SD.Net World Redux Comment Thread V

[PeZook]

So far they have no real ship tradition beyond some fishing boats. We're giving them a handful of patrol ships for a navy, but they need a decent port for commerce. I think we cna work a deal.

Well, you need a port to build a maritime tradition, after all. And a trade school of some sort where a new generation of crews and captains can be trained.

You know, I think there's a shortage of talented Maritime Academy applicants. We could probably enter a deal where we'd train Katangwans in the academy, under the condition they sign a four-year contract on a PeZookian merchantman. After that, they can return home and provide the cadres for their navy or merchant marine.

[Coyote]

Make an offer in-game and I'll pick it up!

[Mr Bean]

Five more pages and the lock.

[Coyote]

"Don't clench... just let it happen"...

[Siege]

I don't really feel like making an endless series of posts detailing every orbital weapons test I'm carrying out, so I'm just posting these here for your convenience. Critique is welcome.

AIM-101 Chafer
The AIM-101 Chafer is a 1,200kg air-launched anti-satellite multi-stage missile deployed on the F-111 Aardvark and F-120 Rafale. Designed as a ‘quick and dirty’ way of taking out targets in low earth orbit, the Chafer is equipped with infrared or active radar-homing and has a flight ceiling of 580km. The missile can be fitted with either a kinetic kill or a high explosive warhead.
Status: In Service The AIM-101 has the distinction of being the first space weapon available to San Dorado, and has been sitting on arsenal shelves collecting dust for over a year now.

SIM-120 Weevil
At 160kg and with a length of 3.9 meters the Weevil is the lightest missile planned for deployment in space. It carries a 25kg high explosive blast fragmentation warhead and is guided toward its target by active radar. Its delta-V is limited by its relatively small supply of rocketfuel, and it is therefore considered a point-defence weapon for orbiting spacecraft. The SIM-120 can be used against both satellites, orbiters and incoming projectiles.
Status: Testing This weapon is considered very nearly ready for deployment.

SIM-147 Fiddler
Developed from the AIM-54 Phoenix missile carried by the F-111, the SIM-147 is a 480kg heavy space intercept missile. Launched by spacecraft in orbit, it is designed to swat enemy satellites or orbiters out of the skies. The Fiddler is armed with a 60kg high explosive blast fragmentation warhead and like its atmospheric counterpart has an extremely prodigious reach. It is equipped with active homing radar and a passive LWIR seeker for target acquisition.
Status: Testing Slightly farther away than the SIM-120, but not by much.

SGM-1 Ladybird
This deceptively innocent-sounding weapon is in fact a 1,800kg space-to-ground missile. Using a highly advanced inertial guidance system enhanced with LIDAR terrain contour matching and a digital scene-mapping area correlator system the missile will eventually have an accuracy of less than 10 meters circular area probable. It is designed to carry one FTO-standard Mk V nuclear warhead with a 475kt yield.
Status: In Development/Testing Development of the guidance system on the Ladybird is plagued by setbacks: Most importantly is it proving difficult for an orbiter to deliver the missile into the ‘weapon box’ where the terrain recognition system can take over. The missile will hopefully enter production in 2014.

[Ryan Thunder]

Do they have a modern port? We build nice ports. Ask the Miratians.

Uh, what?

I don't recall that. I'll run with it, though...

Also, does somebody mind giving me some help with my OOB? I'm realizing I should actually organize it beyond "lol 9000 troops and 4 frigates lol" but I'm not quite sure how it should be organized...

[Master_Baerne]

Feel free to copy other people's OOBs and input appropriate numbers. It's what I did...

[PeZook]

Uh, what?

I don't recall that. I'll run with it, though...

I've been upgrading your river port in exchange for stakes in the uranium mines.

[PeZook]

Make an offer in-game and I'll pick it up!

I did for the Migs, I'll post the rest tomorrow

[Steve]

I figured somebody needed to point out the legalities of Shroomania's... *snicker*.... castration of Coiler's sub.

[Ryan Thunder]

Uh, what?

I don't recall that. I'll run with it, though...

I've been upgrading your river port in exchange for stakes in the uranium mines.

Oh shit, how could I forget? Sorry.

Yes. It's a very nice port!

PeZookia interested in tank upgrades
Sources inside several military planning comittees confirm recent rumors that PeZookia is interested in purchasing upgrades for its Leopard 2A6 tanks. The upgrade package would include a terrain observation radar, ERA reactive armor, anti-RPG systems such as grill plating for the engines and active defence systems, additional thermal imagers, a remote-controlled machine gun cupola, a new communications and data transfer suite and most importantly, an all-new 120mm electrothermal gun capable of firing both standard projectiles and guided missiles.

Most of those are already incorporated into my own battle tanks, so I might be able to help you with that. Dunno about the main gun or active armour, but I can sell you bolt-on missile pods that could get you similar results, I think.

[phongn]

I don't really feel like making an endless series of posts detailing every orbital weapons test I'm carrying out, so I'm just posting these here for your convenience. Critique is welcome.

Range isn't the main issue for space-to-space combat, delta-V is. You need enough fuel for the kill vehicle to maneuver and engage the target. That might be a little or a lot, depending on the target.

As for the Ladybird, you probably will be limited to radar mapping and the 10m CEP seems extremely ambitious. Pershing II's MARV had a 50m CEP (according to unreliable web sites) and the technical challenges there were a lot less (IRBM rather than deorbiting).

[Zor]

Fingolfin, i am not actually mining in Malip or Egsa lands, the Ironridge mountains are further inland than both their ranges

Zor

[Zablorg]

Batman crosses over with PIRATES! This is going to be AWESOME!

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Erm, Steve, I actually offered an upgraded K-2 Black Panther and a K-3 Black Tiger a while back when you asked for information on new tanks.

Fingolfin, i am not actually mining in Malip or Egsa lands, the Ironridge mountains are further inland than both their ranges

Zor

Well, if it's outside their territory, fine.

Most of those are already incorporated into my own battle tanks, so I might be able to help you with that. Dunno about the main gun or active armour, but I can sell you bolt-on missile pods that could get you similar results, I think.

He likely can find it from his next door neighbours who invested heavily even in point defence systems light enough to be placed on tanks.

[PeZook]

He likely can find it from his next door neighbours who invested heavily even in point defence systems light enough to be placed on tanks.

Yeah, I was really thinking Byzantium and the CSR mostly, to ensure commonality in logistics.

And bolt-on missile pods? What?

[Siege]

Range isn't the main issue for space-to-space combat, delta-V is. You need enough fuel for the kill vehicle to maneuver and engage the target. That might be a little or a lot, depending on the target.

Yeah, that's what I meant. Substitute 'range' for 'delta-V'.

As for the Ladybird, you probably will be limited to radar mapping and the 10m CEP seems extremely ambitious. Pershing II's MARV had a 50m CEP (according to unreliable web sites) and the technical challenges there were a lot less (IRBM rather than deorbiting).

Pershing II was also a weapon designed in the 1970's. This is a weapon designed in the 2010's. There's vastly better radars and onboard computers available to us, and they didn't have DSMAC systems in the 70's either. Still, it might be ambitious, but then with a 475kt warhead we afford a slightly greater CEP.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Pershing II was also a weapon designed in the 1970's. This is a weapon designed in the 2010's. There's vastly better radars and onboard computers available to us, and they didn't have DSMAC systems in the 70's either. Still, it might be ambitious, but then with a 475kt warhead we afford a slightly greater CEP.

A couple of things Siege, you will be looking at a very expensive weapon system if you push that far, and second, to achieve that sort of CEP, you will need a GPS system, which I don't recall you having. Never mind that you will also need to spend several billions to miniaturise nukes which... I am not sure if you have spent the tens of billions required.

You are going to have to either hope to survive with 10-20 such weapons, or a larger CEP. Take your pick. The FTO as a whole doesn't have that much of an economy to support buying too many of these things.

[Siege]

A couple of things Siege, you will be looking at a very expensive weapon system if you push that far, and second, to achieve that sort of CEP, you will need a GPS system, which I don't recall you having.

No shit it's expensive. It's a space-to-ground missile mounted on a spaceplane. As for CEP, why are we still talking about this? It's irrelevant. There's a 500kt nuke mounted on the tip of that thing. When it goes off, it doesn't matter if you're 9, 30 or 50 meters away, because you're still toast.

Never mind that you will also need to spend several billions to miniaturise nukes which... I am not sure if you have spent the tens of billions required.

I haven't. We have been running a collective nuclear weapons program for years, including miniaturization to mount the damn things in a whole host of weapons: gravity bombs, cruise missiles, SLBMs, you name it.

You are going to have to either hope to survive with 10-20 such weapons, or a larger CEP. Take your pick. The FTO as a whole doesn't have that much of an economy to support buying too many of these things.

The FTO has a combined GDP of just over 4 trillion dollars. I think we can afford a nuclear program, thank you very much.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Gun? What are you talking about? What would a gun be doing on these orbiters? We certainly don't sell them with guns installed... The military version can carry 3,600kg excluding rotary launcher (or whatever equipment Shroom is using to launch his KKVs) etc. 3,000+kg of tungsten slamming into the ground at hypersonic speed is more than enough to make a pretty big hole in the planet. And this isn't debris entering at a shallow angle, nor is it a relatively fragile spaceship: it's a solid tungsten rod aimed straight down. So what Columbia has to do with this I can't even fathom.

Siege, please think. For this to work, you need to impart significant velocity on the round so that it can and will achieve any reasonable CEP. Dropping off the damn round with a bloody low speed is going to lead the round to deviate from the path so significantly you are wasting money even sending the spacecraft into orbit. Think in terms of IMPULSE, which refers to Force X Time. The slower your initial speed, the longer the effect of the atmosphere on your rod. Otherwise, you are going to have to wait for the said device to achieve the hypersonic speed you so desire and in that time, it can drift just about any damn direction depending on the high altitude wind. You want the thing to hit terminal velocity ASAP.

No shit it's expensive. It's a space-to-ground missile mounted on a spaceplane. As for CEP, why are we still talking about this? It's irrelevant. There's a 500kt nuke mounted on the tip of that thing. When it goes off, it doesn't matter if you're 9, 30 or 50 meters away, because you're still toast.

It will matter if you are talking about dealing with hardened bunkers.

The FTO has a combined GDP approaching 4 trillion dollars. I think we can afford a nuclear program, thank you very much.

And you have been spending more than the rest of us on warfare thanks to a mini-skirmish once a year? And then that little zombie infestation? Sure you have more than enough money to have a nuclear program but delivery programs this expensive? The USSR spent a hefty what.. 20%-40% or more of the economy to maintain that sort of technological edge?

[Shroom Man 777]

Cascadia can't know that we're dismantling the Warden.

Fingolfin, will the Caliphate of Velaria or whatever it is be needing Stratellites and stuff to beam anti-Zorian propaganda to the Muslim world? We can oblige.

[Siege]

*Snip stuff about KKVs*

Whatever; the KKVs aren't a weapon I designed anyway, they're Shroom's. Ask him how they work. I'm using missiles, rockets being my forte.

It will matter if you are talking about dealing with hardened bunkers.

But I'm not. I stated as much in the 'Space' briefing I posted two weeks ago; I don't intend to ever use these missiles against hard targets. They're doomsday weapons. You know what San Dorado is, if we get into an atomic shooting match we're stone dead. There's no plausible way for us to survive that as a society. These nukes are intended solely as a strike from beyond the grave, a way to get back at whoever killed us and fucking hurt them. If it comes to global thermonuclear war I'm taking a page from ye olde Red Technocracy's playbook: I'll nuke cities, watershed areas, large rivers, agricultural areas. Screw military targets, if I'm going down I'm taking whoever does the deed with me. Hopefully that possibility will be sufficient deterrence to get people to back off.

And you have been spending more than the rest of us on warfare thanks to a mini-skirmish once a year? And then that little zombie infestation? Sure you have more than enough money to have a nuclear program but delivery programs this expensive? The USSR spent a hefty what.. 20%-40% or more of the economy to maintain that sort of technological edge?

I'll repeat this for your convenience. Four trillion dollars. Russia's current GDP is $2.25 trillion and with that they manage to maintain a huge army, a fleet of supersonic bombers, a myriad different cruise missiles, a war with Georgia, an advanced boomer fleet, the horridly expensive C4I systems required to control god knows how many ICBMs and ~10,000 nuclear warheads.

Despite having 1.8 times more funds than Russia the FTO only runs a joint nuclear program, a rocketry program and a shipbuilding program. San Dorado meanwhile has been building orbiters for years, and is now focusing its strategic efforts pretty much entirely on the development this one missile. Silver Streak and a space-to-ground missile were my goals pretty much from the start.

Your incredulity is really misplaced considering I've focused damned near all my efforts on space technology since day one of the game. I got the FTO onboard with the Lucrelance project. I've been pouring billions a year into this field of research. Shroom and Karmic and I were the first with a satellite television network. I was the second one to launch an orbiter, Lonestar narrowly beating me to the punch. FASTA is using MY rocket design under license. None of this clued you in on what was going on here?

[Shroom Man 777]

*Snip stuff about KKVs*

Whatever; the KKVs aren't a weapon I designed anyway, they're Shroom's. Ask him how they work. I'm using missiles, rockets being my forte.

But Siege-kun, you tolds me to use KKVs.

Consider flattening Bleak Castle the first step of a long line of trials and testings. Maybe the test was "staged" or something, like a lot of preliminary weapons tests today, just to find out of a Dyna-Shroom CAN drop something out of its bomb bays or something.

If using accurate KKVs is unrealistic, then we can just retcon it to a fat warhead that's like a MOAB of a FOAB.

And Bleak Castle's a shitty building anyway (it's the seat of Astarian power, it could've even been hit by a Shepistani warhead in the past and thus get its structure weakened). I'm sure even a near-miss would've caused it to fall apart anyway.

The important thing is that Dyna-Shrooms can chuck objects out of its butt-bay. Maybe the Dyna-Shroom itself was moving really fast in orbit, so when it chucked the KKV, the KKV would already be also moving fast.

How did Bean explain-away his KKVs in Game 1?!

Aurgh, maybe I should just work together with the SNC to build space guns. Or something. I'm horrible with this space stuff.

All I'm good at is writing lulz. Just look at my latest post.


HEY SNC GUYS:

What're those super Mig-31s anyway?

[Steve]

Heh, whoops, I thought it had become publicly known that you're dismantling Warden.

Actually, I think it would be publicly known by now. You can only hold the sub for so long before people notice things, and any numbers of dock workers, lower ranked personnel, etc., could have leaked the news.

And now I'm getting a tremendous urge to bomb some people. Including your crazy-Batman..... are you sure you don't go by the nom de plume "Grant Morrison", Shroom?

[Beowulf]

How did Bean explain-away his KKVs in Game 1?!

By doing his math extremely badly.