Healthcare bill up for vote today

[The Romulan Republic]

Now on CNN: one of the Republicans shouted "baby killer" at Representative Stupak.

[JME2]

So far, so good.

[LMSx]

Mandating the use of a private product seems illogical, one would imagine that if it was so essential for all to have you'd simply make it a socialized product like police or fire coverage. But no matter: once people start expecting the ability to get health care, this shifts the ground that Republicans would have to trod on to dismantle the social safety net. Even if they run this fall on "Repeal The Bill" Democrats get to ask Americans if they want to actively create a system that discards the unhealthy, kicks out all the 21-26 year olds now getting health insurance, and opens up a giant donut hole in Medicare Part D coverage. Either Republicans try and ignore those charges or Democrats force Republicans to defend a plan of their own.

Next up: working for a Public Option.

I can't stand listening to Fucking Ed Schultz, but that's better than Wolf Fucking Blitzer or Goddamn Bret Baier.

[The Romulan Republic]

Reconciliation bill has passed.

[LMSx]

Joe Biden looks like a cat that just ate the canary.

[JME2]

Suck it, Republicans. Suck it, you fuckers...

[SirNitram]

The easy part is done.

The difficult part, of course, is the goddamn Senate, where good bills go to die.

[hunter5]

Then it will have to get past the inevitable Supreme Court challenge under a possible 10th amendment violation.

[Vehrec]

Then it will have to get past the inevitable Supreme Court challenge under a possible 10th amendment violation.

On what grounds, pray tell? I mean, there are lots of other federal programs under the aegis of Interstate Commerce, just like this one. What the hell is different about this?

[Koolaidkirby]

The easy part is done.

The difficult part, of course, is the goddamn Senate, where good bills go to die.

correct me if I'm wrong, but don't they only need 51 votes for the senate since they're doing it through reconciliation?

actually don't they only need 50 since they have Biden as well?

[hunter5]

Then it will have to get past the inevitable Supreme Court challenge under a possible 10th amendment violation.

On what grounds, pray tell? I mean, there are lots of other federal programs under the aegis of Interstate Commerce, just like this one. What the hell is different about this?

What I keep hearing about is the requirements to buy insurance regardless of your ability to afford it.

[Vympel]

Nothing is going to go wrong in the Senate. The Dems may be fucking weak, but they're not so incompetent as to be all triumphalist about something that can die in the Senate - everyone has been watching the House vote intently because it was the final real hurdle.

[The Romulan Republic]

correct me if I'm wrong, but don't they only need 51 votes for the senate since they're doing it through reconciliation?

actually don't they only need 50 since they have Biden as well?

As I understand it, that is correct. So they can loose nine votes and it'll still pass.

[LMSx]

Nothing is going to go wrong in the Senate. The Dems may be fucking weak, but they're not so incompetent as to be all triumphalist about something that can die in the Senate - everyone has been watching the House vote intently because it was the final real hurdle.

I've heard the Reconciliation bill characterized as "all ice cream, no spinach". The bigger feat was just getting the Senate bill through to the President. I guess *maybe* (maybe) there would be a screwball ruling from the Senate Parliamentarian that forces the House to vote one more time on Reconciliation, but there's very little Democrats could do to screw things up at this point.

[Knife]

Then it will have to get past the inevitable Supreme Court challenge under a possible 10th amendment violation.

On what grounds, pray tell? I mean, there are lots of other federal programs under the aegis of Interstate Commerce, just like this one. What the hell is different about this?

What I keep hearing about is the requirements to buy insurance regardless of your ability to afford it.

That's why it is subsidized. I mean, I know a lot of GOPers and some State Attorney Generals have made some political hay about suing the Fed over it, but it's mostly talk.

[Fire Fly]

I thought that the Senate had already voted on the bill and all that was left was for the House to vote on it?

[Knife]

I thought that the Senate had already voted on the bill and all that was left was for the House to vote on it?

Sort of. The Senate passed their Bill, as did the House. Normally, if the Senate Bill and the House Bill is different, they do a conference session where the House and Senate mish-mash their bills together and then both houses of congress vote on the compromise again. They knew that wasn't going to work, so instead, the House voted to pass the Senate Bill as is, so now both houses voted yes to the same bill, no conference committee.

Then the House voted on a package of 'fixes' to send to the Senate to vote on something called reconciliation, where it only takes 51 votes to pass and way less ways to slow down or kill. Those 'fixes' are basically what many believe would be the things changed in conference committee but free from procedural shit the GOP could kill it with in regular Senate shit.

[Fire Fly]

Well the Health Care Reform bill that was passed doesn't sound too bad

FACTBOX-US healthcare bill would provide immediate benefits
Fri Mar 19, 2010 6:46pm EDT

WASHINGTON, March 19 (Reuters) - The U.S. House of Representatives is heading for a Sunday vote on a sweeping overhaul of the $2.5 trillion U.S. healthcare system.

Regulatory News | Bonds

House Democrats are confident they can overcome solid Republican opposition and pass the bill. Leaders are using a two-step process where the House approves Senate-passed legislation and then votes for a separate package of changes to satisfy concerns of House Democrats. The Senate is expected to approve those changes as well and President Barack Obama plans to sign the bill into law.

Here is what to expect if the bill becomes law:

WITHIN THE FIRST YEAR OF ENACTMENT

• Insurance companies will be barred from dropping people from coverage when they get sick. Lifetime coverage limits will be eliminated and annual limits are to be restricted.
• Insurers will be barred from excluding children for coverage because of pre-existing conditions.
• Young adults will be able to stay on their parents' health plans until the age of 26. Many health plans currently drop dependents from coverage when they turn 19 or finish college.
• Uninsured adults with a pre-existing conditions will be able to obtain health coverage through a new program that will expire once new insurance exchanges begin operating in 2014.
• A temporary reinsurance program is created to help companies maintain health coverage for early retirees between the ages of 55 and 64. This also expires in 2014.
• Medicare drug beneficiaries who fall into the "doughnut hole" coverage gap will get a $250 rebate. The bill eventually closes that gap which currently begins after $2,700 is spent on drugs. Coverage starts again after $6,154 is spent.
• A tax credit becomes available for some small businesses to help provide coverage for workers.
• A 10 percent tax on indoor tanning services that use ultraviolet lamps goes into effect on July 1.

WHAT HAPPENS IN 2011

• Medicare provides 10 percent bonus payments to primary care physicians and general surgeons.
• Medicare beneficiaries will be able to get a free annual wellness visit and personalized prevention plan service. New health plans will be required to cover preventive services with little or no cost to patients.
• A new program under the Medicaid plan for the poor goes into effect in October that allows states to offer home and community based care for the disabled that might otherwise require institutional care.
• Payments to insurers offering Medicare Advantage services are frozen at 2010 levels. These payments are to be gradually reduced to bring them more in line with traditional Medicare.
• Employers are required to disclose the value of health benefits on employees' W-2 tax forms.
• An annual fee is imposed on pharmaceutical companies according to market share. The fee does not apply to companies with sales of $5 million or less.

WHAT HAPPENS IN 2012

• Physician payment reforms are implemented in Medicare to enhance primary care services and encourage doctors to form "accountable care organizations" to improve quality and efficiency of care.
• An incentive program is established in Medicare for acute care hospitals to improve quality outcomes.
• The Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, which oversees the government programs, begin tracking hospital readmission rates and puts in place financial incentives to reduce preventable readmissions.

WHAT HAPPENS IN 2013

• A national pilot program is established for Medicare on payment bundling to encourage doctors, hospitals and other care providers to better coordinate patient care.
• The threshold for claiming medical expenses on itemized tax returns is raised to 10 percent from 7.5 percent of income. The threshold remains at 7.5 percent for the elderly through 2016.
• The Medicare payroll tax is raised to 2.35 percent from 1.45 percent for individuals earning more than $200,000 and married couples with incomes over $250,000. The tax is imposed on some investment income for that income group.
• A 2.9 percent excise tax in imposed on the sale of medical devices. Anything generally purchased at the retail level by the public is excluded from the tax.

WHAT HAPPENS IN 2014

• State health insurance exchanges for small businesses and individuals open.
• Most people will be required to obtain health insurance coverage or pay a fine if they don't. Healthcare tax credits become available to help people with incomes up to 400 percent of poverty purchase coverage on the exchange.
• Health plans no longer can exclude people from coverage due to pre-existing conditions.
• Employers with 50 or more workers who do not offer coverage face a fine of $2,000 for each employee if any worker receives subsidized insurance on the exchange. The first 30 employees aren't counted for the fine.
• Health insurance companies begin paying a fee based on their market share.

WHAT HAPPENS IN 2015

• Medicare creates a physician payment program aimed at rewarding quality of care rather than volume of services.

WHAT HAPPENS IN 2018

• An excise tax on high cost employer-provided plans is imposed. The first $27,500 of a family plan and $10,200 for individual coverage is exempt from the tax. Higher levels are set for plans covering retirees and people in high risk professions.

(Reporting by Donna Smith; Editing by David Alexander and Eric Beech)

[LMSx]

It doesn't take much to guess that the next step for Republicans will be a pivot as they steal the Democrats' tactic of using medical bureaucratic sob stories to blast Obamacare as an Obamination. To blunt that I think, smartly, the Democratic leadership has stayed on message that this is just a first step in a long process. That lets them logically pivot in turn by using the popular Public Option or Alan Grayson's Medicare for All as a bludgeon as part of a "let us keep improving your health care" 2010 midterm message.

Looking at Fire Fly's list, I wonder if a second part of that message would include increasing the time tables for some of these events to come in- like the health insurance exchanges. Why dick around until 2014?

[bobalot]

Then it will have to get past the inevitable Supreme Court challenge under a possible 10th amendment violation.

On what grounds, pray tell? I mean, there are lots of other federal programs under the aegis of Interstate Commerce, just like this one. What the hell is different about this?

What I keep hearing about is the requirements to buy insurance regardless of your ability to afford it.

So when challenged on how it is actually unconstitutional, you don't have a shred of evidence other than something you "heard".

[Stuart Mackey]

Looks overly complicated and expensive and open to rort's. But I guess time will tell.

[Broomstick]

The easy part is done.

The difficult part, of course, is the goddamn Senate, where good bills go to die.

correct me if I'm wrong, but don't they only need 51 votes for the senate since they're doing it through reconciliation?

actually don't they only need 50 since they have Biden as well?

Biden gets to vote only in the event of a tie.

[Guardsman Bass]

On what grounds, pray tell? I mean, there are lots of other federal programs under the aegis of Interstate Commerce, just like this one. What the hell is different about this?

What I keep hearing about is the requirements to buy insurance regardless of your ability to afford it.

So when challenged on how it is actually unconstitutional, you don't have a shred of evidence other than something you "heard".

I don't think he's arguing for the position.

That's what I've been reading as well - a number of conservative state attorney generals are going to try targeting the bill based on their belief that a federal mandate forcing someone to buy something in the private market is unconstitutional. Normally, I'd believe it would just get knocked down (there are few limits on the power of Congress to regulate interstate commerce as determined over the years), but with a conservative-leaning court, who knows?

In any case, when this bill finally gets signed, I'll be rejoicing, both for personal reasons (both my brother and I will get to keep our health care coverage, which we originally had under our dad but lost for age reasons), and because finally, finally all future reform efforts will take place with this having gone before. There's been almost a psychological barrier to true universal health care reform from all the failures over the years, and this is finally a start.

[atg]

The easy part is done.

The difficult part, of course, is the goddamn Senate, where good bills go to die.

correct me if I'm wrong, but don't they only need 51 votes for the senate since they're doing it through reconciliation?

actually don't they only need 50 since they have Biden as well?

Biden gets to vote only in the event of a tie.

So if 50 votes are for it, its a tie, Biden votes, Democrats win, isn't Koolaidkirby correct?

[Broomstick]

Yes, just wanted to clarify as I'm aware that there are many here not fully familiar with the nuances of how the US government works (or doesn't, as the case may be)