Dragon Age is out

[Stofsk]

Forumlas are formulas for a reason: people love them. Hey, Alistair is alright. I haven't noticed him whine, but I concede I've only completed Ostagar and am at Lothering.

That said, I'd love to see a story more in line with Baldur's Gate "Find out what's going on/solve the mystery/discover who the Bad Guy really is and what his motivations are" in any sequel. Although, apparently you can make your own campaigns? There's some sort of toolset or something I think.

[weemadando]

Alistair is whiny to some people? I'm loving his sarcasm. The back and forth between him and Morrigan and him and pooch are fantastic.

[charlemagne]

Alistair is whiny to some people? I'm loving his sarcasm. The back and forth between him and Morrigan and him and pooch are fantastic.

I'm just at "that point" right now with him complaining about Spoiler

being a prince

and right after that Spoiler

we visited his sister

so he probably just got on my nerves yesterday

[Manus Celer Dei]

Alistair's sort of alright most of the game, but near the end he just turns into a complete shithead.
Spoiler

"Wah wah wah I don't want to be king. But we can't trust the queen. Arranged marriage-of-convenience to strengthen our claim to the throne? No, I'm going bitch endlessly about that as well, because no possible course of action will please me."

"Wait, you want to spare Loghain because he could still be useful and we need all the help we can get? NO THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE I COMMAND YOU TO MURDER HIM OR I'LL LEAVE FOREVER."

I don't know. Maybe it's just because it's incredibly jarring to have Loghain's heartfelt and pretty sad goodbye to his daughter immediately followed by Alistair screaming bloody murder and demanding you kill him, but I told Al to take a hike. Wanker.

[Mr. Tickle]

Over-all very impressed with the game, enjoying it hugely. Running at about 50 hours playtime which I haven't done in a single player in a loong time.

Slight complaints however in certain aspects. Some of the bigger quests (esp at the Dwarf city) did turn into a bit of a grind clearing each room as you went along, got a bit repetative. Although the end of it did make up for it.

The drops aren't hugely impressive, although I do accept more items would make the inventory management more tedious (ala Mass Efffect) but some better weapons would be nice.

The biggest thing I'm wondering is what we might learn about Mass Effect 2 from this. Certainly the good/evil thing has been nicely done without it being thrust in your face and the morality of certain choices is kept very nicely grey rather than a clear black/white. Presumely ME2 will have a similar tactics system and the menus setup might also be very comparable, personnally I found flicking around very easy on the controller.

To be honest if they have gone at ME2 in similar way in developing this then I think it bodes very nicely for next year.

[wautd]

I just started playing as human warrior. Good first impression on this game. It doesn't has the same "solve the mystery"-vibe going on like back with the ol' Baldurs Gate and it even feels a bit predictable at times. Spoiler

like the betrayal in the castle at the beginning - comon, the guy sounded evil therefore he's evil and 5 bucks says the king's army is about to get its royal ass kicked by this darkspawn

But it made me curious enough to keep exploring and that's what matters. Oh, and 6 different starting points = nice

I wonder if it's actually possible to refuse to become a Grey Warden at the beginning of the game. I guess not but I havn't tried

edit: a friend got the collector's edition which looked really nice. What with the map on a bloody piece of cloth and all

[Vendetta]

Spoiler

like the betrayal in the castle at the beginning - comon, the guy sounded evil therefore he's evil and 5 bucks says the king's army is about to get its royal ass kicked by this darkspawn

Spoiler

Quite frankly, if he couldn't tell that Logaine was the most obvious traitor since Wash's plastic T-Rex, Cailan deserved to get his ass kicked. That's the trouble with royalty, inbreeding makes for poor quality control.

[AniThyng]

Has anyone noticed that set bonuses seem to disappear after some time? I seem to have to take the armour off and reequip it..

[GuppyShark]

Oh man, but am I getting sick of the mages.
Spoiler

Yeah, we get it. You don't like being watched by the Templars. Guess what? You, at any minute, can turn into a demon. You keep proving it to us every time an apostate fails to keep themselves in check. The Chantry didn't make you walking time bombs, stop acting like they did, stop dicking around with blood magic and stop putting the world in danger just because you have Daddy issues.

At first I was a little sour on the combat but with a full party and more abilities it gets a bit more interesting. I'm really enjoying this and I look forward to seeing what alternative solutions there are to problems on additional playthroughs.

Anyone know if there will ever be a multiplayer version? I was part of a really amazing Neverwinter Nights persistent world many years ago and it would be great if it could be brought back to life with this game.

[charlemagne]

Has anyone noticed that set bonuses seem to disappear after some time? I seem to have to take the armour off and reequip it..

Yeah, also, some group buffs disappear when zoning and have to be re-cast. Minor annoyance, this is.

Oh yeah, "Arcane Warrior" is quite awesome. Both Morrigan and Wynne are stomping around in heavy or plate armor by now, and I enjoy them joining the fight wacking things with swords and axes, however unpractical it is I still do carry staffs for them, so that during boss fights they won't run around trying to step into every aoe spell. But it's funny seeing them as covered in blood as my rogue main during conversations

[White Haven]

Something of a catch 22 there, Guppy.
Spoiler

There's at least one blood mage that I'm aware of who turned to blood magic because the Chantry makes the Circle mindwipe any mages who aren't 'strong enough,' and he was afraid they'd do it to him, so he went looking for another source of power. Then there's an entire faction of magi who want to gather more power at more or less any cost to fuck the Chantry and the Templars in the ear and go off on their own way. That entire group loses its motivation if the Inquisi--Templars weren't such shitpieces. Sorta...fear leading to the dark side, no?

[charlemagne]

I just finished the game. The scale is, as mentioned, much grander than you'd think. I'm also very happy that railroading is kept to a minimum - something I especially hated in KOTOR.

I played a Human Noble Rogue, sticking to good options throughout the game. I have to say that this was a satisfying ending. The screens detailing what happened in various regions and even picking up on some minor side quests - that was really great.

And now, on to my elvish mage, who will turn out to be quite ruthless and bloodthirsty

[GuppyShark]

Something of a catch 22 there, Guppy.
Spoiler

There's at least one blood mage that I'm aware of who turned to blood magic because the Chantry makes the Circle mindwipe any mages who aren't 'strong enough,' and he was afraid they'd do it to him, so he went looking for another source of power. Then there's an entire faction of magi who want to gather more power at more or less any cost to fuck the Chantry and the Templars in the ear and go off on their own way. That entire group loses its motivation if the Inquisi--Templars weren't such shitpieces. Sorta...fear leading to the dark side, no?

Spoiler

Except that we know where it began. This same hubris (that the mages do not need oversight) was what led to the darkspawn threat in the first place. The magi of Ferelden were practicing human sacrifice and tyranny before the Chantry even existed. In fact the Chantry arose because of the mage lords.

Many people would still be alive if Jowan had been made Tranquil. He would not have been able to poison the Arl, nor been in a position to fail to tutor Connor with such catastrophic results. It would probably have been best if he had been permitted instead to risk the Harrowing but it is clear that he probably would have just become an abomination on the spot and possibly killed a bunch of templars in the process.

What do you do with somebody who is doomed to harm others?

It sucks, I don't argue that, but the Templars aren't the cause. Even Wynne set another kid on fire as a child before the Templars found her. Taking the Templars away wouldn't make mages safe. They'd find some other flimsy excuse to act like a bunch of entitled brats.

Oh, and additionally, I haven't actually come across any Templars who were pricks. There was one Templar in Lothering that was suspicious of Morrigan. That's it. Every other Templar I've almost been able to forget they're the dreaded Templars because they keep going on about protecting the weak and other such chivalrous things.

Thankyou for making the counter argument, it's nice to see this game has enough philisophical meat to it that we can actually have some discussion on it.

[White Haven]

Spoiler

Aaah, but then you have to ask yourself if Jowan would have turned to blood magic if he hadn't been under the threat of personality-death for not being a strong enough mage. in the first place.

As for asshat Templars, how about the one redhead whose name escapes me, from the Tower. Y'know, the one who absolutely insisted that you murder the entire surviving Circle, just to be sure, and is furious with you if you don't.

The Templars are a walking, talking, plate-armored black/white fallacy. Mages need some form of oversight, so the only solution is to to stick an order of warriors with the power of summary execution to breathe down their necks and then force the Mages themselves to mindrape anyone who they even suspect won't be a strong enough mage.

Also, how many of those so-called 'Malefica' are actually blood mages, and how many are just mages who want nothing to do with the Circle or the Chantry (not an unreasonable viewpoint, given the actions of both)? Morrigan's not a blood mage, nor apparently an abomination, but she's certainly a Malefica as far as establishment is concerned. Her only 'crime' is to be an independent. In fact, she's only not a blood mage because of her own will, she's already under a sentence of death for existing in the first place, so why shouldn't she turn to blood magic, she can't be in more trouble with the law than she already is. Jowan was faced with the same choice, be soulwiped or reach for any power he can to try to avoid it. Flemeth is no peaceful monk, but neither is she rampaging around the countryside raping and pillaging. As near as I can tell, the lion's share of the deaths she's caused are either templars come to kill her, for which I'd cheer her on, or her own daughters, which is admittedly fucked up, but not a problem to anyone but her own progeny.

Let's say you're deathly afraid of knives. You put a religious zealot from an order sworn to the eradication of knives in every household containing a knife, with orders to execute anyone using a knife outside of the kitchen, and for some uses in the kitchen itself. Anyone you suspect might attempt to take a knife outside the kitchen in the future, you murder and replace with an emotionless drone. After all that, you've forfeited the right to act surprised and offended when one of these knife-wielders stabs one of your fanatics to death.

[Xon]

Spoiler

The redhead in the tower just wittnessed every one he knew inside the Tower get twisted into a mockery of themselves devoted to serving actual demons

He may, just may, be traumatized

[White Haven]

Spoiler

The redhead in the tower just wittnessed every one he knew inside the Tower get twisted into a mockery of themselves devoted to serving actual demons

He may, just may, be traumatized

Spoiler

And he reacted exactly as he'd been trained to. When in doubt, kill everyone.

[White Haven]

Edit: Added some stuff while you were posting, Xon. Check the spoiler box again. It has grown.

[Imperial Overlord]

Spoiler

The Dale elves aren't giving up their mages to the Circle and we're not seeing any rampaging elvish abominations in those forests. The Mages Collective are apostates and they purge maleficars aggressively. And its not like the Chantry only has a hard on to control mages. They turn their templars into junkies to control them, which is part of what allows the Mage Collective to escape them because they're literally buying the bastards off with smack. Sure magic is dangerous and needs to be controlled, but the Circle conveniently keeps the mages isolated, totally under the Chantry's thumb, and justifies the existence of a order of warrior addicts who act as Chantry enforcers.

As for the origin of the darkspawn, I'm taking that with a giant pinch of salt. That's the version according the Chantry and they have plenty of motive to stick the blame on mages from an empire that practiced a different religion.

[wautd]

The witch of the wild sounds suspiciously like captain Janeway

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Because it is. Kate Mulgrew does Flemeth.

Also, Morrigan is Claudia Black.

[GuppyShark]

Spoiler

Yes, the Dalish mages aren't rampaging around becoming abominations because they are being trained to deal with their gifts. I wonder what methods they use to achieve this. I've only just reached the Dalish elves in my campaign so I have not actually met any of their casters yet.

I seriously doubt Flemeth would have the reputation she has if she had not been a killer at some point - but that's not really relevant since she is clearly not an abomination. She has the knowledge and will to control her magic, and she has passed that onto Morrigan. That there are Apostates who have managed stability is not in question. The problem are mages too weak to accomplish this on their own, or in Jowan's case, even with assistance.

Hrmm, maybe Jowan would have succeeded at a Harrowing, but Tranquility was chosen instead as they wanted to eliminate his fraternisation with the priest without making it public? Politically motivated instead of magical necessity.

How does the Mage's Collective operate (other than as a quest giver)? Do they train young mages in their abilities or is it purely for runaway Circle mages and hedge mages?

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Spoiler

Flemeth is an abomination of sorts, actually, at least according to Morrigan and her research. She's a particularly powerful one and has managed to control the Fade-demon or at least co-exist with it to some degree.

[Imperial Overlord]

Mage's Collective
Spoiler

They have apprentices and police their own ranks. At one point you can find the remains of a wizard who tried and failed to stop his apprentice who got possessed.

[wautd]

Dragon Age is actually quite awesome at the characters saying what they think is the truth and not having a direct pipeline to the truth.

And fuck the game is hard even on easy. Or at least, doing Redcliffe first even on easy is - those fucking Drakes in the mountain! Unbelievable! Insane!

Did anyone manage to save Murdock, the Mayor, in the battle near the beginning of the quest line?

I'm playin on normal and just got this part. Fuck Murdock, I can't even save my own party. Those zmobies just keep coming ad infinitum (or so it seems)

[Ghost Rider]

Dragon Age is actually quite awesome at the characters saying what they think is the truth and not having a direct pipeline to the truth.

And fuck the game is hard even on easy. Or at least, doing Redcliffe first even on easy is - those fucking Drakes in the mountain! Unbelievable! Insane!

Did anyone manage to save Murdock, the Mayor, in the battle near the beginning of the quest line?

I'm playin on normal and just got this part. Fuck Murdock, I can't even save my own party. Those zmobies just keep coming ad infinitum (or so it seems)

Depends on party and did you do at least the flames and extra people. The dwarf and company helps as extra bodies and so does the elf. The flames don't do much but it's damage.

So far the only fights that have been really bad are
Spoiler

Flemeth, and the Arch Demon. And Flemeth for me was worse because of how low my level was. The Arch Demon was hard because of his huge amount of crap to wade through to get to him. Though having a decent armies is fun times.

I will give this much, the game needs MORE MONEY. I can deal with levels becoming absurdly hard to get because after a point you can obliterate anything...but buying that shiny necklace? Better save your pennies...