SGU "Space" [season 1 episode 11]

[Alyeska]

I rather liked the episode. The way they portrayed the space battle was entertaining. The shuttle really is cool. Ancients know how to make good transport vehicles. Seeing the Destiny choose between shields and guns was a nice touch. Just makes me wonder what the ship was like back at its height. From what we've seen, I think the Destiny's main power source has to have died long ago. We are told that the ship can only recharge its batteries to 40% with the star maneuver. But even at 100%, it would seem the ship would deplete its power source rather quickly in combat and FTL. I honestly think the ship had some other form of power for primary use that died long ago.

The angle of having Wray involved in Rush's actions against Young makes a lot of sense. Given how we saw Wray immediately started going after Rush and wanted to ground Greer, her aggressive motivations make sense because she knew exactly what was going on. It also shows that Rush isn't quite the immediate loner we thought. He was working that angle with Wray thinking that she would help protect him. Young proved he was willing to make the hard decision by trying to kill Rush, so I believe Rush will back down. For now.

All bets are off if Young discovers Rush and Wray were working together.

[Johonebesus]

Regarding the aliens' incompetence in combat, the characters' speculation that the aliens didn't want to do too much damage to the Destiny makes sense. Given the choice between their being stupid or their deliberately holding back, I'll take the second option for now.

I'm also not bothered by humans being physically stronger than these aliens. Since it is practically a law in sci-fi that humans are particularly weak compared to other species, I found it pleasant that Rush was able to over-power the alien.

I do wish the aliens could have been a bit more alien. In fact, why should they even be compatible with the communication stones? Is it possible that the seed ships did more than just drop stargates? The Ancients liked to create or alter life so as to resemble life from their homeworld. On the one hand it would be really disappointing to see yet another instance of Alterran created life, but on the other hand we've already seen too much familiar life for it to be natural. I suppose the realities of producing a show with a finite budget and schedule prevents the creators from going to great lengths to make truly alien environments for every episode, but it's still disappointing.

[adam_grif]

I'm also not bothered by humans being physically stronger than these aliens. Since it is practically a law in sci-fi that humans are particularly weak compared to other species, I found it pleasant that Rush was able to over-power the alien.

Well, a certain kind of alien. The grey style aliens (Asgard, these guys) are always shorter, weaker, and with enlarged brains. But yes, it is nice to see SGverse villains that don't have superstrength and a healing factor.

[Asdeed]

I actually liked the tomato scene in the mess hall. Not for the food or lame jokes, but the woman in the background who stood up for Young. It throws a small wrench in the 'civilians vs military' atmosphere Camile the IOA bitch is trying so desperately to create. Seriously, how power hungry does a person have to be to start this kind of crap in that situation? Rush I can understand and actually like watching, she's just a pain in the ass.

[Siege]

As for Rush mindfucking aliens. Eh. Why are we taking what he's saying at face value again? Man is not trustworthy. I suspect there's more to it than that.

Why wouldn't we take what he's saying at face value? We saw how he got out of the test tube (Col. Young lend him a hand), we know how he mind-hacked an alien mook and strangled it afterwards, we even saw him rescue Chloe from her own tube. Why should we assume he got out through another way than the way that was (more or less) shown? Hell, we even saw that the mind-accessing of random individuals caused said individuals a not-inconsiderable amount of agony, so there's reason for Rush to prefer not to recall any account of himself being mind-accessed.

As much as I don't think Rush is particularly trustworthy, I don't think that we as the audience have much reason to doubt the account of their escape at all.

[JME2]

Really? Damn, I must've missed that. That raises the question though, how did the alien get hold of a communications stone?

Well, they were after the Destiny, and they speculated that they had been following their progress for some time. It's possible that they once had access to it, but were forced to bail out shortly before the current occupants arrived due to the widespread failure of ship systems (i.e. what the crew had to fix in the first episode). They took some stones with them.

And kept tabs on Destiny's movements until they had unlocked the stones and were ready to intercept. Yeah, that seems to be the likely explanation.

Overall, not the strongest mid-season opener, but still good.

I'm glad we got a more 'alien' antagonist; I like the Goa'uld, Wraith, and the Legos from Hell as much as the next Gater, but this was a nice break. And Wray is playing a dangerous game here. Rush is still the wild card and she should not lose sight of the fact that he's a manipulative bastard at heart.

4/5

[adam_grif]

The replicators were plenty alien, until they had to go and make human-form ones and have them fall in love with carter and shit. Blergh.

[NecronLord]

Why wouldn't we take what he's saying at face value?

He was telling a major lie in the very same sentence "Young couldn't have known I survived"

We saw how he got out of the test tube (Col. Young lend him a hand), we know how he mind-hacked an alien mook and strangled it afterwards

Err, did you miss that Young put the reader device on himself, and Rush was wearing the master's one? That hardly counts as Rush being awesome, any more than if Young had handed him the alien's sidearm and he'd blown its head off.

The 'mind hacking' is the idea that Rush managed to defend himself. Which seems unlikely.

Though if he did mind-hack them, I imagine it will be revealed that it's because Rush has already started on the journey to ascension or something, based on information in Atlantis and other sites. Rather than "Rar, humans are awesome."

[Siege]

He was telling a major lie in the very same sentence "Young couldn't have known I survived"

Which is actually technically true . Young couldn't have known Rush would've survived being marooned in the middle of a wasteland on an alien planet a billion light years from anywhere. But sure, your point that we shouldn't necessarily take anything Rush says for gospel is well taken... However we can corroborate most of the story he tells because, you know, we actually saw him grab information from the alien's mind, break out Chloe, and make off in the direction of what was presumably the fighter bay. Why should we suspect there's more to his escape than that?

Err, did you miss that Young put the reader device on himself, and Rush was wearing the master's one? That hardly counts as Rush being awesome, any more than if Young had handed him the alien's sidearm and he'd blown its head off.

I did in fact notice that, I even commented on it earlier in this thread. And the way I'm looking at it trying to convince an alien to do something mere seconds after regaining consciousness, being flushed out of a bacta tank and having an alien device removed from your head is pretty impressive. Sure the alien turned out to be remote-controlled but Rush didn't know that at the time, and he still had the presence of mind to immediately think of a way to get the information he needed to escape. Which he then promptly pulled off, rescuing Chloe in the process. Sure he had some help at the start but even so, that's an SG-1 worthy sequence of badassery.

The 'mind hacking' is the idea that Rush managed to defend himself. Which seems unlikely.

That is indeed unlikely, but that was only Rush' impression. He said the aliens were getting frustrated because he didn't provide them with the information they wanted. Rush seems to think this is because of him putting up some sort of resistance, but it might just be that he didn't have the information they wanted in the first place. If for example the aliens were looking for the master password to the Destiny's main computer, they'd be shit out of luck... Because Rush doesn't know the master password.

Though if he did mind-hack them, I imagine it will be revealed that it's because Rush has already started on the journey to ascension or something, based on information in Atlantis and other sites. Rather than "Rar, humans are awesome."

There's certainly precedent for that sort of thing, and in 'Time' Rush did say that the idea that ascension was possible was "the reason [he] ended up here"... But even so, that would be pretty awful as far as ideas go. I do fervently hope the writers have more sense than to turn Rush into another Daniel Jackson or Jack o'Neill style 'halfway to ascension/advanced human' character.

[NecronLord]

I did in fact notice that, I even commented on it earlier in this thread. And the way I'm looking at it trying to convince an alien to do something mere seconds after regaining consciousness, being flushed out of a bacta tank and having an alien device removed from your head is pretty impressive. Sure the alien turned out to be remote-controlled but Rush didn't know that at the time, and he still had the presence of mind to immediately think of a way to get the information he needed to escape. Which he then promptly pulled off, rescuing Chloe in the process. Sure he had some help at the start but even so, that's an SG-1 worthy sequence of badassery.

Yes. Rush is a senior SGC scientist; unlike most of the crew, he is likely to be quite experienced in these things. He probably expected the alien that randomly broke him out of the tank would turn out to be the weird blue alien version of Teal'c or something.

That is indeed unlikely, but that was only Rush' impression. He said the aliens were getting frustrated because he didn't provide them with the information they wanted. Rush seems to think this is because of him putting up some sort of resistance, but it might just be that he didn't have the information they wanted in the first place. If for example the aliens were looking for the master password to the Destiny's main computer, they'd be shit out of luck... Because Rush doesn't know the master password.

That indeed did occur to me too.

There's certainly precedent for that sort of thing, and in 'Time' Rush did say that the idea that ascension was possible was "the reason [he] ended up here"... But even so, that would be pretty awful as far as ideas go. I do fervently hope the writers have more sense than to turn Rush into another Daniel Jackson or Jack o'Neill style 'halfway to ascension/advanced human' character.

I would think more that he'd be chasing it as an objective (he seems to be) and shitting on anyone in his way.

[CaptJodan]

Why the fuck wouldn't it think they're Ancients? They came from close to Terra Atlantis, through the stargate, and are human (as the Ancients were, fundamentally).

The ship is still pretty much locked down, in terms of what the crew can and can't do. If the ship really thought these were ancients and thought these people deserved access, it wouldn't be responding with one security measure after another keeping them locked out.

Or if there's a survey team on the planet...

Already addressed above as the most likely explanation. But you're the one saying the ship isn't that smart.

or if they need to protect some innocent people or...

Which is not something the AI is likely to be able to figure out. I'm talking about a ship that is, undeniably, being controlled by an autopilot that won't relinquish control, even when the crew wants it to stay put until all team members are back from a trip through the gate. The AI isn't likely to go protecting innocents.

Why are you assuming it's that bright? It's not an AI (or rather, not a sapient one) it's a computer program.

The ship has already shown itself to adapt to unexpected circumstances. It's shown some basic intuitive response to threats against its passengers. A ship that's flying around a void and might drop into someone else's space and come under attack is a pretty basic possibility there. You're saying the ancients are smart enough to make an AI (and yes, I'm calling it this) that responds to air, water, food, and power crises, (the first three of which the ship shouldn't have to be programmed for if the ship truly thought they were ancients, because they would take control and do this themselves), but were too stupid to program in a "jump away or shoot back if attacked" routine? Really?

We've seen the Ancients' freak out the last time they encountered a sapient AI. Why should they have actually made this ship able to preempt its crew?

To what are you referring? They presumably created the Asurans well after this ship was launched, so apparently very advanced AI wasn't a problem later on. I don't know what you're actually referring to, though.

Ahem. The other model of Lantean shuttle we've seen is good in combat. Why should it be surprising that this one is too? I should note that they are good in combat.

You're using a Proof by Example fallacy to claim all Lantean shuttles are automatically good at combat.

Look, clearly the ship has combat capability, or it wouldn't be armed. But this shuttle is far, far older than a Jumper, and can't even keep up with it's mothership, something a jumper can do.

It's simply far more likely that the aliens, for whatever reason, were more interested in losing many of their pilots than they were at destroying the shuttle. Which goes back to stupid aliens.

For that matter, they are imagined by the producers to have a stealth mode, at least according to the notes on the control panels on the actual prop. Whether this means a cloak or something else is unknown. But that would suggest it's intended to get into situations where such a thing is necessary. Not just flying around peacefully.

In TNG's "Who Watches the Watchers" the Federation had a hidden (stealthed) base on a planet so they could observe the local intelligent life without interacting or interfering with it. What makes you think the ancients don't use their stealth mode for this purpose?

Really, the inclusion of a stealth mode (which has yet to be canon) is far less proof that they anticipated that they may need to defend themselves than the fact that the shuttle is armed at all, something that is now canon.

Random shuttle now has the ability to use guns and fight against aliens that cant even win with superior numbers. They didnt even seem to be shooting back which is hilariously funny.

Agreed for the most part. All against a single shuttle with pilots who've never flown it in combat before, have limited flight hours, and were flying a ship that, even on screen, didn't show the nimbleness of the craft it was up against.

To be fair, the aliens DID fire back. They even hit the shuttle once that we saw. But they were so bad at any kind of attack, even serving as a distraction, that either they simply wanted to die, or we have to believe they're even less well versed in their own technology than Scott is with the shuttle.

I'm just waiting for when they start having kids... I dont imagine they brought lots of protection with them and an Ancient condom machine would be funny.

I was wondering the same thing during the episode. Given how many times Scott has probably fucked Chloe, I'm wondering when that shoe will drop. Or does Johansen have birth control in her pack too?

Regarding the aliens' incompetence in combat, the characters' speculation that the aliens didn't want to do too much damage to the Destiny makes sense. Given the choice between their being stupid or their deliberately holding back, I'll take the second option for now.

And I'm fine if they're offensive abilities were toned down because they wanted to capture, not kill. The problem is, even if that's your goal, you don't generally work on just flat out dying in droves. Given their advanced numbers, their presumed familiarity with with their own tech, and what looked to be ships at least compatible in acceleration and maneuverability, if not better, to the shuttle, you'd expect them to do better at avoiding the single shuttle's fire. They didn't have to kill the shuttle, but they could have made it a lot harder for the shuttle to destroy them.

I'm also not bothered by humans being physically stronger than these aliens.

This is something I'm also not bothered with. The Goa'uld and Wraith were always stronger. Given this race's MO, that they left Destiny the moment they knew humans were aboard, and their tactics here, it's clear that they're cautious about getting into a person-to-person shooting war (though don't care about dying in droves in space, apparently). It makes sense that they are physically weaker and try and use other means to even the scales, thus the intelligence gathering mission.

I do wish the aliens could have been a bit more alien.

This is something I don't quite understand. We've just passed the halfway mark of the first season, and this is the first alien that is in any way humanoid looking, and even still they're different enough so as to need to be CGI, rather than forehead of the week. All other alien(s) we've seen have been non-humanoid. Given Stargate's history of excessive human-like aliens, I think they've done a good job at giving us a variety so far, especially given the cost of making a CGI alien every week.

[Oskuro]

Random idea, maybe the smallish ships were mostly remote controlled and used as a diversion?

As for the aliens not being alien enough... What the fuck? The only "non-alien" thing they have is their anthropomorphic distribution (hands, feet, head with two eyes and a mouth), something that makes perfect evolutionary sense for a tool-using species.
Their skin is different, their bone structure is different, their eyes are very different, they have no lips either. Hardly as human looking as the Wraith or any species on Star Trek.

I find it funny how often people claim that something must be related to humanity just by virtue of being anthropomorphic, yet anthropomorphism is what enabled us to become a complex civilization. Had we had flippers instead of hands, we'd still be wild animals. Or, in other words, anthropomorphisn is not special because humans have it (yay for human egocentrism), humans are special because they are anthropomorphic.

Why the fuck wouldn't it think they're Ancients? They came from close to Terra Atlantis, through the stargate, and are human (as the Ancients were, fundamentally).

Was there any mention of anyone having the ATA gene?

[Soontir C'boath]

Why the fuck wouldn't it think they're Ancients? They came from close to Terra Atlantis, through the stargate, and are human (as the Ancients were, fundamentally).

The ship is still pretty much locked down, in terms of what the crew can and can't do. If the ship really thought these were ancients and thought these people deserved access, it wouldn't be responding with one security measure after another keeping them locked out.

Doesn't Destiny require security codes since she doesn't have a gene interface (maybe the chair perhaps?)? If the security was in that manner, then they'd lock out the Ancients as equally if not far more for the humans.

[CaptJodan]

Doesn't Destiny require security codes since she doesn't have a gene interface (maybe the chair perhaps?)? If the security was in that manner, then they'd lock out the Ancients as equally if not far more for the humans.

Which is why I don't buy Necron's "the ship knows (or thinks) they're ancients" schick. It knows only that it has passengers on board, and probably isn't programmed to know or care why they haven't taken control of the ship. But until they do, apparently the programming allows for the ship to keep whatever passenger's it has alive, not vacate all the air and kill them all as being a security threat. In the meantime, it seems to generally be following its original programming.

Edit: Little grammar edit.

[Vympel]

Pros:-

* Real aliens, who aren't humanoid at all. Even the Wraith were vaguely humanoid, and lets face it - as enemies they were always lame. Everything about them, really;

* Starship Porn. Destiny has a big ventral bow gun. Doesn't really make much sense, I thought they were going to fire those big cannons, but whatever;

* Some interesting ideas, like having the communication stones serve as the introduction to this new race, the mind transmit/ receive probes, etc;

* Plot twist / advancement/ development - i.e. Rush didn't act alone to try and get rid of Col. Young;

Cons:-

* Lame space battle. Sorry, but Stargate has never been able to pull off spectacular space battles. Anyone who ever lists a Stargate space battle as their favorite is obviously on drugs, because they've always been pretty terrible. They show no artistry in direction or visual noise whatsoever.

They're always the same: unacceptably static, visually boring, with terrible sound effects (worst sound effect ever: Wraith weapons fire) and uninteresting special effects. This was no different. Destiny's main weapon firing was the most anticlimactic thing ever. Everyone knows how to make at least a decent space battle except the people who do Stargate.

Just sucks balls. Move the fucking camera around. Add some visual flavor. Do some interesting things, for fuck's sake. It's CGI, you can do whatever you want.

* Aliens were thickos.

* Rush back within the space of an episode.

[JME2]

The replicators were plenty alien, until they had to go and make human-form ones and have them fall in love with carter and shit. Blergh.

I meant the original bugs, not the human-forms. I always hated that. Hated the Asurans, too.

[Siege]

Was there any mention of anyone having the ATA gene?

Rush claims the ship predates ATA technology, so even if they do it'll probably not do them much good.

I do agree that the battle was sort of anticlimactic but of course that does make some sense: the Destiny is barely functional, can't use most of it guns, and apparently is in dire danger of blowing itself up if the main gun is fired one too many times... And the aliens don't want to destroy the thing they're out to capture. I was kind of put off by the standard 'sparks fly out of random walls when ship is hit' bits though, and indeed the direction was a bit tame.

[Johonebesus]

I do wish the aliens could have been a bit more alien.

This is something I don't quite understand. We've just passed the halfway mark of the first season, and this is the first alien that is in any way humanoid looking, and even still they're different enough so as to need to be CGI, rather than forehead of the week. All other alien(s) we've seen have been non-humanoid. Given Stargate's history of excessive human-like aliens, I think they've done a good job at giving us a variety so far, especially given the cost of making a CGI alien every week.

We've seen a couple of planets with vegetation that looks a lot like our plants. The aliens this week had a basic humanoid form, complete with a recognizable face of two eyes and a mouth. There's no reason they should mimic our body plan. Why not have three or four legs, or arms with several joints, or eyes set into a stalk or tentacle with a bunch of little mouths all over the back, or maybe big fern-like antennae or gills/lungs? Yes, their shape is different enough that they can't pass for humans on Earth, but they are still awfully humanoid for something that isn't even remotely related to us.

[Oskuro]

The aliens this week had a basic humanoid form, complete with a recognizable face of two eyes and a mouth. There's no reason they should mimic our body plan.

The main reason for the aliens looking like they do is that their body language needs to be understandable. If you throw in some amorphous blob or tentacle mass, viewers will have a harder time reading their expressions and understanding their attitudes, so from a storytelling perspective, making them anthropomorphic makes a lot of sense.

Yes, their shape is different enough that they can't pass for humans on Earth, but they are still awfully humanoid for something that isn't even remotely related to us.

Ok, back to my previous point, why do you assume that an anthropoid distribution should be exclusive to creatures evolved on Earth? In fact, if certain traits are prevalent among animals on our planet, it tends to mean that said features offered an evolutive advantage that made them thrive, so it wouldn't be so far fetched to assume that life on other similar worlds evolved along similar routes (and these aliens operate on similar atmospheric and gravitational environments as humans, so their homeworld was probably similar).
As an example, both cephalopods and mammals have eyes, yet they were evolved along different paths.

The thing is that for an species to use tools, and as such create technology, it needs to be able to manipulate objects, that is, arms and hands with opposable thumbs (They could use tentacles or pseudopods, but those types of limbs tend to not fare too well out of the water, and we are discussing creatures that live on similar conditions to us). They could be centauroid, or have snake-like lower halfs, but to the very least you need manipulators. And having your sensory organs and brain on a head has a series of advantages too.

In my opinion, having wacky aliens is always cool, but claiming that anything vaguely anthropoid must mean there is a biological relationship with us reeks of both anthropocentrism and ignorance of evolution.

[Johonebesus]

The aliens this week had a basic humanoid form, complete with a recognizable face of two eyes and a mouth. There's no reason they should mimic our body plan.

The main reason for the aliens looking like they do is that their body language needs to be understandable. If you throw in some amorphous blob or tentacle mass, viewers will have a harder time reading their expressions and understanding their attitudes, so from a storytelling perspective, making them anthropomorphic makes a lot of sense.

Yes, their shape is different enough that they can't pass for humans on Earth, but they are still awfully humanoid for something that isn't even remotely related to us.

Ok, back to my previous point, why do you assume that an anthropoid distribution should be exclusive to creatures evolved on Earth? In fact, if certain traits are prevalent among animals on our planet, it tends to mean that said features offered an evolutive advantage that made them thrive, so it wouldn't be so far fetched to assume that life on other similar worlds evolved along similar routes (and these aliens operate on similar atmospheric and gravitational environments as humans, so their homeworld was probably similar).
As an example, both cephalopods and mammals have eyes, yet they were evolved along different paths.

The thing is that for an species to use tools, and as such create technology, it needs to be able to manipulate objects, that is, arms and hands with opposable thumbs (They could use tentacles or pseudopods, but those types of limbs tend to not fare too well out of the water, and we are discussing creatures that live on similar conditions to us). They could be centauroid, or have snake-like lower halfs, but to the very least you need manipulators. And having your sensory organs and brain on a head has a series of advantages too.

In my opinion, having wacky aliens is always cool, but claiming that anything vaguely anthropoid must mean there is a biological relationship with us reeks of both anthropocentrism and ignorance of evolution.

We are upright because we evolved from animals that adapted to standing up on tree limbs. There are over two hundred million years of bipedal archosaurs, and the only ones to evolve to be upright are penguins, and that stance is not an adaptation to walking on land. We are bipeds because we evolved from four-legged beasts, and the easiest way to evolve manipulators was for our ancestors to modify a pair of limbs, leaving only two legs. We have two eyes on a head and a mouth right beneath that because we evolved from worm like creatures with a tube shaped body plan.

Looking at life on earth, there are plenty of opportunities for creatures to evolve that don't resemble humans or even chordates. I didn't say I had a problem with eyes per se, but rather the arrangement of features on a head. Your first point, that it makes it easier to read body language and so makes sense from a story telling perspective has some merit, but it seems to me that your eagerness to defend the evolution of the humanoid form in a completely unrelated biota "reeks of both anthropocentrism and ignorance of evolution." Even within amniotes, most biologists have roundly condemned the hypothetical dinosauroid as being unlikely, and rather prefer something like Nemo Ramjet's suggestions as much more likely. Could there be humanoids on other planets? Yes it is possible, even likely if there are many, many intelligent species out there, but the odds are most aliens would look very little like us. Our form really is an accident of our evolutionary heritage, not some sort of "ideal" form that evolution must naturally lead to.

[Oskuro]

Again, I'm all for weird new lifeforms, but I find it a bit short-sighted to claim that all occurences of anthropoid lifeforms must be biologically related to Earth. Maybe our evolutionary path is based on accidents and coincidences, but that's natural selection for you at times. Regardless, what evolution proves is that our physical configuration is viable in our environment, thus making it plausible that creatures on other planets with similar environments would have similar evolutionary paths. This doesn't exclude the appearance of weirder creatures, but it doesn't exclude the appearance of similar-looking creatures either.


Now, I belive the reason for the shape of these aliens is purely due to the needs of the medium (a TV series meant for a wide audience) and due to budgetary limitations (harder and thus more expensive to make believable wacky creatures, specially if they are to interact with actors), my secondary point is that their shape can be rationalized without needing to resort to the Ancient ships seeding planets or something.

[adam_grif]

It's necessary to distinguish between traits that resulted in our success, and traits that were incidental to it. This is what irks me when people bring up convergent evolution to justify the shockingly high number of space boobs and rubber forehead aliens in Star Trek.

We see animals with similar bodyforms that perform in similar roles all over Earth, but they're never close to identical, even if their bodyplan is very similar. From the top of my head, the four legged sharp toothed predator has evolved several times in several isolated environments (various big cats, wolves, dogs etc, lots of pre-mammal species had this bodyform too, some reptiles for instance).

[Oskuro]

Exactly, and these new aliens just have their distribution in common with us, their skin, their eyes, their bone structure... It's all different. Heck, if these were the typical forehead aliens so similar to us that there can be crossbreeding, I'd be pointing it out and calling bullshit too, but this desing is pretty alien as it is, I particularly like the sounds they make, and will be thouroughly dissapointed if they have them speak (seeing how they don't even have lips).

[adam_grif]

Yeah, they're good as far as SciFi aliens go. The only thing I'm not too fond of is the psychic probing ballocks. I was kind of hoping that people would just forget that psychics were ever in Stargate and never speak of it again...

[Zac Naloen]

Yeah, they're good as far as SciFi aliens go. The only thing I'm not too fond of is the psychic probing ballocks. I was kind of hoping that people would just forget that psychics were ever in Stargate and never speak of it again...

It's technological mind-reading though, not an evolved trait.


It's like the device that the Goa'uld have back in the Milky Way.