Gundam 00 - Second Season.

[avatarxprime]

Well, it would appear that Setsuna is becoming an Innovator due to his exposure to the high volume of GN Particles from the 00. I imagine that it has something to do with the "Quantization" event and if so then Saji should be transforming as well. I'd guess that the exposure to the unfiltered GN Particles is what spurred his body to begin making the change. You know what this means of course, somebody has to shoot Saji so we can test this theory.

[VF5SS]

If GN particles make you an Innovator then this show has officially gone fuck all stupid. It's bad enough they're shoehorning Newtypes into a story that didn't need them at all during the first season.

[Commander 598]

If GN particles make you an Innovator then this show has officially gone fuck all stupid.

It wasn't there already? Transam alone was a horrible gimmick. Transam + teleporting + Raiser is just .

At least they're finally cutting back on the number of irrelevant and useless characters. Better late than never I guess.

[VF5SS]

Trans-Am wasn't that bad. It never managed to save anyone or even fully win the day outside of its first appearance in season 1. If a show like Layzner can give the main robot V-Max (which is just blue Trans-Am) and make the lead pilot responsible in its use then I don't see why Gundam 00 couldn't have done the same. Honestly it's like all the shows current problems can be traced to that damn backpack plane. The 00 itself was actually interesting with its twin drive, but now it's gone fuck all Ideon on us and it gives and excuse for fucking Saji to be around. Although I don't understand why Red Haro can't just pilot the thing. Hell, the 00 Raiser even looks stupid. At least the Mk II and G-Defenser looked kinda cool together. This is just as bad as that damn G-Falcon.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

So, they had what sounded like a promising first season, only to end up turning this show into SEED?

[Manus Celer Dei]

The 00 itself was actually interesting with its twin drive, but now it's gone fuck all Ideon on us and it gives and excuse for fucking Saji to be around. Although I don't understand why Red Haro can't just pilot the thing.

The original 00 was boring. It was just Exia with less sharp edges and another gun.

As for Saji, the 00 Raiser needs someone to be in the Raiser to properly calibrate it or something, this was pretty much explicitly shown in ep 18 when Setsuna had to wait for Saji bfore he could whip out the silly huge beam saber.

Both times the huge saber has been used and the GN-newtype stuff has occured Saji's been in the Raiser, and the teleportation only happened twice without him (which occured offscreen and could've easily just been Setsuna dodging at Trans-Am speed).

Hell, the 00 Raiser even looks stupid. At least the Mk II and G-Defenser looked kinda cool together. This is just as bad as that damn G-Falcon.

Wrong, wrong and wrong.

So, they had what sounded like a promising first season, only to end up turning this show into SEED?

Not really. I'm still enjoying the second season, it's just a lot different in tone from the first.

Plus SEED's problem was that it was a worthless rehash of 0079 with horrid characters, whereas most people's problem with 00 is that it's a bit schizophrenic and all over the place.

[Sharp-kun]

So, they had what sounded like a promising first season, only to end up turning this show into SEED?

Nowhere near as bad. I'm still enjoying the series quite a bit.

[Commander 598]

So, they had what sounded like a promising first season, only to end up turning this show into SEED?

Not really. I'm still enjoying the second season, it's just a lot different in tone from the first.

Plus SEED's problem was that it was a worthless rehash of 0079 with horrid characters, whereas most people's problem with 00 is that it's a bit schizophrenic and all over the place.

SEED was substantially less problematic than GSD, it at least had the fact that it was mostly OYW retelling with 94% less lol70s designs keeping it fairly steady and interesting, till about halfway through. Before that it's biggest problem was that it had a few too many characters involved meaning that supposedly awesome characters (specifically the Char clone(s)) never really got much of a chance to shine because the "FABULOUS squad" and the Newbie were hogging all the screentime. After the midway point, the biggest problems were it trying too hard to be different with a side dish of trying to hard for fanservice and a pacifist princess hamfistedly shoved in as a main character for no good reason (Also cuts back to trying to hard to be different) as dessert. The Freedom Gundam and everything after it plus just about anything transforming and/or combining is pretty much pure mecha fanservice. The Forbidden Gundam is pretty much the epitome of trying to hard to be different as it's clearly a Deathscythe (from Gundam Wing, it and it's pilot were pretty popular) ripoff while trying so hard to not be a Deathscythe copycat that it basically became really unnoteworthy (aside from it's BACKPACKS design philosphy and the fact that it carried a scythe) and downright retarded (HOMING BEAM SPAM) at times.

Also another problem with SEED: Everyone that wasn't Orb or a 16 year old idol's rebel faction wasn't enough of a villain so we had to endure drugged up penal lab rat pilots, a suicide superweapon termed CYCLOPS, Blue Cosmos, and an outright attempt to destroy the Earth with a superweapon I can't recall the name of.

Gundam SEED Destiny is just everything bad about Gundam SEED cranked up to 11 and then some.

As far as 00S2 is concerned, much like nBSG, it is gifted with a passably decent staff so while still suffering from some of the same things that I straight out torch other series for, it is still enjoyable even if it could be way better for very obvious reasons. Also because it was already well established in the first season that even the S2 Gundams were capable of some WTF displays such as STO sniping and making a multi-kilometer trench for cover.

Trans-Am wasn't that bad. It never managed to save anyone or even fully win the day outside of its first appearance in season 1.

It still feels pretty silly though.

Honestly it's like all the shows current problems can be traced to that damn backpack plane.

It's really only one of many problems. Even if you ripped all the antigrav systems and beam cannons out of Geass R2 mecha, though it would probably make it better, perhaps even way better, it would still be suffering from some clear deficiencies in other areas.

They really need to do something about Marina (00's resident pacifist princess trope, including singing) and Ali's lack of being Ali though. I hope everyone else is thinking of what I'm thinking... Two birds with one stone...

[VF5SS]

The original 00 was boring. It was just Exia with less sharp edges and another gun.

But the twin drives meant THRUST-VECTORING (rule the skies, turn on a dime Macross Zero style) and the new sword-guns were pretty cool in their very Temjin-esque characteristics. It was a simple, clean cut design that fit Setsuna's fighting style. Now it's all about teleporting and giant beam sabering. Now the thrust-vectoring is gone thanks to those damn 0-Raiser wings.

As for Saji, the 00 Raiser needs someone to be in the Raiser to properly calibrate it or something, this was pretty much explicitly shown in ep 18 when Setsuna had to wait for Saji bfore he could whip out the silly huge beam saber.

Why can't the robot push the buttons? Or Lasse? Why does it have to be the guy least qualified (and the one I hate the most)?

Wrong, wrong and wrong.

Hey, at least the G-Defenser doesn't make the robot longer than it is tall.

[pj1351]

But the twin drives meant THRUST-VECTORING (rule the skies, turn on a dime Macross Zero style) and the new sword-guns were pretty cool in their very Temjin-esque characteristics. It was a simple, clean cut design that fit Setsuna's fighting style. Now it's all about teleporting and giant beam sabering. Now the thrust-vectoring is gone thanks to those damn 0-Raiser wings.

Thrust vectoring, plus the idea of having the 00 take advantage of those twin drives like it did in its intro episode (aka. blasts of pure GN particles as a directional anti-projectile shield), only to a much greater extent, had massive potential for some incredible fight scenes. But yeah, now the twin drives are reduced to mere power plants for the 00-Riser and its inane gimmicks.

As for Saji, the 00 Raiser needs someone to be in the Raiser to properly calibrate it or something, this was pretty much explicitly shown in ep 18 when Setsuna had to wait for Saji bfore he could whip out the silly huge beam saber.

Why can't the robot push the buttons? Or Lasse? Why does it have to be the guy least qualified (and the one I hate the most)?

But... But Saji was working as some sort of tech on a space station! Obviously working on a space station must qualify you to fly and monitor and calibrate the systems of a space fighter/Gundam support unit!!!

I hate the people writing for Saji more than I hate Saji, if only because none of them went "Hey, why doesn't Saji just tell Louise that CB had nothing to do with killing her family, that was done by that Trinity bunch, who had been involved with the people she's working for now!?"... Having a contrived reason for Saji to be on board the 0-Riser simply doesn't make the situation any less contrived. If they just said straight out that Saji was only to be a passenger (doubling as a last resort backup only in the event that Haro got damaged), for the reasoning of helping him talk with Louise, that I could have swallowed. As it is...

Hey, at least the G-Defenser doesn't make the robot longer than it is tall.

BTW, does anyone know if the 0-Riser, in 00-Riser configuration, turns the cockpit around 180 degrees? What I found to be really glaring was that, from what episode 11 shows, it looks like it doesn't (based on the movement direction of the GN particles, and the fact that we don't see the back of the 00's head, the cockpit is still facing the rear), yet moments later when Setsuna put on the burners, Saji is slammed back into his seat in the same direction that 00 was accelerating!

Such a glaring mistake leads me to believe that the existence of the 00-Riser in its present form was simply shoehorned in so they can make Saji a major character when he would otherwise have no major relevance.

[VF5SS]

Thrust vectoring, plus the idea of having the 00 take advantage of those twin drives like it did in its intro episode (aka. blasts of pure GN particles as a directional anti-projectile shield), only to a much greater extent, had massive potential for some incredible fight scenes. But yeah, now the twin drives are reduced to mere power plants for the 00-Riser and its inane gimmicks.

I think that's the major problem with the 00-Riser is that it takes away the only unique thing about the 00 Gundam. All of the S1 Gundams were interesting because they did things we'd never seen before. Exia had a giant sword that wasn't some awkward beam butterknife, Dynames was an actual sniper, Kyrios was kinda same-y except for that evil shield, and Virtue was totally bizarre with its Gundam in a Gundam. The enemies were not just direct ripoffs of Zeon equipment and each nation had its own feel. Everything just felt fresh and unique which is weird for Gundam.

But... But Saji was working as some sort of tech on a space station! Obviously working on a space station must qualify you to fly and monitor and calibrate the systems of a space fighter/Gundam support unit!!!

Yeah really. It actually feels more forced and artificial than even Amuro and Camille combined.

Such a glaring mistake leads me to believe that the existence of the 00-Riser in its present form was simply shoehorned in so they can make Saji a major character when he would otherwise have no major relevance.

That's kind of hard to decipher. On the one hand, it takes time to create the designs for the show that will eventually be transformed into no less than ten different types of toys and models, however the first one off the block was the HCMP toy and that one wasn't even compatible with the 0-Riser so they had to release the set that included extra parts to make it fit. Other than that, I think Saji being thrown backwards is just an animation error. It's more natural to a director to show someone getting shoved back into their seat rather than being slammed forward.

[VF5SS]

Now here's some statistics you can take to the bank.

Code: Select all

Allelujah Haptism does not have control over his lines.

Ep　 Lines “Marie”　
０１　　　０　　　０　　
０２　　　１　　　１　　First line of the season: “Marie…”
０３　　２７　　１０　　Rescue operation. First attack of the Marie disease.
０４　　２４　　　４　　
０５　　　９　　　０　　
０６　　　８　　　３　　
０７　　５６　　２７　　Severe Marie disease.
０８　　１０　　　２　　From here on, he is silent.
０９　　　５　　　０　　Trans-Am battery.
１０　　　６　　　２　　
１１　　　７　　　０　　
１２　　　４　　　０　　Trans-Am battery.
１３　　　３　　　０　　Still Trans-Am battery.
１４　　　６　　　１　　
１５　　　５　　　０　　
１６　　　３　　　０　　
１７　　　９　　　１　　
１８　　１５　　　６　　Attack of Marie disease the moment he cannot control his waifu.
１９　　　７　　　６　　Come back Hal, he is hopeless…

Total
２０５ ６３　By now, 30% of his lines are “Marie”.

Do you think this is a wrong turn for the character?

[Manus Celer Dei]

It seems they sort of blew their load early with Al; most of his character develoment and subplot was already done in S1 and the early bit of S2 and there's not much left for him to do beyond be an accessory for Somarie or wait for Hal to come back properly.

Why can't the robot push the buttons? Or Lasse? Why does it have to be the guy least qualified (and the one I hate the most)?

Saji was already an engineer and had worked with Ian on repairing the Gundams and the Ptolemy, presumably he gained some experience at working with GN drives from that. Lasse meanwhile hasn't really shown much ability beyond flying CBs bigger stuff. He could pilot the Raiser well enough, I guess, but wouldn't be able to calibrate-handwave it as well as Saji.

I mean, the real reason is because it'd be harder to write a conflict between Saji and Louise while he's stuck on the Ptolemy during fights, but even outside of plot reasons it's not a ridiculous choice.

Hey, at least the G-Defenser doesn't make the robot longer than it is tall.

I admit that most of my love for the G-Falcon comes from SRW @G, where it was awesome and didn't look so silly.

Super Gundam was lame, however.

[Marikina]

Why can't the robot push the buttons? Or Lasse? Why does it have to be the guy least qualified (and the one I hate the most)?

What robot? As for Lasse, they would have him do it, if he wasn't suffering from the fake GN particle deterioration.

[VF5SS]

The Red Haro that attaches to the Haro socket in the 0-Riser. Hell, Saji couldn't have done that much to fix the Gundams and Ptolemy since the Haros do all the fixing in the show. Doesn't orange Haro also control the Cherudium's bits? Man, why aren't the Haros piloting the robots.

[Ford Prefect]

Amusingly, Haro does pilot the Dynames/Cherudium whenever Lockon is busy sniping the targets with his sniper pod, and does so quite well. It is time for HARO MEISTERS.

[pj1351]

Other than that, I think Saji being thrown backwards is just an animation error. It's more natural to a director to show someone getting shoved back into their seat rather than being slammed forward.

True, but then they could have just gave the 0-Riser a revolving cockpit... Then again, maybe they deliberately set it up so they wouldn't have a naked-Saji sitting facing the rear of naked-Setsuna.

Saji was already an engineer and had worked with Ian on repairing the Gundams and the Ptolemy, presumably he gained some experience at working with GN drives from that. Lasse meanwhile hasn't really shown much ability beyond flying CBs bigger stuff. He could pilot the Raiser well enough, I guess, but wouldn't be able to calibrate-handwave it as well as Saji.

I mean, the real reason is because it'd be harder to write a conflict between Saji and Louise while he's stuck on the Ptolemy during fights, but even outside of plot reasons it's not a ridiculous choice.

For piloting, Lasse showed himself to be more than capable in the first season with the GN Arms, being able to hit the Alvatore while flying at an oblique angle and shooting sidewards.

For combat support, just take note of what happens before and after Exia & GN Arms join for GN Armor mode. Just before, Setsuna was entirely on the defensive, being forced to use the Exia's rapid-fire wrist guns as well as the sword/rifle just to keep the Fangs at bay, and even then only managing to destroy a single Fang (after Lasse disrupted their attack, at that). However, right afterwards they somehow destroy the remaining five Fangs in seconds, the last shot using that pair of over the shoulder cannons also taking out the Alvatore's shield at the same time, and it is implied by Lasse's dialogue later that those cannons (and possibly also those foot claws, as well as boosting the unit around) are under his control.

[VF5SS]

Oh Anew, why did you have to use Mileina as a hostage? The cries of "desu" have rallied crew in ways unimaginable. And thank you Setsuna for doing to Lyle what we all wanted to see. Also Revive is completely undone by the power of RED HARO! And I have no sympathy for Lyle when he refuses to shoot the woman who betrayed everyone and shot one of his allies. Empress reveals its awesome Layer Section style homing beam attack. And man, does Anew have the coolest Innovator MS. It's got a GN Sword and FANGU! Check out Lyle's sweet Transam Gunkata. Surprisingly, the "MARIE" count in this episode is zero! Good job Allelujah!

[Ypoknons]

FANGS VS SHIELD BITS!

[Ford Prefect]

Fucking finally!

[Companion Cube]

Everyone did well this episode.

[avatarxprime]

It would seem that this episode just pushed more towards Setsuna becoming an Innovator too. I imagine this might be how they deal with Ribbon's "I CONTROL YOU!" mode.

Also this because Cherudim should get to use this in the anime:

[pj1351]

S2, ep 20: Personally, I'm pleasantly surprised that they didn't annoyingly drag thing out between Lyle & Anew. Can you just imagine: "MARIE!" (x infinity) + "ANEW!" (x infinity) =

Also, I was impressed that they kept Setsuna in character and didn't start going all Kira Yamato on us, as I feared. The fact that we, the audience, find out that there was another possible outcome only seconds later just gave it that much more impact. Now, if they can keep the bar at this level for the rest of the season...

[Commander 598]

This episode was a refreshing shot of quality entertainment.

Also, new [UC] Gundam incoming:

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b329/ ... 508973.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b329/ ... 695946.jpg

Title: Unknown

Mechanic Design: Katoki Hajime
Character Design: Suzuki Tatsuya

Mobile Suit: Phantom Gundam Unit No.7

EARTH FEDERATION PHANTOM SWEEP TEAM

Hughes Curro: Male. Age 32. A veteran officer who leads the Phantom Sweep special forces unit charged with hunting for Zeon remnants. He has a bitter experience in which his unit was annihilated in the past.

Sherry Allison: Female. Age 24. She was serving as a test pilot but was assigned to the special forces unit as a replacement.

ZEON FORCES INVINCIBLE KNIGHTS

Erik Blanque (Blank): Male. Age 20. A young officer whose family is a distinguished family in the Principality of Zeon. He takes command of the “Invincible Knights” in order to execute a counterattack operation against the Earth Federation Forces.

Story: The time is Universal Century 0081. One year has passed since the war. Although the world was regaining order, small-scale battles continued in various places by the Zeon remnants who still continued to resist. During the situation, a veteran soldier of the Earth Federation Forces is appointed to a cleanup operation of the Zeon remnant forces. Feelings mix on the battlefield as the young Zeon officers advance their secret strategy for the revival of Zeon…

[Darksider]

christ. is it just me or is the U.C. timeline getting a little crowded in certain places.

hmmm. I wonder if the zeon remnants plan for a resurgence will work?