Texas: Age of the universe now susceptible to popular vote

[Darth Wong]

Catholics are (bye and large) much less devout and insane than Protestants, particularly Evangelical Protestants.

That perception might be due to the fact that moderate Protestants don't necessarily declare themselves unless you ask, so they become invisible in faith comparisons. Evangelicals are in-your-face while Catholics like to declare themselves as such even if they barely observe their religion.

[wautd]

It's just fucked up to see supposed science educators giving the finger to science.

Aye, scientists should decide what science is, not some laymen politicians. I also read that Texas provides the most textbooks to the other states as well, so it's not just themselves they'll be dragging down.

Pseudoscience generally.

I've run into opposition about Plate Tectonics!

As have I. In one debate, my opponent believed that the surface of the Earth was above a gigantic ocean, which is where the "Great Flood came from.

Hogwash. Everyone knows Expanding Earth Theory is the upcoming enlightenment

[Lagmonster]

The Texas apologists will no doubt now claim that this is a small fringe group and not representative of Texans in general, despite the fact that these people are responsible for the education of Texans in general.

You know there are some Texans on this forum, right? We might, maybe, know Texas a little bit better than you. I can tell you that while there are disturbingly large numbers of people like this in the state, they are not representative of Texans in general.

Let me explain why it's hard to believe someone who tells me that Texas is mostly full of intelligent, responsible people: If someone told you that there was a town with 100 people, that precisely one of them was an idiot, and that this one person also just happened to be the elected mayor, what, exactly, would you conclude about the other 99?

Anyway, the issue I was calling attention to is the fact that the fucknuts are in a position to control the education of all young Texans, which is not something that tells me that the non-fucknuts are in control of the situation. Indeed, it tells me that the fucknuts would like to raise your kids as copies of themselves.

[Jaevric]

I've lived in the Dallas/Fort Worth Metroplex area since 1997, though I'm not a native of Texas. No, idiots like this aren't a majority of the people I've met here; the problem is, they are the people we have put into our State Board of Education. Which means either they are representative of the state as a whole, or they are representative of the people in the state who are willing to go to the trouble of putting someone who they agree with in public office.

If the rest of us are too lazy or busy or apathetic to make sure that our educational system is well-managed, then we deserve mockery as much as the idiots who come up with these ideas in the first place.

[Darth Wong]

Pseudoscience generally.

I've run into opposition about Plate Tectonics!

As have I. In one debate, my opponent believed that the surface of the Earth was above a gigantic ocean, which is where the "Great Flood came from.

That's a classic example of a Stunner argument: the kind of argument where you are momentarily rendered speechless by the sheer stupidity of it and the fact that an adult human being could actually say it with a straight face.

[Darth Wong]

I've lived in the Dallas/Fort Worth Metroplex area since 1997, though I'm not a native of Texas. No, idiots like this aren't a majority of the people I've met here; the problem is, they are the people we have put into our State Board of Education. Which means either they are representative of the state as a whole, or they are representative of the people in the state who are willing to go to the trouble of putting someone who they agree with in public office.

If the rest of us are too lazy or busy or apathetic to make sure that our educational system is well-managed, then we deserve mockery as much as the idiots who come up with these ideas in the first place.

It's a lot like the situation I've cited before with respect to moderate Christians vs fundies. The moderates may not be as batshit-insane as the fundies, but when push comes to shove, they are still often sympathetic to them, which is almost as bad because it tends to translate into political support, or at least acquiescence.

In any case, if the majority of the state really is as reasonable as the apologists say, then they will react accordingly and these idiots will be turfed out at the first opportunity.

PS. And why the fuck does Texas export textbooks to the rest of the country? Why does the rest of the country think "Hey, if we want textbooks, we should avoid the elitist Northeast with its Ivy League schools and highly educated population and go to fucking Texas?"

[Androsphinx]

I read a very interesting article a few weeks back about the textbook market.

When it comes to setting the agenda for textbook publishing, only the twenty-two states that have a formal adoption process count. The other twenty-eight are irrelevant -- even though they include populous giants like New York, Pennsylvania, and Ohio -- because they allow all publishers to come in and market programs directly to local school districts.

Adoption states, by contrast, buy new textbooks on a regular cycle, usually every six years, and they allow only certain programs to be sold in their state. They draw up the list at the beginning of each cycle, and woe to publishers that fail to make that list, because for the next seventy-two months they will have zero sales in that state.

Among the adoption states, Texas, California, and Florida have unrivaled clout. Yes, size does matter. Together, these three have roughly 13 million students in K-12 public schools. The next eighteen adoption states put together have about 12.7 million. Though the Big Three have different total numbers of students, they each spend about the same amount of money on textbooks. For the current school year, they budgeted more than $900 million for instructional materials, more than a quarter of all the money that will be spent on textbooks in the nation.

...

The big three adoption states are not equal, however. In that elite trio, Texas rules. California has more students (more than 6 million versus just over 4 million in Texas), but Texas spends just as much money (approximately $42 billion) on its public schools. More important, Texas allocates a dedicated chunk of funds specifically for textbooks. That money can't be used for anything else, and all of it must be spent in the adoption year. Furthermore, Texas has particular power when it comes to high school textbooks, since California adopts statewide only for textbooks from kindergarten though eighth grade, while the Lone Star State's adoption process applies to textbooks from kindergarten through twelfth grade.

And he goes on to explain how some evangelicals (who have lots of time and really really care about this sort of thing) have made a small industry out of attending and manipulating adoption hearings. Scary stuff.

[Alyrium Denryle]

I made it through the Texas education system alright, and I'm trying to see my step-son through it now. It may be a struggle at times, but from what I've seen it doesn't seem much worse than any other state. A lot of it depends on where in Texas you are.

Hi. I am a grad student in the state of texas. I teach undergraduate students biology. From the perspective of an educator, math and science education in the state of texas sucks more cock than a Thai ladyboy when a naval vessel pulls into port.

My students have not been exposed to the following concepts in a satisfactory way.

Evolution, Natural Selection, basic Mendelian genetics, statistics (they dont even know what ∑ means for fuck's sake, and cant do a standard deviation to save their lives), cellular respiration (I learned this in the 9th grade), basic developmental biology, basic chemistry...

Do I need to go on? I basically teach high school biology and statistics at a university, because the education system cannot be arsed to do it right the first time. It is not even the fault of the teachers. They are handed down a shitty curriculum from the school board, not funded by the state legislature, and then told that they cannot even apply natural selection to their classrooms and FAIL the people who deserve to fail. They actually have a Max Failure Quota. They can ONLY fail the bottom 20% of their class. No matter how poorly the rest do. Thankfully I am under no such restraint!

You know there are some Texans on this forum, right? We might, maybe, know Texas a little bit better than you. I can tell you that while there are disturbingly large numbers of people like this in the state, they are not representative of Texans in general.

Just because conservative, fundamentalist, white assholes control most of Texas, that doesn't mean that all - or even most - Texans are like that.

Um... You realize this is a contradictory statement right? Especially when paired with this.

This is very true. There is a HUGE differance between rural and urban Texas. There are also far more urban than rural Texans, but they rednecks have a disproportionally loud voice here.

Yes, if they make up the majority of the population, the idiots in charge are NOT dispropotionately powerful, and YES they are representative of Texans as a whole.

Remember, these people are VOTED into office. Popular Sovereignty applies, whether you like it or not.

[Alyrium Denryle]

PS. And why the fuck does Texas export textbooks to the rest of the country? Why does the rest of the country think "Hey, if we want textbooks, we should avoid the elitist Northeast with its Ivy League schools and highly educated population and go to fucking Texas?"

The population is huge. Capitalism at work.

I've lived in the Dallas/Fort Worth Metroplex area since 1997, though I'm not a native of Texas. No, idiots like this aren't a majority of the people I've met here;

How representative is your sample

I dont leave the university except to go look for snakes, and I still get a pretty good sample of stupid.

[Darth Wong]

It's worth pointing out that science does not come up in small-talk conversation for most people, hence it is quite possible to know people socially without having the slightest idea that they're actually blithering anti-science idiots. Of all these people Jaevric declares as reasonable, how many has he actually asked about their attitude toward evolution, science, and the supernatural? How many have expressed opinions like "global warming is a media hoax" which he dismissed as non-representative of their ability to be reasonable?

When you're friendly with someone, it's easy to overlook their flaws or look away before finding out something you don't want to find out.

[Intio]

Similar to what Androsphinx posted, I had heard of the influence Texas had in this issue via the publishers. Many educational publishers will simply match the standards for Texas and mass print those books, fulfilling their quota for Texas and supplying the excess to other states that require them. Some publishers, I understand, produce 'Texas only' versions of science books, but many will not to go the expense of concurrent print runs.

Can anyone over-the-pond confirm this?

[Darth Wong]

It's so aggravating that so much of American politics is decided by the Old South. These are the fucking knuckle-dragging troglodytes who lost the Civil War and still think they deserved to win it. It's literally the goddamned zombie corpse of the 19th century, reaching out its withered claws to drag down the present.

[Anguirus]

Hi. I am a grad student in the state of texas. I teach undergraduate students biology. From the perspective of an educator, math and science education in the state of texas sucks more cock than a Thai ladyboy when a naval vessel pulls into port.

My students have not been exposed to the following concepts in a satisfactory way.

Evolution, Natural Selection, basic Mendelian genetics, statistics (they dont even know what ∑ means for fuck's sake, and cant do a standard deviation to save their lives), cellular respiration (I learned this in the 9th grade), basic developmental biology, basic chemistry...

I'm ABOUT to be. My advisor warned me about this but not so explicitly...guess it will be a long 5-7 years.

[Force Lord]

It's so aggravating that so much of American politics is decided by the Old South. These are the fucking knuckle-dragging troglodytes who lost the Civil War and still think they deserved to win it. It's literally the goddamned zombie corpse of the 19th century, reaching out its withered claws to drag down the present.

Indeed. One can argue that the Civil War isn't over at all, but that stuff is no longer decided by force of arms but by court decisions and government rulings. What still surprises me is that the Old South just won't accept the fact that it was proven wrong and persists with its insanity in the hopes that it'll get lucky somehow.

[wautd]

This man is up for the position of the State Board of Education Chair in Texas..
Warning: braindamaging stupidity inside