Moderator: NecronLord
). Rating titles inspired by NecronLord's.
Not a spoiler.Of course I loved the part when Chloe admitted what we all already know:
She's worse than useless, she's actively sabotaging things and insisting that she be in charge instead of the people who know what the fuck is going on. Why is she still alive? I mean shit, Rush is at least extremely useful and we've already had an attempted murder on him. She's only going to give them more headaches in the long run, I think it's well within their rights to use a bit of 9mm aspirin.Camille seems second in uselessness only to Chloe.
I'm going to be thoroughly disappointed if this is the last we see of them, though. They seem like the sort to be recurring antagonists, but I still cry myself to sleep when I think about those one-shot aliens on SG-1 that had the mind-reading neural links, hologram tech so good they could make anybody look like anybody else and the ability to pass through the Iris unphased. They took over the SGC, got driven off, and were never seen again.I wasn't expecting the aliens to return so quickly in the next episode, but it was kind of nice that they did, and with three times the number.
The Foothold aliens? They didn't exactly pass through the Iris, if I remember correctly they abducted an SG team, disguised themselves as said team and infiltrated the base that way. It wasn't like they were able to simply walk through the Iris like the Tollans did. And yes, it was a shame they never returned. Neither did the Ree'tou, or the Crystal Skull aliens, or ... hell that list could go on for quite a while. Kinda a waste.adam_grif wrote:They seem like the sort to be recurring antagonists, but I still cry myself to sleep when I think about those one-shot aliens on SG-1 that had the mind-reading neural links, hologram tech so good they could make anybody look like anybody else and the ability to pass through the Iris unphased. They took over the SGC, got driven off, and were never seen again.
Thanks, I was just erring on the side of caution. I know that the 'to spoiler' or 'not to spoiler' issue has sometimes been a bit fuzzy.CaptJodan wrote:No need for spoilers in the topic itself. We assume if you're here, you saw it.
I though it added a nice twist to the tension, especially since they correctly didn't hint at them being back in the previews. If the writers/producers stick with what they original claimed (i.e., hopping to a new galaxy every season, and hence having new antagonists), then I would assume that they will work them in as much as possible for the remaining S1 episodes. However, Rush seems to indicate that they've been interested in, and thus trying to get hold of Destiny for quite a while. So that could indicate that they're either advanced enough to easily travel between galaxies, or possibly that they're following Destiny around with a small fleet.CaptJodan wrote:I wasn't expecting the aliens to return so quickly in the next episode, but it was kind of nice that they did, and with three times the number. Again, I find issue with their tactics though. Had they used their fighters in addition to their larger ships, they probably would have punched through the shields sufficiently to...do whatever it was they were intending to do. What was that again? Capture the ship? Given that they can easily pass through the shields to board the ship (and after a while they should have realized the ship wasn't going to defend itself) they could have easily sent boarding parties over. It wasn't going to get much easier than that without causing major damage to what they claim they want to capture intact.
Gawd yes, she's become a royal cunt. I originally thought she was just playing IAO bitch as she's probably expected to; it seems to be their SOP. But when she went back home and we actually got to see her as more of a human being, I was actually starting to like her. While I wasn't surprised by her initial stepping up to take command, I figured we'd at least see a little more depth and indecisiveness to her character's actions, a little more: "I really want to get home, but I'm in over my head. what do I do? Who do I side with?"CaptJodan wrote:Camille seems second in uselessness only to Chloe. Her motives are unclear much of the time. She tried out command not two episodes ago and found herself somewhat lacking. So naturally she tries again with a mutiny, only to find out she was never in charge then either. She's not an effective leader in any sense, and it seems like she's there just to piss everyone off. The only time she seemed less like your typical IOA stooge was when she went home. If there was someone who could be punished for their role in the mutiny without affecting much of the work on the ship, she'd be a prime choice.
Well they could lock him up in the lab, but short of having Rodney McKay there to keep tabs on what he's doing (Eli sure isn't up to it), it would only make him harder to deal with.CaptJodan wrote:They can't realistically lock up Rush.
They certainly didn't have time to show all of the fallout from the mutiny, but I was hoping for a kind of reversal from last weeks ending, with Chloe sitting alone in bed crying.CaptJodan wrote:If Scott decides that Chloe went too far, she'll basically lose any usefulness she had on the ship as Scott's bed toy. She really needs to actively pursue a job of some kind.
The fate of the Trust is still a dangling thread from SG-1; I doubt even Ba'al's final death crippled the organization, so it could work.Revy wrote:adam_grif wrote:You know what would have been a nice plot twist? If one of Ba'als goa'uld/trust underlings managed to body-snatch one of the team prior to the series beginning, in order to learn what the project was all about, and ended up stuck on the ship. They could even hint at it by having said goa'uld avoid using the stones for fear of how they would work on him/her. And they never did track down Athena, did they?
I'd think that's unlikely. Too much like Atlantis' snake-episode Critical Mass.adam_grif wrote:You know what would have been a nice plot twist? If one of Ba'als goa'uld/trust underlings managed to body-snatch one of the team prior to the series beginning, in order to learn what the project was all about, and ended up stuck on the ship. They could even hint at it by having said goa'uld avoid using the stones for fear of how they would work on him/her. And they never did track down Athena, did they?
SpoilerJME2 wrote:Spoiler
Wray came out of the gate on day one trying to not only boss people around when she had no real authority, but made good progress on not trying to work with the military people. At each stage of the process, she's put the finger to the military, up to and including taking Greer off of assignments because she doesn't trust him, even though he's shown up to this point to be fairly reliable man.NecronLord wrote:I'm not getting the Wray hate, mind. The Colonel's running the ship isn't working. Witness how almost anyone not in a uniform seemed happy to try and depose him. Yeah.
Are you fucking kidding me? The damned clock was counting down till it could jump again, and even had Eli calling out time till jumping, which corresponded to when the shields were about to fail. He said they'd jump in a little over a minute, and sure enough, that's when they jumped by episode time. Are you saying that the ship was just counting down, from the moment it jumped into the system, how long until it's shields failed by time? That's ridiculous.On a technical note, Destiny jumped away the moment the shields were about to fail. Circumstantial evidence for her being programmed to do so?
Yes, the leadership fucking fails on Destiny. Young is shown here to be about as effective as a chocolate teapot. We know the enemy have access to stargates (one of their pods ditched near one, and there was no mention of a survivor or bodies, and of course, they've been probing Rush's mind) and yet he's posted no standing guard on the ship's gate, or if he has it's one guy with a sidearm.CaptJodan wrote:Wray came out of the gate on day one trying to not only boss people around when she had no real authority, but made good progress on not trying to work with the military people. At each stage of the process, she's put the finger to the military, up to and including taking Greer off of assignments because she doesn't trust him, even though he's shown up to this point to be fairly reliable man.
She takes charge, then backs off. Takes charge again, only to realize she never really was in charge. She's shown very little desire to work with the military except by her own decree, and while I wouldn't say Young is any better in this area than she is, he's been right more often than wrong in most cases. Where he was wrong, he admitted fault.
I'm not saying Young is perfect, and if there were other options I wouldn't consider them. But from the standpoint of the three possible options we have so far....the power hungry incompetent bitch, the guy who has no interest in returning home, and the military officer who was framed by a guy who promised he'd never stop trying to betray him and left him to die because of it, I think I'd pick the latter.
Really? I thought Eli was pretty vague on when it'd jump. The clock was going, but there's no actual shots of it around that time. Perhaps that is an unwarranted assumption, I'll grant, but it does seem convenient.Are you fucking kidding me? The damned clock was counting down till it could jump again, and even had Eli calling out time till jumping, which corresponded to when the shields were about to fail. He said they'd jump in a little over a minute, and sure enough, that's when they jumped by episode time. Are you saying that the ship was just counting down, from the moment it jumped into the system, how long until it's shields failed by time? That's ridiculous.
We do, sort of. See the calcs I ran for her acceleration in Light. If she wasn't slowing down to dock with the shuttle in that episode, then her standard acceleration is truly piteous, on the order of forty gravities, though that is a low end figure. It seems much more likely she picked that particular speed so the shuttle could dock.Face it, if Destiny could jump at any time, then it WAITED until it took damage this week. It was stated that they sustained damage. There was NO reason for the ship to stand there and take a pounding. No gate was activated. No one left the ship (and we can see how much the ship cares about that too, given that it was going to jump without the shuttle's clamps being engaged).
Destiny's stardrive appears to be realspace, like ST's warp. Presumably it needs shields to prevent impacts (like navigational deflectors, in fact).It did not run when it's shields were about to fail, it ran because, according to its clock, it was time to go.
On an actual technical note, it appears as if the shields need to be working in some way for FTL to be safe, which is interesting because the Asgard and other ships cannot run shields in hyperspace. Thus, hyperspace must be far less turbulent or destructive to ships than whatever Destiny uses.
I'm not sure that's completely fair. Somewhat fair, but not completely. The seeded gates don't come equipped with a DHD, so gaining access to them at least wouldn't be TOO trivial (though yes, it can be done). But we really can't say they have actual access, as in all the requirements to use the gates. Just because there were no bodies in the very limited area that they walked to and from the gate doesn't mean that they went though said gate.NecronLord wrote:We know the enemy have access to stargates (one of their pods ditched near one, and there was no mention of a survivor or bodies, and of course, they've been probing Rush's mind) and yet he's posted no standing guard on the ship's gate, or if he has it's one guy with a sidearm.
Let me ask, have you taken the time to learn what those symbols mean so as to be able to read the clock? It wouldn't surprise me if you had, but if not, a shot of the clock isn't likely to help.Really? I thought Eli was pretty vague on when it'd jump. The clock was going, but there's no actual shots of it around that time.
You take way too much joy in this.Nah, mostly I just put that one in there to tweak you. In reality, Destiny seems to need to build up power before jumping or something. Spoilers suggest we'll get a much better idea how her FTL works in a future episode though.
I have not seen these calcs, but why would the ship assume the crew would have the foresight to call for a slingshot around a planet to gain acceleration the shuttle didn't have? Then, even after that, why would the ship then not slow it's acceleration just a little bit more so that they could have more than an almost suicidal landing? What was the harm in slowing down another 5 m/s to ensure a more controlled touchdown?We do, sort of. See the calcs I ran for her acceleration in Light. If she wasn't slowing down to dock with the shuttle in that episode, then her standard acceleration is truly piteous, on the order of forty gravities, though that is a low end figure. It seems much more likely she picked that particular speed so the shuttle could dock.
Still leaves people and equipment behind. The ship is pretty fanatical when it comes to keeping to its schedule.Given the other safety protocol, I imagine she wouldn't just run the shuttle over, but would rather thrust away from it and then go into FTL. Eli did say that was a worst case scenario in his estimation, after all.
Uhh, I didn't make that statement. JME2 just rooted up his quote tags.I'd think that's unlikely. Too much like Atlantis' snake-episode Critical Mass.
The implication was that she was spreading discontent and mistrust off-screen, it's obvious that they've been planning this for a while. But I hate her so much because she's already had a go at command and she fucking failed. She's not cut out for that shit, but she insists that she is. She claims she's just "putting civilians in charge", when really she just wants to trade a dictatorship lead by Col. Young for a dictatorship lead by Megabitch Wray.I'm not getting the Wray hate, mind. The Colonel's running the ship isn't working. Witness how almost anyone not in a uniform seemed happy to try and depose him. Yeah.
There's no reason they can't compromise and have the civilians decide on civilian issues and when they come under attack from aliens, the Colonel takes charge until the immediate threat is over. It may not be a military vessel, but it's got a large number of military personnel, and more importantly, they've started facing real military threats.The rebels have a point, mind. Destiny does need a different style of governance, it's not a warship, and they're not it's crew.
Actually... I have. The clock is impressively consistent.CaptJodan wrote:Let me ask, have you taken the time to learn what those symbols mean so as to be able to read the clock? It wouldn't surprise me if you had, but if not, a shot of the clock isn't likely to help.
Mwhahaha.You take way too much joy in this.
The Ancients have been star-faring for millions of years by the time they built Destiny Literally millions of years. I'm pretty sure that'd be a routine manoeuvre for them.I have not seen these calcs, but why would the ship assume the crew would have the foresight to call for a slingshot around a planet to gain acceleration the shuttle didn't have?
To quote a friend of mine:Then, even after that, why would the ship then not slow it's acceleration just a little bit more so that they could have more than an almost suicidal landing? What was the harm in slowing down another 5 m/s to ensure a more controlled touchdown?
No. They suggest that Destiny wasn't flooring it, but aiming to allow the shuttle a chance to dock.More likely, Destiny wasn't accelerating away at maximum speed, but at a fairly leisurely pace, which the shuttle still couldn't match. The question is, do your calcs prove the shuttle has pitiful acceleration?
Indeed.Still leaves people and equipment behind. The ship is pretty fanatical when it comes to keeping to its schedule.
It makes them look incredibly pathetic that they can't even do a door lock properly. And seriously, what was the plan? Civilian authority in command? So, when they order a military thing, what happens? Do they call in Young to have him decide how to do it? How would this change anything for anybody? It's not like the Military is getting the best rations and bunks and so forth.CaptainChewbacca wrote:I loved that the civilians' plan to sieze control of the ship lasted for all of about 40 minutes before they were surrounded by armed troops.
If they could get Carter and McKay to fucking body swap with some people, they'll have it in working order in like four hours. They really don't have an excuse for not having professionals on the ship at all times, swapping with the bodies of useless fucking idiots like Wray and Chloe.Covenant wrote: I want to see them doing a Robinson Crusoe In Space thing on this ship, jury-rigging shit to make it work, not squabbling about who gets to command the ship.
They could even benefit by swapping Mitchell in, silly as that sounds, or Picardo's guy. I feel that Young is simply not fit for a leadership position. He's barely shown any serious discipline, especially self-discipline, and I do not get the feeling he's very smart either. Especially considering how bad any of his technical commands are--like diverting power from shields to weapons despite having to know how pointless that would be. He seems nearly passionless and creatively bankrupt except when it comes to ego-driven macho behavior like punching Telford or punching Rush.adam_grif wrote:If they could get Carter and McKay to fucking body swap with some people, they'll have it in working order in like four hours. They really don't have an excuse for not having professionals on the ship at all times, swapping with the bodies of useless fucking idiots like Wray and Chloe.
I think the past two episodes prove conclusively why you can't have "swapped in" people being in charge and running critical positions. Having them come in to advise and do specialist repairs and whatnot, sure, but them being permanently swapped in would cause problems if the link fails at an inopportune moment - and we've just seen that that situation is very much possible during a crisis.Covenant wrote:They could even benefit by swapping Mitchell in, silly as that sounds, or Picardo's guy. I feel that Young is simply not fit for a leadership position. He's barely shown any serious discipline, especially self-discipline, and I do not get the feeling he's very smart either. Especially considering how bad any of his technical commands are--like diverting power from shields to weapons despite having to know how pointless that would be. He seems nearly passionless and creatively bankrupt except when it comes to ego-driven macho behavior like punching Telford or punching Rush.
I found it amazingly shortsighted of Rush and co for not accounting the hole the aliens made on their end of the ship and that there were space suits on Young's end. I was tempted on giving the episode a three for this stupidity.CaptainChewbacca wrote:I loved that the civilians' plan to sieze control of the ship lasted for all of about 40 minutes before they were surrounded by armed troops.
That's something that has seriously surprised me. I can understand them not having guest stars, or even different extras showing up as specialists every episode; obviously there are time and budgetary constraints. But at least allude to the fact that specialists are coming aboard to help out on a semi-regular basis.adam_grif wrote:If they could get Carter and McKay to fucking body swap with some people, they'll have it in working order in like four hours. They really don't have an excuse for not having professionals on the ship at all times, swapping with the bodies of useless fucking idiots like Wray and Chloe.Covenant wrote: I want to see them doing a Robinson Crusoe In Space thing on this ship, jury-rigging shit to make it work, not squabbling about who gets to command the ship.
Well, not a ton of proof, but if Young had killed Rush and left him on that planet his first order of business shoulda' been swapping home to request McKay and Zolenka swap in to help get Eli get the systems running, not yelling at the fat nerd for not knowing how to run an ancient ship written in a language he can't understand that well.Temujin wrote:Granted there's no proof that their not doing it, we just haven't really seen much of it.
