I just saw "Stargate Continuum" *Spoilers*

[Crazedwraith]

I don't want to resurrect This old thread but I do want to post my thought on the lastest SG-1 Movie.

For what its worth: It better than Moebius, which is damning with faint praise if ever I heard it. Moreover, its what Mobeius was supposed to be: a fun romp through classic SG-1. We get to see the glory of the Goauld once more: Apophsis, Nirriti, Chronus, Yu, all the old gang and they're are going to kick our ass.

The opening is brilliant. The Title panning down to a slow shot wandering through out the SGC, catching snippets of daily SGC life, until Major Davis, ends up greeting SG-1. Sam, Cam, Daniel and Teal'c. The movie goes down hill from here.

First there's some attempts at comedy: Vala wants to bring a plasma gun with her to Ba'al's execution. Then we go through the gate to a Tok'Ra City (I thought we didn't like them anymore?) that contains not one Tok'Ra we've met before. Granted the only Tok'Ra we met that I don't recall dying was Peter Stebbin's Marek from a couple of season 6 episodes. Oh and Anise/Freya. Stil here we meet General Jack O'Neill. I don't want to see O'Neill anymore I really don't He's written so childishly, even RDA doesn't seem to like playing him any more. I'm beginning to think the money is the only reason he guest spots for the franchise at all.

Jack makes some childish complaints about the length of the ceremony, Baal mouths off a bit, and then people begin disappearing due to Ba'al's meddling with the time line, which makes not a lick of sense what so ever. Jack is then stabbed by Baal in the shoulder and dies. While the remainder of SG-1 makes a beeline for the gate, they get through just as everything changes and are spat out in the Artic. Where Daniel looses a foot and they are all rescued by the alternate Timeline Jack. (who's soon is still alive. Good old Chaos theory.)

SG-1 try to convince the new government, to let them fix the timeline. Landry has an awesome scene here, the gist of it being: "nuh-uh, we don't want to change the fabric of reality thanks."

One year later Baal at the head of the entire Goa'uld fleet. Good news: He wants to be friendly! (which is why he took half a hundred ha'taks with him) bad news. Vala, his queen, stabs him in the back. (literally) and decides she wants to be in charge and instructs the goa'uld to blast earth to smithereens. Teal'c sees Vala do this and swears revenge. (Ba'al promised him a free jaffa nation)

SG-1 are obviously called back into action when the Goa'uld appear, and fly fighters up to Russia to meet the gate, at the same time Teal'c arrives. The use the old highly over used 'we will free your people' change sides button on Teal'c back to win him over and then they end up at Ba'al's Time machine, which uses solar flares to sent people back in time. (As in Atlantis' The Last Man, the fact that it solar flares spit you out at your starting point, rather than your original destination is not addressed) but Vala arrives at the same time. SG-1 are killed by her Jaffa in an extended and lame fight but not before Cameron Mitchell is sent back in time to stop Ba'al. We see Ba'al's execution, laugh at Jack some more. The end.

The good:

• The opening, very fun.
• Baal's last words in the AT:
  T: My lord, shall I enact your final wishes?
  B: No you idiot! Save me!
• Apophsis' cameo.
• Ba'al's take over of the Achilles. Very cool. The Jaffa actually seemed somewhat menacing again and hit targets with a fair amount of accuracy
  
  The bad:
• Teal'c and Vala pretty much getting shaft into very minor roles. Claudia Black especially got stuck being a near characterless badie
• The massive reset button. I would have liked it if they'd manage to get SG-1 safe and sound, rather than the typical get killed trying to change the past
• There's all of two action scenes. A sub-par dogfight and a terrible shoot out at the end. Daniel dual wields M9s. Urk.

Also I've seen people say the replicators should have eaten Ba'al, but if SG-1 never met Thor, then he wouldn't come to Earth for help in Nemesis, thus the Replicators would have no special interest in the milky way. They'd get there eventually but not within the time period of "Continuum."

[Darth Onasi]

Also I've seen people say the replicators should have eaten Ba'al, but if SG-1 never met Thor, then he wouldn't come to Earth for help in Nemesis, thus the Replicators would have no special interest in the milky way. They'd get there eventually but not within the time period of "Continuum."

Did Thor come for help? IIRC Thor didn't want to expose Earth to that danger, but the Replicators sifted through the Beliskner's databanks and deemed Earth "tasty".
Given that the Asgard had visited Earth regardless and had several protected planets and outposts in the Milky Way I don't see why the Replicators wouldn't be interested.

[CaptainChewbacca]

Well, Baal knew about the Dakkara weapon, and he was there when they not only unlocked it, but activated it. It could be that he had the thing primed and ready to fire the second the replicators showed their faces in the Milky Way.

[PREDATOR490]

Well, Baal knew about the Dakkara weapon, and he was there when they not only unlocked it, but activated it. It could be that he had the thing primed and ready to fire the second the replicators showed their faces in the Milky Way.

If the Replicators follow suit they will rape the Asgard galaxy while sending small parties into the Milky Way. If Baal activates the weapon and dosent get them all then he has just fucked himself royally. The surviving replicators will identify the Milky Way as a prime target and attempt to get to the Dakara device. Failing that, the weapon worked on a specific frequency and the Replicators have been shown to adapt against that form of attack. Baal uses device enough = Replicators adapt, gang rush Dakara until they take it and then rape the Milky Way with it.

[CaptainChewbacca]

If the Replicators follow suit they will rape the Asgard galaxy while sending small parties into the Milky Way. If Baal activates the weapon and dosent get them all then he has just fucked himself royally. The surviving replicators will identify the Milky Way as a prime target and attempt to get to the Dakara device. Failing that, the weapon worked on a specific frequency and the Replicators have been shown to adapt against that form of attack. Baal uses device enough = Replicators adapt, gang rush Dakara until they take it and then rape the Milky Way with it.

I doubt it. The Dakkara weapon completely wipes the galaxy. There's no surviving replicators in the vicinity to study the effects of the weapon, and they can never get close enough to Dakkara to threaten it before Baal just does another purge.

Heck, I think he knows how to make ARG's, too, and maybe even that Asgard satellite weapon.

[Darth Onasi]

Most of Baal's knowledge on those subjects came from being Anubis' stooge, with Anubis' combination of Ancient knowledge and stuff stolen from Thor's mind.

[Ford Prefect]

the Replicators have been shown to adapt against that form of attack.

They have been shown to adapt to any weapon once, and only after Replicarter spent an entire episode studying the weapon and messing around with its mechanics. Further, those two weapons operate on entirely different principles - the handheld anti-Replicator weapon operated by messing around with the 'chiron pathways' which allow for communication and coherence between the Replicator blows, whereas the the Dakara weapon operates on some magical rearranging of atomic matter. There is no reason to assume that the Replicators will pull a Borg and 'adapt' to the Dakara pulse.

[Bilbo]

SG-1 are obviously called back into action when the Goa'uld appear, and fly fighters up to Russia to meet the gate, at the same time Teal'c arrives. The use the old highly over used 'we will free your people' change sides button on Teal'c back to win him over and then they end up at Ba'al's Time machine, which uses solar flares to sent people back in time. (As in Atlantis' The Last Man, the fact that it solar flares spit you out at your starting point, rather than your original destination is not addressed) but Vala arrives at the same time. SG-1 are killed by her Jaffa in an extended and lame fight but not before Cameron Mitchell is sent back in time to stop Ba'al. We see Ba'al's execution, laugh at Jack some more. The end.

No they do not. They seem to be pretty random. In "1969" they spit them back out the same gate. In "The Last Man" Sheppard arrives in Atlantis which means it sent him to the destination. Ba'al must have figured out a way to control which way the process works.

[Bilbo]

Daniel dual wields M9s. Urk.

In the opening scene of Season 2 Daniel duel wields a 9mm and a H&K to decent effect. So not the first time Daniel has suddenly had a John Woo inspired moment of badass.

[Crazedwraith]

SG-1 are obviously called back into action when the Goa'uld appear, and fly fighters up to Russia to meet the gate, at the same time Teal'c arrives. The use the old highly over used 'we will free your people' change sides button on Teal'c back to win him over and then they end up at Ba'al's Time machine, which uses solar flares to sent people back in time. (As in Atlantis' The Last Man, the fact that it solar flares spit you out at your starting point, rather than your original destination is not addressed) but Vala arrives at the same time. SG-1 are killed by her Jaffa in an extended and lame fight but not before Cameron Mitchell is sent back in time to stop Ba'al. We see Ba'al's execution, laugh at Jack some more. The end.

No they do not. They seem to be pretty random. In "1969" they spit them back out the same gate. In "The Last Man" Sheppard arrives in Atlantis which means it sent him to the destination. Ba'al must have figured out a way to control which way the process works.

I am aware of The Last Man, I referenced it my first damn post. Reading comprehension is a plus.

In the original (and best) time travel episode 1969 and then again in 2010, the method stated is that a solar flare slingshots the wormhole back to the point of origin and into the past. I'd like to see a solar flare that could both slingshot a wormhole (ie radically change its course) at the same time as keeping going in the same direction so that you end up at your intended destination.

Baal obviously didn't have any control of the process, its entirely dependant on the solar flares, they were incredibly luckily a useful flare arrived at the same time that they were at the device and they did get ones that would as Sam said, just said them back to the Cretaceous.

In the opening scene of Season 2 Daniel duel wields a 9mm and a H&K to decent effect. So not the first time Daniel has suddenly had a John Woo inspired moment of badass.

Doesn't make it less retarded.

And actually he was less 'badass' than he just took a staff blast to the chest and nearly died.

[Bilbo]

SG-1 are obviously called back into action when the Goa'uld appear, and fly fighters up to Russia to meet the gate, at the same time Teal'c arrives. The use the old highly over used 'we will free your people' change sides button on Teal'c back to win him over and then they end up at Ba'al's Time machine, which uses solar flares to sent people back in time. (As in Atlantis' The Last Man, the fact that it solar flares spit you out at your starting point, rather than your original destination is not addressed) but Vala arrives at the same time. SG-1 are killed by her Jaffa in an extended and lame fight but not before Cameron Mitchell is sent back in time to stop Ba'al. We see Ba'al's execution, laugh at Jack some more. The end.

No they do not. They seem to be pretty random. In "1969" they spit them back out the same gate. In "The Last Man" Sheppard arrives in Atlantis which means it sent him to the destination. Ba'al must have figured out a way to control which way the process works.

I am aware of The Last Man, I referenced it my first damn post. Reading comprehension is a plus.

In the original (and best) time travel episode 1969 and then again in 2010, the method stated is that a solar flare slingshots the wormhole back to the point of origin and into the past. I'd like to see a solar flare that could both slingshot a wormhole (ie radically change its course) at the same time as keeping going in the same direction so that you end up at your intended destination.

Baal obviously didn't have any control of the process, its entirely dependant on the solar flares, they were incredibly luckily a useful flare arrived at the same time that they were at the device and they did get ones that would as Sam said, just said them back to the Cretaceous.

In the opening scene of Season 2 Daniel duel wields a 9mm and a H&K to decent effect. So not the first time Daniel has suddenly had a John Woo inspired moment of badass.

Doesn't make it less retarded.

And actually he was less 'badass' than he just took a staff blast to the chest and nearly died.

How is it obvious he did not have control over the process. When he traveled through time he went exactly where he wanted to go. Either the process is random, or back to sender is the more common result and Ba'al figured out how to change it.

Also do we know where Ba'al went after he went back in time? Did he stay in the past or somehow go back into the future? The first would leave two Ba'als in the past which might be a bit awkward. The second would merely require Ba'al studying long enough to find two properly timed flares close together. One to go back in time and another one near a different stargate he can use to return to the future.

[CaptainChewbacca]

The time-travel process is 'random' in that you take your solar flares as you can. Ba'al was monitoring an entire galaxy, possibly for weeks, waiting for the right solar flare to make itself available for him to travel back to the appropriate time. The place was less important, though, as he had the whole gate network at his disposal.

[Bilbo]

The time-travel process is 'random' in that you take your solar flares as you can. Ba'al was monitoring an entire galaxy, possibly for weeks, waiting for the right solar flare to make itself available for him to travel back to the appropriate time. The place was less important, though, as he had the whole gate network at his disposal.

Then my apology. I misunderstood. I thought he was saying that Ba'al had no control over what Gate he came out of when he time traveled. Obviously he has no control over the time travel itself. Though he has the computer power and satellites in place to make it appear like he controls them. It did not take Sam long to find a useful solar flare to send Mitchell back. So Ba'al must have a truly massive sat network.

[dragon]

If the Replicators follow suit they will rape the Asgard galaxy while sending small parties into the Milky Way. If Baal activates the weapon and dosent get them all then he has just fucked himself royally. The surviving replicators will identify the Milky Way as a prime target and attempt to get to the Dakara device. Failing that, the weapon worked on a specific frequency and the Replicators have been shown to adapt against that form of attack. Baal uses device enough = Replicators adapt, gang rush Dakara until they take it and then rape the Milky Way with it.

I doubt it. The Dakkara weapon completely wipes the galaxy. There's no surviving replicators in the vicinity to study the effects of the weapon, and they can never get close enough to Dakkara to threaten it before Baal just does another purge.

Heck, I think he knows how to make ARG's, too, and maybe even that Asgard satellite weapon.

That was one thing I was curious about the Darka weapon it proprogates through the stargate but what about infested planets that have no gates or even ships light years away from active gates. The wave as it traveled didn't look faster than light.

[NecronLord]

Tok'Ra City (I thought we didn't like them anymore?)

Jack O'Neill doesn't like them, because he's a fractious jerk. They happen to have been pretty instrumental in saving the galaxy from being consumed by Von Neumanns.

And of course they've set up openly, they're no longer persecuted.

Good news: He wants to be friendly! (which is why he took half a hundred ha'taks with him)

Makes sense, from his perspective. Observe how many times the planet has come through through some eleventh hour deus-ex-mechanica.

(As in Atlantis' The Last Man, the fact that it solar flares spit you out at your starting point, rather than your original destination is not addressed)

I don't see a problem with that, so long as you go somewhere where there's a stargate. Presumably they arrived on Praxion in 1940 or whatever.

Also I've seen people say the replicators should have eaten Ba'al, but if SG-1 never met Thor, then he wouldn't come to Earth for help in Nemesis, thus the Replicators would have no special interest in the milky way. They'd get there eventually but not within the time period of "Continuum."

I've suggested, way back in the old thread, that Ba'al probably used his foreknowledge to nip the replicators and Anubis in the bud. Say, by sending a message to the Asgard that 'hey, there's this giant kill all replicators device on one of my planets... but I need you to teleport the worst goa'uld ever into the intergalactic void for me...'

Of course, it's a deeply flawed film, but most of the continuity errors resolve themselves with a little thought.

[NecronLord]

Baal uses device enough = Replicators adapt,

That's the Asurans (who have a full knowledge of Ancient technology, including how to make the damn thing) not the Replicators. They were only able to 'adapt' after SG1 let Replicarter play about with their research and learn how it works.

Without that there's no reason to think they could ever render themselves immune.

[NecronLord]

Further, those two weapons operate on entirely different principles - the handheld anti-Replicator weapon operated by messing around with the 'chiron pathways' which allow for communication and coherence between the Replicator blows, whereas the the Dakara weapon operates on some magical rearranging of atomic matter. There is no reason to assume that the Replicators will pull a Borg and 'adapt' to the Dakara pulse.

Err. They're explicitly said to work on very similar principles. In Reckoning they basically just copy the settings over onto the Dakara device. Clearly the Ancient-ARG uses the same underlying technology as the 'mysteriously phasorise living things but not inert organic material' setting.

[Zac Naloen]

One thing I have noticed is that the only time we've seen it sling back to the same gate was when the solar flare was in the same system.

They've been pretty consistent with that at least.

[FireNexus]

If they work on such similar principles, why not modify the ARG to make an infantry weapon capable of melting attackers?

It would certainly have fucked with the priors.

[Crazedwraith]

Tok'Ra City (I thought we didn't like them anymore?)

Jack O'Neill doesn't like them, because he's a fractious jerk. They happen to have been pretty instrumental in saving the galaxy from being consumed by Von Neumanns.

No, I mean didn't we pretty much cut diplomatic ties with them after Death Knell? (or rather they did with us) to the point where only Jacob would associate with us in Reckoning?

[Zac Naloen]

Tok'Ra City (I thought we didn't like them anymore?)

Jack O'Neill doesn't like them, because he's a fractious jerk. They happen to have been pretty instrumental in saving the galaxy from being consumed by Von Neumanns.

No, I mean didn't we pretty much cut diplomatic ties with them after Death Knell? (or rather they did with us) to the point where only Jacob would associate with us in Reckoning?

They didn't like our methods and blamed us for the death of half their population as it made them become more open in their methods and open to attack.

As a result they got more and more distant and unwilling to help us and just wanted us when they need us. Until season 8 when we cut off ties because we'd had enough of being used as it became clear they needed us more than we needed them by that point.

Continuum is about 3 years after that event, so I guess the Tok'Ra must have attempted to open diplomatic ties and said sorry by that point.

[NecronLord]

If they work on such similar principles, why not modify the ARG to make an infantry weapon capable of melting attackers?

You're assuming the power requirements of turning some machines off, and phasoring someone are equal.

It would certainly have fucked with the priors.

Or made them turn agressive and telekinetic-head-crush any Tau'ri they see (and just for good measure, they can see through cloaking devices on some occasions). They're basically dicking about with the Tau'ri in season nine and ten. If they suffered prior-casualties, that could change.

[Bilbo]

Tok'Ra City (I thought we didn't like them anymore?)

Jack O'Neill doesn't like them, because he's a fractious jerk. They happen to have been pretty instrumental in saving the galaxy from being consumed by Von Neumanns.

No, I mean didn't we pretty much cut diplomatic ties with them after Death Knell? (or rather they did with us) to the point where only Jacob would associate with us in Reckoning?

Well the Tok'ra also seem to play rather fast and loose with the facts when they condemn Earth. I remember one BS line from Jacob about how every time we kill a System Lord a worse one comes along or the Goa'uld get closer to being under one command and thus a greater threat.

Apophis - Earth didnt kill him first time. They destroyed alot of his power with his two ships in defense of the planet. When he was taken out the second time it was part of a Tok'ra and Carter plan to blow up a sun. How is that Earth's fault?

Cronus - Killed so that he would not murder Teal'c. Was not a planned mission to assassinate him.

Heru - Killed by a brilliant Tok'ra plan to start a war between him and Apophis.

Sokar - Killed by the Tok'ra which is probably the biggest snafu of all since right after he dies and Apophis loses his fleet we see Anubis show up.

Yu - Killed by Replicarter but before that the oldest, most stable, and most decent of the System Lords gets Alzheimers after as part of a Tok'ra plan he gets injected with a mind-altering drug by Daniel.

Moloch - Was killed while running a program of murdering every female Jaffa under his rule. But then the Tok'ra never give a shit when Jaffa die no matter the reason.

Nirrti - Technically killed by one of her experiments and she wasn't that big a political player anyway. More of the loner mad scientist type.

Ra - Supreme system lord killed in the movie but things do not appear that peaceful from flashbacks we see with Teal'c. So we cannot say what for sure.

So the Tok'ra have very little to bitch at SG-1 one about. Oh and the subtle hide and sneak Tok'ra are full of shit. Jolinar raised an army and attempted to destroy the System Lords in open conflict. This happened recently enough that Cronus still has assasins hunting her when SG-1 happens to find her.

In reality the Tok'ra are complete fuckups who try to push their mistakes off on others and really act nearly as arrogantly as the Goa'uld do.

[CaptainChewbacca]

We also killed Seth and Imhotep, don't forget.

[Darth Onasi]

We also killed Seth and Imhotep, don't forget.

But then, Seth was hiding out on Earth as a cult leader of little note, and Imhotep was an underling with delusions of grandeur who was going to get ass raped by Yu if Teal'c hadn't killed him.
There's also Hathor and Osiris, but again neither were major political players due to their imprisonment. The Tok'ra might argue that the Tauri released them in the first place, but what do they expect when Earth has so many sealed evil in cans lying around?

Edit: In any case, Seth's death was also Tok'ra aided.