SDN Wars: A Galaxy Divided: OOC

[Thanas]

Sorry to hear about your weekend.

[Kartr_Kana]

The golden republic is going to be interested in buying two holonet stations. One on alsakan and one on mechis III. I just got the Essential Atlas today and found out where exactly all my planets are. Mechis is the only one that is to far away to tap into one on alsakan.

BTW the Essential Atlas is worth every penny!

[Thanas]

Make an offer IC to Mahd Windcaller and I am pretty sure my Council will approve it.

[Kartr_Kana]

Ok I will, it'll be a day or two "real world time" till my next IC post since I'm trying to flesh out my next couple of posts instead of just winging it like I've been doing recently.

[Thirdfain]

I have a gameplay question: Through what mechanism is the Remnant selling HoloNet access? I.E, what sort of resources would I need to gain my own HoloNet access?

[Thanas]

You have PM.

[RogueIce]

So I did have questions to ask, but now that my computer is fixed...I forgot them.

Oh well. I guess I can try and tabulate that budget now.

[Master_Baerne]

OOC-Note: Spherical formation 4 is a rough sphere, with one half of the sphere taken by capships, the other one by lights, where the heavies normally face the enemy. SphF 1 employs and equal arrangement, SphF 2 places the lighter units on the outside, SphF 3 on the inside

About these sphere formations - The 4th one makes no sense at all, because the whole purpose of lighter units is to screen heavier ones from missiles and fighters, and you seem to have your ships doing the exact opposite. Spheres really aren't very good proper battle formations, since half the units in the sphere can't fire past the other half.

[Thanas]

Shhh, she is supposed to learn IC. And a sphere in this case is really more of a ball of ships grouped together to take advantage of overlapping shields.

[Serafina]

OOC-Note: Spherical formation 4 is a rough sphere, with one half of the sphere taken by capships, the other one by lights, where the heavies normally face the enemy. SphF 1 employs and equal arrangement, SphF 2 places the lighter units on the outside, SphF 3 on the inside

About these sphere formations - The 4th one makes no sense at all, because the whole purpose of lighter units is to screen heavier ones from missiles and fighters, and you seem to have your ships doing the exact opposite. Spheres really aren't very good proper battle formations, since half the units in the sphere can't fire past the other half.

Actually, the purpose is to use the higher mass and shielding of my heavy units to protect the lighter ones.

You see, a single turbolaser/ion cannon can severely damage/cripple a light unit (say, everything below an VSD), while it would be absorbed by the shields and/or armor of a heavy unit.

It's not supposed to be used in a straight standoff against an enemy fleet. It's there for situations where you have to either
-protect severall small, weak units (say, transports)
-are unable to mount effective counterfire due to the fact that you have to move a lot

Spheres in general are certainly not the best formations there are. But they have no (or at least less) weak spots.
Remember that the Cultural Union is relatively inexperienced with war - their last actuall life-combat experience on a great scale was during the Clone Wars!
We were not idle, studied history books, held internal maneuvers and exercises etc. - but we have no combat-experienced officers on anything but a "raid" scale.

Some examples of the implications:
-Admiral Amyria certainly knows the Thrawn pincer in theory - but she NEVER saw it in a live action. She had a gut feeling that something bad was about to happen and that there was a flaw in her tactic. An experienced officer would have connected that feeling with his knowledge, and would have known the counter-tactics.
Of course, not all experienced officers do have good inution - Amyria has.

-The training and drills tends to be formalised. This is reinforced by the sheer amount of droids that operate the fleet.
Droids can be programmed to perform complex maneuvers easily, but it is very hard to make them an organic combat unit.
And officers, especially staff officers, love to show off just as everyone else.

-The whole strategy and tactic of the Cultural Union is very theoretical. A strategy/tactic may work nicely on paper, but not at all in reality.
Take my attempted charge as an example - it would have worked nicely on paper, but Thrawn Captain Hunt simply did not fall for it - something which is hard to calculate.


Of course, thats just me rationalizing my actual strategic and tactical errors - but i had that in mind when i created my background.

Regards
Fina

[RogueIce]

Networking for fun and profit! So I did have something to do during the Signing Conference.

Also, I think some joint exercises among the CORE Alliance (of the powered down turbolaser variety, not the simulated stuff) would be a good thing. Morale building, getting used to working together and all that good stuff. Since we mostly come from an Imperial background this should be decent, but we've had two-plus years apart doing our own thing means we might have come up with new ideas or squared off against new tactics, so come catch up may be in order.

Plus it serves, for me, an OOC benefit much as Serafina is looking for. I am quite certain my Imperial Admirals and officers are pretty good at the whole space combat thing. So I need to make sure RogueIce is at least passingly competent as well.

[Thanas]

OOC-Note: Spherical formation 4 is a rough sphere, with one half of the sphere taken by capships, the other one by lights, where the heavies normally face the enemy. SphF 1 employs and equal arrangement, SphF 2 places the lighter units on the outside, SphF 3 on the inside

About these sphere formations - The 4th one makes no sense at all, because the whole purpose of lighter units is to screen heavier ones from missiles and fighters, and you seem to have your ships doing the exact opposite. Spheres really aren't very good proper battle formations, since half the units in the sphere can't fire past the other half.

Actually, the purpose is to use the higher mass and shielding of my heavy units to protect the lighter ones.

You see, a single turbolaser/ion cannon can severely damage/cripple a light unit (say, everything below an VSD), while it would be absorbed by the shields and/or armor of a heavy unit.

I think the single cripple/injure is only applicable to corvettes and frigates. Cruiser shields for example should handle an HTL salvo. Up Cruiser level and above it really turns into a slugging match.

[Serafina]

I think the single cripple/injure is only applicable to corvettes and frigates. Cruiser shields for example should handle an HTL salvo. Up Cruiser level and above it really turns into a slugging match.

Still, the same logic applies: The formation is usefull when normal screening can not be applied, or certain vessels need to be protected.
But thanks for the correction.

Regards
Fina

[Mr Bean]

I think the single cripple/injure is only applicable to corvettes and frigates. Cruiser shields for example should handle an HTL salvo. Up Cruiser level and above it really turns into a slugging match.

I'll remind you of the old calculations we have floating around where-in two star destroyer's facing off were able to each put several salvo's (Read minimum of three at most eight into each other during Isard's Revenge(X-Wing series) with no damage except to reduce shields and when another ISD joined the fray the next combined broadside was enough to knock down one SD's shields and the one after rendered the ship combat ineffective. Also during the Bacta War(X-wing series) when a Star Destroyer takes on a Super Star destroyer, the first full broadside takes out the SD's shields and does enough damage that side of the ship is rendered combat in-effective with shield generators turned from the hull and guns melted in position. The next broadside (Single) was able to turn that Star Destroyer into a float metal box not worth scrapping.

I can dig up other examples but the clear indications we have is that in one on one fights it is a slugging match but more than one ship engaging the others turns the tide quickly. Shields have to disparate energy and once they exceed that threshold of how much they can disparate they are quickly knocked down and even a single HTL can put down most smaller ships. Frigates and below are said to snap if not simply be turned into float slag by a half dozen shots.

[Master_Baerne]

Networking for fun and profit! So I did have something to do during the Signing Conference.

Also, I think some joint exercises among the CORE Alliance (of the powered down turbolaser variety, not the simulated stuff) would be a good thing. Morale building, getting used to working together and all that good stuff. Since we mostly come from an Imperial background this should be decent, but we've had two-plus years apart doing our own thing means we might have come up with new ideas or squared off against new tactics, so come catch up may be in order.

Plus it serves, for me, an OOC benefit much as Serafina is looking for. I am quite certain my Imperial Admirals and officers are pretty good at the whole space combat thing. So I need to make sure RogueIce is at least passingly competent as well.

I'm certainly up for something of the sort.

[Thanas]

I think the single cripple/injure is only applicable to corvettes and frigates. Cruiser shields for example should handle an HTL salvo. Up Cruiser level and above it really turns into a slugging match.

I'll remind you of the old calculations we have floating around where-in two star destroyer's facing off were able to each put several salvo's (Read minimum of three at most eight into each other during Isard's Revenge(X-Wing series) with no damage except to reduce shields and when another ISD joined the fray the next combined broadside was enough to knock down one SD's shields and the one after rendered the ship combat ineffective. Also during the Bacta War(X-wing series) when a Star Destroyer takes on a Super Star destroyer, the first full broadside takes out the SD's shields and does enough damage that side of the ship is rendered combat in-effective with shield generators turned from the hull and guns melted in position. The next broadside (Single) was able to turn that Star Destroyer into a float metal box not worth scrapping.

I can dig up other examples but the clear indications we have is that in one on one fights it is a slugging match but more than one ship engaging the others turns the tide quickly. Shields have to disparate energy and once they exceed that threshold of how much they can disparate they are quickly knocked down and even a single HTL can put down most smaller ships. Frigates and below are said to snap if not simply be turned into float slag by a half dozen shots.

Of course, that is also the assumption I work under. With regards to frigates, there is the infamous example of Nebulon-Bs snapping under one salvo from an ISDII.

A slugging match only works if you have parity. And I would expect an SSD to destroy anything the size of an ISD - seriously, the Executor has 120x the firepower of an ISD, at least (judging by reactor size).

However, cruiser level and above can stand up to ISDs. There are numerous examples during the Thrawn campaign, for example. This is not to say that they can withstand more than one or two salvos, but one salvo they should be able to take.

[Mr Bean]

A slugging match only works if you have parity. And I would expect an SSD to destroy anything the size of an ISD - seriously, the Executor has 120x the firepower of an ISD, at least (judging by reactor size).

However, cruiser level and above can stand up to ISDs. There are numerous examples during the Thrawn campaign, for example. This is not to say that they can withstand more than one or two salvos, but one salvo they should be able to take.

Are you thinking of the engagement in Dark Force rising where an ISD is matched by six dreadnoughts(Class not weight) firing Ion cannons? I note that engagement Dreadnaught's were accounted at least Heavy Cruiser's and their singular enemy meant that they could do things like roll their ships periodically to expose as yet un-touched shield sections to the ISD's fire? During that example when it was 3 on 1 things went sharply against the Dreadnoughts, enough so that orders were be given to withdraw when one of the slave unit equipped ships rammed the other ISD that had arrived.

The obvious interference is that six were sufficient to pose a danger to the ISD with the ISD being unable to engage any one ship long enough to damage it, but that two ISD's were sufficient to destroy one and then quickly in sequence destroy the rest as their numbers were reduced ship by ship.

[Thanas]

A slugging match only works if you have parity. And I would expect an SSD to destroy anything the size of an ISD - seriously, the Executor has 120x the firepower of an ISD, at least (judging by reactor size).

However, cruiser level and above can stand up to ISDs. There are numerous examples during the Thrawn campaign, for example. This is not to say that they can withstand more than one or two salvos, but one salvo they should be able to take.

Are you thinking of the engagement in Dark Force rising where an ISD is matched by six dreadnoughts(Class not weight) firing Ion cannons? Inote that engagement Dreadnaught's were accounted at least Heavy Cruiser's and their singular enemy meant that they could do things like roll their ships periodically to expose as yet un-touched shield sections to the ISD's fire? During that example when it was 3 on 1 things went sharply against the Dreadnoughts, enough so that orders were be given to withdraw when one of the slave unit equipped ships rammed the other ISD that had arrived.

Yes, but it shows that three of them can stand up to an ISD and not be annihilated immediately and can infact conduct a safe retreat and even force another ISD to withdraw.

The obvious interference is that six were sufficient to pose a danger to the ISD with the ISD being unable to engage any one ship long enough to damage it, but that two ISD's were sufficient to destroy one and then quickly in sequence destroy the rest as their numbers were reduced ship by ship.

Of course, which is what we mods are working on. You won't get "Cruiser swarm rapes ISD" from us. All I am saying is that a Vindicator, for example, which is larger than a Dreadnought, should not immediately be destroyed by one salve from a single ISD.

[Thanas]

Anybody can guess who the two persons are who just hit Saenger in the head and then fixed him?

Send me a PM if you do. The winner gets a flowery propaganda message of praise or hate (in case of Thirdfain ) on the Imperial Holonet. Mods cannot play as they already know who they are.

EDIT: I am speaking of this post so that it does not get lost in the fleet exercise stuff.

[RogueIce]

Mods cannot play as they already know who they are.

So fellow Imperials, no small talk?

[Thanas]

Praji is always interested in small talk....I'll PM you my part.

[Thanas]

Edited the results of the fleet exercise in, in order to avoid any confusion. Hunt won, the Union admiral stopped the simulation after the colony was attacked by stormtroopers.

[Serafina]

Ok, here is an important note for everyone:

VERY FEW people know what TRILLIAN really is or does.

Even to most people in my civilisation, TRILLIAN is just a manager. They do not know that she actually makes most of the important decisions.
Officers, High bureaucrats and people in similar positions DO know what is really going on.

To the uninformed, Lady Serafina Morantor is the elected ruler of the Cultural Union.
In fact, there IS a strange mixutre of aristocracy, technocracy and democracy which DID "elect" most of my characters (except the military ones, of course) - but this means little to nothing, since TRILLIAN makes the real decisions.

If TRILLIAN is refered to in any IC-posts, she will only be refered to as a managing system.
Please do NOT refer to her as a being in any kind of position with real power.

Regards
Fina

[Thanas]

Okay, two huge reveals in my last post. I am quite pleased with them. Note that the inclusion of Guri was approved by the other two mods. By now you must have guessed the identity of "Ruhin" as well. He too was approved by the mods.

Also, the plan of the Black Sun regarding Feena has been revealed.

[Agent Sorchus]

First, I have been rather busy and apologize for my absence, unfortunately this is probably going to continue to be a trend for me.

Serafina: Defense pact will be okayed, treaty signing should happen around the 'new year'. If you want to write up specifics of the agreement PM them to me and I should have time to give you an opinion. Is that good?

Darth Raptor: My ambassador is offering a trade pact that includes access to Balmorran war droids from my worlds. I also will entertain any offers that you make.

Kartr_Kana: A trade deal is good with me, along with embassy's for both of us. If you want anything more offer it.

Thirdfain: My ambassador is looking for access to Sullust to continue suplying my fleet with the superior parts from the original factories. Since I am feeling the crunch of time i would be happy if you made the first post.

And last, Thanas when you changed the ship list you changed the size on the Liberator cruiser and eliminated the troop capacity. Also in general the lists for non imperial vessels almost entirely lack ground troop capacity. This peeves me, because I was relying upon the ability of the Liberators to transport troops and I happen to be one of only two users of the liberator in the game. Now I don't mind the change to wookieepedia's standard in size, so long as I can keep the troop capacity that goes with the entry. What I would be happy with is:
Liberator
800m 11000 troops (three short regiments) 72 fighters and the ability to not run screaming from most ships in the cruiser class, while a dreadnaught can make them break off.

Now I know that what we want and what we get are not the same, but with the lack of any troop transport capacity in non imperial ships I feel that your limiting of this one ship was a bad judgment. Note: wookieepedia does not actually have a source for the ships size that is good, I own and still play Rebellion and nothing in that game should be treated as scaled properly.