Smokers save health system money - Aussie politician

[mr friendly guy]

so says this guy

Senator Nick Minchin praises smokers for 'dying early'
From: AAP May 04, 2010 4:39AM

A SENIOR Liberal politician has encouraged smokers to keep up their habit, saying smokers who die early save the health system money.

Senator Nick Minchin has criticised the Federal Government's plan to increase the tax on cigarettes as he told smokers to: "Go for it".

"They die early, they actually save us money," he told ABC television last night.

He rejected comments by another panellist on Q&A that smokers should pay more tax because they cost the health system money by getting sick.

Senator Minchin, who is leaving politics at the next election, is a key figure in the Liberals' conservative faction and was a minister under former Prime Minister John Howard.

He has kept a relatively low public profile this electoral term, but broke loose last night.

He said that smoking was a "hideous habit" but people had the right to indulge it in a free country.

"We've all got to choose our way to go, everyone's going to die of something," he said.

"If people choose to die of smoking, I as a Liberal think, 'Well that's your problem but go for it'."

The Government was "slugging poor old smokers every time they need money" by proposing the tax hike.

Senator Minchin, a prominent climate sceptic, also expressed doubt about the science of climate change.

A SENIOR Liberal politician has encouraged smokers to keep up their habit, saying smokers who die early save the health system money.

So do people who die instantly in car crashes. Quick, lets encourage more people to speed or DUI.

"They die early, they actually save us money," he told ABC television last night.

Except of course they come into hospital with ischaemic heart disease, COPD etc and are treated multiple times before they die. I guess he didn't think of those costs, idiot.

He rejected comments by another panellist on Q&A that smokers should pay more tax because they cost the health system money by getting sick.

Perhaps he might explain why.

He said that smoking was a "hideous habit" but people had the right to indulge it in a free country.

I love how every argument for wankers like this boils down to "they have a right to do it." What the hell has that got to do with it costs the health system money and it would be better overall if less people didn't smoke. Or maybe we could have the option of not treating these people?

"If people choose to die of smoking, I as a Liberal think, 'Well that's your problem but go for it'."

While I don't really have sympathy for smokers, they do however still use the health system and its only fair they pay some of the load.

The Government was "slugging poor old smokers every time they need money" by proposing the tax hike.

He is channelling Tony Abbott and Malcolm Turnbull with the black / white fallacies of "its not a health measure, its a tax."

Senator Minchin, a prominent climate sceptic, also expressed doubt about the science of climate change.

I see he doesn't confine his stupidity to just health issues. Good riddance that he is retiring.

[Molyneux]

Why is there never anyone who stands up and points out that their numbers are suspect and their assessment of the situation wildly inaccurate when people start spouting idiocy like this?

[Lusankya]

I think it might actually be true that smokers cost the health system less money due to dying earlier.

But most of the people who say that forget that smokers also contribute less to the health system through taxes due to dying earlier. They also cost the economy in other ways: by spending their disposable income on cigarettes, they are consuming less to other sectors of the economy; smokers are more likely to cause fires than non-smokers; their smoking impacts the health of non-smokers; smokers cost the economy billions in lost productivity due to taking more sick days and longer breaks, and when they do work, their overall lesser health means they are on average less productive than non-smokers; etc.

Looking at the issue as merely a "healthcare costs" issue is really a red herring, because the question Mr Minchin should be asking is not "how much does smoking cost the healthcare system?" but "how much does smoking cost the country?" Of course, Mr Minchin is not going to ask that question, because Mr Minchin is an idiot who deserves to choke on his own bile.

[atg]

I was so certain it had to be an Onion article.
Alas I was disapointed. Yay Australia?

[Lusankya]

Remember, the Liberal Party under Tony Abbott is trying its hardest to become the biggest joke in the world.

[thejester]

My anecdotal evidence would be the exact opposite. Both my grandfathers were long-term smokers who have a massive variety of problems as a result. One has basically been in and out of hospital for operations relating to heart disease (linked to his smoking) for the past decade, which would be a truley massive bill; both are now permanently on oxygen (paid for by the Commonwealth), one is in a nursing home and the other whilst still living at home is in and out of hospital/respite care reasonably regularly. It's also been pretty regular over the last 2-3 years for doctors to express surprise that they're still alive.

Given their age and previous lifestyles (neither was adverse to a good feed or a drink) it'd be unfair to sheet these problems home entirely to smoking, but the fact is - they're old, well past average life expectancy, and for at least 10 years they've been a pretty constant drain on the health system. So in conclusion...Nick, buddy, you're wrong.

[Lusankya]

Your anecdote is very nice, but the fact that both of your grandfathers are well past life-expectancy shows that they are atypical of the population in general. Furthermore, a Dutch study shows that in the long term, non smokers cost more on average than non-smokers over the course of their life. While smokers in any age group cost more on average than non-smokers, this is offset by the longer life-expectancy of non-smokers.

Other studies of this subject estimate lifetime health care costs, taking the differences in life expectancy into account, and find that smokers have higher medical costs.3,21,22 In our study, lifetime costs for smokers can be calculated as $72,700 among men and $94,700 among women, and lifetime costs among nonsmokers can be calculated as $83,400 and $111,000, respectively. This amounts to lifetime costs for nonsmokers that are higher by 15 percent among men and 18 percent among women.

As I said in my first post, though, just looking at these figures discounts the other costs that smokers impose on society, which are likely much greater than the potential costs of having fewer smokers.