Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen (Spoiler ahoy!)

[Vympel]

It'd be nice if they made a website with extreme hi-def renders of the various Transformers - I have ridiculously high-quality pics of Megatron (Transformers 1 version) and Starscream (also Transformers 1 version) - for an idea of how good they are, the picture of Megatron is 5544 x 6350 and it's 9.2 megs.

I wish I had one like that for each Transformer from each movie. They're so freaking awesome. I can't even remember where they came from.

[Oskuro]

The movie is a goddamn glorious mess. A totally RADICAL one! YEAH!

It's a Kaleidoscope of awesome. It has really nice bits harshly meshed together with little sense or rythm. The mindset you have going in probably affects the viewing. I was personally tired, and didn't have the energy to handle its inconsistencies, but Shroomysome other people might have been in a more psychoticcheerful mood and been more forgiving.

[18-Till-I-Die]

I liked the movie, I just don't get the criticisms of it.

I love the movie to hell and think it's absolutely awesome - but I can understand that objectively and logically, under the rules of good moviemaking, that Revenge of the Fallen could be considered as a cinematic atrocity.!

I really don't see how. I mean...I guess if you're only criteria or "rules" were for some over dramatic, empty nonsense like Away We Go or Seabiscuit then yeah it sucks...but that's neither objective nor logical, and even if it were, I'd go as far to say that if the rules stipulate that we need better rules.

In fact from what I know of these "rules", they suck ass and end up making movies like...well like Away We Go and Seabiscuit. Am I the only one who looks at dramas just to riff on them? Does everyone really enjoy this crap somehow? I mean honestly...Revenge of the Fallen was bad but like, what, Titanic was good? What about new shit like My Sister's Keeper, is little cancer girl dancing in the bubble rain good? What is considered good then? Really, someone let me know because obviously we go to the movies for different reasons, I was under the impression the point was to be entertained. Am I behind the times?

I know I have "bad taste" but is that like reverse psychology or something, like Bizarro World, "bad" movies are good ones and "good" movies suck ass? What? Huh? Someone explain it to me...

I'm not trying to be hostile, I just honestly don't get the criticisms. "Big robots hurt each other", no shit, I mean...what did people look at the trailer and expect it to be like some over drmatic tripe like Breakfast Club.

[Vympel]

I really don't see how. I mean...I guess if you're only criteria or "rules" were for some over dramatic, empty nonsense like Away We Go or Seabiscuit then yeah it sucks...but that's neither objective nor logical, and even if it were, I'd go as far to say that if the rules stipulate that we need better rules.

In fact from what I know of these "rules", they suck ass and end up making movies like...well like Away We Go and Seabiscuit. Am I the only one who looks at dramas just to riff on them? Does everyone really enjoy this crap somehow? I mean honestly...Revenge of the Fallen was bad but like, what, Titanic was good? What about new shit like My Sister's Keeper, is little cancer girl dancing in the bubble rain good? What is considered good then? Really, someone let me know because obviously we go to the movies for different reasons, I was under the impression the point was to be entertained. Am I behind the times?

I know I have "bad taste" but is that like reverse psychology or something, like Bizarro World, "bad" movies are good ones and "good" movies suck ass? What? Huh? Someone explain it to me...

I'm not trying to be hostile, I just honestly don't get the criticisms. "Big robots hurt each other", no shit, I mean...what did people look at the trailer and expect it to be like some over drmatic tripe like Breakfast Club.

Dude, Breakfast Club was a great movie. It wasn't overly dramatic, it was mostly 80s teen pap. And it gave us this awesome song.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pybSRca-cA

(yeah, I'm a big softie)

But anyway, needless to say, I agree with you. Revenge of the Fallen was more or less what I expected and what I paid to see - a hugely entertaining FUCK YEAH of a movie. I haven't decided yet whether I like it better than the first one, both have their pluses and minuses.

One thing I find hugely annoying about these reviews is the bullshit about whenever someone mentions the Twins, they say "the most racist character since Jar Jar".

What. The. Fuck. I mean, what the fuck kind of race was Jar Jar a caricature of? I remember this idiocy from 1999, but fuck me this sort of idiocy has become conventional wisdom? This is why conventional wisdom is worthless.

And as usual, so are critics. A movie doesn't make $500 million in a matter of days (completely annihilating its competition in humiliating fashion) when it's beset by universally awful reviews unless the movie has awesome word of mouth power (G1 whinger nerd rage and similar over-represented internet complaining aside).

[RogueIce]

As far as I'm concerned, this movie was awesome. I went in expecting Transformers fighting, things blowing up, and the US military showing off some hardware. With just enough of a plot to get us from one battle to the next. And it delivered on that.

Call me a fanboy if you will, but I went in for mindless fun and I got just that. And I really don't think Michael Bay was trying for anything more than that. Well, aside from making an "awesome" movie.

[TheLostVikings]

The movie is a goddamn glorious mess. A totally RADICAL one! YEAH!

It's a Kaleidoscope of awesome. It has really nice bits harshly meshed together with little sense or rythm. The mindset you have going in probably affects the viewing. I was personally tired, and didn't have the energy to handle its inconsistencies, but Shroomysome other people might have been in a more psychoticcheerful mood and been more forgiving.

I think the tone of the movie is best captured in this review.
Which by the way also happens to be the best movie review I've ever read.

[18-Till-I-Die]

Ah yes, another review made of fail and butt hurt. Yeah that's the funniest review I ever read...it's so clever I mean, you couldn't even tell he was doing a cute little passive agressive act until the second word in the first paragraph.

(See what I did there?)

But, hey guys, if you want to be really edgy and have impact you're review needs to be face to face.

Check out the Spoony Experiment (http://www.spoonyexperiment.com), and watch his TF2 review. He thinks it's worse than Manos: The Hands of Fate AND Batman and Robin, in case you even believed for a second he had credibility.

Also he looks like Lelouch from Code Geass, so that has to count for something. (wink wink, Bishonen fans! )

[Shroom Man 777]

I really don't see how. I mean...I guess if you're only criteria or "rules" were for some over dramatic, empty nonsense like Away We Go or Seabiscuit then yeah it sucks...but that's neither objective nor logical, and even if it were, I'd go as far to say that if the rules stipulate that we need better rules.

In fact from what I know of these "rules", they suck ass and end up making movies like...well like Away We Go and Seabiscuit. Am I the only one who looks at dramas just to riff on them? Does everyone really enjoy this crap somehow? I mean honestly...Revenge of the Fallen was bad but like, what, Titanic was good? What about new shit like My Sister's Keeper, is little cancer girl dancing in the bubble rain good? What is considered good then? Really, someone let me know because obviously we go to the movies for different reasons, I was under the impression the point was to be entertained. Am I behind the times?

Who's talking about Sea Biscuit anyway? It's a movie about racing goddamn whorses starring Spiderman. So what? It's about as dramatic and as empty and as nonsensical as a movie about some washed out actor of some 80s movie about a time-travelling DeLorean, suffering from some crippling nerve-disorder, and going on to train some hockey team of delinquent shitpiece orphan shits with some shit team-name like the "Spruce Gooses" or some shit chanting "we will we will rock you" or fuck. Why bring it up?

The rest of the goddamn movies you go on about, I haven't even heard about. So whatever. You suck.

I know I have "bad taste" but is that like reverse psychology or something, like Bizarro World, "bad" movies are good ones and "good" movies suck ass? What? Huh? Someone explain it to me...

I'm not trying to be hostile, I just honestly don't get the criticisms. "Big robots hurt each other", no shit, I mean...what did people look at the trailer and expect it to be like some over drmatic tripe like Breakfast Club.

You're dense. Don't you think that there are some legitimate criticisms on the Transformers movie? I like them to hell, but I do realize that they've got lots of things that are horribly-horribly wrong - even though the movies are as epic and as awesome and as ridiculously fun as watching an entire Blue Whale being fed to an oversized (Constructicon!) meatgrinder wholesale, or being blown up by copious amounts of TNT and having bloody whale guts and blubber raining down an entire town full of inbred yokel shitpiece fuckers and diseased male prostitutes! Ha-haa-HAAA!

As to these "rules" of logic and good movie-making, yes, Transformers DOES fall short of some of them. It COULD have done better, and it COULD have been far more polished - and the results would've been WAY better. It wasn't, but what we have now is still pretty awesome. For me, and apparently Vympel and you (but I agree that you have horrible taste and are rather dense).

Now, what shortcomings do I think TF2009 has? Well, it has a lot. Basically the same as its predecessor, though the prevalence of GODDAMN AWESOME AKSHUN scenes makes up for it and dilutes the mistakes by a more significant degree.

The shortcomings are basically the unnecessary and needless shit in the movie. I can shut down my brain and ignore these things well - but not everyone can do this, and others can have horrible adverse allergic reactions to the condensed stupid in parts of the Transformers movies, mangs.

Come on, I can understand why a whole lot of the artsy-fartsy critics thought that it was unnecessary and downright detrimental to have scenes like green-gooey robot secretions being splooged all over some Decepticon whore - or the racist shit with Car-Car Binks. Yes, it was racist. Not really to blacks, or to other races like Gungans or Nemoidians - but to all human beings as a whole, on the virtue of sheer goddamn golden-buck-toothed ebonics-spewing stupidity. Everything that came out of Car-Car Binks constituted as hate-speech for the non-intellectually impaired non-orphans!

Why the fuck do we need to see bling-adorned livestock with names like "Mojo" or "Frank the Pug" get it on, having dog-sex in tree-houses? Is that what constitutes as funny nowadays? Am I behind the times? Again, I was able to ignore it and actually smile at it, but shit - that's not really good comedy, and come on scenes of dogs fucking or people being gored in the groin by goatals are funnies reserve for shit youtube videos and movies like Jackass or some shit, with glue-addicted hobos being paid to shoot nailguns into their trachea or some shit.

Neither did we need to see decrepit menopausal whores get high on shit bakery products manufactured by drug-addicted college dropout shits, or possibly Einhander Snowman, and then frolic around in campus in hashish-fueled euphoria. Jesus Christ. ARE WE WATCHING A GODDAMN ROBOT WAR MOVIE or some shit rejected scenes from some movie like American Pie or Eurotrip?

I've never seen American Pie, but I saw Eurotrip and I liked it. I don't know - maybe guys like 18 would think it would also be AWESOME if Car-Car Binks and Jazz went to some nude beach to look for "bitches, man" before blundering into the "biggest weiner-feast ever" and getting chased by a whole bunch of horny European middle-aged miscreants in the buff, with their grey-pubed wrinkled penises flapping for all to see, who are in pursuit of Megan Fox or some shit. Sam Witwicky and his new college buddy could ride the TGV and get fondled by homosexual Italian perverts! Or maybe we could have some Borat-humor and have the Autobots scold Kazakhstan celebrating the Running of the Jew, and have Optimus Prime pontificate on the evils of throwing Jews down the well while extolling freedom as the right of all sentient beings. That would be cool, huh?

Shit, man. These scenes actually ARE detrimental to the whole movie as a whole. Goddamn.

This extraneous bullshit should've been cut for the sake of the coherency of plot and storyline - THAT's one of the goddamn rules you're going on about, 18. I don't know, maybe instead of digressing into lame-ass humor on the level of fart jokes, we could've had - I don't know - MOAR scenes of goddamn Ironhide and Ratchet doing rocket-jumps and ripping off Decepticon limbs with surgical robot-bonesaws, or some shit. Or maybe more of Lennox and his crew or something - Lord knows we needed more of him and his special forces, plus token minority operators. Maybe we could've had an ending that didn't just go "OPTIMUS RIPS FALLEN'S FACE OFF - AIRCRAFT CARRIER MONOLOGUE SCENE IN TWO MINUTES END CREDITS" and ended up with some decent closure instead?

Those aforementioned shit-scenes, like in TF2007 with that whole White Chick and Obese Computer-Literate African Americans with their Mammies, just digressed from the whole focus of the plot. Serving no purpose at all. It actually took time away from scenes that could've added MORE to the goddamn movie.

People have mentioned that the movie was, like, a bit of a mess - disorganized with some problems transitioning BETWEEN the action scenes. Maybe if instead of having scenes with goddamn Car-Car Binks or Robot Bodily Fluids serving as intermediaries for the transition of the action scenes, they actually showed something else that advanced the goddamn plot!

You bring up movies like SEA BISCUIT or WATER WAFER or OCEAN OREO or some shit.

Well, I bring up movies like TERMINATOR 2 and ALIENS and even the FIFTH ELEMENT. These are ALL awesome sci-fi action spectacles, and are not 100% serious business. Terminator 2 had Uncle Bob learning humanity by saying shit like "chill out dickwad" and learning to smile, in some versions. ALIENS had Hudson talking shit about "technological badasses" and "bitches" and Gorman being an idiot and Vasquez and Apone and Hicks and Bishop with his knife games! But they didn't digress into totally meaningless and worthless shit like humping dogs or shit for funnies, and they kept the integrity and the goddamn cohesion and focus of their plot without being a goddamn mess.

Jesus Christ! Having 18 argue for Transformers actually makes me see more of the goddamn movies' goddamn flaws and glaring horrific mistakes! Shit! Motherfucker!

Mang. But I still want to watch Revenge of the Fallen again. Goddamn it!

EDIT:

Don't diss goddamn Batman & Robin, motherfucker. It's one of my favorite childhood movies!

[Oskuro]

*stares in awe at Shroomy's rant*

Darn, man, you posted ALL THAT while I wrote the following bit? Still, I agree with most of your points. Except Batman and Robin. I was a hardcore Tim Burton fan back then.

SPOONY

Watch it, the Spoony One is associated with That Guy With The Glasses, and his kind is not looked upon favorably around here.


Or so I think, who cares, here is his review of the whole thing. (I'm hoping some charitable soul tells me how to embed those videos so I can inflict them on the board more easily. The MJ Death thread was begging for the Moonwalker video)

[Shroom Man 777]

Your post made me unable to edit my post slightly.

Mang. But I still want to watch Revenge of the Fallen again despite 18's unwavering support of it. No matter how much 18 likes Transformers and raves about it, I still think Transformers is awesome! Goddamn it!

[18-Till-I-Die]

I'm really not sure how to respond, because my actual opinion is that, I saw no real problems with the movie other than the fact it was too long for my tastes. The jokes, I enjoyed, the comic relief characters I found funny and endearing, and the action scenes I liked...so what do you want me to say. No I don't find these criticisms to hold water, IMHO, because to me there is nothing wrong with these things. I like toilet humor, so saying "The toilet humor isn't funny" has no effect on me other than to say, "I think you're wrong". I would go as far as to say, a majority of people seem to agree with me, seeing as how much money it made and how it hilariously crushed all opposition. It wasn't even released on a weekend, that's something right there.

So I guess my only response is, those may be legit criticisms from a standpoint of some arbitrary standard of movie making, but those standards obviously fail to account for what people actually want. Clearly millions of people want nothing more than to see robots tell toilet jokes and shoot things for two hours. So if your standards fail to account for actual reality you're standards are broken. In fact the first movie kind of showed that...clearly millions of people DO want to see magic cars from space with lasers, they DO want to see Shia LaBouf and Megan Fox, and they DO NOT care about what critics consider "good movie making". So while, under the current understanding of a "good movie", these critiques make sense...they fail to take into account what is the actual reality. People, and not just a few people a huge majority of people, LIKED Transformers 2. It's not just me...apparently most movie goers really don't give a fuck about good movie rules.

It's like Communism. The plan works on paper, but the reality of human nature says it fails. I'd go as far as to say, it's been demonstrably shown to be wrong, based on public response. If it only made that first 60 million you can say it was hype...but it's been making money steadily for days and days now, over four hundred million. That's a majority of people saying just what I'm saying: who cares, it's fun, don't take it so seriously. I guess that's my main problem with these critics, in general...they take movies so seriously they fail to realize the sole reason to even make a movie, or any kind of "art", is to entertain the masses. Millions, literally millions, of people have spoken and they honestly liked TF2. So...why should I care again? I mean, how is it I'm wrong when the "rules" seem to disagree with reality? Surely if these "rules" actually worked then this movie would have bombed...right?

[18-Till-I-Die]

I just realized the stock rebuttle to that:

"People are stupid! They'll pay for anything!"

Even if that were the case, it only goes further to show how arbitrary the "rules of good moviemaking" are. If people really are just stupid and will like anything then it's irrelevent what rules you make since they'll have no effect. An art movie would have just as much chance of being a blockbuster as TF2, if it caught the public eye, so the critics become even more irrelevent then instead of less. In fact under that standard their opinion in general is worthless since it doesn't take into account the reality of the situation.

I mean this is like those people who say that buying a game by EA makes them make more "crappy games", but since the public like those games then clearly they're not considered crappy by the majority of gamers. The idea that it's "bad" or "stupid" somehow, presupposes that the public's opinion is immediately less valid than someone whose opinion is out of touch with the reality at hand.

So again, how exactly is their opinion relevent? If it's so at odds with what people actually want, obviously they don't know what makes a real "good" movie, in as much as "good" is a movie that people will enjoy.

[NeoGoomba]

Jesus Shroomy, that was the best fucking critique/praise of this movie yet. I applaud and salute you for it.


Unrelated, thing about the Prime/Fallen fight that bothered me was the whole "only a Prime can defeat me" thing. Yeah, only Optimus Prime beat him, but not really because of anything that stood out due to having the "Prime" status. They could have expounded on it a bit maybe, like when Megatron and Scourge...er The Fallen are standing on top of the pyramid, after the neat gravity manipulation, instead of hitting those Raptors with rocks, Sco...The Fallen could have turned on some uber force field that nothing can get through, not even the super railgun, except Optimus Prime and his Peter Cullen-powered-Prime-aura. THEN Prime proceeds to rip Scourges face off. Or the Fallens. Whatever. It should have been Scourge.

Just my two cents.

[Shroom Man 777]

@ 18

Cutting out the needless extraneous material off the movie would've made it not-long.

Look, I like Transformers and perfectly and willingly forgive it for its weird-ass sense of humor and all the utterly retarded stuff inside it because, yes, it delivers awesome robot action and because aside from those few groan-worthy moments I've mentioned, it's genuinely entertaining and I'm very forgiving of my movies - because movies aren't SRS BSNSS (unless they are, but TF is definitely NOT SRS BSNSS) and because this is goddamn Transformers.

But fuck it if, despite being able to enjoy it for all its worth, I can see that the movie is definitely very far from perfect. It's got its fair share of flaws and you would have to be very fucking obtuse to not acknowledge at least that much.

Audience attendance and box office gross does not dispute the fact that the movie could have still used some work. Yes, it was fun, yes, people liked it a whole lot, but it is also simultaneously true that the movie did have a whole lot of rough edges. The fact that everyone except Havok liked it does NOT dispute that fact, 18. A movie can be fun and enjoyable while also being simultaneously flawed to a great degree.

Christ, the movie even used stock footage from the previous movie. The scene where they deploy the 'Predators' and we get a closeup shot of some unidentified jet-propelled UAV - the very same one from TF2007 in the battle before Lennox called in the A-10s on Skorponok.

That huge-ass motherfucking post I made wherein I slandered orphans and marine mammals and Europeans and orphaned marine Europeans with my criticism does not necessarily mean that Transformers was NOT an enjoyable movie. It was. I have said repeatedly that I think it's as great as an exploding whale - which is an awesome accolade indeed. But that doesn't mean that the movie could not have been improved and bettered by fixing its flaws.

Your argument that "hurr! EVERYONE LEIKS TF2009 PEW PEW ROBOTS SO ALL CRITICS AND CRITICISMS ARE GODDAMN WRONG WRONG WRONG FUCKERRRSSS!" is goddamn obtuse. Maybe the fact that so many people watched and enjoyed Transformers despite the fact that the movie had its fair share of flaws meant that... umm... I dunno... maybe it meant that many people watched and enjoyed Transformers despite the fact that the movies had its fair share of flaws. That they overlooked those flaws because the awesome robot action more than made up for it.

That doesn't mean just because everyone likes the movie, that the movie is goddamn immune from any and all criticism at all.

Christ, 18's opinion-based arguments are retarded. I wonder if he can apply that to cigarette-smoking and alcoholism as well. He thinks that just because the public likes item/game/movie X, it means that item/game/movie X must be immune to all criticism and that any and all flaws that item/game/movie X has is moot and not in touch with "the randome altarnate realty" at hand and shit.

Maybe if the majority likes something so much, it becomes hot shit and critics can't offer a second (contradictive) opinion - or their own opinions become utterly worthless next to the majority.

If we applied this 18-logic to things other than movies and videogames, then that bit in my previous post regarding deranged Kazakhstanis and throwing ethnic minorities down wells was goddamn prescient.

[18-Till-I-Die]

So you're saying that TF2 is the same as drug use and drunk driving? How? How is it dangerous? Because that's the only reason those are wrong, they're dangerous, if they weren't dangerous no one would have a problem with being a drunk or smoking. Think about it, if smoking caused no ill effects, who would care about if you smoked? If drinking caused no problem other than slurring your words and smelling like a bar, who would care if you got drunk? You're comparing the public liking a form of entertainment to them taking a dangerous drug and getting drunk and tying a car around a tree.

Whatever, I see were going deep into the realm of discussion where soon someone will bring up the Nazis and openly invoke Godwin's Law. Obviously, I just didn't see it that way. Now I'm sure that you disagree, and you're points may be valid, but...God I don't care. The things you found annoying, I either didn't notice or didn't find annoying. So what can I say...I can't say I agree with you because I'm not going to lie to your face just to end an argument. I can only say that really, I just disagree with you. Frankly It was one of the better movies I've seen in a while, easily as good as, say, Dark Knight which was the last really quality movie I've seen. I give up, I really don't care and I just don't take it this seriously. If you think it had such massive problems that's perfectly fine but I didn't care then and I don't now, I didn't even notice half of that (stock footage? Really that wen't right past me).

I also just don't think the public would embrace a movie that had so many major problems in it. I truly believe no one was "overlooking" all this stuff, when everyone was cheering and got up to clap at the end. But that's just a subjective opinion.

Really, there is no way to objectively tell if something is successful in entertainment other than to look at if people like it. Otherwise you start arguing about "artistic merit" and it just becomes a farce. There is no such thing as art, it's a concept so abstract and nebulous as to be worthless, either it entertains people or it doesn't. What else can you say about it? I hate South Park more than I ever hated any show in my life but obviously it must be entertaining to the majority because it's a licence to print money, so I grit my teeth and admit I'm just out of touch with the zeit geist and don't watch it. What else should I do exactly?

[Trogdor]

Shroom, dude, I happen to generally agree with you, but give 18 a little credit. Unlike with movies and video games and stuff, there's nothing subjective about the fact that cigarettes give people cancer. I haven't seen him trying to hand wave away that sort of thing with opinions yet, nor have I ever gotten the feeling that he would try that.

18, look, if you enjoyed all the toilet humor, more power to you. Personally, I could have done without Devestator having testicles, but that's just me. However, the idea that Transformers 2 making buttloads of money is proof that most people enjoyed it too is just crazy. I don't know about you, but I went to T2 wanting to see giant robots beating the scrap out of each other. I was far from disappointed, which is why T2 gets Trog's thumbs up, not because of the toilet humor.

Also, there really are some "rules" of movie making, and story telling in general, that it's a good idea to follow. For one thing, it's better if the plot doesn't require the characters to be idiots ("I found a piece of the Allspark, which brought all the appliances in my kitchen to life and caused them to attack. Rather than give it to the robot who's chilling right there in my garage and who can give it to Optimus Prime or something, I hand it to my girlfriend and promptly forget about it"), because an idiotic villian's not scary and an idiotic hero can be hard to root for. Also, movies should be about what they're supposed to be about. For instance, if I went to a Star Wars movie, and there was no war among the stars in it, I think I'd be kind of pissed even if I found what the movie was about entertaining. When I see a movie titled Transformers, I expect lots of transforming robots fighting each other, and yet roughly half the movie was consumed with Sam's various misadventures. Nobody ever watched Transformers, from G1 to these movies, for the humans, they watch it for the robots. I wish Michael Bay had remembered that.

[Singular Intellect]

Jesus fucking christ...is there a reason a movie needs to be 'perfect' rather than simply entertainng? I know I could point out a shitload of flaws in both Transformers movies if I really tried. But I don't go to the movies to pinpoint plot holes and scientific problems, I go there to be entertained.

In that context, Transformers succeeded brilliantly. I was very entertained and enjoyed the experience.

For fuck's sake, it's a movie based on a kid's cartoon about giant transformers alien robots beating the shit out of eachother and humanity's toys.

Anyone pissed off because it isn't a cinema masterpiece needs to get their fucking head examined.

If you enjoyed it, awesome. If you didn't, oh well, life goes on.

But seriously, come on, if you start criticizing (or even trying to defend) plot holes and 'errors' on the film, repeat after me: "giant alien transforming robots".

Don't let the live action nature and nice CGI fool you; you're essentially analysing a Saturday morning cartoon that made it to the big screen. Any actual plot consistencies and scientific accuracy is a bonus, not a requirement.

This is like trying to analyse/nitpick a Bugs Bunny episode because it got shown in theaters with a bigger budget.

[CaptJodan]

But seriously, come on, if you start criticizing (or even trying to defend) plot holes and 'errors' on the film, repeat after me: "giant alien transforming robots".

I'm sorry, what board are you posting to again?

I'm not saying it has to be a masterpiece any more than Shroom is, but the fact that it is "giant alien transforming robots" doesn't make it immune to criticism, especially on a board known for examining the intricacies of Star Trek and Star Wars, neither of which are any less silly in their premise (and sometimes, execution).

I felt this movie was right in the vein of the original: shallow, poorly thought out, with questionable (at best) humor, but with some great giant robot action. Hated the first because I expected more, liked the second better because I expected a trash plot, with pretty CGI and Baysplosions. So it was, overall, true to the vision laid out in the first movie. If I judge it as a "good movie" it's crap. If I judge it as a fun summer action flick, then it entertained and succeeded. But even judging it by the latter standard, it could have used some improvement.

I think it's the sign of a lazy writing team if you can't have both a coherent story in addition to giant robots killing each other. Even lazier to say it isn't worth pointing those flaws out.

[RogueIce]

You know what my biggest problem with the movie was? When those F-18s launched from the carrier, I leaned over to my friend and said something along the lines of how the Navy was gonna get some payback for its carrier. And then they were never seen again. They should've had F-18s in the big "we blow shit up" scenes but they didn't. Very sad.

EDIT: Oh yeah, another thing. I'm no expert on wearing high heels, but just how did Megan Fox run in those heels when the Decepticon terminator chick was chasing them and not break her ankle?

Oh yeah, and are the Transformers public knowledge now? I'd think so, because as implausible as trying to cover up the first movie fight was, I don't think even Action Movie Awesome Government Conspiracy powers (which makes any supposed 9/11 conspiracy look like amatuer hour) could deal with the pyramids and all that other ancient Egyptian stuff getting wrecked. Surely somebody would notice? As well as the massive battle in Egypt itself. I would say Optimus Prime walking down the flight deck of the carrier at the end too, but then they had a whole battlegroup burying Decepticon parts in the first movie so I guess they could've hushed that one up.

And that's my best explanation for how Sam Witwicky walked back into his astronomy class with smiles from the professor and all. He's the Savior of Humanity now, and is buddies with giant alien transforming robots. Who wouldn't give him at least a smile and want him in their class?

[18-Till-I-Die]

She took off the heels. She was holding them in her hand, IIRC, during the running part. So the more pressing question is "when did she have time to take them off"?

Also, I'm pretty sure the fact that the Fallen openly adressed humanity means the Transformers are now public knowledge. Though likely no one knows that Sam had anything to with it, they're probably aware of what happened. In fact I'm pretty sure a TV screen in one scene after the Fallen's broadcast said "alien invasion!!!" or "alien attack!!!" or the like. I could be wrong, but if that's the case then, at the very least, everyone knows the Transformers exist.

Sam was smiling because he just saved the world, and he probably realizes he doesn't need to take shit from some know-nothing professor who can't even use a pickup line correctly. And as for the prof...well, the term, I believe, is "shit eating grin".

My one real disappointment was, after hitting the Aircraft Carrier, I genuinely expected one of them to morph into a giant carrier Decepticon. I think one exists in the toy line already...tidal wave or some such.

[neoolong]

The toys, and novelization for that matter, also have a Decepticon that transforms into a biplane.

The government probably came up with a story for the public for why the Decepticons wanted Sam. Makes me wonder exactly what it was.

Also, were there any tourists near the pyramid? I would have thought that there'd be at least some tourists. Even if I don't think it was quite tourist season yet.

[Shroom Man 777]

So you're saying that TF2 is the same as drug use and drunk driving? How? How is it dangerous? Because that's the only reason those are wrong, they're dangerous, if they weren't dangerous no one would have a problem with being a drunk or smoking. Think about it, if smoking caused no ill effects, who would care about if you smoked? If drinking caused no problem other than slurring your words and smelling like a bar, who would care if you got drunk? You're comparing the public liking a form of entertainment to them taking a dangerous drug and getting drunk and tying a car around a tree.

It might not be dangerous - hey, a movie is totally harmless - but the idea of saying that just because public opinion on movie/game/item X was generally positive does not mean we disregard any and all criticism on movie/game/item X at all. It might not be as bad as taking dangerous drugs or fatal car accidents, but just because today we're talking about Transformers does not mean the next day we won't be talking about worse mouth-breather entertainment. Your arguments can be used to defend, say, shit like mediocre reality TV shows crawling out of the woodworks and becoming the only thing there is on TV.

"Hey, the public really likes reality TV! Fuck the critics, let's cancel all our goddamn decent TV series shows and replace 'em all with randome altarnate realty shows that dare people to eat turds and swallow guns for fifty bucks!"

[TheLostVikings]

My one real disappointment was, after hitting the Aircraft Carrier, I genuinely expected one of them to morph into a giant carrier Decepticon. I think one exists in the toy line already...tidal wave or some such.

Reportedly Bay loved the idea of a gigantic transforming aircraft carrier was awesome, and they spend some serious amount of time trying to work it into the movie. (although as we all know, it didn't end up happening)

Here is some official concept art of said transformer:

[18-Till-I-Die]

That us truly awesome.

If that had been in the movie, I prolly would be still tweaking my nipples with joy a week later.

Christ will anyone ever find a way to work Metroplex or Omega Supreme into these movies? Is it that much MORE outlandish than magic car robots from space...magic fortress robots from space? That right there would have been a PERFECT Trypticon, what mass changing space cars are fine but when we get a giant mechanical spider/aircraft carrier then OOOOH suddenly we're getting off message!

[Gandalf]

Fiancée and I saw the film last night.

3/10.

The fights were better, but that's about it.

Otherwise I was a wonderful combination of boredom and irritation. The Autobots were annoying, and the Decepticons were just lame. The humans were a combination of those two.