Commentary from SDN:SoT

[Robo Jesus]

((Extraneous discussion removed from Story Thread. It was mentioned before that there is a thread in OT for other discussion. USE IT.
--LadyTevar ))





Someone in that crowd is likely to know of some (if not all) of these.:p

[Mayabird]

You were warned by the Writer's Forum that something like this has already been written and it was quite good and thus posted in C & C and it had a sequel which was also quite good though incomplete. (Speaking of, probably need to join the Writer's Forum). Not to rain on your parade*, but a lot of us reading this will probably be consciously or not comparing yours to those stories.


*So long as it started before the parade and not during, I actually preferred rain on parades. Then it was like "oh horrors, I play a woodwind instrument, which will get ruined in rain, so therefore I cannot participate and join in the accidental stepping and slipping in piles of horse shit in the middle of the street and have little kids throw firecrackers at me and rednecks heckle us in incoherent broken language fragments. So awful!" But my perspective is probably a bit skewed.

[Academia Nut]

I do know about Battle of the Hymn, but I don't recall about anyone ever bringing it up in the Writer's Forum. And even if comparisons are inevitable, this is the story I am writing (although Alfred Packer wants to join in too) and by the parameters of the set-up are different enough that it won't be the same.

Besides, I'm from Canada. Inclement weather upon activities is considered something you just roll with

[Mayabird]

So long as you've been warned. And I wasn't trying to discourage. I've read dozens of versions of "the Star Wars galaxy invades the Star Trek galaxy and the Federation gets its ass thoroughly kicked" crossovers and I still find it interesting how the different authors have things play out. Though there one can often see comments of "Oh god please tell me this isn't going to be another 'Star Destroyers Rampant.' " (I've never actually read that, but I've gotten the plot synopsis from people.)

[Junghalli]

Just looking at the first section of that story Mayabird linked to, its premise was quite different from this one. It was a straightforward "SDN is dumped on an alien world" scenario. This is "SDN is dumped in 1250 BCE", which gives it tons of potential to do things the other story could not. The only way this story could be derivative of the other one or seem unoriginal is if Academia Nut completely ignored all the potential stories that you get from dumping a large group of modern people into history. I really don't think this is going to be a problem.

I will be very interested to see where this story goes.

[Academia Nut]

Well, technically I'll be ignoring a large section of the stories of people getting dumped on an island (sort of) in that the story is meant to focus on my character and the people around me as we cope and things change while all sorts of things go on around us. So it will be like one story that is tangled up with dozens of other stories, its just that since the perspective is at ground level you can't see everything at once. However, if other people wish to collaborate and write their own stories, I know that in the Writer's Forum Alfred Packer already has his own arc being written up. We're just trying to figure out where the best place to post it is.

Also, if anyone wants to have a namesake or explicitly doesn't want to appear (I've got one of those requests already) just speak up and I will be happy to accomodate either way.

[LadyTevar]

I'd really like to think that SDNetters would not tolerate Rape, nor stoop to it.

However, a mob is only as bright as the member with the lowest IQ.


I would like to think that there were enough 'knights in geek clothing' that the rapine didn't get far, not to mention the average military mindset towards rape. (Most military types I know would be feeding the rapist their own balls, followed by the penis.)

I've already told ACNut what I can and will do to a rapist trying anything around me.

[Junghalli]

I'd really like to think that SDNetters would not tolerate Rape, nor stoop to it.

I don't think it's too implausible that a group of several thousand people is going to just randomly contain a couple of scumbags. That said, I rather suspect that realistically in a situation like this even the sort of people inclined to that sort of thing are probably going to be more concerned with surviving/getting out of the situation than randomly indulging their dark impulses. I'd be much more worried about people acting like Kurtz from Heart of Darkness later on. A situation like this makes the idea of indulging that sort of power fantasy all too feasible. It's also something that would be easier for people to fall into, because it better lends itself to rationalization ("I'm just doing what it takes to survive!" and the like).

[Academia Nut]

In this, any rapists on the first day would more likely be motivated by near suicidal despair than Kurtzian survivalist power trips. These would be the 'nothing matters anymore' assholes. The real sociopathic assholes who are dangerous won't start cropping up until well after the shit has hit the fan and they can grow like fungus. Much more dangerous would be the trading of sexual favours for protection or food, or the equally disruptive tactic of a woman getting herself pregnant to ensnare the protection of a man, and in this situation the entire community as well. Hopefully we're not stupid enough to do shit like that, but it doesn't require conscious decisions to start acting selfishly when the primary motivation is fear. It will require constant, conscious vigilance of our behaviour to keep from sliding into the older, less equitable forms of behaviour practiced by our ancestors.

[Simon_Jester]

Also, the massive gender imbalance would do screwy, screwy things. A mass exodus to some friendlier climate with an existing Bronze Age society seems likely; there's no way that the SD.net forum population has the skill set required to stay alive on an island in the North Atlantic.

[Junghalli]

SM Sterling (the author of the Island In The Sea of Time books) is a member on SDN, or at least he used to be. I wonder how he's reacting to this.

[Ford Prefect]

SM Sterling (the author of the Island In The Sea of Time books) is a member on SDN, or at least he used to be. I wonder how he's reacting to this.

He probably doesn't check the board much, if at all. However, given the some members' previous work with the Draka, his reaction could have been quite interesting.

[Academia Nut]

That gives me the hilarious picture of Stirling waking up on the island, looking about him and the situation, realizing what is going on and crying out Vader style "Noooooooooo!"

Definitely something not to be included in any actual stories, but an amusing thought nonetheless.

[Junghalli]

He probably doesn't check the board much, if at all. However, given the some members' previous work with the Draka, his reaction could have been quite interesting.

I meant how he'd be reacting in this scenario.

[MarshalPurnell]

Stirling came over to the Divine Salamis forum to comment at length on Drakafic and was very cool about. Got into an argument over aircraft design with Stuart and praised Norseman for his work on it. While he was over there he commented briefly on Marina's take on ISOT, the "Shang scenario" and seemed interested in it. This is even more focused on board culture though so it may not make as much sense once divorced from the SD.net context.

[Simon_Jester]

Do you have a link to those comments on Drakafic? I would very much like to see them.

[Mayabird]

Unfortunately Divine Salamis is gone and it's unlikely to be back...well, maybe not ever, but definitely not for a long time. Marina might have backup logs on one of her computers somewhere, but it'd be a serious hassle to get them transferred to some sort of usable form.

[Simon_Jester]

Crap. I would really have liked to find out what he thought of the setting.

I love it to pieces, partly because it's a vastly more realistic treatment of the Drakas, and partly because the Drakas make such good unsympathetic villains. They go to incredible lengths to strip out everything admirable, everything human about themselves.

They sort of remind me of the "New Gods" from the Belisarius series, if you've read that.

[JonB]

although by statistics we probably got a couple of sociopathic nutbars

o_O Do I have to be worried about this?

[Simon_Jester]

More so than everyone else? I don't see why you would.

I mean, for crying out loud, the percentage of deranged nutbars in the population is on the order of 1%, at least; surely in a forum invented in large part for the purpose of argument, with nearly four thousand members, you're going to see a respectable sized population of them.

Add to that another good-sized chunk who are largely sane and functional in normal society but start getting wacky in extreme conditions (and "we're stranded in prehistory with a three to one male-female ratio" is pretty damn extreme), and everyone should be worried.

[Simon_Jester]

The advantage would tend to be offset by the fact that we'd be going up against wiry little bastards who have been practicing hand to hand combat all their lives. Also, there seems to be a shortage of authority figures capable of organizing effective formation fighters; sort of a cross between "too many chiefs" and not nearly enough. But that's just me reading between the lines.

[Rogue 9]

There are those of us who know a thing or two about formation fighting; the question is whether or not anyone would listen.

[GrandMasterTerwynn]

The advantage would tend to be offset by the fact that we'd be going up against wiry little bastards who have been practicing hand to hand combat all their lives. Also, there seems to be a shortage of authority figures capable of organizing effective formation fighters; sort of a cross between "too many chiefs" and not nearly enough. But that's just me reading between the lines.

And they are, individually, vastly more fit than we are. We're a product of a civilization which doesn't make us really work for our calories, and a significant majority of people our modern medical technology allows to live would've died in childhood in a neolithic society.

And I imagine that those on the board who know about formation fighting are back on the island drilling a select number of those who don't. But the stories you've seen so far haven't really focused on that aspect of SD-Nantucket's life, or on people with that particular skill-set during a time when they could put that skill-set to use.

[Simon_Jester]

There are those of us who know a thing or two about formation fighting; the question is whether or not anyone would listen.

Exactly my point. Remember my reference to "too many chiefs." Populating an island with the membership of a self-consciously raucous debating society is not good for internal discipline.

The advantage would tend to be offset by the fact that we'd be going up against wiry little bastards who have been practicing hand to hand combat all their lives. Also, there seems to be a shortage of authority figures capable of organizing effective formation fighters; sort of a cross between "too many chiefs" and not nearly enough. But that's just me reading between the lines.

And they are, individually, vastly more fit than we are. We're a product of a civilization which doesn't make us really work for our calories, and a significant majority of people our modern medical technology allows to live would've died in childhood in a neolithic society.

I wonder about that; the infant mortality rate wasn't 50% back then, was it?

[Justyn]

There are those of us who know a thing or two about formation fighting; the question is whether or not anyone would listen.

Exactly my point. Remember my reference to "too many chiefs." Populating an island with the membership of a self-consciously raucous debating society is not good for internal discipline.

The advantage would tend to be offset by the fact that we'd be going up against wiry little bastards who have been practicing hand to hand combat all their lives. Also, there seems to be a shortage of authority figures capable of organizing effective formation fighters; sort of a cross between "too many chiefs" and not nearly enough. But that's just me reading between the lines.

And they are, individually, vastly more fit than we are. We're a product of a civilization which doesn't make us really work for our calories, and a significant majority of people our modern medical technology allows to live would've died in childhood in a neolithic society.

I wonder about that; the infant mortality rate wasn't 50% back then, was it?

Wikipedia says it was about 20% for infant mortality, and 30% for childhood mortality. I'd say one in five to one in three is significant, but not a majority. But the information on Wikipedia doesn't seem to be sourced, so take that with a couple grains of salt.