The price spike was when I was in the 7th grade, which was about 10-12 years ago, so 1999-2001ish.Samuel wrote: Gas prices continue to decline
For it to still be that rate, the average wage would need to be 30 something dollers.
Moderators: Alyrium Denryle, Edi, K. A. Pital
The price spike was when I was in the 7th grade, which was about 10-12 years ago, so 1999-2001ish.Samuel wrote: Gas prices continue to decline
Something else to keep in mind is that, when this graph starts, the majority (roughly 2/3's as I recall) of households were single income households. Now, the reverse is true with about that same amount of households now dual income.Stas Bush wrote:Oh, I actually found a graph to show it quite good:
It's actually amazing, since the 1980 the income of the lowest 10%, lowest 20% and lowest 50% was almost flat. The last-ditch rise, fuelled by mass consumer credit and other methods in the 1990s, seems to have been wiped out in the last crisis.
It would be cool to see where this graph leads to in 2010.
Clearly, today's American middle class has a much greater standard of consumption than 50 years ago. If you want to have 1950's standards of consumption, you can have those without having two wage earners in the house.Stravo wrote:The Spartan brings up an excellent point that is not addressed in the article. Before you could be Middle Class and be a single wage earner home. Now you basically need two pay checks to stay in the game. We're working harder just to tread water.
No you cant. Back then, a single income family could afford their house payment, a car, health insurance etc. Now they cant. Very simple.Clearly, today's American middle class has a much greater standard of consumption than 50 years ago. If you want to have 1950's standards of consumption, you can have those without having two wage earners in the house.
What exactly has changed such that home labor has dropped? We dont exactly have Sweeping Robots. Home labor has stayed roughly the same. Mom just works a double shift now.The number of Americans working per family has increased because the requirements of home labor have decreased, not because income per person has decreased.
Yes, I know that average is different than median.Patrick Degan wrote:Average is different than median. Average, or arithmetic mean, is a basic measure of total value divided by number of units. The median however is a benchmark measure defining the exact middle value and is far more useful as an indicator when a range of values is defined by extremes. To give a simple example: the average value of 10, 20, 30, 50, 100, 300, 600, 1800 is 363.75. The median value, however, is the one which lies between 50 and 100: 75.Iosef Cross wrote:Them argue that per capita income don't measure anything, that middle class is a relative concept and that average is different than median. Good.
So Many Square Feet, So Few People
by Nic Darling on October 20, 2008 · 54 comments
in Philosophy
Taking part in the comment conversation on a couple of posts I have written led me to consider the way we think about home size. Typically, as one reader complained, homes are merely judged by their square footage and disregard the number of occupants. Meaning, that the owner of a large home with a big family might be criticized by small home proponents, while at the same time small homes are shunned for offering too little space for a family. Perhaps, instead of thinking of how large a house should or should not be, we should consider how much space each individual needs, a sort of square feet per capita idea.
The best way to start is by gaining a little historical perspective. The average American home in 1950 was 983 square feet (source) and, according to Census data (PDF), the average American household size was 3.37 people. This means that in 1950 the average American had 292 sfpp (square feet per person).
Square Feet Per PersonIn the years that followed home size gradually grew and household size gradually fell until, in 2006, the average American household of 2.61 (source) shared a house of 2,349 square feet (source). So, in 2006, the average American had 900 sfpp, and that number has certainly grown in the last two years. I have heard average home size numbers approaching 2,800 square feet for 2008, but I couldn’t find a reliable source to quote.
So, seeing this wide range, the question remains . . . how much space do we need? Has the increase in sfpp seen a correlating increase in the quality of life? Are we three times more comfortable than we were in 1950? Are we three times happier? Could we, perhaps, manage to live in slightly smaller spaces than those with which we have become accustomed, particularly if it proves to have a positive impact on our environment, traffic congestion and other quality of life issues?
Houses in 1950 were 3 times smaller. Families in the 50's had fewer cars. Health care was cheaper, though less effective: Living expectancy in 1950 was 68 years in the US, today it is over 78 years. In Mexico today it is 75.1 years.Alyrium Denryle wrote:No you cant. Back then, a single income family could afford their house payment, a car, health insurance etc. Now they cant. Very simple.Clearly, today's American middle class has a much greater standard of consumption than 50 years ago. If you want to have 1950's standards of consumption, you can have those without having two wage earners in the house.
Microwave ovens, pre prepared dishes, washing machines, clothes washers, etc.What exactly has changed such that home labor has dropped? We dont exactly have Sweeping Robots. Home labor has stayed roughly the same. Mom just works a double shift now.The number of Americans working per family has increased because the requirements of home labor have decreased, not because income per person has decreased.
You mean the wages per hour? The period from 1980 to 1997 is only of 17 years, also, real wages increased at faster rate than productivity between 1950 to 1980, then between 1980 and 1997 their increase was reduced.Stas Bush wrote:Strangely enough it shows almost no real progress between 1980 and 1997, as opposed to the massive progress in prior times. Low base - high base, obviously - super-industrialized economies of the First World are hitting limits of growth, it seems.Iosef Cross wrote:Read that:
http://myslu.stlawu.edu/~shorwitz/Good/myths.htm
The number of labor hours needed to purchase goods in 1950 compared to 1997 (by 2010 it will be even higher)
True, the richer got richer at faster speeds than the poorer using this measure. However, when one measures the per capita or per household consumption of poor households, their access to consumer goods has increased at faster pace than the rich (maybe because the rich already have more income than they could spend on microwave ovens and air-conditioners).So this means that the real income of the bottom quintile almost stood flat, whereas the incomes of the rich rose substantially. In absolute terms, the poor got dick, and in relative terms, they got poorer compared to the rich. *shrugs*~Article wrote:The US economy grew substantially between 1975 and 1991, and the average income of those in the bottom quintile did rise in real terms ($207 on average), albeit not by very much. So even though the relative share of the poor fell, their absolute income rose.
The increase in consumer credit wouldn't expand incomes, but it would expand consumption without expanding incomes. This can explain why poor households expand their consumption more than their incomes in the last 30 years in the US: They loaned money.Oh, I actually found a graph to show it quite good:
It's actually amazing, since the 1980 the income of the lowest 10%, lowest 20% and lowest 50% was almost flat. The last-ditch rise, fuelled by mass consumer credit and other methods in the 1990s, seems to have been wiped out in the last crisis.
On the graph, there's more progress between 1965 and 1980 than between 1980 and 2005. Sorry.Iosef Cross wrote:The incomes of the lowest 10% actually expanded substantially between 1965 and 2000. Considering that "neoliberal" era started in 1973, their incomes expanded during this era of increasing inequality.
The graph I have shown proves nothing of the sort.Iosef Cross wrote:The 50% percentile had the most stagnated incomes. That means that the poorest have ascended to middle class, while the rich have "transcended" previous income levels.
Sure we do. They're called Roombas. Although in my experience they're less effective at sweeping than at terrorizing the cats. Plus dishwashers, laundry machines, vacuum cleaners, air filters, ionizers, automated toilet cleaners and all manner of purpose-designed solvents and cleaning products designed to minimize or eliminate labor that used to occupy hours of time (although one might argue that the hours of time are still required; you just spend them working to afford the cleaning gimcrackery rather than doing the cleaning the old-fashioned way...)Alyrium Denryle wrote: What exactly has changed such that home labor has dropped? We dont exactly have Sweeping Robots.
Or hires an illegal alien housekeeper, or another worker sufficiently desperate for the job.Alyrium Denryle wrote:Home labor has stayed roughly the same. Mom just works a double shift now.
If the appliance lasts long enough, you win in the long-term.Kanastrous wrote:(although one might argue that the hours of time are still required; you just spend them working to afford the cleaning gimcrackery rather than doing the cleaning the old-fashioned way...)
They are a cute novelty. They are only effective at terrorizing the cats...Sure we do. They're called Roombas. Although in my experience they're less effective at sweeping than at terrorizing the cats.
Invented in the 1800s, electric drying in 1940, full adoption in domestic residences by 1970. Prewashing dishes in the sink is still necessary, loading and unloading still needed. They do not reduce the time for dishwashing, just the elbow grease.Plus dishwashers
60% adoption by 1940. Laundromats fill the gaps. No drop in labor since the 50s...laundry machines
Common by the late 40s.vacuum cleaners
Yes, because mom manually filtered the air...air filters, ionizers
I will grant you the solvents, but those still do not significantly reduce the actual time doing the work as that is controlled more by square footage. They reduce the effort/clean ratio certainly, but not the time spent doing the work since the 50s. Not enough to make one spouse so non-busy that she now occupies herself with a 40 hour work week in addition to the housework to avoid boredom.automated toilet cleaners and all manner of purpose-designed solvents and cleaning products designed to minimize or eliminate labor that used to occupy hours of time
This is imprecise. Average describes a group of functions which all provide measures of a dataset's central value. Mean (arithmetic, geometric, harmonic), median, and mode are all averages, and each offers better values depending on the dataset. There are yet more, but those are the most common.Patrick Degan wrote:Average is different than median. Average, or arithmetic mean, is a basic measure of total value divided by number of units. The median however is a benchmark measure defining the exact middle value and is far more useful as an indicator when a range of values is defined by extremes. To give a simple example: the average value of 10, 20, 30, 50, 100, 300, 600, 1800 is 363.75. The median value, however, is the one which lies between 50 and 100: 75.Iosef Cross wrote:Them argue that per capita income don't measure anything, that middle class is a relative concept and that average is different than median. Good.