Elections in the UK

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Hillary
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Hillary »

Teleros wrote:
Hillary wrote:"All these Eastern Europeans flooding in. Where are they coming from?"
They pop out from the woodwork y'know ;) ...


Anyway, I'm not sure she came off as bigoted exactly - hostile certainly, which is probably what caused Gordon Brown to blow it - but saying "we have too many immigrants" is hardly bigoted. Oh well, it's probably cost Labour a few votes so three cheers for Brown's temper :) .
The thing that no one has pointed out as yet is that she has an Irish surname (Duffy). 40 years ago, of course, people like Gillian Duffy were complaining about all the "paddies" coming over here and taking our jobs. Before that it was the "wogs" and a bit later the "pakis". Britain, and England specifically, is a nation of mongrels. People have been complaining about immigrants since Roman times.

In 20 years' time, we'll have the children of recently migrated Poles complaining about whatever breed of new immigrant is currently arriving.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Hillary »

Admiral Valdemar wrote:The southern US accents are equivalent to the southern accents here. Unless you happen to think cockney and West Country are particularly pleasing on the ears. Rochdale, Bolton and the surrounding areas can have far more variety in dialect than most nations, though I find it funny that one commenter for the BBC on Jeremy Vine's show used "angry Yorkshire woman". Apparently everyone north of Birmingham sound the same.
And everyone in the South East is a Cockney to anyone in the North. :wink:
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Teleros »

Fire Fly wrote:So this is the first British general election that I'm following (when the last one happened in 2005, I didn't even know it happened). My impression from the few British people I know and what I read on the internet is that everyone wants Gordon Brown out. What's he done to incite so much vitriol against him?
Taxes, lots of failed (or poorly performing, or perceived as poorly performing) policies, lots of debt, huge government waste... all that kind of stuff basically. Plus I suspect for a lot of people he simply doesn't come across as very likeable.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Ubiquitous »

Teleros wrote:
Fire Fly wrote: he simply doesn't come across as very likeable.
I think this is probably the main reason. In this increasingly Presidentialised system, personality is key. And I think it is quite clear now for all to see that GB has character flaws that prohibit him from being a successful leader.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Lord Pounder »

I feel things might have actually gone better for Brown if he hadn't have forced Blair out the way he did. I feel it was badly handled and lead to a lot of comments along the lines of "who voted for Brown, I didn't". Brian Cowen in Ireland has faced much the same thing, both leaders of a country who wheren't leaders when the General Election happened.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Admiral Valdemar »

Clegg has come out and said he'd be fine working with Labour, just not with Brown as leader. The image problem needs to be dealt with before anyone can move on with Labour, and while I'm no fan of them, I'd much rather have the boss kicked out and a new face brought in if it comes to a hung Parliament with New Labour.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Bluewolf »

That wont matter anyway. The Tories are getting between 35%-38% in the polls and we still have Thursday to go. The Lib Dems are stuck in their potions and Labour is only just recovering slightly. It will most likely be a Conservative government at the end of the day.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Crazedwraith »

It's highly unlikely they'll actually have a majority in actual seats though IIRC. So possibly David Cameron PM (uurgh) with a minority or coalition government?
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by DaveJB »

The current government gets first refusal on forming a coalition government. If Labour are willing to support electoral reform and letting key LibDems into the next cabinet, then I think we'll see either Nick Clegg or Alan Johnson heading a Labour-LibDem coalition (Brown, irrespective of the election result, is toast). I suppose the Tories could conceivably form a coalition with the LibDems as well, but they'd probably be feeling bold enough to rule with a minority government in the short-team before trying for a real majority later this year.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Teebs »

Lord Pounder wrote:I feel things might have actually gone better for Brown if he hadn't have forced Blair out the way he did. I feel it was badly handled and lead to a lot of comments along the lines of "who voted for Brown, I didn't". Brian Cowen in Ireland has faced much the same thing, both leaders of a country who wheren't leaders when the General Election happened.
I think Labour would have benefitted from having a leadership election too rather than so many MPs nominating Brown that there weren't enough left over to nominate even one other candidate.
It's highly unlikely they'll actually have a majority in actual seats though IIRC. So possibly David Cameron PM (uurgh) with a minority or coalition government?
That's probably based on a number of modelling assumptions. They seem to be doing better in marginal seats than overall in which case a majority is much more likely than general polls would indicate. Personally I think they'll be very close to a majority (either just short or just over).
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Bluewolf »

Have you lot seen the polls? Across most of them Lib Dem surport has died down and Tory surport is going up. It wont be long until they get a winning majority.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Vendetta »

Bluewolf wrote:Have you lot seen the polls? Across most of them Lib Dem surport has died down and Tory surport is going up. It wont be long until they get a winning majority.
Polls don't necessarily give an accurate picture of who will get seats. It matters far more where those voters are concentrated.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Bluewolf »

Oh of course but that is not comforting either. Labour and Tory tend to have concentrated areas they can take while the Liberals are spread and therefore get screwed over by FPTP.
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Re: Elections in the UK

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Daily Telegraph wrote:General Election 2010: unionist deal could make David Cameron prime minister
David Cameron could be installed as prime minister, even if he fails to win the general election outright, under a deal with unionist parties, The Daily Telegraph can disclose.

Northern Ireland MPs have indicated that they will formally back the Conservative leader if he protects the region from this year’s public spending cuts. The move would cost up to £200million.

The deal, which Mr Cameron will be under presuure to accept, would give his party another nine or 10 parliamentary seats.

Current opinion polls suggest this would be enough for him to form a majority government.

The Daily Telegraph understands that the Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) is willing to enter into a formal coalition with the Tories should Mr Cameron fail to win an overall majority.

Mr Cameron became the first of the main party leaders to visit Northern Ireland during the election campaign on Tuesday.

He indicated he wished to give Northern Ireland politicians ministerial positions — and see the province play a key role in the “mainstream politics” of the entire country.

The Tory leader was due to campaign throughout the night while making his way from Scotland to Bristol, meeting fishermen in Grimsby and other night-shift workers across the country.

The Conservatives believe they now have “momentum” although they may fail narrowly to win an outright majority.

Mr Cameron is believed to be prepared to rule with a minority government rather than negotiate with the Liberal Democrats.

Kenneth Clarke became the first shadow minister to talk openly about a possible deal.

“I think there’s a still a slim chance we can get an overall majority, which I would very much like to see,” the former chancellor said.

“It is very difficult to read because the electoral geography is quite local and it is a complicated breakdown of voting which is taking place. But my hunch is we’re still in with a chance of getting a parliamentary majority.

“In the end you can always do a deal with an Ulsterman, but it’s not the way to run a modern, sophisticated society.”

During a frenetic day of campaigning, Labour appeared divided over whether to advise the public to vote tactically to keep the Tories out of Downing Street.

Three Labour ministers including Ed Balls, the Schools Secretary, indicated that they advocated Labour supporters voting Liberal Democrat in constituencies where there was no real prospect of Labour winning.

The strategy, described as “desperate” by the other parties, appears to have split Cabinet ministers, with Alistair Darling and others saying that all voters should back Labour.

The latest opinion poll conducted by Comres for ITV News and The Independent had the Conservatives on 37 per cent, Labour on 29 per cent and the Liberal Democrats on 26 per cent.

The figures were unchanged from Monday night.

The latest YouGov/Sun opinion poll has the Conservatives on 35 per cent, Labour increasing to 30 per cent and the Liberal Democrats dropping to 24 per cent.

If replicated in the general election, Labour would just be the biggest party in Parliament. The intervention of the Northern Ireland politicians could prove decisive to Mr Cameron’s hopes of securing victory.

The Conservative leader agreed an alliance with the Ulster Unionists in 2008.

However, the UUP are now struggling to retain their only parliamentary seat, according to an opinion poll.

In contrast, the DUP, led by Peter Robinson, is set to win at least nine seats.

The Daily Telegraph can disclose that the DUP has drawn up a “shopping list” of demands in return for its backing of Mr Cameron.

The wish-list is likely to be more extensive depending on how much Mr Cameron needs to rely on their support. If the Conservatives win anything between 280 and 330 seats, the DUP believes it will have a very strong negotiating hand.

Top of the list is a demand that Mr Cameron holds back on the £100million to £200million of cuts which — under the terms of the Barnett formula used to calculate expenditure in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland — would be Ulster’s share of the £6billion planned by the Tories this year.

At the start of the election campaign, Mr Cameron caused alarm in Northern Ireland by singling the province out as an area that was too dependent on public money.

One DUP insider said: “If the Conservatives failed to win a majority it would put us in a fairly pivotal position. We are naturally more sympathetic to the Tories, but we won’t simply fall into line.

"We will have a shopping list, and we would have issues to resolve. Once the election is out of the way, crude political calculations will come into play. Depending on the strength of our position, there could be a whole series of things we ask for before we sign on the dotted line.”

A Tory insider said: “There will be no problem with signing up the unionists if that’s what it takes to get David into Downing Street. We’re sure we could do a deal.”

Speaking in Northern Ireland, Mr Cameron hinted that he was preparing to cut business taxes in the province.

He added: “This election presents a new opportunity to participate in he mainstream of British politics…mainstream politics in which people in Northern Ireland can participate at all levels of government in the UK — from the council chamber right the way to the Cabinet table itself.”

An opinion poll published by the Belfast Telegraph suggested the DUP was on course to remain the largest party in the Province, holding on to all nine of their current Westminster seats.

To win a majority, the Tories need 326 seats, but victory by a small margin would put Mr Cameron at the mercy of rebellious Conservative backbenchers, meaning he may still seek a coalition with the DUP.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Teebs »

We already subsidise Northern Ireland, bloody place, they shouldn't be exempt from cuts.



Anyway here are some predictions for election day (excluding Northern Ireland because they're just annoyingly different, by which I mean I have no idea what to expect there). These are educated guesses, but it's fun to make them and hopefully some of this might be informative to people who interested in this kind of thing. I'm happy to explain any of my reasoning in more detail.

Vote Shares:
Conservatives: 36%
Labour:28%
Lib Dems: 27%
Others: 9%
SNP + Plaid Cyrmu 2.5%
UKIP 2.5%
Greens 1.5%
BNP 1%


Seats (628 total, excluding 18 seats in N.I.):
Conservatives 315 (+117)
Labour 210 (-146)
Lib Dems 90 (+28)
SNP 7 (+1)
Plaid Cyrmu 4 (+1)
Respect 0 (-1)
BNP 0 (0)
Greens 1 (+1)
UKIP 0 (0)
Independent 1 (-1)

This is obviously no more than an educated guess, but I've been following the polls closely and have always been into psephology.

I'm predicting Labour's performance to be worse than under a uniform national swing, but the evidence in the polls is that they are suffering more in marginal seats and so should do worse than expected. Obviously my predictions for the three major parties are approximations rather than exact figures, but I'd bet (small) money on my minor party predictions.

Scotland

Labour's collapse doesn't seem to have happened in Scotland and Scottish polls are showing only a small drop for Labour with the SNP as the beneficiaries. I think Labour will lose a few seats to other parties due to either them being very close (e.g. Edinburgh South West where they have a 400 vote majority over the Lib Dems) or local factors, but no huge change. I only have the SNP predicted to gain one seat because they only have one close second place (Ochil & South Perthshire, Lab majority of 688), everywhere else just seems too distant for them.

Wales

The only Welsh poll that I've seen actuall has Plaid Cyrmu losing votes not gaining them, but so are Labour. Given that, I can't see them retaking Ceredigion off the Lib Dems but would guess that they will take one of Arfon or Yns Mon.

Respect

This was basically a one trick pony in 2005 with George Galloway as their celebrity leader winning Bethnal Green and Bow, although to be fair to them they did manage one other good result in Birmingham (although that seat has now been abolished). I can't see them winning anything this time. The party split since the last election and George Galloway's reputation has taken something of a hit.

BNP

The obvious BNP target is Barking, but I very much doubt they'll take it even with the current unpopularity of Labour, they're just too far behind (poor 3rd place). I expect them to come second though and who knows what might happen at the election after this one.

Greens
The Greens' only real prospect is Brighton Pavilion where they came third at the last election. Before the Lib Dem surge I'd have predicted this as a Green gain, but Lib Dems and Greens seem to recruit from very similar pools of voters, so an increased Lib Dem vote could make this seat a four-way marginal and these are obviously hell to predict. I'd say the Greens are still the most likely to win here, but it's all up in the air.

I'm happy to explain why I'm predicting a Green gain but no BNP one from apparently similar positions.

UKIP

UKIP have the problem of having their votes widely spread across the country in the same way that the Lib Dems do. Like the Lib Dems they suffer from this, but unlike the Lib Dems they don't have a vote share of over 20%. So, despite coming 4th in the popular vote at the last election and looking like they'll do so again this time they don't have any parliamentary seats. Their main prospect is Nigel Farage standing against John Bercow (the Speaker) in Buckingham, it's hard to predict this because by convention the major parties don't stand against the Speaker, but I jsut can't see this coming out as a win for Farage. They haven't got a snowball's chance in hell anywhere else.

My home cities

I live in Oxford (university) and Norwich (home), so here are my predictions for the four seats in those cities.

Oxford East- Lib Dem gain (uncontroversial, 900 votes behind Labour last time).
Oxford West & Abingdon - Lib Dem hold (5000+ vote majority over the Conservatives should be enough to keep Dr Evan Harris safe. He's an awesome MP by the way, big secularist and good on fake medicine).
Norwich South - 50-50 Labour hold/Lib Dem gain. Either way I think it will be exceptionally close. I'd have called this a shoe in for the Lib Dems but they haven't done so well in local elections recently and the Greens are really going for the seat and while they won't win they might well take enough votes that would have gone Lib Dem to save Labour.
Norwich North - Conservative gain. It's a bellweather seat that normally goes with the winning party and Labour lost it by a lot in a by-election fairly recently, so I can't see any way it wouldn't go Conservative.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by DaveJB »

Well, election day is officially upon us. And Nigel Farage of the UKIP has narrowly avoided being killed as a result of a publicity stunt:
The former UK Independence Party (UKIP) leader Nigel Farage has been injured in a plane crash in Northamptonshire.

The plane carrying two people crashed at Hinton in the Hedges Airfield at Steane, near Brackley, at 0759 BST.

A Northamptonshire Fire and Rescue Service spokeswoman said Mr Farage and the pilot were freed from the wreckage.

Mr Farage was taken to hospital in Banbury with non-life threatening injuries, and the pilot was transferred to University Hospital in Coventry.

The pilot, who was trapped in the wreckage and had to be airlifted to hospital, is believed to be more seriously injured.

East Midlands Ambulance Service and fire crews remain at the scene.

A spokesman for UKIP said he believed Mr Farage had suffered minor injuries and was at Horton General Hospital.

The aircraft was due to circle over Buckingham, where Mr Farage is standing as a candidate, trailing a banner the spokesman said.

Mike Jose, Mr Farage's assistant, said they had previously flown the plane and banner over the constituency without any problems.

A UKIP spokesman said: "We've had unconfirmed reports that either the banner got snagged up, or there were cross-winds and it was unfamiliar airfield to the pilot."

The aircraft had flown into the airfield from Winchester area and was taking off again when the accident happened, the spokesman said.

The airfield has now been closed.

The incident is due to be investigated by the Air Accident Investigation Branch, Northamptonshire Police said.
(Link)

I have to admit, I was hoping that Farage wouldn't succeed in defeating John Bercow, simply because it would set a bad precedent to chop and change speakers all the time (though that still might happen, as several Tories have pretty much announced their intention to remove Bercow if they get a decent majority). Maybe someone is trying to send him a message? :P

Polls are currently giving the Tories 36% of the vote, Labour 28%, and the Lib-Dems 27%, which would produce a hung parliament. However, if you include the "Shy Tory" factor, which traditionally says that you should add 2% to the Tories' voting numbers and deduct 1% each from Labour and the Lib-Dems, that would give the Tories the barest of majorities, assuming the rumoured power-sharing agreement with the DUP goes ahead.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Teebs »

DaveJB wrote:
I have to admit, I was hoping that Farage wouldn't succeed in defeating John Bercow, simply because it would set a bad precedent to chop and change speakers all the time (though that still might happen, as several Tories have pretty much announced their intention to remove Bercow if they get a decent majority). Maybe someone is trying to send him a message? :P
I reckon Bercow will hold on by at least 10,000 votes.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Hillary »

I have done my duty and voted. Mrs H promptly negated my vote by plumping for the other contender in my constituency :)

This is the most interesting GE I've ever been involved in - I'm planning on staying up tonight to watch the results come in.

Teebs - I'll be a bit surprised if the Tories win as many as 315. Basically your prediction kills off any chance of Labour forming a Govt and leaves the Tories with a choice of a very small majority with the Unionists (which won't require too much in the way of concessions, but is likely to fall apart quite quickly) or a larger majority with the Lib Dems (which will require significant bargaining but should be more stable).

It'll be fascinating whatever.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Dartzap »

Done my bit after my nightshift - interesting to note that there was quite a sustained trickle heading in - this just after 0900, compared to the other elections I've been in, where there's hardly been anyone around.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Admiral Valdemar »

Done. Although I was this close to abstention.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Dartzap »

Oh dear, just saw Jeremy Vines latest green-screen jobby. I have to sit through 11 hours of this :( Bloody night shifts with nothing else to do! On the other hand: Brooker, Mitchell and Carr on C4. Decisions decisions....
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Admiral Valdemar »

Fuck Vine. Go with C4's lot. Misanthropic cynical comedians are what we all need for this joke of a situation now.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Korgeta »

I'm choosing to vote for UKIP, most people from the public sector do not want the tories given their experince from the 80's. The lib dems offer intresting options but nick clegg's suggestion for immigration (in regions required) I can't see that working and will not help unemployment in the North West.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Einzige »

Korgeta wrote:I'm choosing to vote for UKIP, most people from the public sector do not want the tories given their experince from the 80's. The lib dems offer intresting options but nick clegg's suggestion for immigration (in regions required) I can't see that working and will not help unemployment in the North West.
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Re: Elections in the UK

Post by Minischoles »

Admiral Valdemar wrote:Fuck Vine. Go with C4's lot. Misanthropic cynical comedians are what we all need for this joke of a situation now.
This, i'll be watching C4 for Brooker alone, Mitchell being part of it as well just sweetens the deal.
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