a Real-Life (not article) moral quandry, staring Solauren.

[Solauren]

Not sure where to put this, but there are moral issues to it I guess, so...

My wife and I are attempting to sell our house. Attempting being an operative word, because all the other houses in the area, that are comparative dumps, having been selling cheaper.

However, we are not the cheapest place in the Condo-Corp, but several thousand dollars, and our house is nicer then the other one. (We have Central Air for one....)

Enter the surprise we had this week-end.
My friend Warren is now looking at apartments, ASAP. He was planning on getting one in the spring, but do to outside factor's involving his girlfriends living situtation/family's insane religious views, they've decided to step things up.

He's currently looking at apartments (2 bedroom), and near where i live (walking distance to work for him),they are about $920 a month (+ taxes). This does not include cable/telephone, or a parking space. (I know, I rented in one of those buildings).

Crunching the numbers (my friend has good credit), he can get a 35 year mortgage at 4.2%, which for my place would be $515 a month (+ 230 in condo fees, + 40 for heating + 140 for hydro if he keeps the A/C on 24/7 like we do for our dog).
That comes out to $925 for everything a 2 bedroom apartment covers, with an extra bedroom, basement, and his own washer/dryer (I can't see him using a laundry mat...), a small lawn that's being fenced in the spring (by the corporation), and the parking space is in front of the condo.

Am I wrong for suggesting to him that he says 'screw the apartment', and instead by my house?

[Samuel]

Am I wrong for suggesting to him that he says 'screw the apartment', and instead by my house?

As long as it is what he wants and he can afford it I don't see how this is a problem. Were you planning on offering it to him and jacking up interest rates halfway through?

[Solauren]

Seeing as I'm not the bank, and once you lock a mortgage in for a period, you can't, no.

[GrandMasterTerwynn]

Crunching the numbers (my friend has good credit), he can get a 35 year mortgage at 4.2%, which for my place would be $515 a month (+ 230 in condo fees, + 40 for heating + 140 for hydro if he keeps the A/C on 24/7 like we do for our dog).
That comes out to $925 for everything a 2 bedroom apartment covers, with an extra bedroom, basement, and his own washer/dryer (I can't see him using a laundry mat...), a small lawn that's being fenced in the spring (by the corporation), and the parking space is in front of the condo.

Am I wrong for suggesting to him that he says 'screw the apartment', and instead by my house?

Can he afford the down payment, though? In this real estate market, down payments have been hovering as high as 20%, and that's probably going to be much higher than what he'd have to pay in terms of a security deposit for an apartment. And is he at a stage in life where's he's going to stay in one place for five or ten years? If he's going to be moving somewhere else in a couple of years, then no, don't suggest that he buy your condo.

[Darth Wong]

What the fuck is wrong with your English? Just look at this:

My wife and I are attempting to sell our house. Attempting being an operative word, because all the other houses in the area, that are comparative dumps, having been selling cheaper.

"Having" should be "have".

However, we are not the cheapest place in the Condo-Corp, but several thousand dollars, and our house is nicer then the other one. (We have Central Air for one....)

"But several thousand dollars" for what? And what "other one" are you referring to? This sentence is garbled nonsense.

My friend Warren is now looking at apartments, ASAP. He was planning on getting one in the spring, but do to outside factor's involving his girlfriends living situtation/family's insane religious views, they've decided to step things up.

"Due to outside factors", not "do to outside factor's". Don't you know the difference between "due" and "do", or the proper way to pluralize a noun? Also, "girlfriend's", not "girlfriends". The possessive form uses the apostrophe, the plural does not. I'll assume "situtation" was just a typo.

Am I wrong for suggesting to him that he says 'screw the apartment', and instead by my house?

"Buy my house", not "by my house". Seriously, are you functionally illiterate or something? This is fucking horrible. I didn't even list every problem, just the most irritating ones.

[Bluewolf]

To be fair he may just be tired and just wrote his message in such a state. I don't know though. Usually Soul's posts are quite well constructed, grammar wise.

[Korvan]

Nothing wrong in suggesting that your friend consider buying a house if his situation warrants it. But, in my opinion it would be wrong to put pressure on him to buy your house specifically without him being able to look at other places for sale in his desired area.

[Solauren]

To be fair he may just be tired and just wrote his message in such a state. I don't know though. Usually Soul's posts are quite well constructed, grammar wise.

Actually, it was a 'rush to get it all out' job, and I didn't think to hit 'preview' instead of 'submit'. I'm not in any particular 'OMG, must say' rush now.

Nothing wrong in suggesting that your friend consider buying a house if his situation warrants it. But, in my opinion it would be wrong to put pressure on him to buy your house specifically without him being able to look at other places for sale in his desired area.

Oh, absolutely on the 'no preasure, he should look around'.

However, my 'listing' is the most economic for a townhouse (lowest condo fees in the area, no renovations needed), while the detacted homes in the area start at around $175,000. $175,000 would result in a mortgage beyond his ability to carry.

Quite frankly, on further reflection, I'm fairly sure the only reason he didn't suggest this one Saturday was because of the need to get this done 'right now', versus waiting for my wife and I to find, purchase, and relocate to a new house.

Understandable this close to the 'mid point' of the month.

[Alferd Packer]

Can't you, as the owner of the condo, simply rent it to him? Or do you need the funds from the sale to buy another place?

[Solauren]

Can't you, as the owner of the condo, simply rent it to him? Or do you need the funds from the sale to buy another place?

The funds are required for the purchase of a new place.

[Nova Andromeda]

Crunching the numbers (my friend has good credit), he can get a 35 year mortgage at 4.2%, which for my place would be $515 a month (+ 230 in condo fees, + 40 for heating + 140 for hydro if he keeps the A/C on 24/7 like we do for our dog).

-If you live in the U.S., even with perfect credit how do you plan to get a 4.2% mortage rate, especially for a 35 yr. loan instead of a 15 yr. loan. The other problem is downpayment as mentioned previously by others.
-What about just renting you place to your friend instead?

[Darth Wong]

Nothing wrong in suggesting that your friend consider buying a house if his situation warrants it. But, in my opinion it would be wrong to put pressure on him to buy your house specifically without him being able to look at other places for sale in his desired area.

It's trickier than that. There's an old saying: "never do business with friends or family". There's a reason for that saying: in business, your objective is to screw the other guy as much as possible. Nobody actually wants to ask for fair market value on his house when he sells it; he wants to sell it for more if possible. Conversely, nobody wants to pay fair market value on a house; he wants to buy it for less than it's worth if possible.

The buyer-seller relationship is, despite superficial cordiality, a fundamentally antagonistic one. When you sell something to a friend that's small, you might sell it for less than it's worth and consider that a favour to your friend. But a house is a huge item; it's not something you want to sell for less than it's worth or even FMV if you can help it. Now if someone is willing to say "I'm perfectly willing to eat thousands of dollars or tens of thousands of dollars as a favour to my friend", that's fine. Good for him. But if that's not the case, you have a situation where you might strain your friendship by trying to do this deal and get what you both consider to be a fair deal for yourselves.

[Solauren]

Ah, Lord Wong cut to the core of my problem, and at the same time, actually inspired a solution.

I have e-mailed my friend my idea, with numbers. I have said whatever he decides is his choice, and I shall respect it and hold no grudge or disappointment (home ownership is not for everyone, my current residience is not for everyone, he may not want to have to deal with a condo corporation, his girlfriend my dislike the idea, etc, etc, etc), and that if he want's to discuss it, however he wants to is up to him.

At this point, it's now at; If you'd rather buy a house, but can't wait for a place to live, if you buy mine, you could live here for free until ownership of the new house (+ old house, aiming for same day roll-over to avoid discharge fees, common practice, and the bank suggested it) is official.


Oh, and for those wondering about how 35 year mortgage and 4.2% interest
That's simple: Canada. Our national interest rate is rather low right now.... (hence the interest in moving on my part)

[General Zod]

Buying a house generally implies a long term investment. Unless your friend is looking to stay in the same place for the next several years without the flexibility of being able to move as the situation warrants, not to mention having to handle the majority of upkeep and maintenance on his own, it's probably not a good idea to recommend he buy the house "just" to save some cash.

[SCRawl]

Buying a house generally implies a long term investment. Unless your friend is looking to stay in the same place for the next several years without the flexibility of being able to move as the situation warrants, not to mention having to handle the majority of upkeep and maintenance on his own, it's probably not a good idea to recommend he buy the house "just" to save some cash.

There's also the costs involved with transferring a property. You might not need to eat that 6% (or so) that goes to the real estate agent(s), but you'll still have to pay a lawyer at the very least. Your arithmetic also didn't include property taxes -- do you pay property taxes for a condo?

DW already hit the nail on the head with respect to the real issue here: are both parties willing to give some financial ground to keep the relationship cordial?