Portal Combat

[NoXion]

I don't believe there has been a thread on this before, but correct me if I'm wrong.

1) In this scenario, the Aperture Science Handheld Portal Device is common enough to be issued to soldiers at the squad level. How would such a device be utilised in combat situations? What effect would it have on modern combat?

2) The upgraded Portal Gun scenario, where they can be made large enough to mount on vehicles with the aperture diametre scaling up appropriately. They can also be fired at any reasonably flat and smooth surface such as still water, and the bolts that produce the apertures propagate at lightspeed. How would this scenario differ from the previous?

3) Civilian applications. How would the Portal Gun and it's upgraded version be used in the civilian sector? If it was cheap enough to be affordable to the average person, what effect would it have on society?

[Darkevilme]

The important question is whether they retain the original portal guns finickyness about the portals moving relative to eachother causing one opening to close.

If so this would most likely prevent using it to get things into orbit by putting a portal on a satellite.

And prevent combat use of the infinitely long magnetically accelerator you can make by putting the portals at the muzzle and breach of a gun.(use something thin for the muzzle surface, if water can serve as a portal surface you can probably use thick paper)

It would however have applications in making a stationary mass driver for tossing stuff into orbit quite feasible if you couldnt stick the end on a satellite.

[Napoleon the Clown]

In all three examples you can get someone/thing up to terminal velocity and then open up a portal to make them hit a wall or the ground at high speed. It'll ruin anything's day. If the military portals lack a safety feature that prevents you from closing a portal while an object is half through, there's also this rather gruesome tactic. Drop someone half through and hit "reset".


The thing is just too damned dangerous for civilian use. Odds are, the government wouldn't let it get released. Like I mentioned, you can use it to drop people from dangerous heights really easily. And I doubt everyone would wear those fancy footsprings.

[Darkevilme]

Amendment to my earlier declaration. The trouble i thought there originally was with using the portal gun to make an infinitely long magnetic accelerator barrel was that if moving the portals relative to eachother causes it to close then your gun is fixed where its aimed for the duration of the 'accelerate up before firing' sequence. Quess i'm not thinking with portals properly, evacuate a cylinder of air and drop the shell through the vacuum between portals to prevent friction limitings its velocity, when it hits a suitably nightmarish velocity move the top end portal onto a plate aimed at the thing whose day you want to ruin. Downside is rate of fire due to having to evacuate the chamber of air between shots and that the weapon platform is static while preparing to fire, upside is the only limit on velocity is how fast you can make the shell go before it vaporizes from friction upon hitting the atmosphere after firing.

[PeZook]

In all three examples you can get someone/thing up to terminal velocity and then open up a portal to make them hit a wall or the ground at high speed. It'll ruin anything's day. If the military portals lack a safety feature that prevents you from closing a portal while an object is half through, there's also this rather gruesome tactic. Drop someone half through and hit "reset".

Yeah, because during a firefight, enemies will totally just run into screwy portals opening in the ground rather than, I don't know...shooting at you?

For tactical engagements, portal guns would be close to useless. They may have some utility against armored vehicles, for ambushing them and such, or perhaps circumventing fortifications somehow.

The thing is just too damned dangerous for civilian use. Odds are, the government wouldn't let it get released. Like I mentioned, you can use it to drop people from dangerous heights really easily. And I doubt everyone would wear those fancy footsprings.

Au contraire, it would be excellent for rescue workers for one. Need to evacuate a building? Send in a fireman with a portal gun! He will open a portal right there inside the building and evacuate people quickly and efficiently. Hell, with an open portal you could use heavy equipment in confined spaces to, say, flood a burning electrical fire with foam really quickly by using a hi-capacity pump which normally wouldn't fit. You could drain flammable liquids, vent closed rooms...

For police use, build a robot with the damn thing and have it zap away bombs into reinforced drums, or create entryways for SWAT teams.

[NoXion]

The important question is whether they retain the original portal guns finickyness about the portals moving relative to eachother causing one opening to close.

If so this would most likely prevent using it to get things into orbit by putting a portal on a satellite.

What if it was a geostationary satellite?

An idea I had for the second and thirds scenarios involved a network of satellites with the upgraded portal guns - I imagine it would make a great system for long-distance transportation, especially if combined with the GPS network.

As for using the portal gun to hurl enemies and projectiles, I thought of that but I realised it would take some time to get up to speed - so perhaps it's not really relevant to tactical situations.

[Shroom Man 777]

PeZook, Portals will be AWESOME at fire and movement.

We're at a disadvantageous position! Portal there, to higher ground! Now frag em!

We can't hit them, sir. We're pinned down!

Open a portal right there and chuck grenades at them!

Come on, move move move! Get out of there, open up a portal over there, two hundred meters, and flank them! Lay down suppressive fire!

[NecronLord]

Amendment to my earlier declaration. The trouble i thought there originally was with using the portal gun to make an infinitely long magnetic accelerator barrel was that if moving the portals relative to eachother causes it to close then your gun is fixed where its aimed for the duration of the 'accelerate up before firing' sequence. Quess i'm not thinking with portals properly, evacuate a cylinder of air and drop the shell through the vacuum between portals to prevent friction limitings its velocity, when it hits a suitably nightmarish velocity move the top end portal onto a plate aimed at the thing whose day you want to ruin. Downside is rate of fire due to having to evacuate the chamber of air between shots and that the weapon platform is static while preparing to fire, upside is the only limit on velocity is how fast you can make the shell go before it vaporizes from friction upon hitting the atmosphere after firing.

While that's a fun idea, and one I've gleefully abused in writing myself, to move up in a gravity well, even via magical wormhole, should actually consume the kinetic energy gained by the drop of the same distance. Simply put, it would remain at a generally constant speed.

[Darkevilme]

Amendment to my earlier declaration. The trouble i thought there originally was with using the portal gun to make an infinitely long magnetic accelerator barrel was that if moving the portals relative to eachother causes it to close then your gun is fixed where its aimed for the duration of the 'accelerate up before firing' sequence. Quess i'm not thinking with portals properly, evacuate a cylinder of air and drop the shell through the vacuum between portals to prevent friction limitings its velocity, when it hits a suitably nightmarish velocity move the top end portal onto a plate aimed at the thing whose day you want to ruin. Downside is rate of fire due to having to evacuate the chamber of air between shots and that the weapon platform is static while preparing to fire, upside is the only limit on velocity is how fast you can make the shell go before it vaporizes from friction upon hitting the atmosphere after firing.

While that's a fun idea, and one I've gleefully abused in writing myself, to move up in a gravity well, even via magical wormhole, should actually consume the kinetic energy gained by the drop of the same distance. Simply put, it would remain at a generally constant speed.

The behaviour of the portal gun in the game seems to violate this law somehow. You can accelerate to a hellish velocity by falling between two portals and several puzzles in the game rely on this feature. Admittedly this is a free energy situation unless Glados was discreetly funneling energy from a reactor to make up for the effect of the portal gun.

[Samuel]

So we can build perpetual motion machines?

[Darkevilme]

So we can build perpetual motion machines?

Yes, the physics of portals do result in perpetual motion machines of many many types.

[Darth Tanner]

The civilian applications are near infinite, from free energy devices to instant mass transportation of goods and people.

Military applications are limited however (other than logistics) the need for flat surfaces makes the devices a bit unreliable in battle and other than the instantanious movement of troops and supplies to pre prepared sites I can't really see any use in actual battle. Messing about with portals while the high ex rounds are zooming about seems a good way to get killed.

[open_sketchbook]

Well you could make really, really powerful mobile artillery cannons. Basically, make a real big naval cannon with one end of the portal in front of the muzzle, and put it in 360 degree chamber so it (and the portal) can rotate to be facing the same relative direction as the gun on the actual vehicle. After you move the gun trailer (really a pickup truck with a log on the back) into position, put the other end of the portal on the end of the log. By rotating both the gun and the log at the same time the same distance, both portals remain relatively stationary to one another.

[Samuel]

Well you could make really, really powerful mobile artillery cannons. Basically, make a real big naval cannon with one end of the portal in front of the muzzle, and put it in 360 degree chamber so it (and the portal) can rotate to be facing the same relative direction as the gun on the actual vehicle. After you move the gun trailer (really a pickup truck with a log on the back) into position, put the other end of the portal on the end of the log. By rotating both the gun and the log at the same time the same distance, both portals remain relatively stationary to one another.

Or you can just put a Portal on a sattilite and avoid problems like LOS, gravity, arcing, etc.

[Napoleon the Clown]

In all three examples you can get someone/thing up to terminal velocity and then open up a portal to make them hit a wall or the ground at high speed. It'll ruin anything's day. If the military portals lack a safety feature that prevents you from closing a portal while an object is half through, there's also this rather gruesome tactic. Drop someone half through and hit "reset".

Yeah, because during a firefight, enemies will totally just run into screwy portals opening in the ground rather than, I don't know...shooting at you?

What about, say, shooting them underneath someone's feet? Did that cross your mind?

[NecronLord]

The behaviour of the portal gun in the game seems to violate this law somehow. You can accelerate to a hellish velocity by falling between two portals and several puzzles in the game rely on this feature. Admittedly this is a free energy situation unless Glados was discreetly funneling energy from a reactor to make up for the effect of the portal gun.

Is it a plot element? If not, it's a fair bet that's a gameplay physics limitation. I bet you don't reach a terminal velocity either, even though you're falling in an atmosphere, right?

[Steel]

The behaviour of the portal gun in the game seems to violate this law somehow. You can accelerate to a hellish velocity by falling between two portals and several puzzles in the game rely on this feature. Admittedly this is a free energy situation unless Glados was discreetly funneling energy from a reactor to make up for the effect of the portal gun.

Is it a plot element? If not, it's a fair bet that's a gameplay physics limitation. I bet you don't reach a terminal velocity either, even though you're falling in an atmosphere, right?

The game is specifically designed so that it violates CoE in this way, and it is remarked on in game that portals function a way that violates CoE (by conserving the velocity vector with respect to the surface of the portal from one aperture to the next). There is also an achievement for reaching terminal velocity by setting up portals and dropping through them to build up speed.

[NecronLord]

So the energy comes from some external source. If it's potent enough, you could annihilate the solar system with it... I think that's a pretty potent combat weapon. Certainly one way or another, it's a perpetual motion machine.

[Sea Skimmer]

I’d suspect, if they have any actual explanation planned, hopefully in Episode III, that the portal gun draws it energy from Zen or the dimension the Combined came from.

[TithonusSyndrome]

Au contraire, it would be excellent for rescue workers for one. Need to evacuate a building? Send in a fireman with a portal gun!

I wonder what happens to a portal if the planar surface it's associated with crumbles from beneath or burns from behind. Presumably it won't stay with them and form dozens of microportals, but still...

[The Grim Squeaker]

Au contraire, it would be excellent for rescue workers for one. Need to evacuate a building? Send in a fireman with a portal gun!

I wonder what happens to a portal if the planar surface it's associated with crumbles from beneath or burns from behind. Presumably it won't stay with them and form dozens of microportals, but still...

In the game a platform that splits apart with a portal on it results in the portal vanishing. Presumably it has no way to maintain cohesion without a nearly totally stable platform to stabilize it.

[Mr Bean]

What about, say, shooting them underneath someone's feet? Did that cross your mind?

You know what would be easier? Shooting them with a gun instead of relying on the portal to drop them someplace unpleasant. Per the game(No live targets only robots) shoot some directly with a portal does not hurt them and per the walls it appears the portals only adhere rather than displace a part of the wall when it's created.

Direct Portal to Portal combat would be limited to weapons and perhaps one-shot portal guns. I could see some sort of artillery shell that delivers a shell many times it's own size.

Put it this way, imagine a 105mm shell that opens a portal big enough for a 155mm shell filled with explosives rather than portal creating technology. Even better the 155 shell only needs very small amount of propelent because it's only traveling a few feet, increasing it's kill power all that more.

[PeZook]

What about, say, shooting them underneath someone's feet? Did that cross your mind?

Yeah, yeah. Because firefights typically happen on flat even surfaces where you can clearly see your enemy and they alway run straight at you! And they totally won't blow you away when you try to dick around with your fancy portal gun, thus not holding an actual weapon!

[Grog]

Why not put portals on the armor of your tanks or something? Try to shoot the tank now, everything will just be reflected or something. I haven't played the game so this might not work.

[Coalition]

I'd argue for logistics help using Portals. If they can only be the size listed in the game, then you can use them for rapidly delivering cargo (let alone what it will do to the transportation industry), plus MWR. MWR = fight for a day, then go home/back to the base at night.

If they can be smaller, then you can use smaller versions in a vehicle's fuel tank, such as to keep a Abrams' fuel tank topped off 24/7. The Supply Sergeant has a small Portal Comm with him, so he can talk into it, and small stuff can be sent through immediately.

The other option would be bandwidth. No need for transatlantic or other fiber optic cables, just pop a portal between the two ends, and pass the fiber through.

Best option - satellite delivery. None of the massive chemical engines needed to launch a one ton satellite, just launch the Portal once and install it into a space station, and pass through satellites as needed. The space station can repair/tweak them as needed, passing tools back and forth as needed. From there, the station just launches the satellites into the appropriate orbit. Use similar technology to perform Lunar, Mars, or other missions, and have the astronauts back on Earth for dinner.