The Legend of the Galactic Heroes

[takemeout_totheblack]

I just wanted to start a thread on a show I feel has been somewhat neglected. This has got to be one of the best shows I have ever seen in my life, no hyperbole! It's an anime (sit down, I'm going somewhere with this) but it doesn't involve any stupid androgynous teenagers wangsting from the cockpit of there super-special-awesome death-wank-prototype mech suit, it's about real people in a realistic war scenario where everyone's in similarly matched ships. Yes, there is the requisite 'wor iz dum' angsting, but it doesn't really spill over into the space battles, which is a plus, the farther away from Gundam: whateverthehell the better right? Now, I've been doing a bit of research (youtube) and I've found most if not all of the major space battles in this series translated.

For those of you who don't know (it's a pretty obscure series) I'll give a brief summary of the plot: it's the 35th century and mankind is divided into two opposing parties, one is the corrupt and impotent space democracy Free Planets Alliance who wage war against their counterpart the militaristic and oh-so-Prussian Galactic Empire. On both sides there are good people and bad people, but the ones we follow are Admiral Yang Wenli of the FPA, and Admiral Reinhard Von Lohengramm. Both are brilliant strategists and both are noble and just, but they constantly battle each other because of space politics (well, initially anyway).

The LotGH has a good amount of material behind it (10 volume novel series, 5 short stories, 11 volume manga, 2 two hour long movies, 3 OVAs, 52 episode side-story series, and a 110 episode main series) but very little has been translated outside of fan dubs on youtube. from what I've seen I've been able to come up with a few nuggets on tech since that's what this site is about.

Ancillary tech
Warp: the war takes place between two spiral arms of the galaxy and both sides seem capable of relatively fast and efficient travel to several points in their respective territories (I'll see if I can scrounge up a map) There seems to be a limitation to their FTL as there are only two points between the arms where 'safe navigation' can be performed, one being the infamous Iserlohn passage but that's for later. Oh, and it seems to involve something called 'null space' (hyperspace?)
Power generation: both sides are apparently capable of some fairly impressive power (getting a 40 trillion ton battle station to 8000 kph in 3 seconds using massively scaled up propulsion tech, lasers capable of vaporizing thousands of starships). Fusion? BIG fusion?

Starships
Battleships: both sides run the gamut in terms of warships and such, the smallest are the roughly 30-40 meter long Spartainian/Valkyrie fighters while the largest are over a click long, Hyperion Class Battleships on the FPA side and the Imperial flagship Brunhild are the biggest, but most seem to be between 600 and 900 meters long, Imp ships are even capable of landing planetside. The Imperials have two huge battle stations, the 60km Iserlohn fortress and the 45km Geiersburg fortress, both with some kind of refractive liquid metal armor and both have a massive X-Ray laser weapon called the Thor Hammer and Vulture's Claw respectively. The give numbers on these weapons are somewhat incongruous with what is seen, only the Vulture's claw is given an output so far as I know "X-Ray beam cannon, with a wavelength of 100 angstroms. Its output power is 740,000,000 megawatts." whatever that means. While Iserlohn's output is never given, both stations appear to be somewhat evenly matched and Iserlohn's Thor Hammer has been seen vaporizing several thousand 600-900meter long warships in less than a second, I'm no PhD but I think it takes a little more oomph than 740TW to do that. So yeah, feel free to crunch a few numbers if you feel so inclined.

That's about all I've been able to come across, if anyone else has a thing to add feel free! It's a shame there are no plans to have this series translated officially, there are so many space opera fans missing out!

Geiresburg specs

Geiersburg speed

[Ford Prefect]

I just wanted to start a thread on a show I feel has been somewhat neglected. This has got to be one of the best shows I have ever seen in my life, no hyperbole! It's an anime (sit down, I'm going somewhere with this) but it doesn't involve any stupid androgynous teenagers wangsting from the cockpit of there super-special-awesome death-wank-prototype mech suit, it's about real people in a realistic war scenario where everyone's in similarly matched ships. Yes, there is the requisite 'wor iz dum' angsting, but it doesn't really spill over into the space battles, which is a plus, the farther away from Gundam: whateverthehell the better right? Now, I've been doing a bit of research (youtube) and I've found most if not all of the major space battles in this series translated.

You could not believe how hard I rolled my eyes when reading this. This is a just plain awful way to introduce any series, let alone something like The Legend. I couldn't actually get through the entirety of your post, and I think LOGH is basically the best piece of visual space opera ever made. You spent more time talking about what it's not (in fact you spent more time talking about what Gundam is not, but I digress), than what it actually offers to the viewer.

What LOGH offers, more than anything else I think, is a huge cast of memorable characters, and you will remember them because they get their names thrown up in text practically once an episode. I mean, I guess I could say that it really is 'epic' in scope, in the sense that it actually feels like events are happening on a truly galactic scale, but I don't think that's really relevant to why the series is so memorable. I think that has more to do with its dry wit and strongly handled central theme.

[takemeout_totheblack]

I just wanted to start a thread on a show I feel has been somewhat neglected. This has got to be one of the best shows I have ever seen in my life, no hyperbole! It's an anime (sit down, I'm going somewhere with this) but it doesn't involve any stupid androgynous teenagers wangsting from the cockpit of there super-special-awesome death-wank-prototype mech suit, it's about real people in a realistic war scenario where everyone's in similarly matched ships. Yes, there is the requisite 'wor iz dum' angsting, but it doesn't really spill over into the space battles, which is a plus, the farther away from Gundam: whateverthehell the better right? Now, I've been doing a bit of research (youtube) and I've found most if not all of the major space battles in this series translated.

You could not believe how hard I rolled my eyes when reading this. This is a just plain awful way to introduce any series, let alone something like The Legend. I couldn't actually get through the entirety of your post, and I think LOGH is basically the best piece of visual space opera ever made. You spent more time talking about what it's not (in fact you spent more time talking about what Gundam is not, but I digress), than what it actually offers to the viewer.

What LOGH offers, more than anything else I think, is a huge cast of memorable characters, and you will remember them because they get their names thrown up in text practically once an episode. I mean, I guess I could say that it really is 'epic' in scope, in the sense that it actually feels like events are happening on a truly galactic scale, but I don't think that's really relevant to why the series is so memorable. I think that has more to do with its dry wit and strongly handled central theme.

You did read the second paragraph of my post right?

I couldn't actually get through the entirety of your post

Oh...
Anyway, I have to agree, I'm not much of a sales person and I try to avoid the word 'epic' whenever I can, seems tacky to me. But I'm glad that this show gets the love and attention it deserves from the few people who've seen it! I mean, sure its got a lot of love from the Japanese, but I don't speak or read Japanese. So yeah, 660 named characters, each with their own lines and more than a few have their own established personalities outside of the main cast, it's actually like the writers felt there were other characters aside from the main ones, that almost never happens! Also, the breathtaking scale of the battles, thousands and thousands of ships, and the battles are actually won by strategy and the brilliance of the admirals, not some stupid kids who... I've been through this before. The music is grand and the story is engaging, I order anyone who sees themselves as a scifi nerd to check it out, I recommend The Battle of Vermillion, it pretty much sums up how awesome this series is.



But enough fan-boy prattle, what of the tech?

[takemeout_totheblack]

I forgot to add, there are 4 parts to that battle, so go check them out!

[Sarevok]

Noted. I am in the mood for some spacebattle porn after much wangst in personal life.

[Srelex]

I've seen it, and although it gets rather snooze-inducingly dull at times, the battles and drama are quite well done at their best.

[Koolaidkirby]

TLGH was an amazing show, at least until Spoiler

yang wenli dies

with a ridiculously large cast that knows how large it is and constantly reminds you who[s who and who has what flagships. Its a show that focus' on strategy and character development rather than the powers of teenage angst

[Vympel]

Saw the first episode, seems decent so far, though its hard to keep track of who's who and the animation is of course quite dated.

[phred]

Someone somewhere(I want to say here, but I'm not sure) suggested this series before. I wasn't aware of any of it outside the main series. Any idea where I could get my hands on it? Preferably translated in some form since my Japanese is nowhere near good enough to do it myself.

[Zor]

Someone somewhere(I want to say here, but I'm not sure) suggested this series before. I wasn't aware of any of it outside the main series. Any idea where I could get my hands on it? Preferably translated in some form since my Japanese is nowhere near good enough to do it myself.

Tragically outside of a few subtitled versions (which i saw on youtube), there has been no attempts to bring it into the english language.

Zor

[scythewielder]

As far as I'm concerned, LOGH is one of the very few anime titles that successfully tells an ambitious story on a grand scale and manages to do so with a surprising degree of maturity. You can definitely see that this was originally based on a sci-fi novel series, first and foremost, and luckily enough the adaptation was made at a time when the OVA format was booming. Today we would probably never see such an extravagant production again or, at best, its length would be severely limited (like what happened with Tytania...sort of).

It seems intimidating to keep up with all the different individuals and their names, let alone all the technical details involved, but I can say the show provided enough breathing room for character development and, perhaps more importantly for me, also delivered plenty of food for thought as far as history and politics are concerned. It's all fiction, in the end, but the themes and concepts involved remained relatively relevant and down-to-earth instead of drifting off into the realm of vague, inscrutable idealism as most anime tends to do.

[phred]

Someone somewhere(I want to say here, but I'm not sure) suggested this series before. I wasn't aware of any of it outside the main series. Any idea where I could get my hands on it? Preferably translated in some form since my Japanese is nowhere near good enough to do it myself.

Tragically outside of a few subtitled versions (which i saw on youtube), there has been no attempts to bring it into the english language.

Zor

Well I've got the entire main series with subtitles. I wish I could remember where from, but I lost the torrent info when I reset my computer

[Vympel]

Be careful not to talk about illegal stuff guys.

[Koolaidkirby]

Be careful not to talk about illegal stuff guys.

Fan subtitling has actually become quasi legal (for certain anime's) now with websites like Crunchyroll, which get their video's directly from the creators (TV TOKYO, Shueisha, Fuji Creative Corporation, Pony Canyon, Yomiuri Telecasting Corporation, Toei Animation, Gonzo, Munhwa Broadcasting of America + more according to their site) and have their community translate it for them, who in return get a slice of their membership + advertising money where they would normally get none.

unfortunately LotGH isn't a part of this

[MarshalPurnell]

It's an absolutely brilliant series. Unlike most stories it seems to revel in the moral ambiguity which marks real life, and its expansive set of characters enjoys a lot of loving attention paid to their development and motivations. Only a handful of points in the 110-episode long series seem to be a result of arbitrary narrative decision, and no one is simply stupid for the sake of it. The clash between Reinhard and Yang Wenli is a perfect picture of a rivalry untainted with personal hatred, just as the war between the Galactic Empire and the Free Planets Alliance is believable mixture of good and bad on both sides. The characterization, the even hand toward the factions, and the low key way in which the anti-war moral is presented allows the plot to stand on its own as a true drama - a fiction that presents something of the truth of the human condition. It is philosophic, it can be long-winded, but usually those points are still interesting and insightful which makes them tolerable, and the most evocative anti-war point is never spoken but rather shown in the mangled bodies of the crewmen killed in the first climatic battle between Reinhard and Yang.

There are problems with scale, which is still much too small for how long the human race has been in space but far bigger visually than any live-action series has ever attempted. The animation tends to be reused for very common shots but the battles remain quite exciting and diverse, at best true chess matches. But the real attraction is the massive cast of characters and their interactions.

[Vympel]

Well it's fair to say I'm immersed now, I'm five episodes in. I looked it up on Wikipedia - it ran from what, something like 1988 to 1997!!! A look at the animation quality in later episodes compared to the first made that obvious, too (I checked without spoiling myself)

[Ford Prefect]

Well it's fair to say I'm immersed now, I'm five episodes in. I looked it up on Wikipedia - it ran from what, something like 1988 to 1997!!! A look at the animation quality in later episodes compared to the first made that obvious, too (I checked without spoiling myself)

It also pretty much involved every voice actor of the 80s at some point. To call it a huge project is probably a little disengenuous, I honestly can't think of anything quite like it. I mean, yeah, there are some televised anime series which are longer, but The Legend was originally OVA: it was released on tape first. And this isn't considering the 52 episode side story OVAs. It's also good to see you enjoying it ... because otherwise it would totally discredit you.

[Uraniun235]

It's worth noting that LOGH is adapted from a series of books of the same name.

It's an absolutely brilliant series. Unlike most stories it seems to revel in the moral ambiguity which marks real life, and its expansive set of characters enjoys a lot of loving attention paid to their development and motivations. Only a handful of points in the 110-episode long series seem to be a result of arbitrary narrative decision, and no one is simply stupid for the sake of it. The clash between Reinhard and Yang Wenli is a perfect picture of a rivalry untainted with personal hatred, just as the war between the Galactic Empire and the Free Planets Alliance is believable mixture of good and bad on both sides. The characterization, the even hand toward the factions, and the low key way in which the anti-war moral is presented allows the plot to stand on its own as a true drama - a fiction that presents something of the truth of the human condition. It is philosophic, it can be long-winded, but usually those points are still interesting and insightful which makes them tolerable, and the most evocative anti-war point is never spoken but rather shown in the mangled bodies of the crewmen killed in the first climatic battle between Reinhard and Yang.

There are problems with scale, which is still much too small for how long the human race has been in space but far bigger visually than any live-action series has ever attempted. The animation tends to be reused for very common shots but the battles remain quite exciting and diverse, at best true chess matches. But the real attraction is the massive cast of characters and their interactions.

Which problems of scale are you referring to?

There is one glaring flaw in the series, and that is the Earth Cult; they get progressively more cartoonishly bad as the series goes on, and I suspect that the writer was either too indulgent or didn't quite know what to do with them.

[Vympel]

It also pretty much involved every voice actor of the 80s at some point. To call it a huge project is probably a little disengenuous, I honestly can't think of anything quite like it. I mean, yeah, there are some televised anime series which are longer, but The Legend was originally OVA: it was released on tape first. And this isn't considering the 52 episode side story OVAs. It's also good to see you enjoying it ... because otherwise it would totally discredit you.

Well it's one of the two anime series I like now. The other being Tekkaman / Teknoman

Anyway, I just saw where the Alliance captured Iserlohn. The garrison being a mere 50 men was pretty ridiculous, but otherwise it was fun.

[Stofsk]

There is one glaring flaw in the series, and that is the Earth Cult; they get progressively more cartoonishly bad as the series goes on, and I suspect that the writer was either too indulgent or didn't quite know what to do with them.

Heh. Cartoonish villains on a cartoon? Scandalous!

[Uraniun235]

Well, like I said, it's based off a series of novels.

Anyway, I just saw where the Alliance captured Iserlohn. The garrison being a mere 50 men was pretty ridiculous, but otherwise it was fun.

That was after the station was locked down, wasn't it? I would imagine the total station garrison is much bigger. It does seem odd that the forces around the main computer core would be relatively light, although the defense planners may not have considered an assault originating from the command center likely.

Thor's Hammer is pretty rad, though.

[Ford Prefect]

Iserlohn itself is majorly rad. I mean, I'd heard of it prior to watching the series, but then I watch the first movie and it is actually a huge spherical mirror? Totally boss.

[phred]

There are problems with scale, which is still much too small for how long the human race has been in space but far bigger visually than any live-action series has ever attempted.

It is an interesting mix of huge but still too small scale. The idea of Iserlohn, a 50km fortress, controlling as much space as it seems to is rather odd when you consider the idea that 20k ships is a tiny fleet and battles are routinely carried out at beyond visual range. Spoiler

The episode where the Empire tries strapping engines to another fortress to get Iserlohn back was pretty awesome though

[Grandmaster Jogurt]

Iserlohn itself is majorly rad. I mean, I'd heard of it prior to watching the series, but then I watch the first movie and it is actually a huge spherical mirror? Totally boss.

Liquid metal Death Star! The visuals of ships passing in and out and flying around the interior are all pretty great.

I've only seen the first half of this series before. I'd been meaning to watch it again from the beginning, but this thread is what finally kicked it off. I'm already most of the way through season one again.

[Uraniun235]

There are problems with scale, which is still much too small for how long the human race has been in space but far bigger visually than any live-action series has ever attempted.

It is an interesting mix of huge but still too small scale. The idea of Iserlohn, a 50km fortress, controlling as much space as it seems to is rather odd when you consider the idea that 20k ships is a tiny fleet and battles are routinely carried out at beyond visual range.

Iserlohn doesn't seem like it could be only fifty kilometers wide, those ships seem too big for so many to fit in it. Although, that shouldn't really matter for what you're talking about; in terms of space controlled, it wouldn't make much difference if Iserlohn was 50 or 5000km wide. Iserlohn Corridor is itself a silly contrivance, but it's not that bad as space opera goes; I get the feeling it got retconned a little as the show went on, but it pretty consistently serves its purpose as being the main bottleneck between the Alliance and the Empire.