Volcanic eruption closes down UK/Scandinavian airports

[CaptainChewbacca]

Volcanic ash is surprisingly good for the environment. I imagine western europe's harvest season will get a bit of a boost, as long as the sun doesn't go dim.

[El Moose Monstero]

Volcanic ash is surprisingly good for the environment. I imagine western europe's harvest season will get a bit of a boost, as long as the sun doesn't go dim.

Actually, there've not really been any cases where you can record a short term beneficial effect from ashfall events that you can't attribute to the physical mass of ash, and so may not be of any significance at this distance. Long term, of course, volcanic ash is good for soil development, but not on our timescales. In the short term, I doubt there'll be any impact at all on harvests or soil fertility, particularly with the abundant use of fertilisers in developed nations, soil nutrient requirements are generally met. The only example of a beneficial impact that I know of attributed to ash chemistry is Cronin (1997) on Ruapehu, but that was in S limiting soils with an ash coated with very large amounts of elemental S. The other benefits you will get from ash deposition are those from the soil physical properties, but again, at this distance, I doubt that there'll be any influence on soil water retention or any adverse effects due to the deposited layer. About the only effect I could think of would be detrimental, as since icelandic volcanoes contain so much fluoride, there might be some aqueous acids on the ash surfaces upon deposition, particularly given that it's a phreatomagmatic eruption, so you could possibly get some minor foliage damage from acids, but that would really depend on the leachate data, and I've not seen that as yet, so I'm guessing there.

[Admiral Valdemar]

Volcanic ash is surprisingly good for the environment. I imagine western europe's harvest season will get a bit of a boost, as long as the sun doesn't go dim.

Unless it has high concentrations of hydrogen fluoride, then you've issues.

[Spin Echo]

We were supposed to head to Italy on Wednesday. Fucking hell...

I'm supposed to be flying to Dubai on Wednesday... through Heathrow. I hope they let me change my flights to go through somewhere else, preferably a direct flight from say, New York.

[Broomstick]

I've just been out for a walk around the fields. The clear azure blue sky devoid of aircraft is different.

I live under the airways for two very large airports (O'Hare and Midway) plus sundry smaller ones. I remember the empty skies in September 2001 as being quite... different. Eerie and beautiful at the same time.

At least no one died to empty your skies. There is that.

[Siege]

Thanks for the explanation with respect to environmental factors, people. It's one of the great things I appreciate about this board: one asks a question, and within the space of mere hours one is informed by people who can know such things about the details of what's going on. Your input is much appreciated.

The Dutch national airline chimed in with a damage assessment: according to the director of KLM his airline is losing € 5 - 10 million per day that liners remain grounded in Western Europe. The company is also not insured for this kind of thing because it falls under the "act of God" clause, which makes sense. According to Mr. Hartman this situation is (freely translated) "pretty disastrous", mainly because there's crews, passengers and aircraft stuck in locations that can't fly to where they are supposed to go, and because crews and aircraft are scheduled to go from said places to other places where they can't go either the effect compounds. If delays take longer than 24 hours to resolve (which they already have) it'll take several days to get aircraft moving on track again, so KLM air travel will be disrupted at least until early next week. I doubt it'll be much better for other airlines: KLM is a fairly big company, merged with Air France and part of an alliance with (among others) Delta, Alitalia and Aeroflot. It can take a hit. It remains to be seen if all other airlines can do so as well.

[Serafina]

While the impact on airlines propably won't be as bad as 9/11 (due to an lack of aftereffects), it is more likely to hit airlines pretty unevenly - obviously, airlines with a lot of traffic in europe will be affected far worse. Which is perhaps even worse for bussiness.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Volcanic ash is surprisingly good for the environment. I imagine western europe's harvest season will get a bit of a boost, as long as the sun doesn't go dim.

Erm... there was a time period of during the age of the dinosaurs where there was a high period of volcanic eruptions and there was something of an extinction if I recall vaguely. So yes, good for the environment, bad for living animals (and plants).

[El Moose Monstero]

Volcanic ash is surprisingly good for the environment. I imagine western europe's harvest season will get a bit of a boost, as long as the sun doesn't go dim.

Erm... there was a time period of during the age of the dinosaurs where there was a high period of volcanic eruptions and there was something of an extinction if I recall vaguely. So yes, good for the environment, bad for living animals (and plants).

Actually, under the right circumstances, ash can be beneficial to plants and phytoplankton, so way to take the extreme end of the volcanic world as a blanket statement and completely missing his point. The interactions between ash and the environment are highly complex and dependent on specific combinations of circumstance to be able to produce both beneficial and detrimental effects, and much more information is needed before the potential impacts of this eruption can be considered properly.

[Rye]

My parents and my stepsister's family appear to be stuck in Spain right now, so we're not sure when they can get back. Still, they have a lovely house out there, so it could be a lot worse.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Actually, under the right circumstances, ash can be beneficial to plants and phytoplankton, so way to take the extreme end of the volcanic world as a blanket statement and completely missing his point. The interactions between ash and the environment are highly complex and dependent on specific combinations of circumstance to be able to produce both beneficial and detrimental effects, and much more information is needed before the potential impacts of this eruption can be considered properly.

So how is it a blanket statement, when I highlighted a caveat in his statement? If you want a less extreme example, there was the Krakatoa eruption in the 19th century. Yes, it is good, assuming the ash doesn't flood and bury all the plants or block out the sunlight for months in a row.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

EDIT: I also meant to add that the ash might have too much by way of sulphur or other rather acidic/alkalinic materials that may dissolve in water and be a possible irritant.

[Admiral Valdemar]

Prelim ash analysis shows high concentrations of silicates and Ti and Fe. There are reports that the eruption may continue to produce a pulsed profile until either the original blockage of basaltic crust and glacial deposits are shifted (apparently someone saw lava glow on one webcam at night), or something more dramatic happens. I see some suggesting this is still a throat clearing phase, as leftover material from 1821 is removed via explosive force now that it is mostly solid, and that the water and ice are cooling a layer between each renewed detonation, causing variations in plume production and height.

It's still hitting 8 klicks up and the wind direction hasn't significantly changed. There is still the potential for Katla to be brought in, or others as one BBC correspondent has seen this as the opening to renewed geologic activity on Iceland.

[Broomstick]

So.... when do flights resume in Northern Europe and the UK? Is stuff still mostly grounded?

[Serafina]

So.... when do flights resume in Northern Europe and the UK? Is stuff still mostly grounded?

Airports are closed at least until Sunday, in Germany at least.

Of course, it depdens on how the situation develops and could be extended if the eruption doesn't get weaker or the wind turns.

[FSTargetDrone]

Amusingly, John Cleese took a £3,300 (roughly $4,400 US) taxi ride to get from Oslo to Brussels due to grounded flights:

John Cleese takes £3,300 taxi across Europe to beat ash flight chaos

John Cleese, the Monty Python and Fawlty Towers star, paid £3,300 to take a cab from Oslo to Brussels after being stranded in Norway by volcanic ash travel chaos.

By Alastair Jamieson

Published: 9:45AM BST 17 Apr 2010

The comedian was stuck after volcanic ash caused airspace across Europe to be closed, forcing the cancellation of all but a small number of flights.

After ferries and trains were booked up, his assistant chose to send him in a taxi to Brussels, from where he could get a Eurostar train to London.

Cleese, 70, said: "We checked every option but there were no boats and no train tickets available. That's when my fabulous assistant determined the easiest thing would be to take a taxi."

Cleese, who was visiting the Norwegian capital to take part in the popular Scandinavian talk show Skavlan. said before setting off: "It will be interesting. I'm not in a hurry."

According to Oslo Taxi, drivers have made numerous trips between Oslo and Stockholm since Thursday and a number of fares have gone even further. "The longest trip so far was from Oslo to Paris," Oslo Taxi spokesman Lars Dolva told the NTB news agency.

Meanwhile singer Whitney Houston, who was due to perform in Dublin as part of her Nothing But Love world tour, was forced to take to the Irish Sea on a car ferry.

The 46-year-old star opted for the boat after the flight ban threatened to cause another cancellation on her tour, which has already suffered several cancelled dates due to her respiratory infection earlier this month.

Ferry firm Stenaline said it received a booking for Houston's entourage on the Nordica superferry which takes three hours 15 minutes to arrive into Dublin Port.

Taxi companies may make out a fair bit, at least in the short term.

[Admiral Valdemar]

I wish I could have seen Cleese give a Boeing/Airbus a "thrashing of its life" when it wouldn't work in the ash.

[Admiral Valdemar]

By the way, anyone following the stories on BBC News' site will no doubt here what jackasses the Indian authorities are being, making people pay for being stranded in Mumbai after flights from Nepal had to turn back, and in some cases putting people under house arrest.

The eruption appears to be intensifying again and NATS has closed the windows that were open earlier briefly for short-haul north of Leeds or so.

[Dartzap]

Yeah, reading between the lines, NATS are looking to nothing really moving until the end of next week, and even that's pushing the boundary of optimism Still, atleast we now know the Met deals with volcanoes as well, that was new one on me, heh.

[Broomstick]

According to Oslo Taxi, drivers have made numerous trips between Oslo and Stockholm since Thursday and a number of fares have gone even further. "The longest trip so far was from Oslo to Paris," Oslo Taxi spokesman Lars Dolva told the NTB news agency.

Post 9/11, some stranded business travelers in the US actually bought used cars to make the trip home. A group of six from my company stranded in Washington, DC pooled their resources to buy a used but good condition SUV and drove back to Chicago because it was actually the cheapest means for them to get home under the circumstances. And, yes, there were some epic taxi rides.

[Admiral Valdemar]

Got a text off my dad to C&P:

I have just been outside cleaning the car when a pizza chicken leg and a strawberry cheese cake landed on my head....probably just the fall out from Iceland...

Brits will get it. Iceland is a frozen food retailer here.

I hear there are worse on Twitter, namely involving cricket...

[UnderAGreySky]

Admiral Valdemar - that was horrid! I loved it! Would love to hear the cricket-related jokes, I'm sure they have something to do with 'The Ashes'

In other news, flights out of the UK are suspended through tomorrow; short haul for all day it seems.

Here's a question: Would it be possible to operate airliners at 10,000 feet till they can get out of the clag? From what it seems the particles are between FL200 and 550. General aviation aircraft at the airport where I live are operating as always.. so I was wondering.

[Ace Pace]

Here's a question: Would it be possible to operate airliners at 10,000 feet till they can get out of the clag? From what it seems the particles are between FL200 and 550. General aviation aircraft at the airport where I live are operating as always.. so I was wondering.

Our Aviation buffs will add more information but in short: Unlikely closer to not going to happen. Modern passenger carrying jets are highly optimized for travel at specific altitudes, in speed and in fuel consumption. Many things change at lower altitudes, among them (just off the top of my head) Terrain and the lack of a Jet stream.

[FSTargetDrone]

According to Oslo Taxi, drivers have made numerous trips between Oslo and Stockholm since Thursday and a number of fares have gone even further. "The longest trip so far was from Oslo to Paris," Oslo Taxi spokesman Lars Dolva told the NTB news agency.

Post 9/11, some stranded business travelers in the US actually bought used cars to make the trip home. A group of six from my company stranded in Washington, DC pooled their resources to buy a used but good condition SUV and drove back to Chicago because it was actually the cheapest means for them to get home under the circumstances. And, yes, there were some epic taxi rides.

Apparently, Cleese's ride involved 2 or 3 drivers taking turns. I saw it elsewhere but can't seem to find it now. With your 6 people, that would have made relief driving easy enough, too!

[Broomstick]

I spoke this week to a US pilot I know who actually had some experience with the Mt. St. Helens eruption. He was ferrying general aviation airplanes in Arizona (well over 1,000 km away) and was supposedly clear of the ash cloud, but, you know, the weather report isn't always right. By the time he landed the windows were fogged over and the airplane required new airfilters, oil change, carburetor and some other work on the engine. ALL the windows had to be replaced. While this is not as expensive as fixing a big jet, and the engine continued to run, piston-powered airplanes are by no means immune to damage.

Remember, that even though the ash cloud is above 20,000 feet some of that ash is continually falling out of the sky. Even at a lower level airplanes in the UK will experience damage from that ash. It may not be enough to destroy the airplanes, but there will be detectable damage done. Running jet airliners at 10,000 feet will still expose them to unusual wear and tear that will have to be repaired and will cause at least a marginally increased risk of accident.

Another factor is that, while an airliner can fly at 10,000 feet it's designed to fly at 30,000 and that where it is most efficient. An airplane that can easily cross the Atlantic at 30,000 feet will NOT be able to do that at 10,000 feet - it simply can't carry enough fuel. That's the difference in efficiency you're looking at. (I heard that KLM was repositioning some airplanes by flying at 10,000 feet, but those airplanes were empty except for crew, and thus lighter. Even so, they weren't crossing oceans with them.) Now, there IS a route over the North Atlantic for airplanes that can't cross the ocean without refueling.... but it goes through Iceland, so it's pretty useless for the current situation.

In addition, Europe does have mountains exceeding 10,000 feet, which would require a detour around them, in which case you might as well go by road. Also, you get more turbulent air (especially around mountains!) at those altitudes and more bad weather - one reason for flying at 30,000 feet is that it puts you above most of the weather.

A more practical solution, looking at a map of Europe and a map of the ash cloud, would be to fly in and out of Europe through Spain and Southern Italy (assuming the winds don't shift to cause problems with that). Of course, Spanish and Italian airports only have so much capacity, and you still have to get people TO those airports from Europe, or away from them once they land in Europe.