Post-human species

[avianmosquito]

That solves the metabolic problem, at the cost of rendering them sterile.

Thermal neutrons are bad for flowers, kitty cats, developing fetuses, and other living things...

You might be able to solve that by borrowing the tricks used by radiation-resistant bacteria like Deinococcus radiodurans. That would actually strike me as one of the less ridiculous things being thrown around in here, and it actually might be a rather neat genemod for slave soldiers in and of itself.

Personally I'm kind of wondering why they used humans for this. If you have the kind of biotech needed to turn a human into something like this you'd think it'd be easier to just take some animal from your own planet and raise its intelligence. It would probably simplify your R&D and logistics too, since even in a panspermia scenario you'd probably have to do a bunch of medical research to be able to work on aliens that you wouldn't have to do for something that shared your biology, and something that shared your biological would probably need fewer special medicines.

Because raising intelligence is difficult and expensive, so they used humans and simply prevented their minds from deteriorating. (which means the adults are more intelligent, because they don't lose as much) As for why humans, there were only three bipedal species available for this, one of which was themselves, (which was illegal at the time, although they removed this law about 550 years later) and sea-mammal (which had legs, but became deydrated too quickly to use anywhere but their natural habitat.) and humans, which were legal, and more practical than the sea-mammals.

As far as their planet, everything there is tiny anyway. They're actually the largest land-mammals on their home planet, and they average 5kg. No reptiles over 20kg, even in the ocean nothing topping 100kg. It was just more practical to work with humans. Special medicine was no issue, simini medical technology is advanced to the point of rediculous. They can cure cancer with an injection, (with no needle) fix a severed spinal coloumn in a single 20-minute surgery, mend broken bones and torn muscle with pills (still takes a few days) and eradicate any disease in a heartbeat. Why would a few different meds be an issue? Why should adapting these things be any difficulty at all? Hell, they seek this stuff out as an excuse to soak up government funding.

On kakara (their 2nd colony system, which had 3 habitable planets in a row, also where the kokome ended up) they had much more to work with. Nearly 2 billion local species, if you include insect life, three local intelligent species, (a sea-mammal, a simian, and a dragon) and a wider range of habitats, everything from desert (almost all of kakara I) to a gigantic supercontinent with scattered islands around the coast (kakara II) to a planet-wide archipelago with scattered swamps and shallow ocean (kakara III), they had everything they wanted to experiment to their heart's content.

However, the local intelligent species were all useless for their expirements. The sea-mammals were hard to work with, and could escape them by just diving to the bottom. The simians were good at hiding in the mountains, and weren't much use either. Finally, the dragons were bigger than the simini vehicles, (by volume, not mass) and were far more likely to be killed than captured, as it takes a military vehicle (more likely several, just to be safe) to combat them. (Not to mention that even if the simini could capture them, they would only find that there is nothing they could do to improve them, somebody more advanced got there first.)

[avianmosquito]

Hence why they can only fly (more glide, by the way) for 20-30 minutes at a time. As for their acceleration, that's easy, just fly about at a downward angle of 15-30 degrees, give it one big push, and pull up. It's something you see birds doing all the time. As for a lack of strength, the wings, being wings, are made up fo either a large, thing membrane (4 and 6-wing insectoid) no thicker than their skin or an array of cartilidge, powerful muscles and a lot of sinew covered in thinner-than-average skin. (avian and mammalian)

That still doesn't make any bloody sense.
You are gleefully ignoring numerous things gliders have to do - such as, oh, i don't know - getting height.
And it has already been pointed out that at that scale, insectoid wings would be very poor - especially on a non-aerodynamic airframe.[/quote]

They can gain height, but once there they glide, not fly. It's easier on them, which is important.
But, insectoid wings weigh very little and take less energy to move.

As for the entire issue with providing thrust, their muscle is more powerful than human muscle (by weight, it comes to ~2.5 times as powerful. By volume it comes to ~4.5.) and therefore shouldn't have any issue providing enough thrust to get a human airborne.

Yes it should. That's still nowhere near enough power - particulary since denser muscles also increase weight. Add you super-thick skin to that and you have at very best something that can controll the direction of a long fall.[/quote]

The skin isn't super thick. It's normal thickness, and actually only weighs 80% more than human skin.

As for range, you cannot rely on "top speed" when making calculations. They can maintain their top speed for 10-30 seconds at a time, the rest of the time they maintain about 20% of that. (Also, kokome like to make statements based off of atheletes and call it "average" so the endurance isn't reliable either.) That means that, even with the best range, they can only travel 30km in one go, and at that time they are likely to come to a less-than-graceful landing and lay on the ground hyperventilating for several minutes.

So their flying is low-speed, next-to no maneuvering, low-range only - all at the cost of an enormous food consumption and a high risk of fatal injuries.

It doesn't need to be any better. It's for getting over otherwise impassible terrain, jumping out of airplanes, and getting over traps. (You can't put landmines in the air.)

[Simon_Jester]

Because raising intelligence is difficult and expensive, so they used humans and simply prevented their minds from deteriorating. (which means the adults are more intelligent, because they don't lose as much)

Wait... HUH? What do you mean about "preventing minds from deteriorating?" What does that even mean? What do you base this on?

As for the entire issue with providing thrust, their muscle is more powerful than human muscle (by weight, it comes to ~2.5 times as powerful. By volume it comes to ~4.5.) and therefore shouldn't have any issue providing enough thrust to get a human airborne.

Yes it should. That's still nowhere near enough power - particulary since denser muscles also increase weight. Add you super-thick skin to that and you have at very best something that can controll the direction of a long fall.

The skin isn't super thick. It's normal thickness, and actually only weighs 80% more than human skin.

Yeah, but what about their digestive tract? Bones? Leg muscles, which are useless in flight? Sure, these guys' flight muscles may be powerful enough to lift themselves, but they're carrying so much extra mass. Birds are pretty well optimized to be a pair of wings, a digestive tract, and not much else. These guys are carrying hundreds of pounds of extra weight.

Winged humanoids are just not practical unless you reshape the human form almost entirely and make a lot of design compromises. Even then they're iffy. And they don't really make the winged "supersoldiers" all that much deadlier than they would be anyway.

It doesn't need to be any better. It's for getting over otherwise impassible terrain, jumping out of airplanes, and getting over traps. (You can't put landmines in the air.)

For jumping out of airplanes they have parachutes. For impassible terrain climbing gear, and for minefields... well, if the minefield is covered by fire your guys get shot trying to fly over it, and if it's not, the engineers can take it apart in short order.

[avianmosquito]

Wait... HUH? What do you mean about "preventing minds from deteriorating?" What does that even mean? What do you base this on?

The human brain deteriorates over time. Hence why people go senial over time. The simini modified the brain to the point where this takes 8 times as long (maybe a little more, but 8 was their goal) and gave it better protection against damage from drugs such as alcohol. This way, their minds will last far longer than human minds. As a result, where a human will drop at least 40 points from infancy-adulthood, (from ~140-100) kokome will drop about 5. (In the end, 135 is a lot better than 100.) Furthermore, humans usually drop another 40 points every 40 years after that.

Yeah, but what about their digestive tract? Bones? Leg muscles, which are useless in flight? Sure, these guys' flight muscles may be powerful enough to lift themselves, but they're carrying so much extra mass. Birds are pretty well optimized to be a pair of wings, a digestive tract, and not much else. These guys are carrying hundreds of pounds of extra weight.

Same deal. Their tissue averages 80% greater density. (By the way, i've made a change for the winged kokome, making them a seperate subspecies incapable of breeding with kokome. This species is shorter in stature, and significantly thinner, for an overall weight only 75% of the average. Is this satisfactory, or does it need to drop more?) Hence why kokome generally weight about 60% more than humans. (80% more density, sure, but kokome are smaller.)

Winged humanoids are just not practical unless you reshape the human form almost entirely and make a lot of design compromises. Even then they're iffy. And they don't really make the winged "supersoldiers" all that much deadlier than they would be anyway.

Design comprimises? How about smaller size and a different muscle sctructure to their backs that prevents them from lifting their arms higher than their shoulders without dislocating their wings? (Which is similar in concept to dislocating a shoulder, but kokome can do both with ease and without pain.) How about creating larger reserves of water to deal with the waste heat? Anything else I'm missing?

For jumping out of airplanes they have parachutes. For impassible terrain climbing gear, and for minefields... well, if the minefield is covered by fire your guys get shot trying to fly over it, and if it's not, the engineers can take it apart in short order.

Keep in mind that you cannot steer a parachute, you are at the mercy of the wind, and a parachute will not help you get over trees, gorges or rivers. Climbing gear is good for mountains and ravines, but what about gorges, rivers and dense foliage? As far as minefields, flying over them is still safer than walking through them, because it's safer to contend with bullets than bullet AND explosives. Not only that, but engineers cannot, I repeat, cannot take most of them apart. As for why, go on wikipedia and look up "anti-handling device." Engineers have to go through and detonate the mines to clear them, which requires more time to do safely, makes one hell of a ruckus and will call every enemy patrol in the area right to you. In comparison, gliding above it under cover of night is safe and easy, and it doesn't attract unwanted attention. (Especially when fighting enemies that don't even have rifling, let alone proper anti-aircraft weaponry... unless they're using hijacked simini equipment, in which case it's still safer than walking through the minefield.)

[Junghalli]

Instead of giving them wings, why not just give them a technological device that serves the same function?

It's more flexible that way, because unless they have very fast breeding and maturation rates it will be faster to train new flyers if you need them than to breed them, and conversely easier to retask flyers to other tasks. Even if they do have very fast breeding and maturation rates it should still be faster; if they can learn all the life skills they need in a few months they should be able to learn how to use a jetpack in much less.

[avianmosquito]

Instead of giving them wings, why not just give them a technological device that serves the same function?

It's more flexible that way, because unless they have very fast breeding and maturation rates it will be faster to train new flyers if you need them than to breed them, and conversely easier to retask flyers to other tasks. Even if they do have very fast breeding and maturation rates it should still be faster; if they can learn all the life skills they need in a few months they should be able to learn how to use a jetpack in much less.

Cheaper, (in the long run) longer flight times, no training required, better manouverability (with simini tech at the time) heals if damaged instead of needing replacement, moves faster, doesn't require complex and expensive fuel, and so on.

Also, simini never retask the airborne. Why retask somebody crazy enough to jump out of airplanes? They might come back with some common sense, and then you're down a soldier.

[Raxmei]

Healing instead of needing replacement is a weakness. Healing downs the casualty until it recovers, if he recovers at all. You can just replace equipment and get right back to flying again. Hans-Ulrich Rudel springs immediately to mind. He was shot down thirty-two times over the course of his career and suffered numerous wounds including loss of a leg but continued to fly until the end of the war. If he had wings we would have been down for months each time he got hurt while he recovered enough to fly under his own power (he flew missions with a plaster cast still on), and if he ever lost a wing it would have grounded him for good.

[avianmosquito]

Why would anyone with advanced genetic engineering and interstellar technology make supersoldiers and arm them with swords?

They did arm them with firearms, they wre just all way too "specialized" to be used in most situations. They were given shotguns, but these lack range and ammunition capacity. They had heavy machine guns, but these were unweildy, even for kokome. They had small cannons they were supposed to snipe with, but what use is that in CQB? And then they had missile launchers, but what use are those against infantry? Finally, all of them had reliability issues. They used swords because they were actually more effective in CQB than the alternatives. Also, kokome only got one firearm, so it wasn't too much of a detriment to add a bow, which was a more universal weapon than their standard one. This way, they could use their firearm when it was ideal, and either a bow or sword when it was not.

I would take it as a personal favor if you would look at those targets again, and measure their thickness carefully.

1.25mm, 7075 aluminum alloy. Tensile strength: 273mpa.

They stop anything up to any including a .45 jacketed hollow point. Any non-expanding pistol round will penetrate them. Buckshot also penetrates them. Rifles aren't even slowed down. This is why I use hollow points and birdshot for target practice. For rifles, I head outdoors and use a better backstop. (Like a hill.)

[CaptainChewbacca]

Are you telling me it was technically cheaper AND EASIER to genetically engineer a warrior race that flies and glides on 'insect wings' (which, incidentally, don't glide) than build a jet pack or anti-gravity belt?

[avianmosquito]

Healing instead of needing replacement is a weakness. Healing downs the casualty until it recovers, if he recovers at all. You can just replace equipment and get right back to flying again. Hans-Ulrich Rudel springs immediately to mind. He was shot down thirty-two times over the course of his career and suffered numerous wounds including loss of a leg but continued to fly until the end of the war. If he had wings we would have been down for months each time he got hurt while he recovered enough to fly under his own power (he flew missions with a plaster cast still on), and if he ever lost a wing it would have grounded him for good.

Kokome heal 25 times as fast as average humans. This means a broken bone or hole in their wing grounds them for a few hours, a day at the most.

Kokome regenerate, which means that lost limbs, organs and miscellanius body parts grow back. Their healing factor also guarantees this is in a timely fasion. A few examples, directly out of my writing, to give average recovery times: (none for lost wings, sorry)

1. April 2021: a kokome woman looses both legs to a helicopter's 23mm cannons. She survives, if only due to her speedy application of touniquets and immediate medical attention, and her legs recover in 10 months. It should of been less, but she got pregnant (for the third time) during this period.
2.Unknown date, late 2000's. Same kokome woman takes a glancing blow from a bahaar sim'k (bahaar equivalent of a tank. Cloned soldiers made from a larhe bahaar athlete, with steel armour) with a barbed kanabo. She looses her right breast, most of ther left, and part of her right lung. If her son hadn't shown up with a rocket launcher and summoned a competant medic, she would of died of exsanguination, but her lung was replaced by a surgeon and her breasts grew back within a month.
3. Sometime in 2032/33: a small kokome boy has his tail ripped off by a girl with some serious anger management issues, it grows back in about three months under adverse conditions.
4. Sometime in 2023, a kokome toddler is shot with a blast of 12-guage #9, although her hand took most of it because she tried to block it. She looses 3 fingers, but breaks no bones. (She then proceeds to take the shotgun from her attacker and hit him very hard in a place he probably wishes she hadn't.) Her fingers grow back overnight, although she needec to eat more the night before and sleep for twice as long as normal.

[avianmosquito]

Are you telling me it was technically cheaper AND EASIER to genetically engineer a warrior race that flies and glides on 'insect wings' (which, incidentally, don't glide) than build a jet pack or anti-gravity belt?

Point taken. Insect wings have just neen cut.

As far as cost, we're looking at long-term cost. Not only that, but the simini idea of long-term, which is hundreds of years. Over that kind of time, the extremely large initial R&D cost is more than made up for by lower unit cost, lower maitanance, and cheaper fuel.

[CaptainChewbacca]

Your wings-instead-of-jets reasoning only makes sense if these guys were intended to operate without a logistical base. A jetpack only requires fuel while its operating, and when it's not you tune it once a week and keep it polished.

Wings require constant care and attention. They can be damaged easily and you've had to vastly increase the metabolism of these guys just to make them work, which HUGELY increases your food costs. If they're operating without support, these guys will have to forage 10-16 hours a day to get the kind of calories you've dictated they need. Likewise your rapid healing and regeneration are HUGE calorie-hogs. I'd give them access to superior medical technology (nanites is popular) rather than x-men level healing. Rapid healing means rapid metabolism, rapid cell growth, rapid aging, and rapid progression of disease.

These guys need to be a LOT less fanciful and more realistic. They've got innate biophysical abilities that would make wolverine giggle, but they're using swords and don't know how to use walkie-talkies as a part of military doctrine, and somehow they're the greatest warrior race the galaxy has ever known. Power down the biological, and give them some tech that makes sense.

Also, I noticed you have a problem many young scifi writers have; made-up-word-compulsion. Use those sparingly, because telling me a bloo-blaz was shot by a fizz-barg with a woogity-woo is a lot less meaningful than telling me a second lieutenant was shot by an expert sniper with a gauss rifle.

[Serafina]

They used swords because they were actually more effective in CQB than the alternatives.

So their species is so stupid that they can't even develop the concept of an assault rifle?
Or of a bajonett, or mixed squad armament?

Really, i have to wonder how that species ever got out of the stone age.

Kokome heal 25 times as fast as average humans. This means a broken bone or hole in their wing grounds them for a few hours, a day at the most.

How's that supposed to work?
You can't just arbitrarily speed up biological processes. If you speed up healing that much, you will make a mess out of every wound, as it will heal very messily.
It will also take significant amount of energy, and at such a rate the body would actually be in danger of starving if it takes significant damage.

The human brain deteriorates over time. Hence why people go senial over time. The simini modified the brain to the point where this takes 8 times as long (maybe a little more, but 8 was their goal) and gave it better protection against damage from drugs such as alcohol. This way, their minds will last far longer than human minds. As a result, where a human will drop at least 40 points from infancy-adulthood, (from ~140-100) kokome will drop about 5. (In the end, 135 is a lot better than 100.) Furthermore, humans usually drop another 40 points every 40 years after that.

Clearly you have no idea how either the human brain or aging work.
Or anthing else in biology for that matter.

Most things about the human body are balanced tradeoffs. Genetic engineering could certainly make them better (since we define better differently than natural selection), but you can't speed up most biological processes many times without tradebacks. And some of your modifications would be deadly.

Keep in mind that you cannot steer a parachute, you are at the mercy of the wind

Are you telling me that you can't steer a parachute? That's simply not true.
Correct, you are "at the mercy of the wind", but that's also true for avian gliders.

Climbing gear is good for mountains and ravines, but what about gorges, rivers and dense foliage?

You can climb down the gorge and then up again. Or you simply take another route, use a bridge or call in a helicopter.
And for rivers, there is that nifty thing called swimming. Or building a bridge (doable in a couple of hours).
Dense foliage? Do you really think that is somehow impassable for humans?

As far as minefields, flying over them is still safer than walking through them, because it's safer to contend with bullets than bullet AND explosives. Not only that, but engineers cannot, I repeat, cannot take most of them apart. As for why, go on wikipedia and look up "anti-handling device." Engineers have to go through and detonate the mines to clear them, which requires more time to do safely, makes one hell of a ruckus and will call every enemy patrol in the area right to you. In comparison, gliding above it under cover of night is safe and easy, and it doesn't attract unwanted attention. (Especially when fighting enemies that don't even have rifling, let alone proper anti-aircraft weaponry... unless they're using hijacked simini equipment, in which case it's still safer than walking through the minefield.)

So again, your species is so stupid that they don' even have rifling??
As for "decent AA-weapons", any rifle with decent accuracy has good odds of taking down your soldiers. Propably while the soldiers firing them sing "it's raining men".

(You can't put landmines in the air.)

Actually, yes, you can.
Simply put mines with motion sensors to the ground. Let them track everything up to, say, 50 meters. If something of sufficient size is detected, the mine springs up about ten meters and releases a shaped shrapnel charge to cover about 40m.

As far as cost, we're looking at long-term cost. Not only that, but the simini idea of long-term, which is hundreds of years. Over that kind of time, the extremely large initial R&D cost is more than made up for by lower unit cost, lower maitanance, and cheaper fuel.

No, just...no.
Your long-term costs are incredibly high. Your soldiers constantly require very high amounts of high-quality foods.
They propably require specialized medical care. They would have trouble using vehicles, backpacks, clotes and so on.
And for what?
Crossing minefields under fire? Cutting an hour while crossing a gorge or river?
And all that at the drawback of being unable to live without a supply line (they would starve), a huge vulnerability and again requiring intense medical care?

Thanks, but i would stick with unmodified humans rather than those guys. Propably even if i can't give them modern weapons.

[K. A. Pital]

Maybe they're powered by cold fusion of the hydrogen in water, as in that communist wanktech story Stas kept going on about.

When did I "go about" Nanotech net, as opposed to just putting a link to the story in the sig? I'm genuinely confused.

[Raxmei]

And then after decades of genetic engineering some asshole goes and invents a better jetpack (or other gizmo). All previous personal flying equipment quickly becomes obsolete. The guys who used jetpacks before throw the old ones out and buy new ones. The guys with wings throw their old wings out and oh shit they're part of their bodies. What an outstanding long term solution. Completely unimaginable that technological achievement could render that capability obsolete in the time it takes an individual to grow to adulthood leaving you stuck with an entire army of people whose sole purpose in life has been superseded by the march of progress.

[avianmosquito]

They used swords because they were actually more effective in CQB than the alternatives.

So their species is so stupid that they can't even develop the concept of an assault rifle?
Or of a bajonett, or mixed squad armament?

They did have all these things, but not for kokome. A simini squad used 8 simini infantry with assault rifles, with an underslung grenade launcher, shotgun or flamethrower, but not a bayonet as simini are ill-suited to melee combat. 2 kokome with heavy machine guns provided support, 2 more with rockets provided anti-armour capability, while 4 more with shotguns provided close-range protection, and 2 more with shields (tower shields, 3.75cm stainless steel wrapped in 1.25cm thick carbon fibre with frontal 3.75cm aluminum oxide plates. The same protection as a simini light tank) and pistols provided moving cover for the others.[/quote]

Really, i have to wonder how that species ever got out of the stone age.

Kokome heal 25 times as fast as average humans. This means a broken bone or hole in their wing grounds them for a few hours, a day at the most.

How's that supposed to work?

You can't just arbitrarily speed up biological processes. If you speed up healing that much, you will make a mess out of every wound, as it will heal very messily.
It will also take significant amount of energy, and at such a rate the body would actually be in danger of starving if it takes significant damage.

It's 2.5 times as efficient, and the body gets its repair systems working faster and in greater force. However, the part starvation possibly resulting from injury is true, in fact you've greatly understated it. Injured kokome need more energy, but that's not the important part. The important part is the increased need of nutrients, protein inparticular, as opposed to bulk energy. This means a totally different diet, comprising more meat and dairy products, and less corn and rice.

Clearly you have no idea how either the human brain or aging work.
Or anthing else in biology for that matter.

Biology isn't my forte, but I wouldn't say I know nothing about it.

Most things about the human body are balanced tradeoffs. Genetic engineering could certainly make them better (since we define better differently than natural selection), but you can't speed up most biological processes many times without tradebacks. And some of your modifications would be deadly.

They increase the rate of heart attacks and stroke, but I don't see many other issues, and a sufficiently advanced species can keep that under control.

Are you telling me that you can't steer a parachute? That's simply not true.
Correct, you are "at the mercy of the wind", but that's also true for avian gliders.

While there are parachutes can can be steered, they are often unreliable, and tend to go awry. Also, a light breeze will override all atempts to fly into it.

You can climb down the gorge and then up again. Or you simply take another route, use a bridge or call in a helicopter.
And for rivers, there is that nifty thing called swimming. Or building a bridge (doable in a couple of hours).
Dense foliage? Do you really think that is somehow impassable for humans?

Kokome have a hard time swimming, simini even more so. Also, many rivers have too swift of a current to safely swim. In the end, you might not be able to wait until the bridge-builders arrive. (Like, say, when you're retreating from people with shotguns and crossbows.
I'm talking trees packed close together and with dense underbrush. The kind of stuff you need to either destroy or go around. (Why do you think they have saws readily available at the platoon level?

[Jeremy]

They increase the rate of heart attacks and stroke, but I don't see many other issues, and a sufficiently advanced species can keep that under control.

Good to see you noticed some of my objections. So just how big are the Kokomes skulls? A four year old girl could punch one of these things in the face and ruin its day. Remember, you replaced the "sinus cavities" with stuff covered by "thin skin", never mind screeching at them will do wonders for their superhearing.

Kokome have a hard time swimming, simini even more so. Also, many rivers have too swift of a current to safely swim. In the end, you might not be able to wait until the bridge-builders arrive.

I'm sure your Superhuman Tentacle Monster Saiyan Ninjas could walk across the bottom of a river. BTW, how do they fly if the fluid of air when they aren't even buoyant in water?

(Like, say, when you're retreating from people with shotguns and crossbows.

Or concentrated artillery fire and close air support?
Why does such a glorious warrior race need to run from anyone? Can't they just catapult their stormtrooper children into the fray?

I'm talking trees packed close together and with dense underbrush. The kind of stuff you need to either destroy or go around. (Why do you think they have saws readily available at the platoon level?

Welcome to Earth, we evolved here.

They did arm them with firearms, they wre just all way too "specialized" to be used in most situations.

And that is how we kill them. One by one, probably with nerve gas, maybe even with Raid--actually millions by millions if we Curtis LeMay's zombie has anything to say about it.

simini are ill-suited to melee combat.

So is the Human frame.

[CaptainChewbacca]

Skeeter, I'm sorry but it doesn't look like you're even TRYING to grasp the criticism, so I'll sum up:

You: Hey guys, look at what I came up with! Its a massive fucking block of text that isn't actually internally consistent.
Us: O...k...
You: Gosh, I was hoping for more of a critique, you guys are disappointing.
Us: Well, it looks like all of this is highly implausible, ill-defined, and can be solved better through advanced technology.
You: No no, don't you see? I use bio-wank because it makes more sense on a cost basis and through upkeep, and that way they don't NEED tech and can use super-cool swords, chainsaws, and bombs along with quasi-japanese weapons!
Us: Uh... technology is better and cheaper, and these engineered enhancements are going to make these guys incredibly likely to keel over if they miss snacktime.
You: Well, advanced super-tech should take care of the health problems!

Us: Why not just have advanced supertech address the problem in the first place?

Seriously, its ok if you want incredibly-stylized bio-enhanced soldiers. In fact, I'm actually seeing an interesting (though probably unintentional) thread where the creating race did stuff just because they thought it was cool or interesting or for religious purposes, and it ended up causing lots of trouble. A story about a warrior race that is actually HAMPERED by its supposed enhancements would be interesting. If you want ordinary sci-fi action, tone it down.

P.S. Your enhanced healing numbers seem to vary between 2.5 times normal and 25 times normal human rates. Pick one.

[Starglider]

It took three pages and about fifty people pointing out the problems of insect wings to get the single most ridiculous design feature dropped. That has been the only concession, as opposed to further implausible rationalisation, so far. At this rate it's going to take approximately 80 pages and half the population of the board chiming in to get these creatures modified into something sensible.

[Serafina]

All the things your species can do can be done far better and easier with modern technology.
Futuristic technology would be even better.

There is simply no point in creating such a species in the first places.

And what kind of idiots breed expensive supersoldiers and then decide to give them nothing better than muskets and swords?
Really, that's about the dumbest thing about this whole thing so far.

You can't even claim that this was a safety mechanism. First, you've already said that your creator species was too stupid to take any safety measures. Second, it completely destroys their purpose as an army.


In the end, you have a bunch of biologically impossible freaks who have been created by an incredibly stupid species as slaves and soldiers. There are no safety mechanisms at all in place, and the slaves are put into every part of society and the military.
The slaves rebel and somehow manage to overthrow their masters despit being only armed with muskets, having no coherent logistical support and eating about five times as much as a human. They are too stupid to build ponton bridges, make airdrops with parachutes, circumvent minefields, use anything resembling solid tactics and much more.
And somehow, the slaves are able to overcome enemies armed with MGs, aircraft, tanks and all those other nice toys of modern armies. While having nothing but muskets and swords...

That's not only an incredibly stupid species, it's also horrendous storywriting. By any logic at all, your rebellion should have starved en masse within weeks and then slaughtered by a modern army.

[avianmosquito]

So again, your species is so stupid that they don' even have rifling??
As for "decent AA-weapons", any rifle with decent accuracy has good odds of taking down your soldiers. Propably while the soldiers firing them sing "it's raining men".

No, just... No. Reread that, it was referring to the enemies simini usually fought, the simini sure as hell didn't design kokome to fight them. Simini have rifling, they just never use it because they... Well, they kind of have this irrational lone of flechettes and shot, rifling works on neither. Their primary enemies used crossbows and stolen simini equipment, crossbows are decent at hitting flying targets, but not at night, especially when their uses literally have no nightvision. (No night in their natutal habitat.) Maybe if they are using simini equipment they might score a kill, but only with a flechette rifle. A shotgun just won't cut it.

Actually, yes, you can.
Simply put mines with motion sensors to the ground. Let them track everything up to, say,
50 meters. If something of sufficient size is detected, the mine springs up about ten meters and releases a shaped shrapnel charge to cover about 40m.

Yes, but kokome were created to fight the enemies of the simini. Can an army that relies on 15th century technology and stolen enemy equipment really do that? I don't think so, so why would this be taken into consideration?

And all that at the drawback of being unable to live without a supply line (they would starve), a huge vulnerability and again requiring intense medical care?

The foods they eat grow in abundance, which makes it easy to procure, their MREs come out of a factory for the equivalent of $4 for a crate of 100, each weighing 10kg with 30,000 calories each. Food is no issue, even on the field.
Medical care is iffy. Kokome generally die in ~60 years of cardiac arrest without intervention, and that's plenty long enough. Health care for them comes to an annual checkup, a few shots (no needles) and minor surgery if things are going badly, and that allows them to live indefinitely.

Thanks, but i would stick with unmodified humans rather than those guys. Propably even if i can't give them modern weapons.

That's your preference, and most people will share it, but with a sufficient logistics system kokome are worth the extra expense, and simini haven't known famine since a thousand years before they created kokome. As such, this brings it down to a personal preference.

[avianmosquito]

It took three pages and about fifty people pointing out the problems of insect wings to get the single most ridiculous design feature dropped. That has been the only concession, as opposed to further implausible rationalisation, so far. At this rate it's going to take approximately 80 pages and half the population of the board chiming in to get these creatures modified into something sensible.

No, I decided to drop it on page two, but I was going to save it all for a "changes made" post like on the last thread. Also, there have been many smaller changes made as well regarding longetivity, genetic distribution, and armament. It was not my sole concession, in fact it wasn't even the biggest.

[Serafina]

So they were created to fight a bunch of primitives with pointy sticks?
Yeah, they might work for that...

The foods they eat grow in abundance, which makes it easy to procure, their MREs come out of a factory for the equivalent of $4 for a crate of 100, each weighing 10kg with 30,000 calories each. Food is no issue, even on the field.

Yes it is. Food makes up a huge part of the supply chain (especially since you don't have modern equipment). If you crank up the amount of necessary food, you are lowering the amount of soldiers you can feed. Your armies are going to be a lot smaller.
Furthermore, you are dependant on your supplied food, you can't live "off the land". I already mentioned that.

On a more global scale, you can only grow that much food on a planet. You simply run out of areable land at some point.
If they need five times as much food as humans (or whatever, your number change by orders of magnitude anyway), their population will be five times smaller.

Medical care is iffy. Kokome generally die in ~60 years of cardiac arrest without intervention, and that's plenty long enough. Health care for them comes to an annual checkup, a few shots (no needles) and minor surgery if things are going badly, and that allows them to live indefinitely.

"Live indefinietly"?
You really don't know what causes ageing, right?

That's your preference, and most people will share it, but with a sufficient logistics system kokome are worth the extra expense, and simini haven't known famine since a thousand years before they created kokome. As such, this brings it down to a personal preference.

They are not. Needing orders of magnitude more food means that your army will be orders of magnitude smaller.
Add constant medical care (you understate the problem - they would suffer from cardiac arrests in childhood) and you have yourself a very expensive army just for fighting some primitives with pointy sticks.

[avianmosquito]

Seriously, its ok if you want incredibly-stylized bio-enhanced soldiers. In fact, I'm actually seeing an interesting (though probably unintentional) thread where the creating race did stuff just because they thought it was cool or interesting or for religious purposes, and it ended up causing lots of trouble. A story about a warrior race that is actually HAMPERED by its supposed enhancements would be interesting. If you want ordinary sci-fi action, tone it down.

P.S. Your enhanced healing numbers seem to vary between 2.5 times normal and 25 times normal human rates.

You should of seen what this concept was like a year ago... Trust me, this is mild.

As for non-practical motive, I think I already hinted at that 2 pages ago when I said "Hell, they seek these things out just for an excuse to soak up government funding."

Their healing is 25 times as fast, but only 2.5 times as efficient.

[Starglider]

You should of seen what this concept was like a year ago... Trust me, this is mild.

You were making these as incredibly challenging ruthless opponents for your plucky protgaonists, not as wankity-wank wish fulfillment mary sue hero characters right? Right?