Moderators: Alyrium Denryle, Edi, K. A. Pital
The most prominent to my eye is the last, red background and white letters.A Citizen's Guide For Revolution Of A Corrupt Government.
1. Starve The Beast, Keep Your Money.
2. Vote Incumbunts Out Of Office.
3. If Steps 1 and 2 fail?
PREPARE FOR WAR - LIVE FREE OR DIE.
They also have several things going for them, among other things a culture encouraging basic gun training, modern infrastructure and technology that is trivial to procure, and free education. Biding their time while building up for an insurgency, they could be a credible threat... if only the prospect of it actually happening across the board was itself plausible.General Schatten wrote:I find it both amusing and worrying. On the one hand if they do revolt the damned idiots don't seem to realize that they're up against a mechanized Army equipped with vehicles that can resist 12.7mm fire in many cases and they don't have the countless decades of insurgent fighting that 'them damn dirty moozlims' have, on the other I would hate to see fellow Americans' blood shed by Americans.
Well, if it got to that, I doubt I'd see what are, essentially, a band of neo-Confederates as "fellow Americans".General Schatten wrote:...on the other I would hate to see fellow Americans' blood shed by Americans.
Two problems: One, the largest caliber you'll probably find in any major quantity is going to be the .50 BMG, which is going to do very little against a Stryker or Bradley. Two, the majority of these idiots have very little experience with actual assault rifles, instead bolt-action which unless they decide to be ignorant and try and fight a pitched battle is going to have very limited use in an urban environment.Eleas wrote:They also have several things going for them, among other things a culture encouraging basic gun training,
Like what? I mean yes, you do have a lot of items that can be used for making things like IEDs, but unless it's one of the really crazy survivalist nuts, they aren't going to have knowledge of making explosives.modern infrastructure and technology that is trivial to procure
Again, the education American's recieve is for making them effective members of society, very few turn out to be gunsmiths or chemists of any type.and free education.
How would building up for the insurgency help? American's don't have access to unexploded 155mm and mortar shells so no real big IED's and the best you can do is stock up on bulk orders of .308 Winchester or pipe bombs.Biding their time while building up for an insurgency, they could be a credible threat... if only the prospect of it actually happening across the board was itself plausible.
This is where my ignorance of gun ownership comes into play. I was under the impression it was fairly simple to modify a hunting rifle like the AR-15 to make it essentially a full-grade military assault rifle; I furthermore have been inundated with youtube videos of what's colloquially known as 'gun nuts' gleefully firing semiautomatics, which probably isn't at all a representative sample. So I'll defer to you on that one if I must.Two problems: One, the largest caliber you'll probably find in any major quantity is going to be the .50 BMG, which is going to do very little against a Stryker or Bradley. Two, the majority of these idiots have very little experience with actual assault rifles, instead bolt-action which unless they decide to be ignorant and try and fight a pitched battle is going to have very limited use in an urban environment.
You seem to approach this from a strangely small-scale perspective. An effective insurgency or enemy force would be large, and organised, to present any sort of threat; it wouldn't be down to individuals of exceptional skill, but to the total pool of people. According to the OP, we were talking about a not-insignificant part of the country.Like what? I mean yes, you do have a lot of items that can be used for making things like IEDs, but unless it's one of the really crazy survivalist nuts, they aren't going to have knowledge of making explosives.modern infrastructure and technology that is trivial to procure
An insurgency does not need a surfeit of gunsmiths or chemists. What it would need is a broad range of skills and knowledge of diverse topics. Or, in other words, education.Again, the education American's recieve is for making them effective members of society, very few turn out to be gunsmiths or chemists of any type.
I'm sure Timothy McVeigh must have felt much the same way.How would building up for the insurgency help? American's don't have access to unexploded 155mm and mortar shells so no real big IED's and the best you can do is stock up on bulk orders of .308 Winchester or pipe bombs.
It used to be that with some effort, a semi-auto gun could be turned into full-auto, but no longer. They are now made in such a way that it would take a great deal of highly specialized gunsmithing and machine work to do it, to the point where it'd be easier and cheaper to go out and steal a real one. Because even if they could get the trigger assembly to fire full-auto, it'd be stuck forever on full-auto, and within a few hundred rounds the barrel would be ruined. To the point where it is unsafe to fire, in fact, and more dangerous to the user than a target.Eleas wrote:This is where my ignorance of gun ownership comes into play. I was under the impression it was fairly simple to modify a hunting rifle like the AR-15 to make it essentially a full-grade military assault rifle; I furthermore have been inundated with youtube videos of what's colloquially known as 'gun nuts' gleefully firing semiautomatics, which probably isn't at all a representative sample.
I had suspected it, hence my caveat. "Look at this awesome thing I did once" seems part and parcel on YouTube, so I didn't really think it would be representative of how things are done. And yes, I don't doubt a lack of burst capability would be a drawback when it comes to room clearing.Coyote wrote:Beware what you see on YouTube; and remember that "semi" auto means one-shot-at-a-time; and "full" auto means rat-a-tat-tat, like a machinegun. It is possible to squeeze the trigger of a semi-auto very quickly so it might appear to be full-auto, but you will not be very accurate if you do that because each squeeze of the trigger, at that speed, is going to affect aim.
And I'm saying that an effective insurgency isn't possible in the United States, the first people to openly revolt are going to be your survivalist gun nuts who do know how to make IEDs and they'll be the first ones killed, effectively limiting the skill sets available to be trained to homegrown insurgents. This is not like the Middle East where people have had decades to dig in, rally support, and research the methods they use.Eleas wrote:You seem to approach this from a strangely small-scale perspective. An effective insurgency or enemy force would be large, and organised, to present any sort of threat; it wouldn't be down to individuals of exceptional skill, but to the total pool of people. According to the OP, we were talking about a not-insignificant part of the country.
Again, what are you going to use them for? The first people to open fire are going to be the people who've made it their business to know how to revolt.Given that, in response to your question, things get a little more interesting, because nearly everything that the civilian world has to offer would be possible to procure given large enough numbers of "everymen." High-grade electronics, chemicals, weaponry.
To make what? All theAn insurgency does not need a surfeit of gunsmiths or chemists. What it would need is a broad range of skills and knowledge of diverse topics. Or, in other words, education.
And that has what to do with the scenario? Granted he did a lot of damage to a federal building and killed over one-hundred fifty people, but a SVBIED is not an effective weapon against an armored vehicle with a 25mm autocannon firing M791 rounds. Unless of course your target is being idiotically unattentive to not notice a fucking box truck barreling at them and refusing to stop to be checked.I'm sure Timothy McVeigh must have felt much the same way.
I believe you mean "inciting." I'll leave off the obvious jokes about West Virginia to save myself from the wrath of your lady wife.SirNitram wrote:Lafayette County Republicans blog
I'm not quoting their feel-good release. But frankly, this thing should be considered as under incesting insurrection and revolt. But it won't. BEcause they're GOP.
When did this happen though? My understanding of guns is that guns last a long ass time with proper maintenance, so there maybe a good chunk of guns that can be easily converted.Coyote wrote:It used to be that with some effort, a semi-auto gun could be turned into full-auto, but no longer. They are now made in such a way that it would take a great deal of highly specialized gunsmithing and machine work to do it, to the point where it'd be easier and cheaper to go out and steal a real one. Because even if they could get the trigger assembly to fire full-auto, it'd be stuck forever on full-auto, and within a few hundred rounds the barrel would be ruined. To the point where it is unsafe to fire, in fact, and more dangerous to the user than a target.Eleas wrote:This is where my ignorance of gun ownership comes into play. I was under the impression it was fairly simple to modify a hunting rifle like the AR-15 to make it essentially a full-grade military assault rifle; I furthermore have been inundated with youtube videos of what's colloquially known as 'gun nuts' gleefully firing semiautomatics, which probably isn't at all a representative sample.
An IED means Improvised Explosive Device, yeah? I assume they have a gas station nearby and a reasonably well stocked kitchen. It isn't THAT hard to make a fairly potent explosive and improvise a device. Gelignite, for instance, is fairly easy to make and once you actually make it, stable to use for devices*.General Schatten wrote:How would building up for the insurgency help? American's don't have access to unexploded 155mm and mortar shells so no real big IED's and the best you can do is stock up on bulk orders of .308 Winchester or pipe bombs.
The problem with IEDs and EFPs is not from the concussive blast. Sure if you pack a big enough bomb together the concussive blast will do the job. No the real kicker has been that those 155 shells and the like have been shrapnel producing machines. The most effective ones tend to pack ball bearings on top of 2 or 3 shells which turn in to a cloud of lethal fragments well past concussive damage range. Its how we lost 3 guys in my platoon and almost lost all of 1st Platoon but for the grace of shitty detonator cord.Gil Hamilton wrote:An IED means Improvised Explosive Device, yeah? I assume they have a gas station nearby and a reasonably well stocked kitchen. It isn't THAT hard to make a fairly potent explosive and improvise a device. Gelignite, for instance, is fairly easy to make and once you actually make it, stable to use for devices*.General Schatten wrote:How would building up for the insurgency help? American's don't have access to unexploded 155mm and mortar shells so no real big IED's and the best you can do is stock up on bulk orders of .308 Winchester or pipe bombs.
(*the process of making it is somewhat more hazard prone, but that relates to the nature of explosive. Explosive power, cheap to make, easy to make, safe to make. Pick three or more likely two when it comes to an explosive.)
That comes with the design of your explosive. You can pack an explosive nails or ball bearings to do the job, adding all of, what, 5 dollars to the price of the IED? If you design your device cleverly, you can turn most of the explosive shattering potential of the blast into kinetic energy of shrapnel. I cited gelignite because its popularity amongst groups like the IRA during their founding years and can actually be made in a shockingly easy (if, uh, somewhat dangerous if you aren't careful*) synthesis, and that's GREAT at transmitting energy (that is, until they found a source of semtex from the Libyans).CmdrWilkens wrote:The problem with IEDs and EFPs is not from the concussive blast. Sure if you pack a big enough bomb together the concussive blast will do the job. No the real kicker has been that those 155 shells and the like have been shrapnel producing machines. The most effective ones tend to pack ball bearings on top of 2 or 3 shells which turn in to a cloud of lethal fragments well past concussive damage range. Its how we lost 3 guys in my platoon and almost lost all of 1st Platoon but for the grace of shitty detonator cord.
