their government leaders and tighten their belts very narrowly if asked. What they don't have is alot of natural resources.

I wonder if a Japanese-Russian alliance could be made. The Japanese have vast amounts of specialized knowhow and a "Ganbatte!" attitude, while Russia has vast amounts of natural resources. They seem like they could supplement each other very well.

[Kanastrous]

'Nuclear economy?' Meaning nuclear power, or something else?

[Admiral Valdemar]

'Nuclear economy?' Meaning nuclear power, or something else?

Meaning they're all going to be radioactive supermen. They'll all be nuclear families.

I'm also pretty sure fullerenes have been shown to have the strength. The only issue is making the ribbons long enough. A year ago, we could only make a few millimetres worth at a time. They are working on producing metres now and potentially more.

By the way, Japan's problem? It has an ageing, xenophobic population. If they lose a little of the innate racism and fuck more, maybe they'll have people to work on such things in the future. It's one thing to have an overpopulated world, it's another when the nations that produce such marvels are declining rather than staying stable.

[Gil Hamilton]

'Nuclear economy?' Meaning nuclear power, or something else?

They are currently planning to have most of their power production be either nuclear energy or various renewable sources (depending on where in Japan).

[Darth Raptor]

If they can pull this off, then Japan would have a HUGE advantage over any other nation with respect to space applications and more. I only hope this kind of thing forces the EU and US to follow suit, making their own (how Gundam like).

And then we'll all unify under the threat of the militant pacifist menace!

I'm not sure what would be better, a race between the major powers to build the most beanstalks the fastest or some kind of ITER-esque coop. Either way, it's about goddamn fucking time.

[Adrian Laguna]

After all, the Japanese population will listen to their government leaders and tighten their belts very narrowly if asked. What they don't have is alot of natural resources.

Back in the day Japan suffered a serious deforestation problem because of, among other things, the Daimyos (noblemen) building opulent wooden palaces for themselves. Unlike in most societies, Japans nobility realized that they were fucking everyone, including themselves, over, and thus voluntarily enacted forest conservation efforts and stopped the palace building. Consequently, modern day Japan is not an arid, tree-less, shit hole.

[Patrick Degan]

'Nuclear economy?' Meaning nuclear power, or something else?

Meaning they're all going to be radioactive supermen.

No no no, get your mad scientist dialogue right: it's "a race of atomic supermen" (as per Bride Of The Monster).

[Admiral Valdemar]

'Nuclear economy?' Meaning nuclear power, or something else?

Meaning they're all going to be radioactive supermen.

No no no, get your mad scientist dialogue right: it's "a race of atomic supermen" (as per Bride Of The Monster).

"PULL THE STRING!"

[phongn]

"Proving" that something can "never" be or do this or that, seems historically like a kind of bad bet when it comes to chemistry and engineering...

The mechanical strength required is believed to be above the physical limitations of even perfect nanotubes.

[dragon]

"Proving" that something can "never" be or do this or that, seems historically like a kind of bad bet when it comes to chemistry and engineering...

The mechanical strength required is believed to be above the physical limitations of even perfect nanotubes.

Not quite true. Multiwalled carbon nanotubes (MWCNTs) have been analysed to have a tensile strength in the outer layers of between 270 to 950 gigapascals.

Analysis of the stress-strain curves for individual MWCNTs indicated that the Young's modulus E of the outermost layer varied from 270 to 950 gigapascals

with current testing ranging from 11 to 63 gigapascals.

The MWCNTs broke in the outermost layer ("sword-in-sheath" failure), and the tensile strength of this layer ranged from 11 to 63 gigapascals for the set of 19 MWCNTs that were loaded

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As to required amount for space elevator you need about 62GPa.

The desired strength for the space elevator is about 62 GPa. Carbon nanotubes have exceeded all other materials and appear to have a theoretical strength far above the desired range for space elevator structures

from
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So MWCNT's easily have a therotical maxim that more than surpasses the needed strength.

[starslayer]

What kind of cable are we building? Are we using a tapering cable, or one with pretty much uniform thickness? The tapering cable could theoretically be built from steel, although it would require more steel than could possibly be made from the entire Solar System. The uniform thickness cable is the one that really, really needs nanotubes to work as advertised. The taper concept is discussed in detail in this paper.

Brad Edwards did some feasibility studies for NASA, and published a layman's book on the subject. Here is the NIAC Phase I report, and the Phase II. Of course, there are several papers disputing Edwards' optimism; here is one such paper.

Anyways, the required strength for a space elevator cable really depends on how much mass you can muscle into orbit initally, and how much you could conceivably assemble in orbit. Even with the likely much reduced strength of nanotubes, it may still be possible to construct a space elevator if we can assemble it in orbit.

Not quite true. Multiwalled carbon nanotubes (MWCNTs) have been analysed to have a tensile strength in the outer layers of between 270 to 950 gigapascals.

Those are measures of Young's Modulus, not the nanotubes' tensile strength. We already know that they are very stiff indeed, but the key is how strong they are. The stronger they are, the lower the cable's taper ratio, and the lighter the initial cable can be.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Before going into the issue of strength, are these super strong materials resistant to fire? One of the problems about composites or some other new exotic material is that they aren't resistant to fire and too much heat generated will send them burning.

[Kanastrous]

I very dimly remember something off of Coast to Coast AM concerning trailing a cable off a space shuttle and somehow generating current via the differing altitudes and velocities of the cable ends.

(a) was that total BS and

(b) if it wasn't total BS, would that mean that current would flow along the length of a beanstalk incorporating carbon nanotubes?

[Winston Blake]

I very dimly remember something off of Coast to Coast AM concerning trailing a cable off a space shuttle and somehow generating current via the differing altitudes and velocities of the cable ends.

(a) was that total BS and

(b) if it wasn't total BS, would that mean that current would flow along the length of a beanstalk incorporating carbon nanotubes?

(a) No.
(b) No, because the beanstalk is rotating with the Earth, and so isn't cutting across the Earth's magnetic field lines.

[Solauren]

What about building a space elevator as a tier system?

(Hang on while I explain)

I'm thinking of a system where instead of making 1 big elevetor, you stack them in groups.

Say the base is the equal of 25 CN Towers in height and size, serving as the base (5 x 5). Then the next level is say 3x3, then 1x1

Wouldn't that make it easier? Which each 'section' being an independent elevator (you'd transfer to go to the next one).

I'm not an engineering, but could that work?

[Pelranius]

This news will probably cause Beijing and Seoul to start similar efforts, for the sake of keeping up with the Joneses if nothing else. East Asians are almost as bad as the Mid East in that regards.

[madd0ct0r]

What about building a space elevator as a tier system?

(Hang on while I explain)

I'm thinking of a system where instead of making 1 big elevetor, you stack them in groups.

Say the base is the equal of 25 CN Towers in height and size, serving as the base (5 x 5). Then the next level is say 3x3, then 1x1

Wouldn't that make it easier? Which each 'section' being an independent elevator (you'd transfer to go to the next one).

I'm not an engineering, but could that work?

not really, it's not a big tower that needs to withstand the compression forces at the base.

It more like whirling a bucket on a piece of string - the string's in pure tension and keeps the bucket the same distance from you. I don't really want to go into more detail, brings back memories of my (failed) cambridge entrance exam.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_elevator

[Solauren]

That's why I was suggesting stacking the string.

Or more accurately -

Build Elevator Shaft #1 as tall and wide and long as you can build it with commerically avialable materials.

On the floor it ends, start Shaft #2 across from it. Build it the same until it's end, then start Shaft #3

Sure, you'd have to keep moving things from one elevator car to another every few thousand stories, but that's GOT to be cheaper, and more environmentally friendly, then space launches currently are.

[Kanastrous]

If I understand rightly, a beanstalk does not stand on the ground and reach to orbit.

It hangs from orbit, and reaches the ground.

[Singular Intellect]

I'd love to hear how they go about securing the bottom end to the ground. The atmospheric interference alone would be a nightmare.