Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

N&P: Discuss governments, nations, politics and recent related news here.

Moderators: Alyrium Denryle, Edi, K. A. Pital

Cecelia5578
Jedi Knight
Posts: 636
Joined: 2006-08-08 09:29pm
Location: Sunnyvale, CA

Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Cecelia5578 »

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/24/us/24 ... GgAQIO1RZQ
March 24, 2009
Strip-Search of Girl Tests Limit of School Policy
By ADAM LIPTAK

SAFFORD, Ariz. — Savana Redding still remembers the clothes she had on — black stretch pants with butterfly patches and a pink T-shirt — the day school officials here forced her to strip six years ago. She was 13 and in eighth grade.

An assistant principal, enforcing the school’s antidrug policies, suspected her of having brought prescription-strength ibuprofen pills to school. One of the pills is as strong as two Advils.

The search by two female school employees was methodical and humiliating, Ms. Redding said. After she had stripped to her underwear, “they asked me to pull out my bra and move it from side to side,” she said. “They made me open my legs and pull out my underwear.”

Ms. Redding, an honors student, had no pills. But she had a furious mother and a lawyer, and now her case has reached the Supreme Court, which will hear arguments on April 21.

The case will require the justices to consider the thorny question of just how much leeway school officials should have in policing zero-tolerance policies for drugs and violence, and the court is likely to provide important guidance to schools around the nation.

In Ms. Redding’s case, the United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit, in San Francisco, ruled that school officials had violated the Fourth Amendment’s ban on unreasonable searches. Writing for the majority, Judge Kim McLane Wardlaw said, “It does not require a constitutional scholar to conclude that a nude search of a 13-year-old child is an invasion of constitutional rights.”

“More than that,” Judge Wardlaw added, “it is a violation of any known principle of human dignity.”

Judge Michael Daly Hawkins, dissenting, said the case was in some ways “a close call,” given the “humiliation and degradation” involved. But, Judge Hawkins concluded, “I do not think it was unreasonable for school officials, acting in good faith, to conduct the search in an effort to obviate a potential threat to the health and safety of their students.”

Richard Arum, who teaches sociology and education at New York University, said he would have handled the incident differently. But Professor Arum said the Supreme Court should proceed cautiously.

“Do we really want to encourage cases,” Professor Arum asked, “where students and parents are seeking monetary damages against educators in such school-specific matters where reasonable people can disagree about what is appropriate under the circumstances?”

The Supreme Court’s last major decision on school searches based on individual suspicion — as opposed to systematic drug testing programs — was in 1985, when it allowed school officials to search a student’s purse without a warrant or probable cause as long their suspicions were reasonable. It did not address intimate searches.

In a friend-of-the-court brief in Ms. Redding’s case, the federal government said the search of her was unreasonable because officials had no reason to believe she was “carrying the pills inside her undergarments, attached to her nude body, or anywhere else that a strip search would reveal.”

The government added, though, that the scope of the 1985 case was not well established at the time of the 2003 search, so the assistant principal should not be subject to a lawsuit.

Sitting in her aunt’s house in this bedraggled mining town a two-hour drive northeast of Tucson, Ms. Redding, now 19, described the middle-school cliques and jealousies that she said had led to the search. “There are preppy kids, gothic kids, nerdy types,” she said. “I was in between nerdy and preppy.”

One of her friends since early childhood had moved in another direction. “She started acting weird and wearing black,” Ms. Redding said. “She started being embarrassed by me because I was nerdy.”

When the friend was found with ibuprofen pills, she blamed Ms. Redding, according to court papers.

Kerry Wilson, the assistant principal, ordered the two school employees to search both students. The searches turned up no more pills.

Mr. Wilson declined a request for an interview and referred a reporter to the superintendent of schools, Mark R. Tregaskes. Mr. Tregaskes did not respond to a message left with his assistant.

Lawyers for the school district said in a brief that it was “on the front lines of a decades-long struggle against drug abuse among students.” Abuse of prescription and over-the-counter medications is on the rise among 12- and 13-year-olds, the brief said, citing data from the Office of National Drug Control Policy.

Given that, the school district said, the search was “not excessively intrusive in light of Redding’s age and sex and the nature of her suspected infraction.”

Adam B. Wolf, a lawyer with the American Civil Liberties Union, which represents Ms. Redding, said her experience was “the worst nightmare for any parent.”

“When you send your child off to school every day, you expect them to be in math class or in the choir,” Mr. Wolf said. “You never imagine their being forced to strip naked and expose their genitalia and breasts to their school officials.”

In a sworn statement submitted in the case, Safford Unified School District v. Redding, No. 08-479, Mr. Wilson said he had good reason to suspect Ms. Redding. She and other students had been unusually rowdy at a school dance a couple of months before, and members of the school staff thought they had smelled alcohol. A student also accused Ms. Redding of having served alcohol at a party before the dance, Mr. Wilson said.

Ms. Redding said she had served only soda at the party, adding that her accuser was not there. At the dance, she said, school administrators had confused adolescent rambunctiousness with inebriation. “We’re kids,” she said. “We’re goofy.”

The search was conducted by Peggy Schwallier, the school nurse, and Helen Romero, a secretary. Ms. Redding “never appeared apprehensive or embarrassed,” Ms. Schwallier said in a sworn statement. Ms. Redding said she had kept her head down so the women could not see that she was about to cry.

Ms. Redding said she was never asked if she had pills with her before she was searched. Mr. Wolf, her lawyer, said that was unsurprising.

“They strip-search first and ask questions later,” Mr. Wolf said of school officials here.

Ms. Redding did not return to school for months after the search, studying at home. “I never wanted to see the secretary or the nurse ever again,” she said.

In the end, she transferred to another school. The experience left her wary, nervous and distrustful, she said, and she developed stomach ulcers. She is now studying psychology at Eastern Arizona College and hopes to become a counselor.

Ms. Redding said school officials should have taken her background into account before searching her.

“They didn’t even look at my records,” she said. “They didn’t even know I was a good kid.”

The school district does not contest that Ms. Redding had no disciplinary record, but says that is irrelevant.

“Her assertion should not be misread to infer that she never broke school rules,” the district said of Ms. Redding in a brief, “only that she was never caught.”

Ms. Redding grew emotional as she reflected on what she would have done if she had been told as an adult to strip-search a student. Dabbing her eyes with a tissue, she said she would have refused.

“Why would I want to do that to a little girl and ruin her life like that?” Ms. Redding asked.
Going to a small town Oregon high school in the mid 90s, while sucking at the time, now seems quaint compared to getting strip searched. I tend to be pessimistic about these things; American high school students tend to get the short end of the stick when it comes to any semblance of privacy or civil liberties.

<URL tags removed. If you use URL tags, the software will not automatically shorten long URLs for display, but if you do not use URL tags, the software will automatically identify web links by the HTTP prefix and turn them into links for you anyway - DW.>
Lurking everywhere since 1998
User avatar
Steve
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 9781
Joined: 2002-07-03 01:09pm
Location: Florida USA
Contact:

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Steve »

Mostly because children are not seen as having full legal rights, specifically, especially, in schools.

Some of it is understandable. If a principal is given information indicating a kid has smuggled a weapon, or hard drugs, on campus, they need to be able to act on it without having to call a judge and ask for a warrant. However, this bit of power can and often is abused, as those in charge can become used to exercising their power to the extent that they don't think of any consequences beyond using it to the fullest extent in such cases as this, no matter their cause.
”A Radical is a man with both feet planted firmly in the air.” – Franklin Delano Roosevelt

"No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism." - Sir Winston L. S. Churchill, Princips Britannia

American Conservatism is about the exercise of personal responsibility without state interference in the lives of the citizenry..... unless, of course, it involves using the bludgeon of state power to suppress things Conservatives do not like.

DONALD J. TRUMP IS A SEDITIOUS TRAITOR AND MUST BE IMPEACHED
User avatar
Knife
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 15769
Joined: 2002-08-30 02:40pm
Location: Behind the Zion Curtain

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Knife »

Oh for Christs sake. For a dime bag? I might see it. For some sort of prescription SIAD's? WTF? Is preventing the production of prostaglandulins the new rage? Wouldn't want those damn teens having inflammation without pain would we? Could lead to dancing.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong

But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
User avatar
Rogue 9
Scrapping TIEs since 1997
Posts: 18684
Joined: 2003-11-12 01:10pm
Location: Classified
Contact:

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Rogue 9 »

“Her assertion should not be misread to infer that she never broke school rules,” the district said of Ms. Redding in a brief, “only that she was never caught.”
:wtf: So the school defaults to presumption of guilt, and has the gall to expect the courts to do the same?
It's Rogue, not Rouge!

HAB | KotL | VRWC/ELC/CDA | TRotR | The Anti-Confederate | Sluggite | Gamer | Blogger | Staff Reporter | Student | Musician
User avatar
Darth Yoshi
Metroid
Posts: 7342
Joined: 2002-07-04 10:00pm
Location: Seattle
Contact:

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Darth Yoshi »

Well, was she in the suburbs, or the ghetto? It could be that that particular school has a rampant drug problem, which is why the administration cracked down on her like that. Although ordering a strip search because of ibuprofen is stupid. If she had a prescription for it, that should have been the end of that, unless they had reason to suspect she was dealing it out or something.
Image
Fragment of the Lord of Nightmares, release thy heavenly retribution. Blade of cold, black nothingness: become my power, become my body. Together, let us walk the path of destruction and smash even the souls of the Gods! RAGNA BLADE!
Lore Monkey | the Pichu-master™
Secularism—since AD 80
Av: Elika; Prince of Persia
User avatar
Phantasee
Was mich nicht umbringt, macht mich stärker.
Posts: 5777
Joined: 2004-02-26 09:44pm

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Phantasee »

Yoshi: She said she never had any. Her old friend was found with some, and this 'friend' lied and said it came from the Redding girl.

Zero-tolerance is proven to be ridiculous, yada yada. Zero consideration of previous record is a problem here. If you've got a kid like me who got into a lot of fights in grade 7 and 8, you'd expect to see me questioned if there was a fight in high school, even if I was just in the same hallway, with no other connection. If you've got a kid like my sister, who has no history of anything but good behaviour and good grades, you don't expect her to be one of the kids suspended just because some other kid decides to hit her, or someone next to her.

Fortunately my high school, which my sister now attends, is quite a bit more reasonable about that.
XXXI
User avatar
Mr Bean
Lord of Irony
Posts: 22466
Joined: 2002-07-04 08:36am

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Mr Bean »

Keep in mind this is ibuprofen. Can you even get high on ibuprofen? How? Crushing it to snort it? This is right up there with busting some kid for alcoholic based hand lotion. Because you can theoretically mix it with water and drink it except you know... it's a recipe for kidney damage.


Seriously ibuprofen? The stuff which you can buy in stores? Prescription strength ibuprofen is still available over the counter.

"A cult is a religion with no political power." -Tom Wolfe
Pardon me for sounding like a dick, but I'm playing the tiniest violin in the world right now-Dalton
User avatar
Darth Yoshi
Metroid
Posts: 7342
Joined: 2002-07-04 10:00pm
Location: Seattle
Contact:

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Darth Yoshi »

Point.

Maybe I just don't get drunk enough, but being drunk enough to act noticeably drunk usually means being more than drunk enough to screw with your balance. It should be fairly obvious at a glance if people are drunk, especially at a dance.
Image
Fragment of the Lord of Nightmares, release thy heavenly retribution. Blade of cold, black nothingness: become my power, become my body. Together, let us walk the path of destruction and smash even the souls of the Gods! RAGNA BLADE!
Lore Monkey | the Pichu-master™
Secularism—since AD 80
Av: Elika; Prince of Persia
User avatar
sketerpot
Jedi Council Member
Posts: 1723
Joined: 2004-03-06 12:40pm
Location: San Francisco

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by sketerpot »

You can't get high from ibuprofen. If you overdose on it, you can get a variety of unpleasant side effects like abdominal pain and vomiting, but that's about it. The school apparently decided that the way to deal with recreational drugs was to ban pills indiscriminately and avoid using any discretion. I guess if they had left any room in their policy for using their own judgment, they might have had to ask themselves if strip searching someone on suspicion of carrying harmless painkillers was actually moral.
User avatar
Terralthra
Requiescat in Pace
Posts: 4741
Joined: 2007-10-05 09:55pm
Location: San Francisco, California, United States

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Terralthra »

This is either a ridiculous abuse of "zero-tolerance" codes, or there is more to this story. Prescription strength ibuprofen is a joke, it's just 600 or 800 mg of the same drug you'd normally take 400 mg of. Its only potential off-label use would be as an anti-insomnia medication, because taking too much at once would put you directly to sleep. And give you an ulcer.
User avatar
RedImperator
Roosevelt Republican
Posts: 16465
Joined: 2002-07-11 07:59pm
Location: Delaware
Contact:

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by RedImperator »

School districts don't allow students to carry medicine on their person, even relatively harmless medicine like ibuprofen, because of the liability risk. This is understandable, if annoying. Obviously, certain prescription drugs, such as opiates, are even more tightly controlled because of the potential for abuse and the growing number of teenagers who are abusing them (why risk buying from a skeezy drug dealer when you can raid the medicine cabinet instead?).

Now what Safford Unified apparently did was craft an incompetent zero-tolerance policy which draws no distinction between a potentially abused drug like, say, Vicodin, and a drug which has no potential for abuse, like ibuprofen. Then it trained its administrative personnel incompetently, so that they would rigidly enforce the zero-tolerance policy even in absurd situations. Then, it hired administrators with so little regard for the dignity and privacy of the students under their care that they would force a 13 year old to strip in a search for contraband Advil. And finally, instead of firing assistant principal Wilson on the spot, the school--at great expense--has defended her actions all the way to the Supreme Court.

As for what SCOTUS will do, they've shown no inclination in the past to restrict school districts when it comes to enforcing drug policies. This is a really egregious case, but this is also a court graced by the likes of Samuel Alito, so I have no confidence in them making the right decision.
Image
Any city gets what it admires, will pay for, and, ultimately, deserves…We want and deserve tin-can architecture in a tinhorn culture. And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed.--Ada Louise Huxtable, "Farewell to Penn Station", New York Times editorial, 30 October 1963
X-Ray Blues
User avatar
CmdrWilkens
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 9093
Joined: 2002-07-06 01:24am
Location: Land of the Crabcake
Contact:

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by CmdrWilkens »

Right now my only hope for sanity rests, oddly enough, with the federal government:
In a friend-of-the-court brief in Ms. Redding’s case, the federal government said the search of her was unreasonable because officials had no reason to believe she was “carrying the pills inside her undergarments, attached to her nude body, or anywhere else that a strip search would reveal.”

The government added, though, that the scope of the 1985 case was not well established at the time of the 2003 search, so the assistant principal should not be subject to a lawsuit.
So that is the DOJ or some other agency coming out and saying: you better damn well have reason to suspect a strip search is neccessarry before ordering it. I get the counterpoint that the '85 rule allowing for searches without warrant of private belongings was poorly defined and in general if the administration had reason to suspect (and another student informing them that MS Redding has prescription strength drugs qualifies as reasonable) then a search is called for. That the search exceeded reasonable levels is certain but that a search was conducted is not. I don't know what the appropriate response is as this is more of an excessive force case than a completely unreasonable search case.
Image
SDNet World Nation: Wilkonia
Armourer of the WARWOLVES
ASVS Vet's Association (Class of 2000)
Former C.S. Strowbridge Gold Ego Award Winner
MEMBER of the Anti-PETA Anti-Facist LEAGUE

"I put no stock in religion. By the word religion I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called the will of god. I have seen too much religion in the eyes of too many murderers. Holiness is in right action, and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves, and goodness. "
-Kingdom of Heaven
User avatar
Knife
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 15769
Joined: 2002-08-30 02:40pm
Location: Behind the Zion Curtain

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Knife »

Mr Bean wrote:Keep in mind this is ibuprofen. Can you even get high on ibuprofen? How? Crushing it to snort it? This is right up there with busting some kid for alcoholic based hand lotion. Because you can theoretically mix it with water and drink it except you know... it's a recipe for kidney damage.


Seriously ibuprofen? The stuff which you can buy in stores? Prescription strength ibuprofen is still available over the counter.
No you can't. The only thing it does is stop the production of prostaglandin by your degranulated mast cells.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong

But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
User avatar
neoolong
Dead Sexy 'Shroom
Posts: 13180
Joined: 2002-08-29 10:01pm
Location: California

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by neoolong »

"“Her assertion should not be misread to infer that she never broke school rules,” the district said of Ms. Redding in a brief, “only that she was never caught.”"

Really? Jesus, that's harsh. I guess you're guilty unless proven innocent. After a strip-search of course.

What I wonder though is if a teacher was implicated, if they'd strip search the teacher at the word of a student? After all, students never lie.
Member of the BotM. @( !.! )@
User avatar
Furlong
Redshirt
Posts: 35
Joined: 2007-11-14 03:30pm
Location: Vermont / Mass

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Furlong »

If I understand this correctly, the school did act within the law, more or less. The case of New Jersey v. T. L. O. allows for schools to perform searches, but school officials need evidance.

According to the case, officials are required, when "carrying out searches and other functions pursuant to disciplinary policies mandated by state statutes, school officials act as representatives of the State..." Essentially meaning they are held to the same standard as a police officer, as far as searches are concerned.

However, the ruling also states that "school officials need not be held subject to the requirement that searches be based on probable cause to believe that the subject of the search has violated or is violating the law. Rather, the legality of a search of a student should depend simply on the reasonableness, under all the circumstances, of the search" This was because they needed to strike a "balance between schoolchildren's legitimate expectations of privacy and the school's equally legitimate need to maintain an environment in which learning can take place requires some easing of the restrictions to which searches by public authorities are ordinarily subject." (emphasis added)

I'm not saying that I agree with the school on this issue, because I don't, but it should at least be mentioned that there is precedent for warrentless searches at schools. However, there is also the fact that those searches should be "according to the dictates of reason and common sense."
It is said that when three Unitarian Universalists are together, among them on any subject there are at least four opinions!
User avatar
open_sketchbook
Jedi Master
Posts: 1145
Joined: 2008-11-03 05:43pm
Location: Ottawa

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by open_sketchbook »

Wait, even after the strip search, they are still basically saying that she's guilty, but that she wasn't caught? Do they want to do a cavity search or something? That's absolutely absurd.

The problem with zero tolerance policies is that they treat students as prisoners instead of students. There is this sort of twisted idea that all crimes are equal which runs under the whole thing, not to mention the paranoid innocent until proven guilty thing. Kids don't have to do anything wrong; the nature of the policies make them all seen like criminals before anything even happens. How convenient!
1980s Rock is to music what Giant Robot shows are to anime
Think about it.

Cruising low in my N-1 blasting phat beats,
showin' off my chrome on them Coruscant streets
Got my 'saber on my belt and my gat by side,
this here yellow plane makes for a sick ride
User avatar
ArmorPierce
Rabid Monkey
Posts: 5904
Joined: 2002-07-04 09:54pm
Location: Born and raised in Brooklyn, unfornately presently in Jersey

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by ArmorPierce »

Students are often not considered to be fully protected. Reasoning I recall at my school (which that case furlong quoted actually happened my high school) was that you're as a minor you're not fully protected and that the school takes on the role of guardians. I completely disagree with what happened to this girl and fully recognize that teachers act like nazi's sometimes. Even at college we have resident directors treating students like that. I was accused of forging a signature (we need signutures of all room mates and suite mates to sign a guess in) for a overnight pass. Even though my room mates said that it was their signature they wanted them to come in and prove it was their signature by signing their name.

If you ever took a contract law class you'd realize that first them just saying that they did sign it is good enough and there cannot be no case and even if I did sign it, if I had his permission it is still legit.
Brotherhood of the Monkey @( !.! )@
To give anything less than your best is to sacrifice the gift. ~Steve Prefontaine
Aoccdrnig to rscheearch at an Elingsh uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt tihng is taht frist and lsat ltteer are in the rghit pclae. The rset can be a toatl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit a porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae we do not raed ervey lteter by it slef but the wrod as a wlohe.
User avatar
Rogue 9
Scrapping TIEs since 1997
Posts: 18684
Joined: 2003-11-12 01:10pm
Location: Classified
Contact:

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Rogue 9 »

ArmorPierce wrote:Students are often not considered to be fully protected. Reasoning I recall at my school (which that case furlong quoted actually happened my high school) was that you're as a minor you're not fully protected and that the school takes on the role of guardians. I completely disagree with what happened to this girl and fully recognize that teachers act like nazi's sometimes. Even at college we have resident directors treating students like that. I was accused of forging a signature (we need signutures of all room mates and suite mates to sign a guess in) for a overnight pass. Even though my room mates said that it was their signature they wanted them to come in and prove it was their signature by signing their name.

If you ever took a contract law class you'd realize that first them just saying that they did sign it is good enough and there cannot be no case and even if I did sign it, if I had his permission it is still legit.
Public primary and secondary schools get to do this shit, despicable as it is. Public universities do not. If you'd cared to, you could land a resident director treating you like that in a world of legal hurt, though I doubt it'd be worth the trouble for the incident you describe. Strip searching on grounds similar to the ones in the OP, though? The university would have no case.
It's Rogue, not Rouge!

HAB | KotL | VRWC/ELC/CDA | TRotR | The Anti-Confederate | Sluggite | Gamer | Blogger | Staff Reporter | Student | Musician
User avatar
Covenant
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4451
Joined: 2006-04-11 07:43am

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Covenant »

Given that, the school district said, the search was “not excessively intrusive in light of Redding’s age and sex and the nature of her suspected infraction.”
How is this not excessively intrusive? The strip-search itself is pretty absurd, I don't think that schools have the authority to issue those. Even if they're acting with the full authority of the police, I don't think an individual officer can order you to strip. I'd like to hear from anyone who knows what it requires before you're forced to strip down.

Surrendering your bags, fine. If they want to search your clothes, they could ask her to change into her gym clothes. I don't understand why she needed to be strip-searched by school officals. Couldn't they have contacted the police?
User avatar
CmdrWilkens
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 9093
Joined: 2002-07-06 01:24am
Location: Land of the Crabcake
Contact:

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by CmdrWilkens »

Covenant wrote:
Given that, the school district said, the search was “not excessively intrusive in light of Redding’s age and sex and the nature of her suspected infraction.”
How is this not excessively intrusive? The strip-search itself is pretty absurd, I don't think that schools have the authority to issue those. Even if they're acting with the full authority of the police, I don't think an individual officer can order you to strip. I'd like to hear from anyone who knows what it requires before you're forced to strip down.

Surrendering your bags, fine. If they want to search your clothes, they could ask her to change into her gym clothes. I don't understand why she needed to be strip-searched by school officals. Couldn't they have contacted the police?
I believe Red already mentioned this but school admiinstrators are not just acting in lieu of the police they are ALSO acting "in loco parentis." That is a school principal has many of the same rights over students in their charge as a parent does. So they certainly have the authority to order the strip search. The part about whether or not it is excessively intrusive is where things get a bit prickly. On one side she is accussed of violating the perscription drug policy for which most US law backs as a serious offense whcih schools should be able to stamp out. The flip side, of course, being that there was never any indication given in any testimony that she was carrying the pills concealed on her body in such a manner as to be undetectable by a pat down or search of possessions.

Given all of that I stand by my earlier statment: The school had both the right and reasonable cause to search her BUT they exceeded reasonableness in the thouroughness of their search whether any punishment should be metted out on the basis of that I'm not sure.
Image
SDNet World Nation: Wilkonia
Armourer of the WARWOLVES
ASVS Vet's Association (Class of 2000)
Former C.S. Strowbridge Gold Ego Award Winner
MEMBER of the Anti-PETA Anti-Facist LEAGUE

"I put no stock in religion. By the word religion I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called the will of god. I have seen too much religion in the eyes of too many murderers. Holiness is in right action, and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves, and goodness. "
-Kingdom of Heaven
User avatar
Covenant
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4451
Joined: 2006-04-11 07:43am

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Covenant »

It's possible, but it still seems absurd to me, especially based on the word of one student to justify two searches. I would never think of my parents having the right to strip-search me, and I don't know anything ill you can do with ibuprofin except relieve a headache, and I used to hide it on my person when I came to school for just that reason. If they had busted out the strip search, I have no idea what kind of mental trauma that would have caused, but I certainly wouldn't have done it--I'd rather have just been sent home. It's like strip-searching someone to locate a candy-bar that a kid might have smuggled in, in defiance of the "no fatty snacks" ban.

Setting aside the fact I do not agree with the concept of "in loco parentis" or their policy of stopping me from curing my own headache with over-the-counter medication provided to me by my actual parents, they still went way out of line by ordering a strip search. Having people sift through your belongings is one things, but being forced to strip nude in front of school personnel on the evidenceless suspicion of something being hidden taped to your body under your underwear? What's next, a cavity search to look for cigarettes? It's just one step away.

At some point, the school simply does not have the right to do whatever they want to the kids who are mandated to go there, and they require a little sense. Ibuprofin doesn't get you high. Having one student point to another student to avoid blame does not give you a justification to give them both a strip search. Contact the parents, or the police, or use reprimands, or send the kid home, but the idea of going from accusation to being nuded seems to me that this school-district is taking their role in reducing drug use and giving up on it, replacing it with an ironclad attack-dog policy which doesn't reduce use outside of schools and doesn't work with parents to achieve actual change. Nothing seems reasonable about this policy or the way it was handled, or the kinds of results it could have achieved.
User avatar
Uraniun235
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 13772
Joined: 2002-09-12 12:47am
Location: OREGON
Contact:

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Uraniun235 »

open_sketchbook wrote:Wait, even after the strip search, they are still basically saying that she's guilty, but that she wasn't caught? Do they want to do a cavity search or something? That's absolutely absurd.
No, what they're saying is that her having a clean record beforehand is irrelevant because she may have been guilty of prior infractions without having been caught.
"There is no "taboo" on using nuclear weapons." -Julhelm
Image
What is Project Zohar?
"On a serious note (well not really) I did sometimes jump in and rate nBSG episodes a '5' before the episode even aired or I saw it." - RogueIce explaining that episode ratings on SDN tv show threads are bunk
User avatar
CaptainChewbacca
Browncoat Wookiee
Posts: 15746
Joined: 2003-05-06 02:36am
Location: Deep beneath Boatmurdered.

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by CaptainChewbacca »

'Just because we never caught you doing anything wrong doesn't mean you weren't doing something wrong.'

While technically true, its bullshit spin of the highest order.
Stuart: The only problem is, I'm losing track of which universe I'm in.
You kinda look like Jesus. With a lightsaber.- Peregrin Toker
ImageImage
Adrian Laguna
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4736
Joined: 2005-05-18 01:31am

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Adrian Laguna »

I find it somewhat ironic that such abuses of power often harm the good kids, because they are used to following rules and commands. Kids more used to being defiant and belligerent toward authority figures would have likely flatly refused, told the Assistant Principal to go fuck himself, or demand an explanation as to why a pat down would not be sufficient (likely what I'd have done). After that the Ass. Principal can let the matter drop, hand out punishment, or escalate by bumping it higher up the administrative ladder. At that point whether shit flies or not depends on the nature of the child's parents, whether the kid gives enough of a damn to tell them, and/or whether the school officials are sufficiently full of themselves to actually call a parent and tell them their child's in trouble for refusing to strip naked.
User avatar
Singular Intellect
Jedi Council Member
Posts: 2392
Joined: 2006-09-19 03:12pm
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada

Re: Bring ibuprofen to school, get strip searched

Post by Singular Intellect »

CaptainChewbacca wrote:'Just because we never caught you doing anything wrong doesn't mean you weren't doing something wrong.'

While technically true, its bullshit spin of the highest order.
"Guilty until proven innocent". Gotta love that mindset. :wtf:
"Now let us be clear, my friends. The fruits of our science that you receive and the many millions of benefits that justify them, are a gift. Be grateful. Or be silent." -Modified Quote
Post Reply