SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by loomer »

Thought of a good one.
Image
Mona Sax, of Max Payne fame. Is she sexy? Damn right she is. Is it a selling point? Good lord, no. Sure, she has a shower scene in 2 (though nothing of note is shown) and she and Max bang a couple of times. Sure, she has tight pants as part of her usual garb, but they're sure as hell not cut-offs and coupled with a T-shirt or a jacket actually look relatively realistic.

She's a trained assassin and far more professional than Max himself - she's a crack shot with (ugh) a Desert Eagle and a Dragunov, keeps radio headsets, and saves his life more than once in both games. She's what keeps him driving onwards, and Spoiler
her death scenes - or her apparent death scenes, in both games
are some of the most emotional moments in the games, if not THE most.

She is friend and foe, lover and enemy alike for Max, the source of his strength and his greatest weakness, and it's pretty clear that the same goes the other way at least some of the time.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by JonB »

Mai "Konoko" Hasegawa from Oni.

Small (IIRC, she's the second shortest person in the game, the other being a physical child), and distinctly lacking in the chest department. She brings a reasonable set of basics to melee combat to the table, if you disregard the later superpowers. Inspired by Majot Makoto from GitS.

Her personality is hard to divine from the game due to the circumstances of the game, but she was raised to be quite single minded in her goals, and does have some anger management issues. She does angst, but doesn't let it get out of hand. And her life does goes downhill over the course of the story, with little in the way of hope spots.

By the end of the game, she has destroyed the world in order to save it, and the future of humainty in doubt.

I don't think she'll 'win' this competition, but hopefully put down a good showing. I should really load that game up and play it through again.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by loomer »

Ah fuck. is strikeout, not spoiler. If a mod happens to spot my above post, for the love of god, please fix it!

---Edited for you. Lagmonster.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Karza »

fgalkin wrote:<snip pic>
Fall-From-Grace, from Planescape: Torment. A chaste succubus cleric who runs the Brothel for Slating Intellectual Lusts (that's where you go to exercise the other part men think with, the one with a brain inside). Is a Lawful Neutral healer, despite being from a Chaotic Evil demon race. Doesn't wield weapons, but can kill with a kiss.

She is also has some of the best characterization of all game characters, male or female. And, being a character in an RPG, the player's interactions with her and her interaction with other party members is one of the more memorable parts of the game.
Damn, beat me to it. I'd just like to add that in the dialogue (as well as in the character system) it's made obvious that Grace is insanely beautiful and charismatic, but like the picture shows, she's sensibly proportioned and dressed. Furthermore, all that is secondary to the fact that she's probably the calmest, most sensible person in the world. Wisdom and empathy instead of gratuitous fanservice.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Haruko »

Serafina wrote:Wait, a female heroine without either a chainmal/plate bikini or ridicolous cups on her armor?
Now that is worth a lot of credit.

Personally, i want to mention the heroines from Supreme Commander.
Ok, they are not really fleshed out, but no character is - but most characters in the game are female, and they are not sexed-up either.
Image Image Image

And i am really eager to see what happens to them in SupCom 2 - Clarke is dead, but Dostya might be revieved (they dropped a hint the size of a fatboy for that).

Otherwise, i would vote for Jun'ko and Cate Archer - Cate first, since she actually is a main character.
Gotta give Princess Burke special mention here. I would say she's pretty heroic considering she helped close the rift that a crazy alien civilization was using to almost succeed in annihilating the entire human race.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Jade Falcon »

Got to admit that after I powered down my PC last night "Fall-From-Grace" came to mind as a good choice. What about Annah?
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Nephtys »

SupCom didn't have any characters, just moving faces. I'm shocked that anyone would mention them.

And Jade Falcon, Quistis Trepe is cool and all, but she wears a tight leather coat and fights with a whip. That's kinda over the top in my book.

I also think Aeris is a terrible example, since she's the absolute worse member of your team, and did nothing in that game except 'sell flowers on a streetcorner', and die. She's not a heroine, she's the damsel in distress.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Oni Koneko Damien »

Okay...

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Argilla.

Games: Digital Devil Saga, Digital Devil Saga 2

Originally designed simply to be a computer program, testing the combat effectiveness of a syndrome that turns people into cannibalistic demons inside a simulation. Originally a killer/soldier with no emotions, she starts regaining the personality of the 'real-world' person she was originally based off of. In game terms, she is the sniper/'mage' of the player's party. She is one of the few people in the simulation who actually rebel against the new commands that they consume each other to grow more powerful, and isn't hesitant to admonish others against it. By the second game, she's come to terms with cannibalism as a necessary evil, but still restricts herself to using it only in self-defense and encourages others to do the same.

She's by no means a pillar of infallible strength. There are a few times she breaks down emotionally, gets her ass handed to her in a fight, or is simply wrong on something, but she actually grows from it as a character, and in the end gives her own life to defend another character.

As a slight aside, the most 'revealing' part of her outfit would be the rather high-slitted skirt, but even that has a purpose, allowing her to have an easier time kneeling and aiming her rifle.

Image

Chiaki Tachibana

Game: Shin Megami Tensei 3: Nocturne

Nocturne is sort of a weird game. It starts off with the destruction of earth in the apocalyptic 'Conception', and you take the role of one of five surviving humans in a demon, angel and god-infested wasteland, competing to determine what the underlying philosophy of the new earth will be.

Chiaki is another one of the surviving humans, formerly a high school friend of the player. She came from an upper-class family, puts her personal success and future above everything else, and tends to view anyone not similarly driven with a little disdain. After the Conception, she takes the end of the world rather badly, spending quite a bit of time in fear and denial about the state of things. Eventually she comes to terms with things and decides to play by the rules of the new world.

Chiaki decides that in the previous world, things tended to go wrong because those who were spiritually weak constantly got into positions of power, exercising their weakness over the rest of humanity and weighing down its potential. In her ideal world, only those strong enough to earn power would actually come across it, rather than being handed it by chance or inheritance. She pursues this philosophy across the world and keeps going despite all opposition and setbacks, which include getting her arm torn off in a battle against a psychotic mannequin (it's a weird game). Eventually she gains the attention and power of a deceased demonic demigod, forms her own legion of angels, fuses with a deity and becomes the most obviously powerful force in the world by the endgame.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Zixinus »

Perhaps I should try to elaborate on my chosen characters:

Jade: Beyond Good and Evil's story, let's face it, is not that great. It's a fairly predictable "government has betrayed us" game, that is significantly cartoonish and somewhat predictable. However, the thing about Jade, is that she is able to take that mediocre story and make it work because of her.
The reason for this is that she becomes the catalyst for the resistance, as a reporter (the only one for the resistance, which is another cartoonish element).

However, we are introduced to her and to his uncle quite effectively. Literally, the first ten or so minutes of the game establishes all the plot you need to know.
We see Jade strong but only when the situation requires it, thus allowing her other character traits to surface. Otherwise she's a pretty friendly person that houses orphans, obviously caring for them and protecting them. It is difficult not to like her and she is partly the reason why Beyond Good and Evil is good.
Her intentions are easy to sympathise with, her objectives is something that the player gets and understands, her desires are easily identifiable and acquirable. Emotionally, there is little dissonance between her and the player.

Cate Archer

I called her a feminist hero, and let me tell you why: we are introduced to the 60's super duper stylized spy stories, with its fashions and décor. Into these comic-book world, it is almost always the men that fight for the fate of the world.

We enter as a woman into this world. The fact of gender is secondary to another factor that some players may feel: that they're strangers entering into a new world, a world that was previously to be occupied by super-spys, elites and perfects. The player is chosen to finally enter this world and is challenged to prove his (or rather, her) worth.

This is a bit reinforced by the plot: the first few missions go badly and not because of the player's incompetence. However the player is blamed (somewhat) but is still given the opportunity to prove herself. Cate reflects this annoyance as well, her strong-willingness giving motivation and example.

Alyx Vance

The core reason why many players liked Alyx is because she offered color and some variety in the otherwise linear gameplay. She is balanced very carefully: she states your goals, but stands back to allow you to feel that you have archived them. She helps you but leaves the lion's share of the achievement to you.
Another thing, and I am sure Stark would think on similar lines, is the assumptions she seems to make about you. She clearly sees the player as powerful and extremely competent. She doesn't give a negative comment to the player (unless the player does something stupid, like shot allies or her) or one moment of disapproval.
To be fair, this is both due to the "no nagging" policy I spoken about above and because the player almost never does anything that Alyx should disapprove of and still continue the game (except the player's driving maybe).
But aside that, she has very human moments which make the game more immersive. She is freaked out by stalkers, she shows fear against the hunters, she is relieved when things turn up better, she's anxious, etc. Not only that, but she shares those emotions with the players and responds to the player's actions. She shows emotions that the player doesn't and does it so according to the situation so well that the player can forget that he's a disembodied, mute gun-turret.

I would like to comment on April, but I've played the game soooo fucking long ago.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Ryushikaze »

Ford Prefect wrote:
Tritio wrote:I nominate Tifa Lockhart.
While she got ... sexed down in Advent Children, there's really no denying that much she was pretty designed to be sexy. She's in complete contrast to Aerith, who is much more modestly dressed and ... proportioned.
Hilariously, it was Aerith who was emblazoned everywhere to sell the game, not Tifa. Tifa was certainly sexy- but she wasn't the sex sells image for FF7 back in the day.
That, and I've always thought claims of her proportion were, well, blown out of proportion. Everyone's a caricature, and Aerith's got pretty much the same proportion in game.
I'll cop to the 'more modest', except for that whole 'front button dress open up to the thigh' thing, and noting I never found Tifa's attire particularly immodest.
Zixinus wrote:Just to note: you don't have to name characters that are necessarily extremely strong and capable. We're not making a top ten feminist game character list, this tread was only inspired by one.
Advent Children cannot be considered as a video game, no? Can we take movies based on video games into consideration?
I'd rather not. Movies are, after all, created by directors, rather than the video game's developers. Besides, you have to use different characterization for a movie than for a video game.
In this case, the movie is by the video game's developers, so it's handled by exactly the same folks, and her appearance was similarly toned down in all the other ff7 games besides the original.

I would nominate Quistis, and Rosa Farrel/Harvey from FF:IV and FFIV:TA, in both games she is insisting on being in the front lines, and is both a consumate white mage, but also an archer nearly on par in damage dealing alongside the heavy hitters of Cecil and Kain.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by McC »

Most of the characters (except Alyx and Tifa) proposed so far strike me as obscure, so maybe I'm missing something.

Here are some that spring to mind for me.

Samus Aran, Metroid-series, Super Smash Bros. series
Playing some of the early Metroid games, you'd have no idea it was a chick inside the suit. And she's not (usually) depicted as over-endowed while outside the suit, though I suppose her Zero Suit incarnation might disqualify her.
Image

Bastila Shan, Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic
Clad in basic Jedi robes, she has none of the scantily-clad sex appeal of other Jedi like, say, Aayla Secura. However, her voice acting is so well done that she comes alive in a very vivid way.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Brother-Captain Gaius »

However, her voice acting is so well done that she comes alive in a very vivid way.
I think about half the characters mentioned in this thread are done by Jennifer Hale.

I'll get together some pics and background info on some of my nominations.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by fgalkin »

Planescape: Torment is not really obscure, just old- it, along with Baldur's Gate were important CRPGs.

Incidentally, Samus Aran, Fall-From-Grace, and Bastillia Shan were voiced by the same actess- Jennifer Hale.

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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Brother-Captain Gaius »

As were Juni and Ophelia.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by McC »

I say we just vote Jennifer Hale the winner of this competition. Seems easier. ;)
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Brother-Captain Gaius »

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Imoen
Baldur's Gate, Baldur's Gate 2: Shadows of Amn/Throne of Bhaal

Imoen is a thief-turned-mage, raised in Candlekeep alongside the Bhaalspawn by their mutual mentor, Gorion. She is a close companion of the Bhaalspawn until abducted and experimented upon by the badass wizard, Jon Irenicus.



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Zoey
Left 4 Dead

Being an FPS character, Zoey doesn't have a whole lot of development. Still, she is presented as a pretty dedicated survivor, even maintaining a sense of humor about being thrown into the midst of total zombie apocalypse. Like much of her generation, she's an avid zombie flick fan.



Image

Ophelia
Brütal Legend

Voiced by the prolific Jennifer Hale, Ophelia is a rather headstrong and impetuous warrior of metal. The daughter of depressing goth rockers, she faces continual scorn and suspicion for her parents' allegiances. She slaughters lots of bad guys with her twin daggers, and at one point single-handedly infiltrates General Lionwhyte's Pleasure Tower and frees all the slavegirls within to join the metal army of Ironheade as Razor Girls.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Darth Fanboy »

McC wrote:I say we just vote Jennifer Hale the winner of this competition. Seems easier. ;)
Seconded. According to her wiki entry she had a part in X-Wing vs. Tie Fighter as well.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Sela »

Joanna Dark from "Perfect Dark".

Every bit as badass as Bond from GoldenEye (N64). A secret agent, voice acted, plenty of personality, well respected by her institute. Markswoman, not sold on sex-appeal when seen in various cutscenes or from a 3rd-person perspective (such as through a scope). Goes on to repel an alien invasion.

Did I mention that she's the main character?


I've never played the X-Box "Zero" variant, so can't speak to what happened to her next.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Zaia »

Jade Falcon wrote:What about Quistis from Final Fantasy 8, she never seems over the top in the manner in which she is dressed, nor is she outrageously out of proportion.
Er, sorry, but Quistis spends most of the game flirting with her students (eww), showing off her midriff and using a whip. She can be overly sexualized without having big hooters.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Zixinus »

Can somebody please explain just how sexualized is Quistis?
The whip is indeed jarring but not that much so when you account for your average FF sword size (usually the sizes that most real-life sword-smiths did only as a show off or for decoration). I didn't play the series, nor do I plan to, but as far as I can tell, silly weapons are a staple for FF.
I'm not sure whether a tigh leather coat would qualify, unless it's really tight (to the point when it looks more like a catsuit). Even if then, some leeway should be allowed, we're not exactly Victorians here.

I can't find much in-game images or movies about her that show anything that could be considered oversexualized.

Again, the line is a bit fuzzy, but the braking point is when it becomes obvious that the character is acting the way she is just to pander to adolescent boys' sex drive. If there appears to be deeper motivations present (ie, there is a reason why the main character might like or fall in love with the protagonist/player character), that is valid (if if it falls flat or badly written).

Though, I am curious about this: flirting with her students? What?
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Dooey Jo »

Sela wrote:Every bit as badass as Bond from GoldenEye (N64). A secret agent, voice acted, plenty of personality, well respected by her institute. Markswoman, not sold on sex-appeal when seen in various cutscenes or from a 3rd-person perspective (such as through a scope). Goes on to repel an alien invasion.

Did I mention that she's the main character?
Or that she happens to wear an awkwardly armoured wetsuit with tits, for no reason (read: marketing reasons). Thankfully, Bond was never seen in one of those.
I've never played the X-Box "Zero" variant, so can't speak to what happened to her next.
Apparently, they upgraded the suit by adding a cleavage. Although when the cleavage practically goes all the way to the ass, it's more "cutting it in half" isn't it?
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Brother-Captain Gaius »

There was only one Perfect Dark. Any rumors to the contrary are the ravings of delusional madmen.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Lord Woodlouse »

Zixinus wrote:Can somebody please explain just how sexualized is Quistis?
The whip is indeed jarring but not that much so when you account for your average FF sword size (usually the sizes that most real-life sword-smiths did only as a show off or for decoration). I didn't play the series, nor do I plan to, but as far as I can tell, silly weapons are a staple for FF.
I'm not sure whether a tigh leather coat would qualify, unless it's really tight (to the point when it looks more like a catsuit). Even if then, some leeway should be allowed, we're not exactly Victorians here.

I can't find much in-game images or movies about her that show anything that could be considered oversexualized.

Again, the line is a bit fuzzy, but the braking point is when it becomes obvious that the character is acting the way she is just to pander to adolescent boys' sex drive. If there appears to be deeper motivations present (ie, there is a reason why the main character might like or fall in love with the protagonist/player character), that is valid (if if it falls flat or badly written).

Though, I am curious about this: flirting with her students? What?
The fact that FF games are filled with that kind of ridiculousness hardly absolves the existence of such things. Yes, women in FF games tend to be sexualised. That doesn't mean women in these games are exemplary examples of female characters just because they don't look and act like sex crazed centerfolds like the other women around them.

At the end of the day though, you're probably best actually watching or playing FF8 to comment on it as much as you just have.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by Zixinus »

The fact that FF games are filled with that kind of ridiculousness hardly absolves the existence of such things.
Are you referring to the whip or the tight leather coat?

If you are referring to the whip, I am not sure whether it should count because ridiculous and impractical weapons are the staple of the genre. Unless there are connotations unknown to me, I don't see it as disqualifying.

As for the remark regarding the tight leather jacket, yeah, in retrospect, it does seem stupid for me to say that.
At the end of the day though, you're probably best actually watching or playing FF8 to comment on it as much as you just have.
I'll go trough a Let's Play page.
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Re: SDN Women of Video Games Competition (p1)

Post by hongi »

Sarah Kerrigan

Image

Lovable and sarcastic, now more lovable (if a bit spiky) and Bitch Queen of the Universe. She's not overly sexualised in-game...we only see her head most of the time. Great voice-acting and a good story-arc to boot.

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