Pathetic anti-piracy!

[Night_stalker]

I want to jump on shep's bandwagon. (I never thought that could happen...)

It seems rational. What speed would make a ship unboardable? I know that getting a pilot on board is a life-threatening thing, and this is done at low speed and with boats made for that purpose and both ships wanting to make it happen.

At what speeds would boarding be "near impossible"? And could merchant vessels reach these speeds? What are the sustainable top speeds in this area and how is the sea there? calm?

With what I know about ship building, the smaller pirate vessels must be operating at significant above hull speed to keep up with the bigger ships.

The pirates seem to be using principally small boats, so have any merchant vessel go at say 25 knots, which should be fast enough to avoid any but the most determined ships.

[Thanas]

The pirates seem to be using principally small boats, so have any merchant vessel go at say 25 knots, which should be fast enough to avoid any but the most determined ships.

Merchant vessels can rarely go 25 knots. Heck, most have a top speed of 15-18 knots.

I sure would like to know where you are going to magick the other 7 knots from.

[PeZook]

It depends of the size of the ship, but a Suezmax freighter at 18 knots is going to make a bow wave that's absolutely lethal to any small boat attempting to approach from any angle. Smaller ships are SOL, though.

[Kanastrous]

*edit* nevermind

[Night_stalker]

The pirates seem to be using principally small boats, so have any merchant vessel go at say 25 knots, which should be fast enough to avoid any but the most determined ships.

Merchant vessels can rarely go 25 knots. Heck, most have a top speed of 15-18 knots.

I sure would like to know where you are going to magick the other 7 knots from.

I was merely stating ap ossible speed, and plus they could finetune the speed considerably, but it seems that the pirates principally use boats similair to cigarette boats, so all they need to do is make them fairly speedy and they should be safe. At least until the pirates try merchant raiders.

[TC Pilot]

The range of pirate attacks has increased exponentially in the last half decade. Recently, Somali pirates have captured merchant ships over halfway to India. Mandating specific speeds won't really solve the problem, even if they were possible/enforceable.

The only real solution is to basically fix Somalia to the point that where being a pirate isn't the most lucrative job available. In a single succesful raid, your bog-standard Somali pirate can earn an order of magnitude more money than the monthly salary of a sailor in the provisional government's non-existent navy. Of course, the odds of ever bringing Somalia back into some semblance of functional state are pretty much the lowest even by African standards.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

The pirates seem to be using principally small boats, so have any merchant vessel go at say 25 knots, which should be fast enough to avoid any but the most determined ships.

Merchant vessels can rarely go 25 knots. Heck, most have a top speed of 15-18 knots.

I sure would like to know where you are going to magick the other 7 knots from.

The Emma Maersk can actually make about 25 kts, so some of the very new and very large container ships are achieving rather prodiguous speeds for freighters.

[CJvR]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8680074.stm

Three alleged organisers of the March suicide bombings on the Moscow metro have been killed after resisting arrest, Russian officials say.

[Drone]

The pirates seem to be using principally small boats, so have any merchant vessel go at say 25 knots, which should be fast enough to avoid any but the most determined ships.

Merchant vessels can rarely go 25 knots. Heck, most have a top speed of 15-18 knots.

I sure would like to know where you are going to magick the other 7 knots from.

The Emma Maersk can actually make about 25 kts, so some of the very new and very large container ships are achieving rather prodiguous speeds for freighters.

Wouldn't that require a ton of fuel to maintain that speed? If so the cost of maintaining a speed like that would make trips less profitable, possibly to the point that it'd be cheaper just to pay ransoms once in a while.

[Stofsk]

If it was as simple as increasing the speed, I think it would have been done already. About the only sensible solution I've seen is convoying, which might have a lot of practical problems involved, and stepping up naval patrols, which cost heaps of money. Oh and intervening in Somalia - where we will no doubt be welcomed with open arms. Anything else is just bullshit. (lol robo-guns wtf)

[Stark]

If only increasing speed didn't dramatically reduce range?

[Thanas]

The pirates seem to be using principally small boats, so have any merchant vessel go at say 25 knots, which should be fast enough to avoid any but the most determined ships.

Merchant vessels can rarely go 25 knots. Heck, most have a top speed of 15-18 knots.

I sure would like to know where you are going to magick the other 7 knots from.

I was merely stating ap ossible speed,

It is not a possible speed.

and plus they could finetune the speed considerably,

You can't finetune the speed more than max speed.

but it seems that the pirates principally use boats similair to cigarette boats, so all they need to do is make them fairly speedy and they should be safe.

Yes, we should all scrap the merchant fleets and rebuilt them from scratch.

The pirates seem to be using principally small boats, so have any merchant vessel go at say 25 knots, which should be fast enough to avoid any but the most determined ships.

Merchant vessels can rarely go 25 knots. Heck, most have a top speed of 15-18 knots.

I sure would like to know where you are going to magick the other 7 knots from.

The Emma Maersk can actually make about 25 kts, so some of the very new and very large container ships are achieving rather prodiguous speeds for freighters.

Very new and very large, yes. However, these are not the bread and butter type of ships that make up the vast majority of the merchant fleets. Those all have speeds under 20 knots due to fuel economics.

If only increasing speed didn't dramatically reduce range?

And that is another problem.

[Aaron]

I mentioned convoys earlier. Take all the older warships sitting around in NATO fleets (OVH's etc) and have them escort the merchies, declare an exclusion zone around the convoy. Anything within X number of kilometres is subject to search or sinking.

[Thanas]

I mentioned convoys earlier. Take all the older warships sitting around in NATO fleets (OVH's etc) and have them escort the merchies, declare an exclusion zone around the convoy. Anything within X number of kilometres is subject to search or sinking.

Convoys are pretty much impractical for the purposes of the current high-paced economy. Also, the problem is simply not serious enough atm. I mean, out of 21000 crossings per year, how many ships get captured? Less than a hundred?

[Aaron]

Well thats just it isn't it. If the problem isn't that bad then maybe we should just stop bitching about it, if it is, then we should do something. Personally I wonder how much of it is just outrage that some third worlders are hijacking our VCRs.

[Stofsk]

Well thats just it isn't it. If the problem isn't that bad then maybe we should just stop bitching about it, if it is, then we should do something. Personally I wonder how much of it is just outrage that some third worlders are hijacking our VCRs.

I think the outrage is justifiable. I mean, piracy is a crime, and it should be punished. The problem is, to punish them you need to spend heaps of money on patrolling the area with naval ships, take suspected pirates into custody, try them, then throw their asses into prison. (psst someone should tell the Russians about the last two)

Every other solution is nonsense.

[Thanas]

Well thats just it isn't it. If the problem isn't that bad then maybe we should just stop bitching about it, if it is, then we should do something. Personally I wonder how much of it is just outrage that some third worlders are hijacking our VCRs.

It makes a good media narrative, especially in countries who either have a strong marine tradition or are huge exporters. You can also thrown in muslim fundamentalist and the ever popular image how the USA got its behind kicked and ran away. All which play exceedingly well in the media.

As for the seriousness of the threat, these pirates are somewhat more tame because they approach it as a business. The crews are imprisoned, yes, but so far they have not been mistreated to the point of death or serious injury. They are even fed western food and cigarettes. Unlike certain pirates near Indonesia or Vietnam etc., who have a reputation of killing everyone on board (though I do not know if these are still active).

Now, this is not to say that the problem is not serious enough, but it could be worse and have a truly heavy impact on global trade. This is a list of captured or attacked ships

You will see two trends:
a) many of the attacks are unsuccessful
b) the ships captured are mostly small yachts, fishing boats etc., that are not really valuable.

Heck, the numbers are even lower than I thought. The pirates succesfully captured only 42 ships in 2008, and so far they have captured only 8 vessels in 2010.

[Aaron]

True but until there is the political will to do anything we're just going to keep steaming in circles.

[TC Pilot]

In the grand scheme of things, you're only really looking at a couple hundred sailors and maybe a couple dozen ships seized, each of which usually only net one or two million dollars in ransoms, yearly. The more outlandish stories like pirates hijacking supertankers or that Ukrainian freighter loaded with Russian tanks tend to paint over that fact. And as far as I know, the pirates haven't killed any hostages; the most they usually do is threaten to blow up a captured ship. Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if it actually costs more for the West to maintain its naval presence there than to just pay the ransoms. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if they're actually doing less damage than the pirates who operated in the Indian Ocean during the 1690's.

[Korgeta]

I think some are being a little naive, there has been accounts when the pirates have been paid so why resort to killing? their not idoits but it is only a matter of time before they become more sophisticated and set examples on their quarry. They have already well starved and threatned the lives of two civillian hostages Paul and Rachel Chandler who are still captives. somalia is pretty much a lawless country, it's human right record is poor at best. What needs to be done is for the West to force the African union to take greater responcbility regarding Inland Somalia.

[Aaron]

The African Union? You'd have better luck trying to create perpetual motion.

[Korgeta]

The African Union? You'd have better luck trying to create perpetual motion.

I take it you have a better suggestion in mind?

[Thanas]

The African Union? You'd have better luck trying to create perpetual motion.

I take it you have a better suggestion in mind?

Keep buggering on without getting an ineffectual third world military force slaughtered?

[Aaron]

I take it you have a better suggestion in mind?

Yes actually. Leave things as they are, that way we don't get the most incompetent soldiers in the world all killed

[TC Pilot]

The West won't even give the provisional Somali government aid in clamping down on the pirates. Why would they give assistance to a practically useless organization that has even less chance of doing anything than the actual country's "government"?