A choice of two "utopias".

Rathark · Post by **Rathark** » 2003-02-19 09:21am

Here are two possible futures for you to choose from. Sorry if they sound cliched and underdeveloped, but I'm not exactly on a roll right now. Nonetheless, I deliberately chose these two extremes. The test is to determine the most important word in the term "secular humanist".

In the first scenario, self-aware artificial intelligence exceeds human intelligence. While not enslaving us or even outrightly commanding us, the AIs are content to be our advisors, knowing that we would rely more and more upon their superior wisdom as civilization becomes more socially and economically complex. Over the centuries, as humanity and its sentient offshoots (biological and syntheic) spread throughout the solar system, the problems of war, crime, exploitation, oppression and disease dwindle to (by today's standards) negligible levels. Poverty still exists, of course; although we probably won't recognise it as poverty today. The humans still believe that they are running the show. That belief, of course, is essential to preserve their psychological well-being ...

In the second scenario, the world is ruled by fundamentalists (Christian or Muslim - take your pick). Social, political, personal, educational and creative freedom no longer exists for the vast, mindless majority. Public executions of writers, artists, musicians and entire families are a major pastime. On very rare occassions (say, once a generation), there is dancing and rejoicing in a million streets as the nuclear annihilation of another "City of Sodomy" is executed with spectacular success.

So, which do you prefer?

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-02-19 09:25am

Hmm....psychotic assholes or benevolent AI's.....

This has got to be a trick question....

InnerBrat · Post by **InnerBrat** » 2003-02-19 09:28am

Well, that was easy.

Next!

Coaan · Post by **Coaan** » 2003-02-19 09:31am

It probably is a trick....

Ai anyway, Can't stand for extreme religion

Rathark · Post by **Rathark** » 2003-02-19 09:36am

Well, I'm obviously on the side of the AIs. The poll is basically a response to the "your not human unless you suffer CONSTANTLY" crap you hear elsewhere.

Here's the bottom line: If the 21st century turns out to be every bit as fucked up as we could imagine, should we hand over responsibility to a higher power? Should we admit our failure as a species and, irreversibly, pass the torch? Would our time truly be up - not in terms of existence, but in terms of actual control? Would this final honest admission, ironically, be the ultimate act of courage for our species?

In view of recent world events, few seem to be proving otherwise.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-02-19 09:52am

We create machines to make our lives better or simpler....this it seems is just an extension of this premise....

paladin · Post by **paladin** » 2003-02-19 09:52am

I take the AIs.

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2003-02-19 10:11am

Hmm... I think I'd rather be have Colossus as ruler instead of Pat Robertson.

Post by **Lagmonster** » 2003-02-19 10:12am

This isn't really a hard choice, you know.

Expand the concept a bit - Let's say you ask people to choose between two somewhat similar societies to live in:

1) They always tell you what to think.

2) They do all the important thinking for you (ie. decision making).

Which do you think would provide a society that is better for you to live in, assuming you want personal freedom of expression and personal welfare, health and security?

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-02-19 10:22am

I'd rather have the AIs, as long as HAL-9000 isn't among them.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-02-19 10:42am

Rathark wrote:In the first scenario, self-aware artificial intelligence exceeds human intelligence. While not enslaving us or even outrightly commanding us, the AIs are content to be our advisors, knowing that we would rely more and more upon their superior wisdom as civilization becomes more socially and economically complex. Over the centuries, as humanity and its sentient offshoots (biological and syntheic) spread throughout the solar system, the problems of war, crime, exploitation, oppression and disease dwindle to (by today's standards) negligible levels. Poverty still exists, of course; although we probably won't recognise it as poverty today. The humans still believe that they are running the show. That belief, of course, is essential to preserve their psychological well-being ...

Sounds a lot like the Culture. I'm definetley in.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2003-02-19 10:57am

Culture utopia it is.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-02-19 11:19am

Admiral Valdemar wrote:Culture utopia it is.

More like Proto-Culture but still damn good.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-02-19 11:21am

Simon H.Johansen wrote:I'd rather have the AIs, as long as HAL-9000 isn't among them.

Hal wasnt too bad....just people fucking him about that laid him low....

Damn good death scene though

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2003-02-19 12:53pm

Yes is this a trick question? Hell to be fair, How many of us are in charge now? Do we have any US Senators(Or your Countrys equivlant) on the board? Not like we are running the show now

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2003-02-19 01:46pm

Coming up on the next episode of "Polls where everybody votes the same", "Who would you rather fuck: Padme Amidala or Jabba the Hutt?".

XaLEv · Post by **XaLEv** » 2003-02-19 02:11pm

AIs any day. Fundie land might be fun to watch, though. Sounds like the kind of place that will eventually end up as faintly luminescent glass.

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi · Post by **Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi** » 2003-02-19 03:17pm

I'd prefer the AIs. I just can't imagine going back to the Dark Ages. The only thing that could kill me with the AIs is them using a Microsoft OS and crashing.

Kelly Antilles · Post by **Kelly Antilles** » 2003-02-19 04:06pm

Methinks this poll is a little lopsided.

But in a good way.

Morat · Post by **Morat** » 2003-02-19 04:32pm

Let's see...

Scenario 1 is basically a proto-Culture, and is practically a utopia.

Scenario 2 involves being under the rigid control of murderous fascists.

Now tell me again: What is this poll supposed to accomplish?

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-02-19 05:05pm

Morat wrote:Let's see...

Scenario 1 is basically a proto-Culture, and is practically a utopia.

Scenario 2 involves being under the rigid control of murderous fascists.

Now tell me again: What is this poll supposed to accomplish?

Check to make sure we all understand english?

Arrow · Post by **Arrow** » 2003-02-19 07:58pm

I'll take the AI any day of the week. Hell, the AI would probably take a look at Pat Robertson and his ilk, take over the internet, followed by a mass email that states "humans are too fucking stupid to be running the show. Sit back, relax and get laid while I lower your taxes."

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2003-02-19 08:22pm

I would rather have the cold logic of the machine versus the irrational nonesense of the rabid fundie thank you very much.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-02-19 08:28pm

Kelly Antilles wrote:Methinks this poll is a little lopsided. But in a good way.

Extremely lopsided. The second option is not by any means a utopia, it's a dystopia.

That being said, I would actually have to pick the second one *dodges flames*, because it seems more a good deal more likely that the human regime could be overthrown than the machine regime.

Darth Yoshi · Post by **Darth Yoshi** » 2003-02-19 10:43pm

Hmm...32-0. Not enough people are voting for the AIs. That said, I choose them, since they're not going to let us destroy the planet or anything.

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

A choice of two "utopias".

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A choice of two "utopias".

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