Speakers issue

[Lazarus]

I have a Logitech 5.1 setup for my PC, recently the middle speaker has ceased working in games. It still works for music/films etc, but for some reason not in games, which means I can't hear anything if I look at it in FPS's etc. Any ideas?

[Starglider]

I have a Logitech 5.1 setup for my PC, recently the middle speaker has ceased working in games. It still works for music/films etc, but for some reason not in games, which means I can't hear anything if I look at it in FPS's etc. Any ideas?

Does the speaker work when you do a per-channel sound test? In Vista, this is Control Panel -> Audio -> Configure Output Device (speakers) -> Test (5.1 channels)

[Lazarus]

Nope, and neither do the rear two, so does that suggest the speakers aren't being detected as 5.1 properly? But if that were the case, why am I getting partial 5.1 sound?

[Starglider]

Because most sound systems will expand conventional stereo onto all five speakers (naively or with digital soundstage processing). How is this thing connected, by three separate 3.5mm jack connectors? Are they assigned correctly? If you unplug and replug them, do they get detected as 'front speakers', 'rear speakers', 'centre/sub speakers' correctly? If you swap the rear speaker jack with the front speaker jack, does that make the test sounds come out of the rear speakers rather than the front speakers? If yes, then it is definitely a software configuration problem, if you can't find an option to reassign the jack outputs or change the surround mode, try uninstalling and reinstalling your audio output device.

[Lazarus]

Sorry I was wrong before, the test sound for the front left and right comes out of the front and back left and right speakers respectively, while the centre and sub do nothing. The three jacks (coloured black, green and tan) connect from the front right speaker to a black box, from which two plugs (red and white) connect to a single gray plug which only works when plugged into one of six ports. They are in the correct order. Disconnecting and reconnecting the main plug has no effect. The drivers (high definition audio device) are apparently up to date according to device manager.

[Beowulf]

Sorry I was wrong before, the test sound for the front left and right comes out of the front and back left and right speakers respectively, while the centre and sub do nothing.

So, same problem. Sound card thinks you've got 2.0/2.1, and the speakers compensate by duplicating the front and rear channels. It's a config problem. Make sure it's in 5.1 mode.

[Lazarus]

The 5.1 option is selected in audio config under control panel - sound.

[Starglider]

The three jacks (coloured black, green and tan) connect from the front right speaker to a black box, from which two plugs (red and white) connect to a single gray plug which only works when plugged into one of six ports. They are in the correct order. Disconnecting and reconnecting the main plug has no effect. The drivers (high definition audio device) are apparently up to date according to device manager.

Wait, what? How many contacts are there on the 'main' (gray) plug? Is it a 3.5-stereo-jack to dual-phono lead? If so there's no way you're going to get 5.1 sound because you've only got a stereo connection. What is the model number of this speaker setup?

[Lazarus]

Yeah that's it. So I've got a 5.1 setup that shipped with a cable only allowing stereo? Wtf?

This the the model: http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/speak ... 1&cl=gb,en

[Starglider]

Yeah that's it. So I've got a 5.1 setup that shipped with a cable only allowing stereo? Wtf?

The convertor box is probably for use with computers that only have a stereo output, e.g. laptops. For 5.1 sound, you should plug all three jacks directly into the corresponding ports on your computer. Depending on your soundcard this may be fixed (check the symbols and/or manual) or software assignable, i.e. you will get a dialog box asking you which speakers you just connected after inserting each jack.

[Stark]

Is there a reason why they don't just use USB ports, beyond compatibility with other devices? The six colour-coded plug bullshit is pretty lame, since a USB port can pretend to be any number of channels.

[Beowulf]

Is there a reason why they don't just use USB ports, beyond compatibility with other devices? The six colour-coded plug bullshit is pretty lame, since a USB port can pretend to be any number of channels.

Because people don't want to sacrifice a USB port to the sound card, and don't want to have to worry about losing a sound card, etc. What you should really be complaining about is that there isn't a more widespread use of SPDIF (or a related, newer standard) from sound cards to speakers.

[Stark]

Eh? If you have a cool sound card, it would have a USB instead of eight million plugs. If you have onboard '5.1' they could similarly just add another port (or replace the silly plugs entirely).

The SPDIF thingsis pretty galling, really; that's even a proper-made standard for audio. I've NEVER seen speakers 'for computer' that use it.

[Starglider]

Is there a reason why they don't just use USB ports, beyond compatibility with other devices?

It makes the speakers more expensive, because you have to add a serial decoder and D/A chips. In theory that would be balanced by the cost savings of not having to put audio hardware on motherboards, if everyone did it, but of course there is still a huge amount of legacy hardware out there that people demand motherboard support for. Give it another five years, we'll get there. I'm just glad that the HDMI bitstream audio out mess is finally being sorted out, so that computers will now connect to decent home theatre systems correctly.

Because people don't want to sacrifice a USB port to the sound card?

What? Are you somehow unaware of the existence of USB hubs? Even if you are, has anyone ever actually said that to you or did you pull it out of your ass? I've never met anyone who had 'run out of USB ports' - desktops come with four to six of them these days and a lot of monitors have integrated hubs on top of that.

and don't want to have to worry about losing a sound card, etc

You can get USB soundcards, but Stark meant integrating them into the speakers, since the USB sound modules still have the multi-jack confusion issue.

What you should really be complaining about is that there isn't a more widespread use of SPDIF (or a related, newer standard) from sound cards to speakers.

That would be pointless. This is not 1995. Consumer grade sound cards don't do anything useful beyound D/A and preamp any more; since Vista all the sound processing has been in software. S/PDIF would require just as much hardware in the speakers as USB would (i.e. everything that would be on a soundcard). It's an obsolete format anyway, at least in this application, why bother with another custom connector which you can't use for anything else, when USB and HDMI can do the job better and with much more capability. Also S/PDIF speakers would be pointlessly limiting yourself to high-end desktops (very few laptops have S/PDIF out), wheras USB will work with everything, has the data rate to support 7.1 raw, and is probably cheaper to boot.

[Stark]

It makes the speakers more expensive, because you have to add a serial decoder and D/A chips. In theory that would be balanced by the cost savings of not having to put audio hardware on motherboards, if everyone did it, but of course there is still a huge amount of legacy hardware out there that people demand motherboard support for. Give it another five years, we'll get there. I'm just glad that the HDMI bitstream audio out mess is finally being sorted out, so that computers will now connect to decent home theatre systems correctly.

Really? Most 'computer' 5.1 systems I've seen run out of hardware in a separate head unit or built into the sub, and USB can shift simple audio channels with very simple hardware (or so my expereince with multi-mic USB converters and multi-channel USB headsets with mics tells me). If you can do it with crappy $20 headsets, is it really so hard to do it with $500 speakers?

I'm not well informed on this issue, I'm just constantly irritated by the gillion plugs my speakers have (and that 'black' and 'grey' are both on the motherboard for some brain-melted reason).

[Starglider]

It makes the speakers more expensive, because you have to add a serial decoder and D/A chips.

Really? Most 'computer' 5.1 systems I've seen run out of hardware in a separate head unit or built into the sub, and USB can shift simple audio channels with very simple hardware (or so my expereince with multi-mic USB converters and multi-channel USB headsets with mics tells me).

Turning a multiplexed digital input into sound fundamentally requires more electronics than turning discrete unbalanced analogue inputs into sound.

If you can do it with crappy $20 headsets, is it really so hard to do it with $500 speakers?

That said, we're talking about a few extra dollars, maybe twenty dollars for semi-decent DACs (or you can just feed directly into a digital amp), so no it isn't hard for anything but the cheapest crappiest $10 speakers. But then $500 computer speakers are almost always a rip-off, in that a $500 low-end home cinema package will almost always do a better job.

[Stark]

Yeah, but a $500 home cinema system will probably come with better inputs, too. I think it's crazy that the ripoff computer speakers also seem to be quite 'backward'.

[Executor32]

I have the same system, the little black box is for connecting it to a game console or TV. Like Starglider said, plug the green, yellow, and black cables from the right front speaker into the corresponding jacks on your sound card.

[Lazarus]

I have a ridiculous situation.

You'd think this would be simple, but it really isn't. I'm colourblind, so of the three plugs I have, I only know for sure that one is black. The other two look tan and green, but various sites say I should have green and orange or green and yellow. I have 6 ports on my card, which appear to me to be blue, black, pale-pinkish, then 3 others which could be any sort of green/pale yellow. I have absolutely no idea which plugs go where. Trial and error has produced combinations where I have the front/rear left and right speakers working in test but not the centre or the sub, or the front left playing centre and vice versa but no rights or sub . The PC only detects the speakers sometimes, and often fails to do so when I return to a combination it has previously detected. Any guides I find online concern hooking up PC's to home cinema systems which seem to be different.

[Lazarus]

Summoning assistance from someone without retarded eyes has led me to the conclusion I have black, green and orange plugs. Putting them into their corresponding jacks fails, since the speakers aren't detected even after reset. Putting the green in another port of what appears to be a slightly different shade of green also fails after reset. That the jacks are colour coded with the plugs, but incorrectly so, induces a need to break things. Any other ideas before I lose my damage deposit?

[Lazarus]

Could it be a sound card issue? I don't actually know what card I have since I didn't build this computer myself, device manager just states 'high definition audio device' and sound config states 'digital output device (SPDIF)'.

[Lazarus]

Forgive the repeat posts...

Ok I've now solved the original vocal track issue, and seem to have full 5.1
The only issue being that only 2 speakers will play music and at least some films, but I'm told this is because those files are not in 5.1 format. Incidentally this also seems to have fixed my crazy bass problem where the sub was far too high in the mix even with the volume and balance to zero.

[Starglider]

Don't you have the manual for the speakers and/or motherboard, paper or PDF?