Broomstick wrote:Although the octopus, squid, and cuttlefish are all very brainy invertebrates, and do exhibit radial symmetry. So the exceptions are exceptional in that regard.
Cephalopods are bilaterally symmetrical, each side has four/five tentacles, one eye and half of the various other organs, they're also cephalised, in that they have a front and a back. As far as I know they also have a central nervous system even if they do have big ganglions for each tentacle.
I've heard it argued that you couldn't really get an intelligent radially symmetrical creature, since they lack the concentration of brainpower in one direction and are just not fast enough. Consider that as far as I know the smartest radially symmetrical creatures are starfish.
Post Number 1066 achieved Sun Feb 22, 2009 3:19 pm(board time, 8:19GMT)
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Do we know that the internal biology of the Elder Things are also truly radially symmetrical? Just because they've got tentacles everywhere and the details don't go into detail about their true anatomy doesn't mean they're not more like a cuttlefish or a squid rather than, say, like a radially symmetrical sponge or something. They ARE an intelligent species and all that.
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It's worth noting that the scientists in the original story were at a total loss when it came to explaining the tissue structure of the Elder Things. They also are not obviously radially symmetrical, as the arrangement of the sensory organs on their "head" differs from individual to individual, if I remember correctly, and they have their wings, which does make them potentially cephalic/bilaterally symmetrical. It's quite likely that they do have a centralized brain somewhere within the "torso" which the Miskatonic expedition was unable to recognize before the last individuals awoke.
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I mean, how often am I to enter a game of riddles with the author, where they challenge me with some strange and confusing and distracting device, and I'm supposed to unravel it and go "I SEE WHAT YOU DID THERE" and take great personal satisfaction and pride in our mutual cleverness?
ebs2323 wrote:How about The Blob? that thing seems to be realy messed up, no brai or annything. It's just a... blob
"Blobs" do exist in the real world however. Amoeba for example. There's several species ( such as slime molds ) where a multitude of smaller indivduals will merge into a "blob" form. The most unrealistic part of the Blob wasn't that it was a blob, but that it was so tough and so large ( real world blobbish critters tend towards the tiny ).
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ebs2323 wrote:How about The Blob? that thing seems to be realy messed up, no brai or annything. It's just a... blob
"Blobs" do exist in the real world however. Amoeba for example. There's several species ( such as slime molds ) where a multitude of smaller indivduals will merge into a "blob" form. The most unrealistic part of the Blob wasn't that it was a blob, but that it was so tough and so large ( real world blobbish critters tend towards the tiny ).
Two thoughts about the blob...
1-Detection: How can it sense it's prey, the only way i can see this happening is through some sort of vibrational detection.
2-Should it not leave a trail of amonia and other waste products in it's wake?
Zor
HAIL ZOR!WE'LL BLOW UP THE OCEAN!
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open_sketchbook wrote:Of course, being Warhammer 40,000, I wouldn't put gasses with negative mass past them.
How about the Elder Things? They don't seem terribly mobile or practical for surviving before the development of technology; good thing they are horrors from beyond the stars, or they'd be pretty fucked.
In mountains of madness it's implied that their ancestors possessed an ability to travel the stars without technological aid. Their home environment is surely radically different to what we know.
Here I shall sketch only the salient high lights in a formless, rambling way. Myth or otherwise, the sculptures told of the coming of those star-headed things to the nascent, lifeless earth out of cosmic space—their coming, and the coming of many other alien entities such as at certain times embark upon spatial pioneering. They seemed able to traverse the interstellar ether on their vast membraneous wings—thus oddly confirming some curious hill folklore long ago told me by an antiquarian colleague.
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ebs2323 wrote:How about The Blob? that thing seems to be realy messed up, no brai or annything. It's just a... blob
"Blobs" do exist in the real world however. Amoeba for example. There's several species ( such as slime molds ) where a multitude of smaller individuals will merge into a "blob" form. The most unrealistic part of the Blob wasn't that it was a blob, but that it was so tough and so large ( real world blobbish critters tend towards the tiny ).
Two thoughts about the blob...
1-Detection: How can it sense it's prey, the only way i can see this happening is through some sort of vibrational detection.
Scent/chemicals? Or heat perhaps. I don't recall it doing anything more dexterous that extending a pseudopod towards something nearby; it doesn't need senses better than "nearby heat source and organic chemical emitter" for that.
Zor wrote:2-Should it not leave a trail of amonia and other waste products in it's wake?
Only if it constantly disposes of waste. Presumably if kept alive, fed and unable to move from a spot there would be a build up of some kind of waste. Given how efficiently it converted consumed creatures into more Blob tissue, I don't think you'd see much waste; it's all going into making more Blob.
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers
I'm amazed the thread has gotten this far without mention of the aliens from Signs. They apparently came from the Wicked Witch of the West School of Design.
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Zor wrote:Dishonorable mention to the Protoss, do they subsist by bathing in chocolate pudding?
Zor
Just because you can't see their mouthparts, doesn't mean they're not there. You'd be hard pressed to find the mouth on a slug, but it's there. For a larger example, you can't normally see a giant octopus' mouth, but again, it's there.
Unfortunately, if you read the novels (particularly the Dark Templar Saga, which is integrated into the storyline of Starcraft 2), they really don't have mouths. They replenish literally by bathing in sunlight (with no explanation given as to how this sustains them, particularly since they don't seem to consume or ingest anything else).
It's retarded, of course - they should have just said that the Protoss do have mouths (since their ancient primitive society is specifically referred to as a "hunting" one), but that you don't see them open because they communicate telepathically and breathe through parts of their skin. Before the above bit came out, I always assumed that was the case.
IIRC they also drink water in one of the novels. As for the hunting, they (tried to) explain it away as being part of some religious ceremony or whatever, but it's still seems rather hamfisted to change it so the 9ft tall killing machines can be solar-powered.
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Gimli stared with wide eyes. 'Durin's Bane!' he cried, and letting his axe fall he covered his face.
'A Balrog,' muttered Gandalf. 'Now I understand.' He faltered and leaned heavily on his staff. 'What an evil fortune! And I am already weary.'
- J.R.R Tolkien, The Fellowship of the Ring
Zor wrote:2-Should it not leave a trail of amonia and other waste products in it's wake?
Only if it constantly disposes of waste. Presumably if kept alive, fed and unable to move from a spot there would be a build up of some kind of waste. Given how efficiently it converted consumed creatures into more Blob tissue, I don't think you'd see much waste; it's all going into making more Blob.
No system is 100% efficient, besides it would be constantly digesting and metabolizing chemicals (processes which always produce some waste material) and i doubt it would have bladders to store said resedue.
Zor
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Zor wrote:No system is 100% efficient, besides it would be constantly digesting and metabolizing chemicals (processes which always produce some waste material) and i doubt it would have bladders to store said resedue.
Zor
Why not? The blob digests people, so obviously it has some sort of potent acid. Yet at the same time it doesn't leave a trail of withered plants, corroded metal or melted plastic, so obviously it can keep the acid inside itself. It's not a big leap to assume that there's also probably a large vacuole-type chamber that occasionally empties off screen. As far as sensory organs go, it's repelled by cold, so it likely can sense heat and cold. Thus it goes after the patches of warmth, which turn out to be people.
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Guardsman Bass wrote:
Unfortunately, if you read the novels (particularly the Dark Templar Saga, which is integrated into the storyline of Starcraft 2), they really don't have mouths. They replenish literally by bathing in sunlight (with no explanation given as to how this sustains them, particularly since they don't seem to consume or ingest anything else).
It's retarded, of course - they should have just said that the Protoss do have mouths (since their ancient primitive society is specifically referred to as a "hunting" one), but that you don't see them open because they communicate telepathically and breathe through parts of their skin. Before the above bit came out, I always assumed that was the case.
IIRC they also drink water in one of the novels. As for the hunting, they (tried to) explain it away as being part of some religious ceremony or whatever, but it's still seems rather hamfisted to change it so the 9ft tall killing machines can be solar-powered.
Well Karune, the official Blizzard representative in the community for all their RTS related lore and gameplay said
Karune in in the Starcraft II Q & A Batch 19 wrote:Protoss gain nutrition from sunlight, or at a pinch, moonlight (which is just reflected sunlight anyway) by absorbing through their skins. They can go for extended periods without absorbing sunlight. What little moisture they need is also absorbed through their skin
This of course led to people asking what about the solid matter they use to construct their bodies, but I don't believe a response has been provided beyond the above quote. Apparently Protoss just need water and energy in order to grow
avatarxprime wrote:
Well Karune, the official Blizzard representative in the community for all their RTS related lore and gameplay said
Karune in in the Starcraft II Q & A Batch 19 wrote:Protoss gain nutrition from sunlight, or at a pinch, moonlight (which is just reflected sunlight anyway) by absorbing through their skins. They can go for extended periods without absorbing sunlight. What little moisture they need is also absorbed through their skin
This of course led to people asking what about the solid matter they use to construct their bodies, but I don't believe a response has been provided beyond the above quote. Apparently Protoss just need water and energy in order to grow
If the Archon is any indicator, the Protoss may well be some sort of strange psionic energy beings.
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The protoss must get quite a bit of sunlight on their homeworld if they're constructing their bodies out of energy
A scientist once gave a public lecture on astronomy. He described how the Earth orbits around the sun and how the sun, in turn, orbits around the centre of a vast collection of stars called our galaxy.
At the end of the lecture, a little old lady at the back of the room got up and said: 'What you have told us is rubbish. The world is really a flat plate supported on the back of a giant tortoise.
The scientist gave a superior smile before replying, 'What is the tortoise standing on?'
'You're very clever, young man, very clever,' said the old lady. 'But it's turtles all the way down.'
I'd have to nominate the creatures from Pitch Black. How anything would evolve such an extreme photo sensitivity on a planet that rarely experiences night (what is it, once every 17 years?) is beyond me. Then there's how they actually survive in such numbers between nights especially having killed off all other life on the planet.
Perhaps the planet has a far more extensive subterranean network than we know of? Or perhaps the creature was not naturally occurring, but was an introduced species whose original environment was like in the dark side of the moon or something?
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If the cave network was substantial enough you could have a whole different ecosystem down there (not unprecedented on Earth, after all). The critters could remain dormant for 17 years, or in a form with a low metabolic rate, or perhaps they spawn just prior to the multi-eclipse so during the long day they are very few in number.
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I like the idea of the species being an introduced one. Makes the surface ecological devastation seem much more plausible. I'm having a hard time imagining a subterranean ecology extensive enough to support the vast numbers of predators shown in the movie. If there is one capable of of supporting them, then why the exodus to a now barren surface?
So how about having them be an introduced predator who goes dormant during the light season and whose numbers got way out of control a number of cycles ago (the giant bone fields seem pretty old and the outpost which was present during the previous cycle seems to have been built after the ecological devastation) and wiped out all other life. During the current and perhaps a few past cycles they end up feeding on themselves (as shown in the movie) and their numbers are declining, though they probably have a few more cycles left before going entirely extinct.
They could have life cycles like the cicada. Their underground larval stage lasts a very long time compared to the brief surface adult stage, and is in tune with the planet's seventeen year day/night cycle. Not much different from the cicada spending five or so years underground, then a day or two above ground molting, flying, mating and dying.
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That species from Voyager that ages backwards. What else can you say about that? They fucking age backwards. There's a lot of Star Trek Voyager in this list.
1123581321 wrote:That species from Voyager that ages backwards. What else can you say about that? They fucking age backwards. There's a lot of Star Trek Voyager in this list.
Oh yes. An extremely stupid concept. In fact, twenty years earlier, Alan Dean Foster mocked it in his extended novelisation of the TAS episode "The Counterclock Incident", which featured a similar species living in a backward antimatter universe.
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I love the Species 8472. Only decent Voyager creatures, which is my favourite of all the Treks, in the little i've watched.
There are already creatures on earth like ants with 'castes', so species genders may be like that and not necessarily reproduction-orientated. Triple helix DNA or more is plausible, especially in a universe as big as ours. Megaton explosions?
Sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
'least that's what someone important in the sci-fi scene said.
"
- PeZook
