SD.Net World Redux Comment Thread X

[RogueIce]

So anyway, Beo posted the continuation of my little sidebar. I had originally edited it into my post, but then noticed he made a new post. So that's why A) I have two edits on that first bit (because I took that part out again) and B) why Beowulf wrote* from Rufus Shinra's POV. Just in case anyone was confused.

*I suppose it's more accurate that he posted Rufus Shinra's POV. I wrote that little inner dialouge.

[K. A. Pital]

So don't you think now some people might get a little agitated about Beowulf and Lonestar's shenanigans around and in Japanistan, eh?

And that smug reply to Indhopal was fun to read - "Hey, we're screwing with your ally but don't bother. You're a moron who can't see through our schemes". What an insult to common sense.

[RogueIce]

So don't you think now some people might get a little agitated about Beowulf and Lonestar's shenanigans around and in Japanistan, eh?

Not really. Both in and out of character I have no idea what their final plan is or what they're up to.

The only thing I know is the same OOC suspicion I think everybody else who has bothered to pay attention has: a coup is being instigated and Lonestar wants Shep in some position of power. What actually happens I don't know (well aside from the fact Lonestar as much as said Japanistan fractures and no one PC controls it all).

So far as IC is concerned, I don't know what you can base it on. The exercise is not that close to Japanistan you can point at it and say, "Ah ha! Proof!"

[K. A. Pital]

How did Lonestar end up in charge of Japanistan which was under the control of Evil Coyote, and is such a blatant power grab as installing his puppet Shep even viable?

The exercise is not that close, but damn if Indhopal can't put 2+2 together. "Hey, civil war's brewing at the Japs. Let's start a massive naval exercise... um... because we want to!".

What if Steve decides enough gerrymandering is enough and decrees Japanistan has quelled Lonestar's coup attempt and basically assaulted the Old Dominion? Have you guys even calculated against such odds? I'd have fun looking on Beowulf and Lonestar's faces when Japanistani WMDs start raining on their soil.

[RogueIce]

How did Lonestar end up in charge of Japanistan which was under the control of Evil Coyote, and is such a blatant power grab as installing his puppet Shep even viable?

The exercise is not that close, but damn if Indhopal can't put 2+2 together. "Hey, civil war's brewing at the Japs. Let's start a massive naval exercise... um... because we want to!".

What if Steve decides enough gerrymandering is enough and decrees Japanistan has quelled Lonestar's coup attempt and basically assaulted the Old Dominion? Have you guys even calculated against such odds?

I take it you didn't read Lonestar's earlier OOC post?

Myself, Steve, and Shep have discussed this, and bottom line is that Japanistan is going to Fracture, hard. No PC is going to seize the reins of (all) of Japanistan.

And I'm not going to presume to say what Indhopal knows or doesn't. That's Raj's call.

[Beowulf]

The exercise is not that close, but damn if Indhopal can't put 2+2 together. "Hey, civil war's brewing at the Japs. Let's start a massive naval exercise... um... because we want to!".

Your timeline is a bit off. The naval exercises were announced, and then, as is typical of coups, fighting began without warning. Considering that joint exercises between OICAS and Tian Xia just completed in F-ing, it's not unexpected that a similarly named exercise might take place in support of OICAS, in the way of the most likely threat axis.

[K. A. Pital]

No PC is going to seize the reins of (all) of Japanistan.

That's still taking out an important strategic rival by essentially spy games. I'm sure Lonestar will take a part of Japanistan and create a military powerhouse from it using Shep as a convenient puppet. And indeed, Indhopal can make it's own call. As can the CATO nations.

As for Beowulf's claims of OICAS support and "exercises" around Frequesue, that's damn clear the latter is just mere provocations (OD has nothing on F-ing, and it's continued military shenanigans there are irritating to the extreme for most of the small nations there), and Beowulf's support of OICAS against some sort of nonexistent "threats" is just ridiculous. What immediate threats to Lonestar even exist? OICAS is Lonestar's imperialist playground where he has consumed nations and created a brutal neocolonialist and racist regime, heavily utilizing former war criminals, and frankly any support of OICAS or the OD after the political debacle should raise eyebrows from, let's say, neutral nations of the World.

And even a fractured part of Japanistan could have enough military power to initiate a WMD strike at the culprits, who quite clearly will be exposed after the collapse of Japanistan and Lonestar's takeover of one or several parts of the nation.

[CmdrWilkens]

So don't you think now some people might get a little agitated about Beowulf and Lonestar's shenanigans around and in Japanistan, eh?

And that smug reply to Indhopal was fun to read - "Hey, we're screwing with your ally but don't bother. You're a moron who can't see through our schemes". What an insult to common sense.

- For starters the number of personnel actualy committed to the operation is a drop against an ocean of total manpower. The fleets in question ARE engaged in naval exercises and won't fire a shot in anger unless shit goes south in a hurry. If shit DOESN'T go south then no foreign nation (well maybe Raj has enough assets in country) will have enough assets to figure out whether or not a single MESS-aligned troop was involved. There are factions in Japanistan and they have a recent history of miliary coup so while suspicion could certainly turn to the MESS you would have a hell ofa time finding adequate proof.

- If shit does go south it would likely be after a new faction emerges which would be recognized as the legitimate government of Japanistan at which point MESS assets would not be engaging in aggressive actions but rather responding to a request for help subduing elements within the new regeime's borders.

Certainly there are a lot of question marks with this going forward but right now you could count with some hands and toes the number of folks who are involved in operations right now (in fact you'd probably be more likely to find somebody who knows that Shep is in fact Shep).

[K. A. Pital]

If shit does go south it would likely be after a new faction emerges which would be recognized as the legitimate government of Japanistan at which point MESS assets would not be engaging in aggressive actions but rather responding to a request for help subduing elements within the new regeime's borders.

Right. In more simple terms: the MESS will help it's imperialist puppet (or satellite state, as you wish) to take over other regions of Japanistan and stabilize said imperialist puppet against other elements in Jap which could be quite hostile to the MESS. Thanks for explaining the 101 of the MESS style of imperialism to me, but I really wasn't born yesterday

There are factions in Japanistan and they have a recent history of miliary coup so while suspicion could certainly turn to the MESS you would have a hell ofa time finding adequate proof.

Like I said, the moment a coupist government proclaims allegiance to the MESS, it would be hard for even the most impartial observer not to see huge MESS ears sticking out of the whole mess. And the moment the MESS messes (okay, that's an oxymoron!) in Japanistan militarily and acknowledges it's puppet as "legitimate government of Japanistan", I think Indhopal would be within full rights to respond in any fashion it will find appropriate. Hell, even CATO might respond to that - not with military force as MESS actions in Japanistan wouldn't be a casus belli against CATO, but certainly with sanctions and the like.

Moreover, the rogue factions in Japanistan would be within full rights to attack MESS assets that would come to help the "legitimate" warlord faction which would be the MESS puppets. Did you really think about Jap chem bombs falling on YOUR homesoil, or did you just want to play a wargame so badly because you felt all those carrier fleets were useless junk in game terms?

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Why the fuck would Japanistan even so much as request the MESS for assistance? If that happens, you would definitely expect a reaction from us, and I'm am not against extreme prejudice in fucking things up.

And why would there even remotely be "Pro-Tian Xian" elements? If that were the case, I wouldn't mind if there were pro-Byzantine elements, and then they would instead run to us for help. This is not consistent with how Skimmer would have played it, and definitely how Coyote would have played it.

I call bullshit on latest instance of unrealistic role playing.

[PeZook]

I figured it was about time to show off our new defence system for the Med.

Just in case somebody gets any strange ideas related to the coup in Japanistan

[DarthShady]

Fin has a point, why the fuck would Japanistan suddenly be so inclined towards the MESS? Or Tian Xia for that matter? I call bullshit. If you guys take over even a single faction of Japanistan, CATO will take over another and bury you with it.

Fuck, if I see even a hint of this thing threatening to cause harm to CATO members, I'm going to make all of Japanistan glow in the dark.

[PeZook]

I'm pretty sure it's going to be more subtle than "Hey, we're the new government and we'd like to join the MESS!", though. I mean, the MESS are dicks, but not idiots

[Lonestar]

And that smug reply to Indhopal was fun to read - "Hey, we're screwing with your ally but don't bother. You're a moron who can't see through our schemes". What an insult to common sense.

Nonsense. By this insane logic anytime a coup happens anywhere the US is immediately suspected of involvement, because of our personnel stationed in over 120 countries.

And while Coyote gave the okay for Shep to take over Japanistan months ago(in real time) we(Steve and myself) decided that if it was going to happen, it was going to be a in terms where Japanistan was a shadow of it's former shelf.

[K. A. Pital]

By this insane logic anytime a coup happens anywhere the US is immediately suspected of involvement, because of our personnel stationed in over 120 countries.

Actually, there's a fair share of coups the US is suspected in even in nations where it doesn't have it's forces. And rightly so because it turned out true post facto. In case you send forces into Japanistan, that'd be clear as day.

Of course, until you DO send forces no one can directly suspect you, but the moment a MESS soldier steps into Japanistan with the intent ot help the "legitimate" government...

[Shroom Man 777]

PEZOOK! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

EDIT:

This is what I get for being lazy.

*shuts up and reads*

[Karmic Knight]

'Ere we go, 'ere we go,
'ere we go, 'ere we go,
'ere we go, into the Cosmos!

- a Shroomanian children's song.

Very appropriate :D

Which brings up, the Vineyards are still providing funding for FASTA, is this a FASTA or a CATO project?

[PeZook]

Which brings up, the Vineyards are still providing funding for FASTA, is this a FASTA or a CATO project?

Yep. There's...five Vineyards astronauts on Pioneer roster, I think. And there's gonna be a lot more: frankly, while I don't have detailed rosters for all programs run by FASTA, there's probably more than 150 astronauts on FASTA payroll. I'd imagine similar for the MESS.

EDIT: Uh, Shroom? What exactly was the NOOOOOOO about?

[Shroom Man 777]

At my being so lazy that I totally didn't write anything while Noir gets-a-going without me, goddamn it!

But you're a real trooper, mang. You defeat procastination and now WE ARE ON (HARDCORE)!

Man! TOK'RA! Prime Minister Shroom tooling around in Khitan, trying to eat and shit (and trying not to eat shit). And, yeah, finally it really gets kicked up a notch with both Shroom and Ana/Katerin (poor girl ) meeting one another.

Mongolian Khitanese kiddo Yesugei will totally look like this:



Yesugei meets Frank the Elephant

[Beowulf]

OD has nothing on F-ing, and it's continued military shenanigans there are irritating to the extreme for most of the small nations there

So why the fuck were you messing around in F-ing, and why are you still there?

[Siege]

The ships in the north, for one, are there because I asked for them. The ships in the south (if they are still there, I believe they were pulled back) were there because the local goverment.... asked for them.

[Beowulf]

The ships in the north, for one, are there because I asked for them. The ships in the south (if they are still there, I believe they were pulled back) were there because the local goverment.... asked for them.

It's amazing, absolutely amazing, what a government will request when you tell them to request it, and installed that government in place through a coup. Point stands though. OD soldiers and sailors wouldn't have been there if I hadn't agreed to them being there.

[MKSheppard]

I like how people KNOW EXACTLY what is going on so far in a fucking military coup; where chaos fucking reigns supreme. There should be extreme confusion with the following possibles equally possible:

1.) X is Dead.
2.) X is mortally wounded, not expected to live
3.) X is severely wounded, but will live
4.) X is wounded, but beat off his assassin
5.) X wasn't even in the place, and is leading the resistance from a superbunker.

etc.

[Raj Ahten]

So at best you're looking at suspicion with a healthy dose of paranoia.

That seems to be how Indhopal has operated this whole game really Plus I can't afford to look weak while my strategic partner goes down the drain.

[Raj Ahten]

Indhopal should've cast it's lot with CATO. I've already considered the weakness of the Japs as a power bloc, and their instability (instigated by the MESS as well) helps not. Mark my words.

That was a very strong possibility if not for Indhopal's paranoia over CATO. Many in Indhopal were never happy with CATO for its interventions in Frequesue which they blame for starting the death of the FTO before it really got started. I figured President Ahten couldn't sell an alliance to the domestic audience even though my closest ally San Dorado joined up.

Things might be different now, buy Tonkin is still out there but a bargain with them might be worse than a bargain with Japanistan in some ways (Such as demands on economic policy). Plus they may not want me as Indhopal belongs to the NFT's economic bloc via treaty.