Writing a story...

Alferd Packer · Post by **Alferd Packer** » 2003-02-03 03:58pm

To all the writers out there: do you think a fantasy-genre story is viable with primarily atheistic characters and societies, or is the idea of gods so intrinsically linked with the fantasy genre that it's tantamount to writing without ever using the letter 'e'?

Sonnenburg · Post by **Sonnenburg** » 2003-02-03 07:44pm

Speculative fiction (science fiction and fantasy) is so flexible it's hard to imagine scenarios that can't work.

The thing about fantasy is that it's usually linked with magic or the supernatural in one form or another. It seems unlikely that in a society where one can turn a man into a crow with a few well-chosen gestures that people would reject the existence of gods. In this kind of scenario I'd say you've got the following choices:

1) No magic or supernatural. Problem sorts itself out. Gotta stick with it though; no impossible shields or weapons, special trinkets, anything.
2) A fantasy society that is simply unaware of the existence of supernatural forces
3) Magic is a form of science. Problem again then deals with the actual science of it. There should be logic to it. For example, a ring grants three wishes. So, wish for a million wishes. Can't do it, because of conservation of magic (can't get out more wishes than you put in; first law of thaumodynamics)
4) Comedy. Have magic ocurring all around people who dismiss it as being charlatan no matter how impossible. (Man gets turned into broom. Woman: "Am I supposed to be impressed?" Broom: "All smoke and mirrors that is.")

Alferd Packer · Post by **Alferd Packer** » 2003-02-04 12:53am

Well, here was my orginal line of thought: let's say the sentient beings of this realm, be the human, giant toad-people, or whatever, are exceptionally curious. They want to understand everything they can, and throughout their history they've been able to solve the big questions through philosophy and logic. Now, we all know what arguably the BIGGEST question is, and as such, they've answered already: multiple thinkers across the races all agree that there is no god. Since the argument is thousands of years old, everyone in the present accepts this as, well the truth.

Does this, however, necessarily preclude the existence of magic/other planes/fantastically powerful creatues(but not infinitely so)?

Idea 3 seems to fit fairly well, in that magic is likened to fundamental property of the universe, with definible properties and capabilities.

Sonnenburg · Post by **Sonnenburg** » 2003-02-04 01:15am

I'd say you're probably embarking on what is the hardest of all paths (not to discourage you; just my opinion up front). You should probably confine your "laws" to perhaps two fundamentals so as not to lose your audience by delving into the details of your universe.
Goofy example, but something I might use one day (I want to do an invasion of a magical fantasy world by a science fiction space fleet): an atomic bomb is going to be dropped on a medieval city. A wizard casts a large spell for Bottled Light (in essence, slowing light down so that it can be bottled and used at night), thus reducing c to a ridiculously low amount and effectively nullify the bomb. Taking an idea like this and building a functioning rational magic behind this creates the magic of your universe. Anything that falls outside it is considered magically impossible.

Rhoades · Post by **Rhoades** » 2003-02-04 08:05pm

Another example would be to think of the Jedi and Star Wars. Granted what they do with the Force is considered 'magic', but do they believe in gods or does the Force revolve around gods? I think it's easy enough to transplant a concept like that into a medievel fantasy setting. As Wong's TNG database they almost threat it like a science (being able to detect it in people, develop methods to control and strengthen it, as well as have a use for it in society)... it even has a unit of measurement: midichorlens(sp?).

BlackWarMewtwo · Post by **BlackWarMewtwo** » 2003-02-04 08:39pm

I think your best bet in making this scenario work is to avoid the question of deities altogether. For what is a deity if not a magical being?

That said, magical spells, yes, as long as it is easily quantifiable. maybe even visual, but magical creatures would have to be pretty low level and unthreatening. Humans would have to be better than just about all of them, so that they can't imagine a magical being greater than themselves.

Oh, and emphasize language, both written and spoken, so that they can convey their ideas to later generations and continue to build on things. Also philosophy, so that they remain inquisitive.

Alferd Packer · Post by **Alferd Packer** » 2003-02-04 09:19pm

Interesting. Thanks for the input, everyone.