Water Found on Moon

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Fire Fly
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Water Found on Moon

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It's Official: Water Found on the Moon

Since man first touched the moon and brought pieces of it back to Earth, scientists have thought that the lunar surface was bone dry. But new observations from three different spacecraft have put this notion to rest with what has been called "unambiguous evidence" of water across the surface of the moon.

The new findings, detailed in the Sept. 25 issue of the journal Science, come in the wake of further evidence of lunar polar water ice by NASA's Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter and just weeks before the planned lunar impact of NASA's LCROSS satellite, which will hit one of the permanently shadowed craters at the moon's south pole in hope of churning up evidence of water ice deposits in the debris field.

The moon remains drier than any desert on Earth, but the water is said to exist on the moon in very small quantities. One ton of the top layer of the lunar surface would hold about 32 ounces of water, researchers said.

"If the water molecules are as mobile as we think they are — even a fraction of them — they provide a mechanism for getting water to those permanently shadowed craters," said planetary geologist Carle Pieters of Brown University in Rhode Island, who led one of the three studies in Science on the lunar find, in a statement. "This opens a whole new avenue [of lunar research], but we have to understand the physics of it to utilize it."

Finding water on the moon would be a boon to possible future lunar bases, acting as a potential source of drinking water and fuel.

Apollo turns up dry

When Apollo astronauts returned from the moon 40 years ago, they brought back several samples of lunar rocks.

The moon rocks were analyzed for signs of water bound to minerals present in the rocks; while trace amounts of water were detected, these were assumed to be contamination from Earth, because the containers the rocks came back in had leaked.

"The isotopes of oxygen that exist on the moon are the same as those that exist on Earth, so it was difficult if not impossible to tell the difference between water from the moon and water from Earth," said Larry Taylor of the University of Tennessee, Knoxville, who is a member of one of the NASA-built instrument teams for India's Chandrayaan-1 satellite and has studied the moon since the Apollo missions.

While scientists continued to suspect that water ice deposits could be found in the coldest spots of south pole craters that never saw sunlight, the consensus became that the rest of the moon was bone dry.

But new observations of the lunar surface made with Chandrayaan-1, NASA's Cassini spacecraft, and NASA's Deep Impact probe, are calling that consensus into question, with multiple detections of the spectral signal of either water or the hydroxyl group (an oxygen and hydrogen chemically bonded).

Three spacecraft

Chandrayaan-1, India's first-ever moon probe, was aimed at mapping the lunar surface and determining its mineral composition (the orbiter's mission ended 14 months prematurely in August after an abrupt malfunction). While the probe was still active, its NASA-built Moon Mineralogy Mapper (M3) detected wavelengths of light reflected off the surface that indicated the chemical bond between hydrogen and oxygen — the telltale sign of either water or hydroxyl.

Because M3 can only penetrate the top few millimeters of lunar regolith, the newly observed water seems to be at or near the lunar surface. M3's observations also showed that the water signal got stronger toward the polar regions. Pieters is the lead investigator for the M3 instrument on Chandrayaan-1.

Cassini, which passed by the moon in 1999 on its way to Saturn, provides confirmation of this signal with its own slightly stronger detection of the water/hydroxyl signal. The water would have to be absorbed or trapped in the glass and minerals at the lunar surface, wrote Roger Clark of the U.S. Geological Survey in the study detailing Cassini's findings.

The Cassini data shows a global distribution of the water signal, though it also appears stronger near the poles (and low in the lunar maria).

Finally, the Deep Impact spacecraft, as part of its extended EPOXI mission and at the request of the M3 team, made infrared detections of water and hydroxyl as part of a calibration exercise during several close approaches of the Earth-Moon system en route to its planned flyby of comet 103P/Hartley 2 in November 2010.

Deep Impact detected the signal at all latitudes above 10 degrees N, though once again, the poles showed the strongest signals. With its multiple passes, Deep Impact was able to observe the same regions at different times of the lunar day. At noon, when the sun's rays were strongest, the water feature was lowest, while in the morning, the feature was stronger.

"The Deep Impact observations of the Moon not only unequivocally confirm the presence of [water/hydroxyl] on the lunar surface, but also reveal that the entire lunar surface is hydrated during at least some portion of the lunar day," the authors wrote in their study.

The findings of all three spacecraft "provide unambiguous evidence for the presence of hydroxyl or water," said Paul Lacey of the University of Hawaii in an opinion essay accompanying the three studies. Lacey was not involved in any of the missions.

The new data "prompt a critical reexamination of the notion that the moon is dry. It is not," Lacey wrote.

Where the water comes from

Combined, the findings show that not only is the moon hydrated, the process that makes it so is a dynamic one that is driven by the daily changes in solar radiation hitting any given spot on the surface.

The sun might also have something to do with how the water got there.

There are potentially two types of water on the moon: that brought from outside sources, such as water-bearing comets striking the surface, or that that originates on the moon.

This second, endogenic, source is thought to possibly come from the interaction of the solar wind with moon rocks and soils.

The rocks and regolith that make up the lunar surface are about 45 percent oxygen (combined with other elements as mostly silicate minerals). The solar wind — the constant stream of charged particles emitted by the sun — are mostly protons, or positively charged hydrogen atoms.

If the charged hydrogens, which are traveling at one-third the speed of light, hit the lunar surface with enough force, they break apart oxygen bonds in soil materials, Taylor, the M3 team member suspects. Where free oxygen and hydrogen exist, there is a high chance that trace amounts of water will form.

The various study researchers also suggest that the daily dehydration and rehydration of the trace water across the surface could lead to the migration of hydroxyl and hydrogen towards the poles where it can accumulate in the cold traps of the permanently shadowed regions.
Additional source, NYT

To celebrate this news, shall we water our lawns, take baths, and use our laundry machines ten times more? Water conservation is now a thing of the past!
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Zac Naloen
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Re: Water Found on Moon

Post by Zac Naloen »

Also the bbc, this claim


"If you had a cubic metre of lunar soil, you could squeeze it and get out a litre of water," explained US researcher Larry Taylor.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8272144.stm

That adds up to a lot of water on the moon...
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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Can we colonize it now? Seriously, America, stop fucking around and get to it. We need the jump-off point to invade the Solar System.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

Post by ArmorPierce »

Reminds me off my 4th grade english teacher when someone in class said that there might be water on the moon and she said "nope, just frozen gas."
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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PeZook wrote:Can we colonize it now? Seriously, America, stop fucking around and get to it. We need the jump-off point to invade the Solar System.
The same goes to you too Russia and China.

Seriously though, the best possible thing that could happen here would be a lunar land grab between the superpowers.

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Re: Water Found on Moon

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Russia has no frakking chance of doing it, though. The required investment is beyond their capability, though they did have a rocket once that could easily lift enough cargo for a lunar launch - though so do the Americans, with the Shuttle. Both the Energia and the STS would require serious redesign to actually handle a lunar spacecraft, though, and Russian space industry is a total mess, while the US still has the Shuttle kind of in service (how many times was it suppoed to retire now? :D)
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JULY 20TH 1969 - The day the entire world was looking up

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Re: Water Found on Moon

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Isn't the shuttle a piece of shit, though, relatively speaking?
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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Tanasinn wrote:Isn't the shuttle a piece of shit, though, relatively speaking?
No. The shuttle is an awesome piece of technology: all its flaws stem not from bad engineering or manufacturing, but from poor choices of mission and capabilities the engineers had to make possible.

Think about it: the system manages to put 112 tonnes into low earth orbit with a launch mass of 2000 tonnes ; it's very, very efficient at what it does (the Energia never came close, and the systems are almost identical in concept). Its main problem is, of course, that out of these 112 tonnes, only 20 or so are actual payload, with the rest being the manned spacecraft itself, because for whatever reason it was decided it had to be reuseable (and also huge: it has more cabin space per astronaut than any spacecraft ever built). This is why it's expensive to operate and becoming steadily more dangerous to fly as the fleet ages.

Otherwise, it's a really fine vehicle.
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JULY 20TH 1969 - The day the entire world was looking up

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Signature dedicated to the greatest achievement of mankind.

MILDLY DERANGED PHYSICIST does not mind BREAKING the SOUND BARRIER, because it is INSURED. - Simon_Jester considering the problems of hypersonic flight for Team L.A.M.E.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

Post by Fingolfin_Noldor »

PeZook wrote:Russia has no frakking chance of doing it, though. The required investment is beyond their capability, though they did have a rocket once that could easily lift enough cargo for a lunar launch - though so do the Americans, with the Shuttle. Both the Energia and the STS would require serious redesign to actually handle a lunar spacecraft, though, and Russian space industry is a total mess, while the US still has the Shuttle kind of in service (how many times was it suppoed to retire now? :D)
I think the current Russian plan calls for multi-stage approach, and now they are working on the Angara rocket. The Angara-7 looks like a baby Vulkan rocket, incidentally using the RD-191 which has a single nozzle, and probably some degree of upgraded specs I would think over the original RD-171. It's very unlikely they would revisit the Vulkan concept again, especially considering the destruction of considerable infrastructure and machine tools, and if any of that were in Ukraine, it would be long gone by now.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

Post by Skylon »

PeZook wrote:
Tanasinn wrote:Isn't the shuttle a piece of shit, though, relatively speaking?
No. The shuttle is an awesome piece of technology: all its flaws stem not from bad engineering or manufacturing, but from poor choices of mission and capabilities the engineers had to make possible.

Think about it: the system manages to put 112 tonnes into low earth orbit with a launch mass of 2000 tonnes ; it's very, very efficient at what it does (the Energia never came close, and the systems are almost identical in concept). Its main problem is, of course, that out of these 112 tonnes, only 20 or so are actual payload, with the rest being the manned spacecraft itself, because for whatever reason it was decided it had to be reuseable (and also huge: it has more cabin space per astronaut than any spacecraft ever built). This is why it's expensive to operate and becoming steadily more dangerous to fly as the fleet ages.

Otherwise, it's a really fine vehicle.
Weight wise, the huge delta-wings were the biggest problem. You can thank the USAF having insane mission requirements for the thing (few to none of which have been practiced).
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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PeZook wrote:Can we colonize it now? Seriously, America, stop fucking around and get to it. We need the jump-off point to invade the Solar System.
I wouldn't. The Moon freakin' sucks. The presence of water is one thing, but there are still very few volatiles accessible on the Moon, making a self-sustaining colony impossibly impoverished and dependant entirely on Earth.

What this makes is a Lunar base that can be abandoned if need be a bit more viable.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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How about we wait until there are at least 100 million people living on Antarctica before we set off to colonize the Moon. :)
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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But the south pole is boooor-ing, and the moon is awesome.

Using the resources on the moon (solar energy, this bit of water, etc) and stuff we can bring with us, how self-sufficient could we make a lunar colony, given a few decades of dedicated effort?
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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Self-sufficiency is not the goal, though.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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PeZook wrote:Self-sufficiency is not the goal, though.
If it cannot support itself, it is a pretty shitty interplanetary colony. At best, it is a temporary base.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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open_sketchbook wrote:But the south pole is boooor-ing, and the moon is awesome.

Using the resources on the moon (solar energy, this bit of water, etc) and stuff we can bring with us, how self-sufficient could we make a lunar colony, given a few decades of dedicated effort?
No. At the end of the day, to support human life in a quasi-permanent, you need the breakfast of champions for organic life. Compounds that contain phosporous, nitrogen, sulfur, et cetera, preferably in the form of phosphates, nitrates, et cetera, which suitable bacteria can eat and be the bottom of the food chain for what support humans. The moon had MOST of that baked out of the surface during its formation. It is pretty glaringly bare in volatiles. Solar wind deposits some into the lunar soil, but not large amounts. Depending on the reasons we go to the moon, like scooping up He-3 for some futuristic fusion process, solar deposited volatiles might help (we are collecting them anyway along with the He-3, after all), but its not enough to support any sort of large human population.

There MAY be deep volatiles well below the lunar surface that couldn't escape, but it would take the mother of all mining operations to reach them natively, so any lunar colony must be supported from Earth. That raises the cost of a lunar colony immensely, because getting material up Earth's gravity well is an expensive endeavor, particularly if you want to do it in bulk. Frankly, alot of the reasons for visiting the moon is because it's local, not because its particularly interesting.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

Post by Nephtys »

If we don't colonize the moon, how else will polygamists send us mass-driver loads of grain with the help of Sherlock Holmes' digital brother, huh? HUH?

Still, excellent news from an apparently more reliable source than most of the sensational science news these days.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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Gil Hamilton wrote:
PeZook wrote:Can we colonize it now? Seriously, America, stop fucking around and get to it. We need the jump-off point to invade the Solar System.
I wouldn't. The Moon freakin' sucks. The presence of water is one thing, but there are still very few volatiles accessible on the Moon, making a self-sustaining colony impossibly impoverished and dependant entirely on Earth.

What this makes is a Lunar base that can be abandoned if need be a bit more viable.
What would you think of the idea of the moon being used like a pitstop to launch other spacecraft further out of the solar system? There has been the concept of using a mass driver to launch craft from the moon into space and it would give any settlment on the Moon, a goal.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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Bluewolf wrote: What would you think of the idea of the moon being used like a pitstop to launch other spacecraft further out of the solar system? There has been the concept of using a mass driver to launch craft from the moon into space and it would give any settlment on the Moon, a goal.
That's exactly the point. A self-sustaining Lunar colony was always a pie in the sky dream, but there are large iron deposits on the Moon, possibly titanium too. The Moon should be turned into a mighty forge for our starships as they go and conquer the solar system!
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JULY 20TH 1969 - The day the entire world was looking up

It suddenly struck me that that tiny pea, pretty and blue, was the Earth. I put up my thumb and shut one eye, and my thumb blotted out the planet Earth. I didn't feel like a giant. I felt very, very small.
- NEIL ARMSTRONG, MISSION COMMANDER, APOLLO 11

Signature dedicated to the greatest achievement of mankind.

MILDLY DERANGED PHYSICIST does not mind BREAKING the SOUND BARRIER, because it is INSURED. - Simon_Jester considering the problems of hypersonic flight for Team L.A.M.E.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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If the space industry becomes more doable in terms of cost and time then I think someone will eventually try and make a grab for the moon and its materials which could spark a race to the Moon off. A bit of a pipe dream but there is nothing wrong with being hopeful.
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Re: Water Found on Moon

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PeZook wrote:That's exactly the point. A self-sustaining Lunar colony was always a pie in the sky dream, but there are large iron deposits on the Moon, possibly titanium too. The Moon should be turned into a mighty forge for our starships as they go and conquer the solar system!
There is plenty of titanium on the moon in the form of ilmenite that is enriched with magnesium. That's all well and good, but you need a colony of miners to harvest it and the more in mineral poor in a great many other metals and volatiles you need for a production process. The moon's big selling point as a fabrication facility is its low, but present, gravity, not that its full of minerals to exploit. The colony of miners is the problem, because unless they are at least SOMEWHAT self-sufficient, what is the point? You could just build your fabrication facilities in Earth orbit if you are merely shipping most of the materials from Earth anyway.

Besides, you yourself were the one who said colony.
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