SGU 108: "Time" (Spoilers)

[NecronLord]

Discussion for this episode of Stargate Universe

[Agent Fisher]

I thought it was outstanding. Great horror aspect with the creatures attacking at night.

[Slacker]

Fantastic. They're also keeping with the theme of 'incorporate elements of previous stargate episodes to tie the new show in'. I guess we can safely assume that this time they took care of the situation promptly.

And have now replenished their supply of antibiotics.

[CaptJodan]

A pretty decent episode all around. Had character moments, but also had something happen. I'm not fond of the reset button aspect of it, but it continued to borrow from elements of previous stargate rather than doing something really odd with time (ST has a new time traveling ability every week). Eli was his usual self, but I still don't find him as annoying as others here do, and for the first time, Chloe showed that she was trying to be useful. I also like that we didn't have to see it all go according plan, they just cut to the end, knowing we'd know they figured it out.

It eeks out a 4.

[AMT]

Spoiler

Very enjoyable episode. Also liked the ending how it sort of seemed to give a bit of open ended-ness to it.

It's kinda amusing seeing how some other boards are mindlessly bashing it. I lurk over at Spoiler

Televisionwithoutpity

and they are just... really nothing but haters regarding this show. And willfully ignorant of it.

[Rommie2006]

Hmm an improvement this week. Not bad. Is it a two parter? Next week's episode doesn't seem to be related. So I guess we can assume nobody dies?

[CorSec]

I've been catching up on old seasons of SG1. I've made it through season 5. I am entirely pleased that it looks like the writers for SGU have done the same thing. They are wonderfully consistent with what has happened before with regards to what can be done with the gate.

I was left staring at the screen, ready to shout "What the fuck was that ending!?" when it dawned on me that it was a clever way to end the episode. They had already taken us through the thought processes and drama and seeing another recursion of it wasn't necessary.

I'm still waiting for an episode that will make me stand up and say "Yes! That is why I'm watching this show." This episode was as close as the series has gotten so far. I'm not disliking the series (yet) and in my opinion it hasn't had an episode below a 3 (yet) either. It's good, I have some problems with it but nothing big enough to chase me away.

[JME2]

Excellent episode and characterization for Eli, TJ, and even Rush to a degree. I liked the twist that the disease had been picked up from "Water". This is a level of serialization that SG has only tried on a small scale and as a fan of serialized storytelling, it's really adding to my enjoyment of the third series. The acknowledgment of ascension was fine (still hope it doesn't dominate SGU like the other series) and the re-use of the solar flare problem was also nice. Not SG's best time travel episode, of course, but a darn good episode.

5/5

[Xon]

I'm putting a bet down that the Destiny is the sucker behind the crew always been given the required tools just in time to solve thier problems before things go utterly crazy.

Perhaps something like a tactical use of Time Travel for the ship's computer so the Destiny is always in the right spot for the crew to survive properly.

[White Haven]

Contriver, superconvenient solution to a problem, time travel (always the wrong answer, writers please take note), recursive time travel twist visible coming from a mile away. 2/5, worse episode to date.

[Zac Naloen]

By far the best episode to date.

Best Shot, Best Acted, Best Character moments, Best character development.

The use of Time Travel is not an automatic "you suck" for me and as long as it done well and consistently with previous interpretations. I frankly couldn't give a shit about it being used in this episode, it was as decent a decent vehicle for this story as anything.

[Turin]

For someone like me who didn't watch SG-1 much at all, and only saw one or two episodes of SGA, was this a wholly lifted plot or was it a new twist on a theme they've visited before? Are these kinds of "concept-heavy" episodes common for Stargate? Because it really worked for me in a way that they haven't in other series. Some of the character development scenes were a little heavy-handed, but I liked the POV shooting and the acting was pretty good. The way it ended brought a smile to my face -- the show didn't insult our intelligence by going through the loop again.

[Bounty]

Contriver, superconvenient solution to a problem, time travel (always the wrong answer, writers please take note), recursive time travel twist visible coming from a mile away. 2/5, worse episode to date.

You are a fucking moron. Also, it's "worst".

---

Terrific episode, and one with the best opening chapter I've seen in a very long time. Yes, it's a time loop plot, but it's done a fascinating way - it reminded me of TNG's Time Squared, but handled with a far more menacing atmosphere. Good stuff.

[CaptJodan]

the show didn't insult our intelligence by going through the loop again.

That's really one of the things I actually liked about the episode. When Lt. Nipples (James) died, I figured "wow, another semi-regular character death". When Chloe died, I knew they were going around in time again. But I was so glad they didn't feel the need to show it, but just show that they'd have the tools now to properly fix the problem.

I thought one of the more telling moments in this episode character wise was Rush's conversation about death with Eli. It sounds to me like Rush might be in this thing so that he can get whoever was in that picture (his wife, presumably?) back somehow. I don't know how he figures ascension will do that, but I don't think he's necessarily in it for his own ascension. We also get why Rush thinks Destiny is as important as the discovery of the Stargates themselves (though how he arrived at that conclusion is beyond me. Atlantis has a hell of a lot more information, not to mention a acendo-machine, handy).

[Andrew_Fireborn]

Pretty good. A few scenes still felt a little redundant, but there was some clever cuts, and the ending (as has been said) had the good grace not to even start the "final" time loop.
[Though, the only scene I can really point to as redundant was the medic crying in the hall, especially as that little sympathy bonding won't be reflected in the iteration the show will be carrying forward with.]

It also redeemed that character for me, while growing the rest of the cast in a fair way. Hopefully some of this growth will be reflected in the future, though a lot of it might not have good ways to crop up again...


I was wondering if they'd hit the reset up until the away team got eaten, then it was obvious. Even if they wanted to have a hard hitting series of deaths, the majority of the fleshed out cast isn't going to die. [Though Cloe's death might have actually brought some character development...]

[White Haven]

Alright, so sue me, I was half-asleep making that post. Even if you accept the time travel aspect as non-cringe-inducing, however, the venom curing the imported disease felt extremely forced to me. The rest of the scientific solutions have more or less made sense, but since when is 'hurl incompatible biologies together and hope' anything approaching good writing or good science?

I won't disagree that the character portions of the episode were good, but they were good in spite of the situation, not because of it.

[Zac Naloen]

With regards to the disease, I dunno how realistic this is but it makes sense in my brain and for fictional purposes : -


Creature lives in water. People are mostly water. The debilitating effects = critical mass or lifeform living in warm conditions and reproducing rapidbly, collecting around spinal column and brain stem so resembling symptoms of viral menigitus. Death ensues.


With regards to the venom, addition of any compound found in the venom = likes the human nervous system = Coma = organisms die and break down in the body = Recovery.

[Alyeska]

Alright, so sue me, I was half-asleep making that post. Even if you accept the time travel aspect as non-cringe-inducing, however, the venom curing the imported disease felt extremely forced to me. The rest of the scientific solutions have more or less made sense, but since when is 'hurl incompatible biologies together and hope' anything approaching good writing or good science?

I won't disagree that the character portions of the episode were good, but they were good in spite of the situation, not because of it.

Did you go to the Back to the Future movies and throw popcorn at the screen? Did you think Groundhog Day was a shitty movie? How about the SG1 episode Window of Opportunity?

Time travel does not automatically make an episode bad. Its all about the story telling and how they weave it together.

Yes, its convenient. Then again, half of story telling have convenient movements all the fucking time. You accuse it of being bad science, but ignore the fact that we study such venoms right not for their possible attributes.

You want to hate the episode and so your making up idiotic reasons to hate it.

[[R_H]]

This was my favourite episode so far. I was surprised that the diease (sp) was from the ice planet. 5/5

[Oskuro]

Reset-button episodes I tend to dislike because they undo all the character growth that takes place in them, but it might have been the writers' intention all along, to provide exposition about the background of some of the characters without actually revealing it to the other characters, just the audience.

And they got to please Chloe haters by killing her. Twice.

Nice episode in general, but I'm also of the opinion that the series still needs to define itself, so far it almost feels like an extended pilot.

[Bounty]

Nice episode in general, but I'm also of the opinion that the series still needs to define itself, so far it almost feels like an extended pilot.

How so?

[Themightytom]

Contriver, superconvenient solution to a problem, time travel (always the wrong answer, writers please take note), recursive time travel twist visible coming from a mile away. 2/5, worse episode to date.

Swing and a miss White haven, you're still focusing on story mechanics and not character developement.

This was an outstanding story of SGn00bs seeing themselves die, their reaction to it, and how it affected their new perspective on death as they continued to face it. Chloe's reaction to watching herself die? Awesome. Greer's irritation with "himself" for letting people die on whis watch, illuminating. Colonel Everett tried his damnedest to make the second mission go right. Scott's reaction to waking up in a cave full of dead bodies? JESUS FUCKING CHRIST EVEN RUSH GETS CHARACTER DEVELOPEMENT WITH HIS SUNDANCE MOMENT.

These forshadow characters we are still getting to know. Yes these are AU characters, but they are ONE DAY apart from ours. The developement we saw in AU 1 and AU2 is still developement int erms of OUR understanding if not theres. If the Keno Scott threw actually recorded MORE, say the events leading UP to the discovery of the AU Keno, and it should have, considering it was omnipresent... the team next week will reflect the developement of BOTH previous teams.

This was not the wrong answer it was a brilliant one for the shows purposes. Time Travel exists in the SGverse. The writers took a tool and found a new way to use it.

This was not writing anything out of a corner, as they established in this episode that there was a microbe in the water, and could have easily dispensed with that angle in order to settle for a run of the mill "Oh Noes, we went to a jungle planet and creatures attack!" story.

This was a very strong episode for the show, possibly the best to date. You hardly noticed the time travel gimmick, as opposed to the other gimmicks, like the ancient communication body swapping, unpredictable AI or COMPLETELY contrived hole in the ice.

[Starglider]

Solid writing, characterisation, acting etc. Good use of the set and an interesting look that isn't a standard grimdark shakeycam. Manages to feel genuinely threatening. Suffers slightly from unoriginality and the fact that once you realise it's time travel, you know they're going to use it to reset button, but still the best episode to date. 4/5.

[NecronLord]

Alright, so sue me, I was half-asleep making that post. Even if you accept the time travel aspect as non-cringe-inducing, however, the venom curing the imported disease felt extremely forced to me. The rest of the scientific solutions have more or less made sense, but since when is 'hurl incompatible biologies together and hope' anything approaching good writing or good science?

I won't disagree that the character portions of the episode were good, but they were good in spite of the situation, not because of it.

Presumably the injected venom includes a potent antibiotic intended to disable whatever this thing's natural prey depend on. If its normal prey depend on symbiotic bacteria, this would be very effective and plausible.

And a broad spectrum antibiotic affecting alien microorganisms isn't that inplausible, in my estimation. Provided the cells of the infection grow in the same ways (and there can realistically only be so many ways to make a cell wall with human-compatible chemicals) something like the penicillins would affect them.

Of course, I'm not a microbiologist, but that makes sense to my limited understanding. It's not spelt out in the show, but then, they don't have a microbiologist on the ship, either. All they knew, is that empirically it worked, which is of course, a very good way to learn.

[Revy]

Loved it. I'll be honest, I've not been that happy with this show, I'm a fan of the previous two SG series and still loved watching them even when everyone else was getting tired and fed up with them. Fine, to each their own, but I still liked them. SGU I've been on the bar with though.

However this was excellent. 5/5 as far as I'm concerned, my favourite episode so far. I only have two little niggles.

1. Okay so in the first timeline, Rush risks going through the gate. Later, Scott wakes up from his coma, finds everyone dead and then sends the kino through to find out if it's safe to go through the gate himself. The kino gets sent back in time, where the second timeline team find it.

So, question: If the kino Scott sent through turned up for 2nd Timeline team to find, where the hell was Rush? Rush went through first, so why wasn't he there when the 2nd timers showed up on the planet? They found the kino that came through, but what happened to Rush? If he died going through the gate why wasn't his body there for them to find? If he survived, why didn't they bump into him and have him explain everything? What, did he just vanish into thin air?

2. Scott. Hmm. Okay, maybe I'm just reading too much into this, but it kinda bugged me a little that he alone survives when all around him people are dying. I mean on the sand planet, he nearly dies but gets help from an alien bug cloud and survives. On ice planet, he falls into a hole but again lives for another day. I know what you'll say - character shield. He's in the main cast, so of course he won't die.

But the thing with time-loop stories like these is that there are *no* character shields. Because time travel is an easy-use reset button, writers can kill anyone and everyone and still have them all alive again for the next episode. And it showed, with the 1st timers getting slaughtered (all save Scott, who by amazing piece of luck doesn't get chest-bursted like everyone else attacked, and also wakes up cured of his terminal illness). And then as part of the 2nd team, everyone else is killed within seconds, and he is left standing around, very much alive.

My point is that even when the character shields are off, Scott alone survives when everyone else is being slaughtered left right and center. Add that to his other escapes from death, and I'm getting just a really tiny bit worried that maybe later in the series they might try to put his own personal character shield down to God or something. Hell, if it weren't for him surviving in both timelines, the Destiny crew would be screwed. After all if he didn't survive his attack in the first timeline, they wouldn't have learned about the venom curing the illness. And if he didn't survive the second timeline then the (I'm guessing current) Destiny crew wouldn't have got his recording and saved themselves from certain death.

It's not a big deal (I know it sounds like I'm making a big deal out of it), but it just bugs me that it had to be Scott of all people who would consistently maintain his character shield while everyone elses had failed, and save everyone as a result. Couldn't it have been Greer to survive the 2nd playthrough, and make that message to save everyone?

I'll be fine if it was just luck/plot armour or whatever, and just a coincidence that it was Scott who kept surviving. Just so long as that's all it is.