*** Stardestroyer.net is very very flawed ***

Butterbean569 · Post by **Butterbean569** » 2003-01-31 10:54pm

lol I agree. Even the Discussion boards are pretty pathetic. The flamewars between L4L and all those type of people are the best examples...(although the best example of stupidity is easily in these threads hehe)

ReinnResauq · Post by **ReinnResauq** » 2003-02-01 01:54am

Oh me, oh my. Another group that thinks it can refute Mike Wong via *not* saying what's wrong. Gee, that brings the list upto what...40-50 thousand boards? I don't think there's a Trekkie out there who would not look at his website and think "*Scoffs* Well...*Scoffs* He's wrong!" Particularly the ones who would bother joining a board about Star Trek.

You'll also notice that most of them use the thin veil of "He's not nice" to actually debate him on the issue. These people aren't worth beating.

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi · Post by **Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi** » 2003-02-01 07:17pm

Wicked Pilot wrote:Let the stupid people come to us.

My thought exactly. If they think they're correct, then they should come over here and prove it. If they refuse to, then they're probably being cowards.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-02-02 10:46pm

GrandAdmiralPrawn wrote:I'm Shaithis on those boards. I delivered a mighty smackdown to Envy some weeks ago, where I showed that "Mr. Science Professor" lacked any knowledge of basic collision physics. He slunk away for a while, but lately he's started up again.

Isn't it amazing how there's a seemingly endless stream of people who seem to have surfed every fringe-science website in creation and can confidently discuss things like muon-catalyzed nuclear fusion, quarks, and string theory, but don't even fucking understand basic kinematics?

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2003-02-02 11:35pm

Darth Wong wrote:
GrandAdmiralPrawn wrote:I'm Shaithis on those boards. I delivered a mighty smackdown to Envy some weeks ago, where I showed that "Mr. Science Professor" lacked any knowledge of basic collision physics. He slunk away for a while, but lately he's started up again.
Isn't it amazing how there's a seemingly endless stream of people who seem to have surfed every fringe-science website in creation and can confidently discuss things like muon-catalyzed nuclear fusion, quarks, and string theory, but don't even fucking understand basic kinematics?

Some people have trouble divorcing quantitative from qualitative analysis (And there are always thoser more interested in HOW it works than how well it functions.) At least thats my theory (and my experience, some of it personal) on the familiarity of fringe science stuff.

Soontir C'boath · Post by **Soontir C'boath** » 2003-02-03 08:11am

Let's see.

I'm guessing
Envy is a kid with no knowledge whatsover of this sort.
Saguinous Rex is a high school drop out. ROFL

It's just amazing of how far these people go. They still think that the A-Wings took down the shields of the Executor FOR CRYING OUT LOUD. ROFL.

I just gave in my counter arguement against Envy's latest. This dick was asking questions and making baseless claims....ugh

Cyaround,
Jason

smokemare · Post by **smokemare** » 2003-02-03 10:52am

He appears to argue a point to the hilt, then when his point is on the ropes he quickly switches to another.... Hmmm, how many posts before he runs out of non-existant points....

Star Wars Galaxy tiny ? *Shakes head in dismay....* Dear me....

Malecoda · Post by **Malecoda** » 2003-02-03 02:43pm

When you sally forth to engage people like this, do any of you ask them any kind of preliminary questions to make sure they are capable of discussing stuff on your level? What I mean is, is there some kind of screening mechanism that you use? What would happen if, instead of jumping into the debate, you simply said "How can I tell the mins and maxes of a function?" or something along those lines? If they can answer that, then you ask something else, like, "What's a stress-strain curve look like? Why is elastic stress linear? What's sinh and cosh?" or "What's linear independence mean?" There are a gillion questions to weed 'em out with. I personally am curious as to whether these people can answer the derivative test question.

Darth Balls · Post by **Darth Balls** » 2003-02-04 12:03am

ROFL! We're back to 'LASERS CANT HURT ST SHIELDS' again. God these guys are dumb.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2003-02-04 12:15am

Jesus, no one on EITHER side is a good debater over there (present company excluded, of course). If you'll read it, the only people with remotely good points are ones from this board!

smokemare · Post by **smokemare** » 2003-02-04 04:22am

Hmmm, thanks... I'm technically from that board....

Malecoda · Post by **Malecoda** » 2003-02-04 12:44pm

So you clearly do not fall under the blanket statement and can thus exclude yourself.

Soontir C'boath · Post by **Soontir C'boath** » 2003-02-04 01:58pm

smokemare wrote:Hmmm, thanks... I'm technically from that board....

You've been posting before MoO made that statement so technically you are part of our group.

Cyaround,
Jason

Soontir C'boath · Post by **Soontir C'boath** » 2003-02-04 02:13pm

Darth Balls wrote:ROFL! We're back to 'LASERS CANT HURT ST SHIELDS' again. God these guys are dumb.

Yup, hopefully my latest list of why they are not L.A.S.E.R. can change their mind specifically Sinarla.....

Cyaround,
Jason

Admiral Johnason · Post by **Admiral Johnason** » 2003-02-04 05:42pm

Well, look on the bright side, at least they aren't on this board......yet. BTW, which are better overall, photon or proton torps?

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2003-02-04 05:48pm

Admiral Johnason wrote:Well, look on the bright side, at least they aren't on this board......yet. BTW, which are better overall, photon or proton torps?

Depends on the type. Some type of protons are 1 KT, then there are the ones equal to the missiles Slave one carried, or the heavy anticap ship ones, or the capital grade ones, or even the Torpedo sphere level ones.

If we are talking a standard dogfighting torp carried by an X wing, then a photon is more poweful. But that X wing can carry some that outclass quantum torpedoes by a long shot.

smokemare · Post by **smokemare** » 2003-02-05 03:58am

Envy is taking personal attack - cheapshots at Bongmania

http://boards.station.sony.com/ubb/star ... 50542.html

*shakes head* Dear me, he appears not to like the thrust and parry of meaningful debate - but prefers to hide his childishness in another thread...

Is that a concession ?

Darth Balls · Post by **Darth Balls** » 2003-02-11 01:52pm

http://boards.station.sony.com/ubb/star ... 588-5.html

erm... no i see the rantings of a guy / gal with a pinapple up their ass.

it does not explain what han said...

and i assume neither can you.

(refers to the guy / gal who made up www.stardestroyer.net not you... you are one of the more dead on SW advocates)

This is his attempt at refuting this:

Starships
The Federation cultists believe their Federation has impressive industrial capacity, but they are clearly not familiar with our industrial capacity. We have constructed 25,000 Star Destroyers in the last 20 years and two Death Stars within the last 5 years. These forces, impressive as they are, are still dwarfed in numbers by the massive fleets of dreadnaughts, frigates, escort cruisers, light cruisers, etc. that have been patrolling the galaxy for millenia.

Some Federation cultists make ludicrous claims about us having only a few thousand ships (like their puny Federation), because Han Solo stated in ANH that the Empire couldn't possibly have destroyed Alderaan. He said: "The entire starfleet couldn't destroy the planet. It would take a thousand ships with more firepower than I've-" before being cut off by a hurtling TIE fighter. Frankly, it doesn't take a genius to see that this quote can be interpreted in many ways, not least of which is the fact that Han Solo is demonstrably wrong about the capabilities of the Empire since he claims that it is "impossible" for them to have done what they just did: destroy a planet. For them to twist this quote to claim that the Empire can control millions of star systems with a few thousand ships is typically illogical- he is speaking in the heat of the moment, he obviously knows nothing about the true capabilities of the Empire since he thinks they can't destroy a planet (even though they just did) and the Death Star was too large to possibly be an Imperial space station (even though it was). Furthermore, the density of ships filling the Coruscant sky in TPM indicates that millions of ships travel in and out of Coruscant on a daily basis. This isn't even the full military force of the Empire- it is just the food and supply ship traffic for Coruscant's population! We must repeat, and emphasize that any Federation cultist who makes ludicrous claims about our starship fleets being as small as their puny starship fleets is obviously ignorant, self-delusional, or both.

It should be noted that the most common Federation cultist objection is that we never see hundreds or thousands of Imperial warships in one place at one time during the original trilogy. Frankly, this line of argument betrays a staggering lack of analysis. ANH, ROTJ, and TESB's events take place almost entirely in the Outer Rim, where fleet density is low. The only events in the Galactic Core, in all three films, take place in ANH during the destruction of Alderaan. Alderaan had little or no standing fleet, and the Death Star required no fleet since its firepower exceeded that of half the entire Imperial starfleet. Every other event in all three original trilogy films takes place in the Outer Rim, away from the highest concentrations of ships. The Emperor only used a few dozen ships for his ambush at Endor, but he had the Death Star which is itself equivalent to millions of ships. The fleet was only there to herd the rebel ships into position for the Death Star. In the first minute of TPM we see that the Trade Federation blockade consists of 2 mile wide starships in geosynchronous orbit, less than 10 miles apart. Since the TradeFed blockade was a full planetary blockade, this means that they had thousands of these vessels in orbit. This isn't even the government- it is a mere shipping company! Furthermore, the blockade itself is described as "trivial" by Qui-Gon; clearly, this was not a stunning quantity of starships to him. Obviously, attempts to equate Imperial fleet size to Federation fleet size are misguided and futile.

A common fallacy is the belief that Star Destroyers are exceptionally large even by the standards of the Galactic Empire, when in fact they are unremarkable vessels. The Invincible-class dreadnaughts which patrolled space generations before the first Imperator-class Star Destroyers were commissioned were over 2km long, like the one that Han Solo encountered when he traveled to the Stars' End prison facility.

However, a lone ISD is still an impressive sight for primitive cultures, who are generally incapable of constructing a vessel on that scale (the Federation has never been able to build a starship longer than 700 metres). Its length is approximately 1600 metres, and its volume is approximately 9E7 m³. Contrast this with the Federation's front-line warship, the military-version GCS. Several hundred of these ships were deployed in their recent Dominion War, making them the apparent backbone of their fleet (their Defiant-class and Sovereign-class ships are few in number). The GCS is a mere 650 metres in length, and a mere 6.5E6 m³ in volume. Federation cultists invariably compare the length of the two ships when comparing their size, but volume defines mass, and the volume of an ISD is fourteen times as large as the volume of a GCS. A one-dimensional comparison of length is oversimplistic and unrealistic- a 10m sphere is 8 times larger than a 5m sphere, even though it is only twice as wide.

Therefore, even if we disregard the rest of the fleet and exclusively discuss ISD's, the Empire's ISD fleet is as massive as 350,000 GCS's.

It's pathetic. He dismisses all of that with a simple insult. Talk about being dense....

Coaan · Post by **Coaan** » 2003-02-11 02:29pm

smokemare wrote:Please feel free to piss yourself laughing at Rabid Trekkie Envy's evaluation of Stardestroyer.net. Of course providing anything more than speculation and derogatory remarks is beyond him but....

*************
Envy
Station Member posted 01-31-2003 03:12 AM user search report post
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ere....!!! less of it you!

well i would love to respond to all this material, but im at work... and im on UK time... as well so that doesnt help...

i reality though...

i see that there are a lot of people who seem to be just jumping into the whole

"BUT WE CAN SHOOT j00z0r WITH 3,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 MEGATONNES!!!"

the harsh reality is that www.stardestroyer.net is very very flawed... nice idea, but flawed

it assumes things without basis...

all of it claimed "conservative" figures are about as conservative as a... erm... um... not very conservative thing...

it in many cases claims things that are blatently just not true...

oh... and all of its mathmatical calculations are rounded up to the nearest thousand at every stage...

add all this up and you have a very impressive piece of propaganda...

good, and accurate looking, but false propaganda...

*************

Anyone wanting to smack Envy can do so here:-

http://boards.station.sony.com/ubb/star ... 50110.html

Smack him?! Give me the location so we can plan a tactical nuclear strike to cleanse that area of the gene pool...please!!

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

* Stardestroyer.net is very very flawed *

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*** Stardestroyer.net is very very flawed ***

Re: *** Stardestroyer.net is very very flawed ***

* Stardestroyer.net is very very flawed *

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