Democrat Lies about Being in Vietnam, People Care

[Flagg]

MSNBC

Conn. candidate says sorry for misstatements
Blumenthal apologizes, via e-mail, for saying he served in Vietnam War

msnbc.com staff and news service reports
updated 55 minutes ago

HARTFORD, Conn. - U.S. Senate candidate Richard Blumenthal has apologized in an e-mail for misstatements he made about his military service during the Vietnam War, nearly a week after the controversy erupted.

"I have made mistakes and I am sorry. I truly regret offending anyone," Blumenthal said in a statement e-mailed to The Hartford Courant late Sunday.

"At times when I have sought to honor veterans, I have not been as clear or precise as I should have been about my service in the Marine Corps Reserves,'' he said in the statement. "I have firmly and clearly expressed regret and taken responsibility for my words."

t's the first apology from Blumenthal. He had said he regretted his misstatements and took responsibility for them after The New York Times reported last week that he wrongly said more than once that he served in Vietnam.

He served stateside in the Marine Reserve during Vietnam. He says he unintentionally said he served "in" Vietnam when he meant "during" Vietnam.

Blumenthal, Connecticut's attorney general, received the Democratic nomination for the Senate race Friday.

Blumenthal, 64, joined the Marine Reserve in 1970 and served six years, none of it overseas. He put in much of his time in Washington, where he took part in such projects as fixing a campground and working on a Toys for Tots drive, according to the Times.

He received at least five military deferments that enabled him to stay out of the war between 1965 and 1970, during which time he went to Harvard, studied in England and landed a job in the Nixon White House. Once he secured a spot in the Marine Reserve, he had almost no chance of being sent to Vietnam, the newspaper reported.

Didn't we recently have a president that lied about being in Vietnam for like 8 years at some point in the recent past and the press said jack shit?

[Ritterin Sophia]

Didn't we recently have a president that lied about being in Vietnam for like 8 years at some point in the recent past and the press said jack shit?

Yeah, but he made up for it by allowing a totally new generation of Americans to experience Vietnam, so it evens out.

[Simon_Jester]

Didn't we recently have a president that lied about being in Vietnam for like 8 years at some point in the recent past and the press said jack shit?

...Wait, did he actually say he'd been in Vietnam?

I mean, if I don't say I was in Vietnam and I wasn't, that doesn't count as lying.

[Crossroads Inc.]

W. Bush never actually lied about GOING to Vietnam.
His falsification were in serving at home in the National guard. Basically his "Lie" is that he spent the war proudly serving in the National guard doing training and rigorous exercises, when it seems now he spent most of his time getting Drunk, partying, and ditching appointments on the base.

Not to defend Dubya at all, but its pretty different for one guy to lie and say:
"I went to war and defended America!"
And another guy to lie saying
"I stayed home, but did exercises on a military base throughout the war."

If Bush had made the same lie this yutz did, I'd place odds even the double sided nature of American politics would have called him out on it.

[Themightytom]

I think the controversy was more centered on John Kerry's participation in the Vietnam war. As it was juxtaposed to Bush's total lack of participation it was an embarrassing argument all around I think.

[Knife]

Well, not that I'm defending this guy but AFAIK all he did was refer to himself as a Vietnam Vet and while not true he's still a vet. I don't think he's even made any Vet group mad about it, just right wingers and even then he's marginally apologized so I see little here to complain about. The right will complain about him regardless so...

[Phantasee]

I've always understood "veteran" to mean either some combat experience or at least an overseas deployment. Or maybe even a longish career in the armed forces. I mean, what are you a veteran of if you spend your time in the Reserves, in Washington? Unless you regularly put down riots or something, I don't think serving in the reserves counts.

[MKSheppard]

His falsification were in serving at home in the National guard. Basically his "Lie" is that he spent the war proudly serving in the National guard doing training and rigorous exercises, when it seems now he spent most of his time getting Drunk, partying, and ditching appointments on the base.

Crossroads; shut the fuck up. You obviously have no idea what W did.

Aerospace Web page on the F-102
Link 2

I'll just quote the revelant bits from the first link:

Regardless, the F-102 was still far more dangerous to fly than today's combat aircraft. Compared to the F-102's lifetime accident rate of 13.69, today's planes generally average around 4 mishaps per 100,000 hours. For example, compare the F-16 at 4.14, the F-15 at 2.47, the F-117 at 4.07, the S-3 at 2.6, and the F-18 at 4.9. Even the Marine Corps' AV-8B, regarded as the most dangerous aircraft in US service today, has a lifetime accident rate of only 11.44 mishaps per 100,000 flight hours. The F-102 claimed the lives of many pilots, including a number stationed at Ellington during Bush's tenure. Of the 875 F-102A production models that entered service, 259 were lost in accidents that killed 70 Air Force and ANG pilots.

Lt. Bush remained in the Texas ANG as a certified F-102 pilot who participated in frequent drills and alerts through April of 1972. It appears that he remained on air defense alert since he did not meet the minimum of 1,000 flying hours needed to become an F-102 pilot instructor. Bush had over 600 flight hours when he left the Guard, and 278 of these were aboard the F-102 and TF-102.

Second link has this:

July 1970 to April 16, 1972: Bush, as a certified fighter pilot, attends frequent drills and alerts at Ellington.

Let's see; standing on air defense alert, logging 278 hours in one of the most dangerous aircraft the military has ever flown....Yeah, he didn't do shit.

[Simon_Jester]

I think the controversy was more centered on John Kerry's participation in the Vietnam war. As it was juxtaposed to Bush's total lack of participation it was an embarrassing argument all around I think.

The Swift Boaters made an issue of the level of Kerry's participation. But as far as I know, no one denies he was present in theater, or that he got into combat. So he certainly didn't lie about being a Vietnam vet.

[Elfdart]

"I've been to war. I've raised twins. If I
had a choice, I'd rather go to war."

Houston Chronicle, January 2002

Awfully big talk for deserter from REMF duty in the Air National Guard.

The real trophy for a politician bullshitting about what they did in wartime goes to Von Reagan, who tried to butter up Yitzhak Shamir and Simon Wiesenthal by telling them that he personally filmed the liberation of a Nazi death camp. How he pulled this off, given that the Nazis didn't have any camps in Hollywood (where Von Reagan spent the war), he never explained.

[Flagg]

"I've been to war. I've raised twins. If I
had a choice, I'd rather go to war."

Houston Chronicle, January 2002

Awfully big talk for deserter from REMF duty in the Air National Guard.

The real trophy for a politician bullshitting about what they did in wartime goes to Von Reagan, who tried to butter up Yitzhak Shamir and Simon Wiesenthal by telling them that he personally filmed the liberation of a Nazi death camp. How he pulled this off, given that the Nazis didn't have any camps in Hollywood (where Von Reagan spent the war), he never explained.

You rat fuck cunt motherfucking jizzrag. I've been looking for that quote for 30 minutes.

[MKSheppard]

Awfully big talk for deserter from REMF duty in the Air National Guard.

REMFs don't fly planes in which about 30% (about 1/3rds) of all the aircraft of that type built crashed.

And next for your encore; I'm sure you'll call these guys REMFs for standing guard and defending the homeland.

[Flagg]

Awfully big talk for deserter from REMF duty in the Air National Guard.

REMFs don't fly planes in which about 30% (about 1/3rds) of all the aircraft of that type built crashed.

And next for your encore; I'm sure you'll call these guys REMFs for standing guard and defending the homeland.

Yes, defending us from the dreaded Vietcong airforce.

[MKSheppard]

Yes, defending us from the dreaded Vietcong airforce.

There was you know, this thing called the Cold War from you know about 1947-48 to 1992?

[SirNitram]

I was wondering when Blumenthal would prove he's as worthless as the GOP favorite in CT. After all, when one side is the owner of pro wrestling, you realize there's probably gonna be QUITE the circus.

[CJvR]

Let's see; standing on air defense alert, logging 278 hours in one of the most dangerous aircraft the military has ever flown....Yeah, he didn't do shit.

You wont convince people who know for a fact the Bush is to stupid to button his own shirt that he ever flew a fighter jet.

[Elfdart]

The difference is, these guys actually showed up for duty, while Numbnuts went AWOL just as the armed forces started mandatory drug tests. When he applied for the Texas ANG, he specifically requested that he not be sent to Vietnam.

Yes, defending us from the dreaded Vietcong airforce.

Let's not denigrate those who served in the Guard during Vietnam. I mean, someone had to muster the courage to fire over sixty rounds at Kent State's coeds.

[Elfdart]

Let's see; standing on air defense alert, logging 278 hours in one of the most dangerous aircraft the military has ever flown....Yeah, he didn't do shit.

You wont convince people who know for a fact the Bush is to stupid to button his own shirt that he ever flew a fighter jet.

I'm impressed by the boldness of a guy who spent a month cowering in fear from Cindy Sheehan.

[CJvR]

I'm impressed by the boldness of a guy who spent a month cowering in fear from Cindy Sheehan.

What possible reason was there to meet her?

[Elfdart]

I'm impressed by the boldness of a guy who spent a month cowering in fear from Cindy Sheehan.

What possible reason was there to meet her?

It would have defused a month of (well-deserved IMO) ball-busting from the anti-war movement. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed watching the Crawford Caligula get raked over the coals, but it would have ended almost immediately if Bush had met her at her rally. Clinton had the same problem with the Dolchstoss faction of Vietnam veterans when he appeared at the war memorial to give a speech. Rather than pussying out of attending, he showed up, met with the veterans and showed class in the face of hecklers calling him a coward and a draft-dodger -it was the hecklers who ended up looking like assholes.

Bush didn't have Clinton's backbone or class.

[Edward Yee]

I was wondering when Blumenthal would prove he's as worthless as the GOP favorite in CT. After all, when one side is the owner of pro wrestling, you realize there's probably gonna be QUITE the circus.

Her campaign briefly took credit for the expose... up until realizing that it let Blumenthal claim "they're out to get me!" even if it's true, thus illuminating the modern pro wrestling tradition of forgetting that "less is more."

TBH, I'm not sure that Cindy Sheehan would have come off so poorly had Bush gone out to meet her; maybe he and/or his political handlers had that idea too.

[MKSheppard]

The difference is, these guys actually showed up for duty, while Numbnuts went AWOL just as the armed forces started mandatory drug tests.

So in Elfdart world; Bush never logged 200+ hours in the F-102A?

When he applied for the Texas ANG, he specifically requested that he not be sent to Vietnam.

He inquired about PALACE ALERT, but was turned down.

F-102 pilots endured further risk while serving under combat conditions in Vietnam. Some of these were Air National Guard pilots from the 147th FIG, where Bush was stationed. These ANG pilots served in Vietnam from 1968 to 1970 through a volunteer program called "Palace Alert." Palace Alert was an Air Force program that sent qualified F-102 pilots from the ANG to bases in Europe or southeast Asia for three to six months of frontline service. This program was instituted because the Air Force lacked sufficient pilots of its own for duty in Vietnam but was unable to activate ANG units since Presidents Johnson and Nixon had decided not to do so for political reasons. Thanks to Palace Alert, the Air Force was able to transfer much-needed National Guard pilots to Vietnam on a voluntary basis while not actually calling up their squadrons.

Fred Bradley, a friend of Bush's who was also serving in the Texas ANG, reported that he and Bush inquired about participating in Palace Alert. However, the two were told by their flight instructor, Maj. Maurice Udell, that they were not yet qualified since they were still in training and did not have the 500 hours of flight experience required. Furthermore, ANG veteran Col. William Campenni, who was a fellow pilot in the 111th FIS at the time, told the Washington Times that Palace Alert had stopped accepting new applicants before Bush would have been eligible.

[Ziggy Stardust]

He inquired about PALACE ALERT, but was turned down.

Bush admitted in a 1998 interview that he joined to avoid going to Vietnam. As per Elfdart's earlier link:

But, of course, the entire purpose of his privileged (and questionable) enlistment in the TANG was to avoid the Vietnam draft, as he hinted in a 1998 newspaper interview when he said: "I don't want to play like I was somebody out there marching [to war] when I wasn't. It was either Canada or the service and I was headed into the service."

[eion]

Yes, defending us from the dreaded Vietcong airforce.

There was you know, this thing called the Cold War from you know about 1947-48 to 1992?

Yes, and of course the Ruskies were known to regularly fly incursion missions near Texas...

MAYBE the Texas ANG would be called in to defend against the Cuban Air Force, but I think American Airlines could take the Cuban Air Force, so I think the Florida ANG could handle them just fine. Unless of course the Soviet Union had fighters stationed in Cuba during the Vietnam War, then maybe it could get a little serious.

And there is a marked difference between risking your life flying an airplane in Texas and risking your life just walking down a street in Vietnam.

[MKSheppard]

Bush admitted in a 1998 interview that he joined to avoid going to Vietnam. As per Elfdart's earlier link

Yet for some reason, instead of wrangling his way into a nice cushy job sitting at a desk and inventorying spare parts at some random TXANG base -- he wrangles his way into a FIS squadron as an Interceptor Pilot; a much more hazardrous position -- and thence from there on while in training to become an Interceptor Pilot, he inquires about PALACE ALERT....hmm...