Questions from T:SCC s2

[Rogue 11]

After rewatching, I have to say I completely forgot about that. Sorry about that. Still, I wouldn't necessarily call it a success of Skynet. It might just be that there is further infighting in the resistance.

Skynet termies do not really use bullets.

Hence why I said I jumped to conclusions. Still it does not bode for anything good and infighting in the resistance can only help Skynet. Though it could be something like a grey attempting to sabotage the mission, a terminator going bad or a pissed off ex of the soldier picking the last possible moment to settle things.

Right now we don't have enough information to say anything and I should have realized that before posting.

I do personally think that it indicates the resistance being in serious trouble, but that's at best speculation.

[weemadando]

Could it be that there's a civil war amongst the Resistance when he comes back? And that the target list he gives might have ulterior motives?

It could even be that the guy who came back is a grey and giving a target list to HELP Skynet.

[Thanas]

Civil war...unlikely. Because after all, the different factions of the resistance all hate Skynet. It is also not shown that the Jesse faction (and that is a lot of speculation here) has the numbers to even pull of a civil war.


EDIT: As for the guy being a grey, I doubt it, considering that saving families and key personnel etc. does not help Skynet in any way.

[Rogue 11]

It could even be that the guy who came back is a grey and giving a target list to HELP Skynet.

I don't find that likely. He knew where the Connors were and if Skynet knew that exactly it would likely have used that information by now in a more direct manner.

[weemadando]

It could even be that the guy who came back is a grey and giving a target list to HELP Skynet.

I don't find that likely. He knew where the Connors were and if Skynet knew that exactly it would likely have used that information by now in a more direct manner.

It's unlikely, but you never know.

[eyexist]

After rewatching, I have to say I completely forgot about that. Sorry about that. Still, I wouldn't necessarily call it a success of Skynet. It might just be that there is further infighting in the resistance.

Skynet termies do not really use bullets.

Or it could be that a reprogrammed Terminator ran amok.

[Thanas]

Inside the chronosphere? I find that doubtful, considering the only Terminator ever shown near it was Cameron.

[eyexist]

Inside the chronosphere? I find that doubtful, considering the only Terminator ever shown near it was Cameron.

I'm not trying to say that Future John gave another Termie access to the device, just that one happened to "flip a switch" and go on a killing spree. We observed it in Dungeons and Dragons, and Jesse's account of it.

[PREDATOR490]

The simpler solution might be a Skynet attack on the time machine location as an attempt to stop them interdicting it's own operations.

If events in the present directly effect the future then wont that mean Carter will be found by Skynet in the future ?

Skynet clearly wanted Coltan inside that bunker so that it could be used to build more Ts and Cameron tells us Skynet has a terminator factory where she was built located at that bunker. Hence, Skynet should be able to open the doors and find Carter in any future as long as the present condition remains unchanged. Accessing his chip or just having him tell Skynet what happened should alert Skynet to the presence of the Connors and gives it visual IDs of Cameron and Sarah.

To be honest, Skynet would be smarter if it created drops for information like Terminator schematics and historical information so that when Judgement Day comes it can leap ahead to laser guns and T-888s while taking advantage of it's records to nail key targets quickly and efficiently. Although, I would personnally like to see what would happen if Skynet altered strategy and started sending T's back to do benevolent looking things like running companys like Stark or Weaver then paint the Connors as the bad guys so the unknowing humans do Skynet's work for it.

[Rogue 11]

Civil war...unlikely. Because after all, the different factions of the resistance all hate Skynet. It is also not shown that the Jesse faction (and that is a lot of speculation here) has the numbers to even pull of a civil war.


EDIT: As for the guy being a grey, I doubt it, considering that saving families and key personnel etc. does not help Skynet in any way.

On the Jesse faction: You forget that this is before she jumped back with Riley. The way I see it the moment somebody launches a time mission the future it was from is invalidated. It'll still end up similar since apparently the butterfly effect isn't that severe in terminator-verse, but it will still be similar.

Before she jumped back her faction was pathetically small, it could be that she is pretty much it. After she jumped back that could have changed. What if her plan to alter John's behavior backfired and now John is a less competent leader thus making a far greater dissatisfied faction? We don't know.

The only indicator we have of the future after she entered the series timeline is from the resistance side is the bleeding guy.

So far we got the theories down to:

Skynet attack: (Unlikely since it's a bullet. And given that it slow mo's at first it did look like pistol caliber to me albeit that is hard to see mid shot without a bigger screen than I have). Of course if Skynet was suffering from limited resources it could have very well been forced to scrounge resistance weapons a lot of which fire bullets. If that was the case it'd explain why it keeps sending Termies back after he won (And why many of those seem somewhat lower quality than before) as he wants to win without losing so many resources.

Given that all missions we've seen launched afterwards that we've managed to confirm what the hell their mission was happens to cover weakening the resistance so it can be crushed more easilly this possibility just seems more likely but I won't go as far as to say probable

Civil war: Unless the future is significantly altered unlikely.

Terminator gone bad: Unlikely as it seems like a too weird coincidence that it just happened as they were jumping (Though we don't know how long that takes in the future so that might be wrong). You'd think that if it didn't happen before the point of no return they'd just abort and send the mission once he rogue Termie was taken care of. Unless there are issues with time travel we don't know.

Single person opposing the mission: No idea how likely that is. Could be, but why did this guy get access to the time bunker when it was apparently kept Low Key. At least in Derek's future. (Then again Jesse got access somehow)

Grey going back: Unlikely due to him knowing the Connor's location, but just because those actions didn't help skynet doesn't mean they won't later on. In this case the first few would be genuine if I did it to gain their trust once the more speculative comes about. Still that's in the realm of paranoia.

So in summary none of what we've considered looks likely unless the future has been significantly altered since Derek came back. If so the most likely reason for such an alteration would be Jesse and Riley.

Am I missing anything?

[PREDATOR490]

Just because the guy might not be a grey does not preclude the possibility of Skynet employing a less direct strategy. If actions in the present are changing the future then Skynet should be able to monitor those changes much better than any human could in which case the logical conclusion from Skynet's perspective is that something is going wrong and the likely source is the Resistance / Connors.

If anything, Carter should act as a perfect benchmark since any future Skynet can download Carter's memory of it's timeline and be able to cross reference with it's own timeline to discover changes. Same goes for any potential storage device from a future timeline that is left to be discovered.

The main thing that is making Skynet fail so often is the lack of information. All it needs to do is get clear visual ID's of Connor, Derek, Bidell etc. and then when they are captured in the future, Skynet can simply put a bullet in them.
Realistically, Skynet could win instantly by sending T's back to another country. So far all the time travel tech appears to be limited to a specific area so sending a T back and setting up Coltan drops in other countries would make it much harder for any Resistance interference.

[Rogue 11]

Just because the guy might not be a grey does not preclude the possibility of Skynet employing a less direct strategy. If actions in the present are changing the future then Skynet should be able to monitor those changes much better than any human could in which case the logical conclusion from Skynet's perspective is that something is going wrong and the likely source is the Resistance / Connors.

Assuming it's the same Skynet and some travel back does not lead to an all new Skynet which didn't figure it out for some time. As far as I understand it each time a time mission is launched the timeline is rewritten anew, though mostly highly similar. However the nuclear plant takeover Weaver did could be said to support your position. That was however a nuclear plant of which location may not be easily changed. It's not necessarily as easy to capitalize on other events like the failure to kill the unborn girl in Alpine fields.

If anything, Carter should act as a perfect benchmark since any future Skynet can download Carter's memory of it's timeline and be able to cross reference with it's own timeline to discover changes. Same goes for any potential storage device from a future timeline that is left to be discovered.

Assuming it's the same skynet so it knows where to look after that. So it has to place it somewhere it knows it'll look no matter what and that nobody else will think on looking too closely at. After all the newest incarnation after time travel affects things won't necessarily consider that time mission a good idea. And if the phone/power in Carter's bunker were cut as some suspect it may be unable to find him if Carter can't go out and say "Hey guys! Here I am" just because a Factory was there when Cameron was built that's not to say it'll happen now. That factory may have been built due to the mission succeeding the first time around. But then Cameron went back and now that factory could have never been built due to the changes she wrought with the Connors.

That's pure speculation though. Time warfare makes my head hurt.

The main thing that is making Skynet fail so often is the lack of information. All it needs to do is get clear visual ID's of Connor, Derek, Bidell etc. and then when they are captured in the future, Skynet can simply put a bullet in them.
Realistically, Skynet could win instantly by sending T's back to another country. So far all the time travel tech appears to be limited to a specific area so sending a T back and setting up Coltan drops in other countries would make it much harder for any Resistance interference.

They already know how John Connor looks in the past. At least that's the impression the Terminators sent back give me. Why it doesn't off them in the camps I don't know. Maybe the machines used to guard those early camps were subpar and unable to make positive ID of them? Depending on how long it took to set up industries for better stuff it could have been labouring under significant handicaps at the time.

For other countries it may not be able to access, build up those resources and defend those resources in the future when it tries to use them. We don't know how many assets it has left but as far as I can tell it took several years before all survivors in the nearby area to where Skynet was based were put in work camps. I kinda doubt it could launch far reaching expeditions with any ease then.

We really need more information to say anything besides wild guesses.

[Rogue 11]

Ghetto edit: Or John could have some time between now and Judgment day simply undergone plastic surgery. That would have made the old visual IDs worthless. We've never seen him in the future after all.

[Shroom Man 777]

I'm still wondering what those Mexican lyrics in Mr. Fergusson are.

[Thanas]

Wow, so many things to respond to.

Inside the chronosphere? I find that doubtful, considering the only Terminator ever shown near it was Cameron.

I'm not trying to say that Future John gave another Termie access to the device, just that one happened to "flip a switch" and go on a killing spree. We observed it in Dungeons and Dragons, and Jesse's account of it.

Yeah, but I doubt he would be able to come near the chronosphere. The resistance would be terminally stupid to not have a precaution (like people aimed with grenade launchers) against a malfunctioning termie around it.

The simpler solution might be a Skynet attack on the time machine location as an attempt to stop them interdicting it's own operations.

If events in the present directly effect the future then wont that mean Carter will be found by Skynet in the future ?

Skynet clearly wanted Coltan inside that bunker so that it could be used to build more Ts and Cameron tells us Skynet has a terminator factory where she was built located at that bunker. Hence, Skynet should be able to open the doors and find Carter in any future as long as the present condition remains unchanged. Accessing his chip or just having him tell Skynet what happened should alert Skynet to the presence of the Connors and gives it visual IDs of Cameron and Sarah.

Well, theoretically Skynet should discover Carter when it builds its factory there...unless future John blows Carter up as first action of the resistance. Or Carter malfunctioned...or the US took him out.

To be honest, Skynet would be smarter if it created drops for information like Terminator schematics and historical information so that when Judgement Day comes it can leap ahead to laser guns and T-888s while taking advantage of it's records to nail key targets quickly and efficiently. Although, I would personnally like to see what would happen if Skynet altered strategy and started sending T's back to do benevolent looking things like running companys like Stark or Weaver then paint the Connors as the bad guys so the unknowing humans do Skynet's work for it.

Well, it might be possible for Skynet to do that, however if Skynet is really an insane narcisstic AI, it might be possible that it wants to win NOW. Besides, there is nothing that does indicate Skynet has the resources to manufacture T-888s immediately. Remember, the manufacturing base of the USA has been nuked.

Civil war...unlikely. Because after all, the different factions of the resistance all hate Skynet. It is also not shown that the Jesse faction (and that is a lot of speculation here) has the numbers to even pull of a civil war.

EDIT: As for the guy being a grey, I doubt it, considering that saving families and key personnel etc. does not help Skynet in any way.

On the Jesse faction: You forget that this is before she jumped back with Riley. The way I see it the moment somebody launches a time mission the future it was from is invalidated. It'll still end up similar since apparently the butterfly effect isn't that severe in terminator-verse, but it will still be similar.

That is not how time travel works in T:SCC. Besides, nothing prevents Jesse or her string pullers to go against Connnor before she jumps back.

Before she jumped back her faction was pathetically small, it could be that she is pretty much it. After she jumped back that could have changed. What if her plan to alter John's behavior backfired and now John is a less competent leader thus making a far greater dissatisfied faction? We don't know.

Her faction is numerous enough to either include chronotechs or people who can storm the chronosphere.

Of course if Skynet was suffering from limited resources it could have very well been forced to scrounge resistance weapons a lot of which fire bullets. If that was the case it'd explain why it keeps sending Termies back after he won (And why many of those seem somewhat lower quality than before) as he wants to win without losing so many resources.

Lower quality? Eh? It might very well be that Skynet has little resources due to the chronosphere being a last ditch effort.

Just because the guy might not be a grey does not preclude the possibility of Skynet employing a less direct strategy. If actions in the present are changing the future then Skynet should be able to monitor those changes much better than any human could in which case the logical conclusion from Skynet's perspective is that something is going wrong and the likely source is the Resistance / Connors.

How should it be able to monitor the changes? Sorry, I seem to be a bit dense today.

If anything, Carter should act as a perfect benchmark since any future Skynet can download Carter's memory of it's timeline and be able to cross reference with it's own timeline to discover changes. Same goes for any potential storage device from a future timeline that is left to be discovered.

The main thing that is making Skynet fail so often is the lack of information. All it needs to do is get clear visual ID's of Connor, Derek, Bidell etc. and then when they are captured in the future, Skynet can simply put a bullet in them.

See above for Carter.

Realistically, Skynet could win instantly by sending T's back to another country. So far all the time travel tech appears to be limited to a specific area so sending a T back and setting up Coltan drops in other countries would make it much harder for any Resistance interference.

That would imply Skynet has a global reach in the future. Finally, the Chronosphere seems to be a bit limited when it comes to transporting people locally. All indications speak of a limited radius of the teleport.

[Rogue 11]

That is not how time travel works in T:SCC. Besides, nothing prevents Jesse or her string pullers to go against Connnor before she jumps back.

It's not? I will certainly admit I honestly don't know how time travel works there. We know (Well unless Derek has amnesia. Which I won't write off) that alterations have happened in the future and as far as the people in the future knows have always been like that.

Of course the fact that they can launch counters to specific actions that should supposedly lose/win the war near instantly would argue against that.

I hate time travel.

If anybody can give a detailed description exactly how time travel works in SCC I'd greatly appreciate it. Would make figuring this shit out a lot easier.

Her faction is numerous enough to either include chronotechs or people who can storm the chronosphere.

Or she managed to bribe a tech or trick a cronotech into either thinking it's an approved mission or that they are trying something far different than what she's actually doing. I don't think she's going solo either, but I'm not willing to write off the possibility without more information. We don't even know what level of security a chronosphere has. It should be high but I don't know.

Lower quality? Eh? It might very well be that Skynet has little resources due to the chronosphere being a last ditch effort.

Terminator combat is very hard to judge due to all the variables involved. But a couple of more recent termies have been terminated with surprising ease.

Could be circumstances, could be lower quality. Again I don't know (Practically my catchphrase in this thread by now: )

But I do consider it a distinct possibility I'm not willing to write off out of hand.

[Peptuck]

Lower quality? Eh? It might very well be that Skynet has little resources due to the chronosphere being a last ditch effort.

Terminator combat is very hard to judge due to all the variables involved. But a couple of more recent termies have been terminated with surprising ease.

Terminators aren't that difficult to take out if you're properly prepared. The Connor clan, especially Derek and Cameron, have plenty of experience fighting Terminators, so it shouldn't be all that surprising that they can take one down with the right gear and prep time.

[Rogue 11]

Terminators aren't that difficult to take out if you're properly prepared. The Connor clan, especially Derek and Cameron, have plenty of experience fighting Terminators, so it shouldn't be all that surprising that they can take one down with the right gear and prep time.

The ones I'm thinking primarily of is the Ellison replacer and Pretzel-bot. The stab through the chest I can buy but it still feels a bit weak and honestly without knowing a lot more numbers than we do I can't say one way or the other whether this is the correct impression.

The pretzel-bot seemed to bend kinda easily as I can't remember any other terminator being bent out of shape like that. But that may simply have been lack of opportunity to try as Cameron dominated that fight from the start.

[PREDATOR490]

I know the Chrono has a limited range but sending a T back then having it leave the country to make Coltan drops etc. would be more sensible and makes it that much harder for the resistance to send a counter play.

As a machine I would expect Skynet to have a fairly accurate memory of events and thus it will have a full account of it's own history. If changes are revealed to Skynet then it should be able to cross reference with it's own memories to figure what is, should and should not be. Additionally, Skynet would logically have a greater understanding of Time travel dynamics since it apparantly built the damn thing and it must have SOME ability to register wether it's missions are being successful or not.
Not be like the Connors or Derek who are seemingly rather inept at trying to figure out the time travel mess.

Incidentally, wouldnt it be pointless for Vick to have been pressuring that woman to finish the infrastructure if it would only end up getting wasted by Judgement Day nukes ?
Ideally, Skynet should be aiming to AVOID Judgement Day just as much as the Connors because it will be destroying vital infrastructure which it can use. Instead having someone like Weaver who can apparantly rebuild John Henry's face in the modern world is much more convienient. We also have this new HK drone apparantly with access to metals supposedly of Terminator origin.

[Thanas]

If anybody can give a detailed description exactly how time travel works in SCC I'd greatly appreciate it. Would make figuring this shit out a lot easier.

See my posts on the previous page. Thats as far as I am willing to go.

Or she managed to bribe a tech or trick a cronotech into either thinking it's an approved mission or that they are trying something far different than what she's actually doing. I don't think she's going solo either, but I'm not willing to write off the possibility without more information. We don't even know what level of security a chronosphere has. It should be high but I don't know.

We see at least part of it in Dungeons and Dragons. Jesse claims that she tricked a chronotech, but I doubt she is going solo. Who fed her information about John and Cameron? She was not attached to the command post, nor is there any indication that she was part of his inner circle.

The pretzel-bot seemed to bend kinda easily as I can't remember any other terminator being bent out of shape like that. But that may simply have been lack of opportunity to try as Cameron dominated that fight from the start.

Terminators have AFAIK never tried to bent each other like Cameron did. She is the first who I have ever seen using such maneuvers.

I know the Chrono has a limited range but sending a T back then having it leave the country to make Coltan drops etc. would be more sensible and makes it that much harder for the resistance to send a counter play.

But how would Skynet get to it? It does not control the world and it is not like we have seen it using a navy.

As a machine I would expect Skynet to have a fairly accurate memory of events and thus it will have a full account of it's own history. If changes are revealed to Skynet then it should be able to cross reference with it's own memories to figure what is, should and should not be. Additionally, Skynet would logically have a greater understanding of Time travel dynamics since it apparantly built the damn thing and it must have SOME ability to register wether it's missions are being successful or not.

Not if Skynet sending out Termies are all last ditch attempts made in the few minutes before it gets destroyed by the resistance. For all we know and according to T1, it only gained chronotech in the last spell of the war. Heck, for all we know, Skynet is sending out Termies as far as it can in the vain hope that it will influence things (would also explain why only one termie is assigned to one objective and there is no backup termie).

Incidentally, wouldnt it be pointless for Vick to have been pressuring that woman to finish the infrastructure if it would only end up getting wasted by Judgement Day nukes ?

No, since it would still have been valuable software. It never was after the hardware, only the software. That is why Sarah tried to blow up the main server building and why Cameron simply erased it and did not destroy every light.

[quot€]Ideally, Skynet should be aiming to AVOID Judgement Day just as much as the Connors because it will be destroying vital infrastructure which it can use. Instead having someone like Weaver who can apparantly rebuild John Henry's face in the modern world is much more convienient. We also have this new HK drone apparantly with access to metals supposedly of Terminator origin.[/quote]

But without Judgement Day, Skynet would get utterly shafted by the US military. If a resistance cell managed that, the US military would simply smash Skynet.

[Shroom Man 777]

As for Skynet helping itself advance faster, remember how in the original T2 timeline Judgment Day started in the nineties and by the 2020s, Skynet ended up fielding Terminator endoskeletons and other techno-obsceneties?

In T:SCC, the war started in the 2000s and Skynet still ends up fielding Terminator endoskeletons and other techno-obsceneties in the 2020s. Despite Judgment Day and Skynet coming into existence a decade later, Skynet has still made the same technological leaps and advances it made in the original timeline where it had more time to develop.

So, yes, Skynet may very well have given itself information from the future.

[Rogue 11]

Okay. Read up what has been stated on time travel and what we've seen. I can't say it seems very clear. So... I'll be trying to figure it out myself.

We know there has been some changes in the timeline so the future can be altered. And we know they can travel back in time. And we know Skynet is doing it a lot.

As far as I can tell that's all we know for sure. Everything else has some degree of doubt in it.

In the TV series it's implied that the timeline has changed slightly during Derek's stay in the past. What with him not knowing about a torture session and all.

Assuming this is true we can determine that the future in Terminator verse is highly deterministic. The changes had so little long term impact that the first meeting Derek had with Jesse word for word went the same. Or at least close enough that neither person noticed any discrepancy when reminiscing

While this makes it harder to change the future it also means less worry about the Butterfly effect and thus trying to change the future isn't that big a deal.

Time travel seems somewhat limited in where they can be dropped geographically, but there is some leeway. IIRC In the first episode they jumped from New Mexico to LA. We don't know the limits of that leeway.

Time travel has wide range. We know Stark got dumped about a century off target. We don't know if it can only reach that range by accident or if it can be aimed that far back. If it can Skynet likely isn't doing it because that would risk too much alteration.

It is interesting to note that the first deliberate time travel attempt was aimed at the 80s, basically around the time the military started showing interest in AI in Terminatorverse. It could be they got that interest because of the Cyberdyne's research into the wreck of the first terminator, or it could be that after that time the military will try to build skynet as soon as technology allows and he doesn't go back further as to not risk altering that attitude. Or indeed it may not be connected at all.

The only way we know right now of changes in the future is through information of people who go back.

We also know that time missions directly countering eachother are possible. That's a key point in all the movies and possibly with Cameron/Cromartie as well.

We also have time loop and predestination paradoxes. John Connor is one of these. My personal theory in those situations is that where it appears to be a time loop really isn't. It's just the second, third or later repetition. It can be broken. If I'd venture a guess I'd say the moment you enter a time line through time travel you become part of that timeline and can't just erase yourself.

Mostly because this way the headache for the "How the hell is that possible" isn't as major.

So even if in the new time-line Kyle slipped in a spot of grease and broke his neck the day before he's going back in time John would still exist because Kyle has already existed in the past and as far as the time line is concerned started existing at that point.

If that is a case it does add a new dimension to why Cameron wanted to send the gang to the future. By doing a time shift she ensures that John Connor exists for sure from that moment forward and can't be erased by Skynet sending machines further into the past and also seriously narrows the window Skynet has to strike against John by cutting eight years of the time it has.

But how exactly is the time line changed?

Are we looking at a "Meanwhile in the future" situation where the future isn't altered until a key moment the change is initiated in the present? The only possible indicator for that is the directly countered time missions of the movies and possibly Cameron/Cromartie. And there are other possibilities for that. It is however not disproven either so really hard to judge.

Alternate realities being caused by time travel? While not exactly impossible and it'd explain why they can send time travelers after another guy who went to the past. They are just sending it to a new dimension. While not directly disproven I hope to any sort of deity that may be that this is not the case. It'd be IMPOSSIBLE to keep track of the timeline then as each nearby timeline could potentially end up sending travellers to this. Chaos! Blood in the streets! Cats and dogs lying down together in harmony! Ahem sorry about that. I'm filing this one under "Not the preferred theory if there are any other options"

Timeline instantly being rewritten the moment a time traveller steps out of his timesphere? Could be, easiest explanation IMO, but the directly countered Connor missions imply otherwise. Well imply as it is possible that there is another mechanism involved we don't know about (Perhaps time travel takes time to complete, once initiated can't be stopped and if you initiate your own time travel before it's finished you get to go too for instance. Reaching I know). Or perhaps the resistance managed to somehow launch their mission first and the defender was on site in the timeline first and didn't do any significant changes? Either way when rationalizations are needed this theory while I like it personally can't be held as most likely without further evidence.

It could also be somewhat of a mix of more possibilities. Say there is a delay of sorts in change but it's not long

The bigger question is really: If I hate time travel so much why do I spend so much time thinking about it?

I'll try to continue this later once I got my head back in order after all this confusion (My poor abused sanity!). But I think I've covered the major points.

[Rogue 11]

Damn I have no idea how I forgot but we have seen a time shift from the starting end in the pilot. And it went rather quick by all appearances. Well erase one bit of unfounded speculation.

[Rogue 11]

Also re-watching Terminator. Reese went back second by his own statement.

Thus there has to be some form of delay or protection for the current timeline or the resistance would have lost Connor not knowing what was going on

[Thanas]

Alternate realities? No.

Are we looking at a "Meanwhile in the future" situation where the future isn't altered until a key moment the change is initiated in the present? The only possible indicator for that is the directly countered time missions of the movies and possibly Cameron/Cromartie. And there are other possibilities for that. It is however not disproven either so really hard to judge.

Without going too far into details - and please note that this is not official show policy, just me shooting off my own mouth, the future is IMO changed as soon as you stepped out in the year X. Of course, you have to influence the past in order to make a noticeable change (like Stark did).

It is simply not enough to just live in the past.