The Tea Baggers (Party) - is it such a bad thing?

[Big Phil]

Prevalent on this board is the notion that all teabaggers are racist dumbfucks who just want to cut taxes without any thought to the consequences. Recently articles I've read have teabaggers talking about fiscal responsibility (i.e., spending less than you bring in). So here's my question to all of you: racism aside, are the teabaggers good for this country and/or the Republican Party?

My answer: if they actually follow through on their populist message, and actually force the Republican Party to adopt a truly fiscally conservative agenda (i.e., cut spending along with cutting taxes), then yes, it might be a good thing for this country. We cannot continue running trillion dollar deficits. If as I suspect, however, the teabaggers end up being yet more "CUT TAXES... but not spending" dickwads, then they'll be very bad for this country. What say you?

[Kanastrous]

Since so far as I can tell their core constituency appears to be united by ignorance, paranoia, wild-eyed tales of Muslim subterfuge and a host of much less admirable things than their ideas regarding fiscal responsibility...yes, they impress me as a bad thing. Like a Coughlinesque kind of bad thing, a Christian Identity movement wrapping itself in the flag.

'Fiscal responsibility' means more than just yuh-huh yuh-huh I don't want to pay taxes and since I will soon be a billionaire I don't want billionaires to pay taxes either. But I have yet to see or read any coverage of the baggers* that paints their position as any more sophisticated or nuanced, than that.


*Didja know that 'bagger' is in some quarters slang for a hot-tempered, irrational, disagreeable, pointlessly combative person? What a coincidence!

[General Zod]

I'd be a lot less jaded about people who screeched about fiscal responsibility if they didn't turn out to be complete hypocrites so often.

[Aaron]

Since so far as I can tell their core constituency appears to be united by ignorance, paranoia, wild-eyed tales of Muslim subterfuge and a host of much less admirable things than their ideas regarding fiscal responsibility...yes, they impress me as a bad thing. Like a Coughlinesque kind of bad thing, a Christian Identity movement wrapping itself in the flag.

'Fiscal responsibility' means more than just yuh-huh yuh-huh I don't want to pay taxes and since I will soon be a billionaire I don't want billionaires to pay taxes either. But I have yet to see or read any coverage of the baggers* that paints their position as any more sophisticated or nuanced, than that.


*Didja know that 'bagger' is in some quarters slang for a hot-tempered, irrational, disagreeable, pointlessly combative person? What a coincidence!

I have to agree with Kanastrous here, the teabaggers I've encountered on this forum and around the web don't seem to have a plan other lower taxes and roll back regulation, the thought goes no deeper then that. In principle I agree with spending less then you take in but these guys are some of the dumbest mutherfuckers on the political scene.

I would love some honest-to-god fiscal responsibility to come out of the US, but these guys aren't the ones to accomplish it. Not while they have all the racist and woo-woo elements.

[Temujin]

Teabaggers are the last thing this country needs. My boss is a Tea Bagger, and he's also a Randroid Libertarian. He just added a "Refudiate Socialism" sticker with Obama's logo in place of socialism's "O" to his truck's back window. And yeah, if you didn't know, Refudiate is a new word made up by Sister Sarah who now is comparing herself to Shakespeare.

These fuckers are no more fiscally conservative than bog standard Republicans, they're just government hating libertarians with new costumes; and that seems to be all the different so-called "conservative" groups on the Right are anymore. Ironically, they most likely bad for the long term viability of the Republican party, which is fine by me because they don't offer one thing to make them worth voting for. The sooner they get swept into the dustbin of history the better, for this country and the world.

[LionElJonson]

Of course the teabaggers want to cut spending. Health care and welfare spending make up, what, 60% of the total budget? Slash those down to nothing, and cut taxes by 30 or 40 percent, and you're dramatically reducing the amount of debt the US government's racking up, while improving the economy through lower taxes.

[Duckie]

Of course the teabaggers want to cut spending. Health care and welfare spending make up, what, 60% of the total budget? Slash those down to nothing, and cut taxes by 30 or 40 percent, and you're dramatically reducing the amount of debt the US government's racking up, while improving the economy through lower taxes.

If by 60% you mean 39% of the budget for Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, yes. It's 56% if you include all mandatory expenses, but that includes many non-healthcare, non-welfare things. About a third of the US GDP is spent on various supports for people, all said and done, but only about 20% is actual government expenditure- the GDP counts private corporations providing assistance to people too, after all.

[weemadando]

Look on the bright side. There's every chance that they'll split the Republican vote. Unless of course the Tea Party candidates are just standing as Republicans "but moreso".

[Crossroads Inc.]

Look on the bright side. There's every chance that they'll split the Republican vote. Unless of course the Tea Party candidates are just standing as Republicans "but moreso".

Thats pretty much whats happening... Its a bit like Libertarians who say "Im not a Republican!" but yet will vote republican 90% of the time.
The only real thing the tea party os doing is giving really crazy candidates a chance at getting elected (see Sarah Angel)

[Knife]

Teabaggers are bad for the country. If they were really fiscal conservatives, they'd be against the wars we fight and throw trillions down, they'd want to cut back on military spending since it is one of the largest costs in the budget. Instead, they want to cut domestic spending for people they perceive as less than they are. To be clear, they are people who vote republican, voted for McCain, and are mostly middle class white folk.

[Alyeska]

They are tearing apart the Republican party. Moderate republicans who have nothing to do with the democratic policy are getting ousted by extremist conservatives. Lisa Murkowski up in Alaska just lost the primary to a Tea Bagger. We might see some damage to the Democrats, but I question how much. The tea baggers are so radical that I honestly think the middle ground voters are going to be turned off.

[Patroklos]

If all it accomplishes is returning fear to the Republican incumbants and causing the Democrat's heads to spin after Novermber and maybe a reassesment of their current direction, I can't see that as a bad thing.

Politics in this nation needs to be stirred up, at both ends of the pool. I'll take a little populism in stride if it makes the the power elite a little uncomfortable.

[bobalot]

I would have more respect for teabaggers if they were around during George Bush's era of massive deficit spending. Most were not.

It's hard to take a group of people seriously when they whine about "Obama's taxes" when 95% of them got a tax cut under Obama. Then again, he's not a rich white conservative christian, so he doesn't get a free pass.

[weemadando]

I would have more respect for teabaggers if they were around during George Bush's era of massive deficit spending. Most were not.

It's hard to take a group of people seriously when they whine about "Obama's taxes" when 95% of them got a tax cut under Obama. Then again, he's not a rich white conservative christian, so he doesn't get a free pass.

Indeed, he's a rich mixed-race conservative christian... Which makes him evil. Ah, sweet logic.

[GrandMasterTerwynn]

Of course the teabaggers want to cut spending. Health care and welfare spending make up, what, 60% of the total budget? Slash those down to nothing, and cut taxes by 30 or 40 percent, and you're dramatically reducing the amount of debt the US government's racking up, while improving the economy through lower taxes.

Ahh yes, the rich white asshole solution: Sodomize poor people with a rusty chainsaw. Every time I feel tempted to drift back toward the right, people like you remind me of what sort of amoral, human-shaped, scum occupy that side of American politics. Lion-O, I thank you.

Of course, if you're neither rich, nor white, then that just makes you an asshole. If you're not an asshole, then you're advocating a position that will do you personal harm in the long run. Cut taxes for the rich . . . we've had three fucking decades of increasing rich-poor divide to demonstrate that trickle-down economics only works to make rich assholes richer, and everyone else their debt-slaves. Cut health-care and welfare spending, and you'll destroy the economy by creating a class of people who will only load down the economy on the account of having no money to spend, and are too sick to get jobs. Welfare is a form of economic stimulus, since people on it have some small modicum of purchasing power that they wouldn't otherwise. Health care is a form of economic stimulus. After all, people should be healthy enough to work and find work.

[Temujin]

Of course the teabaggers want to cut spending. Health care and welfare spending make up, what, 60% of the total budget? Slash those down to nothing, and cut taxes by 30 or 40 percent, and you're dramatically reducing the amount of debt the US government's racking up, while improving the economy through lower taxes.

And destroying peoples lives who depend upon those very same programs you would be eliminating.

Of course the economy wouldn't be improved nor would the debt/deficit be reduced, just like it wasn't under every recent Republican administration. They are hypocrites, and would just spend that money on things they approve of, like the military, police and prisons. The United States of Teabaggerstan would be an impoverished prison state with a heavy handed police force (Think Joe Arpaio on a National level) and a bloated, inefficient military machine perpetually at war with the Islamic world.

[Crossroads Inc.]

Of course the teabaggers want to cut spending. Health care and welfare spending make up, what, 60% of the total budget?

Five seconds of google search turned up this.

Wiki to be sure... But... There is no single aspect of the budget over 25% there. Healthcare and Social Security Together are barely 40% of the budget.
And if you are serious about lowering the budget, why WHY won't you cut the military?

Slash those down to nothing, and cut taxes by 30 or 40 percent, and you're dramatically reducing the amount of debt the US government's racking up,

How does lowering taxes decrease the debt?
Taxes are a source of INCOME.
Lowering spending, thats fine, I understand that. But how does lowering a source of INCOME Reduce the debt?
I am not one to normally harp on people, but just tell me how this works?

[General Zod]

It's funny how assclowns like Lionel never seem to suggest cutting the military, which is surely a greater source of expenditure than healthcare. But of course the moment you start attacking that particular sacred cow some shrill chickenhawk's going to swoop in and start screeching about how you're trying to turn their holy bovine into filet mignon.

[Akhlut]

Of course the teabaggers want to cut spending. Health care and welfare spending make up, what, 60% of the total budget? Slash those down to nothing, and cut taxes by 30 or 40 percent, and you're dramatically reducing the amount of debt the US government's racking up, while improving the economy through lower taxes.

Everyone else has covered that your figures are dead wrong, but, I have a bigger question for you to answer.

In 2008, some 13% of Americans were under the poverty line (url=http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/00000.html]source[/url]). This comes out to a bit over 40 million people who, under your proposition, would have no support from the government and no stake in public life anymore. They have no reason to support the US because society, government, and corporations give no help and would, more often than not, shit on them. Without welfare or a social security net, they have no reason to not go into open revolt. We're having enough trouble with Iraq and Afghanistan, much less additional millions rioting in the US. If even only 5 or 10% go into open revolt, that's still 2-4 million people rioting. Do you think that would cause LESS economic and civil havoc than simply funding social services and raising taxes?

[Mr Bean]

The Teabaggers are a great thing for the Republican party.
Wait did I say Republican Party? I'm sorry I meant the Democratic Party, the Teaparty is great for the Democrats. This is a group of very dedicated, very uninformed (Or misinformed by the Fox Propaganda channel) people. These people get their "news" and world view from talk radio and a "news" station that is out and out a propganda arm of the Republican party. Or would be a propaganda arm if someone other than Steele was in charge. As it is, call it Republican BFF but they have things thing on the side for the Tea Party.

As Akhlut points out, should a Tea Party ever gain control of Washington, disaster is the best we can hope for. Catastrophe may be the result instead.

[General Trelane (Retired)]

Prevalent on this board is the notion that all teabaggers are racist dumbfucks who just want to cut taxes without any thought to the consequences. Recently articles I've read have teabaggers talking about fiscal responsibility (i.e., spending less than you bring in). So here's my question to all of you: racism aside, are the teabaggers good for this country and/or the Republican Party?

My answer: if they actually follow through on their populist message, and actually force the Republican Party to adopt a truly fiscally conservative agenda (i.e., cut spending along with cutting taxes), then yes, it might be a good thing for this country. We cannot continue running trillion dollar deficits. If as I suspect, however, the teabaggers end up being yet more "CUT TAXES... but not spending" dickwads, then they'll be very bad for this country. What say you?

The problem with the Teabaggers platform is that such "fiscal responsibility" of not spending more than you earn makes sense for one's household budget, but it simply does not scale when talking about government; their platform becomes one of fiscal irresponsibility.

[Ritterin Sophia]

When they run around wrapping themselves in a banner of fiscal responsibility and then oppose a healthcare system that would cut cost per capita in half AND cover everyone, I can't help but think they really don't care about fiscal responsibility. Or when they tout Austrian economics as a valid way to run an economy, even though it's the economic equivalent of creationism. Call me crazy.

[Big Orange]

I don't fear most Teabaggers, I generally pity them, most of them seem to be misguided dupes and losers who have been played like a fiddle by an expert clique of Republican/corporate backed organizers and propagandists, with such gatherings sucking in a disproportionate amount of bigoted douchebags and sociopaths, making the whole horrible thing take on a life of its own. They're just expendable cannon fodder deployed by the ideologically debased though still well funded American Right to Zerg rush the rest of us with their shouting and idiocy for the past 18 months, putting a dampener on sensible debate and awareness of issues.

[Simon_Jester]

I think that the Tea Party is a bad thing for America, because they want to do bad things to America, even if they are too pig-ignorant to realize it (as detailed above).

While they might end up doing some good, by splitting the Republican vote. Or pushing through candidates in the primaries who have no chance of winning the general election. Or even by convincing the Democratic leadership that it's pointless to make a fetish out of reaching out to "moderates" when a large and growing fraction of the population is to their left and increasingly frustrated at their impotence and naivete (fat chance).

But the point is, any good the Tea Party does for America, they will do strictly by accident. They will not have meant to do good for America, they will not realize they are doing good for America by doing these things, and as they watch the good consequences of their (hypothetical) good actions unfold, they will scream and rant and rave about how it shouldn't be happening.

Because, when you get right down to it, they want bad things to happen to America. Even if they are too pig-ignorant to realize it. So they get no credit for any good they may do, just as an earthquake gets no credit for knocking down a building that was an eyesore anyway.

[Kanastrous]

I don't fear most Teabaggers, I generally pity them, most of them seem to be misguided dupes and losers who have been played like a fiddle by an expert clique of Republican/corporate backed organizers and propagandists, with such gatherings sucking in a disproportionate amount of bigoted douchebags and sociopaths, making the whole horrible thing take on a life of its own. They're just expendable cannon fodder deployed by the ideologically debased though still well funded American Right to Zerg rush the rest of us with their shouting and idiocy for the past 18 months, putting a dampener on sensible debate and awareness of issues.

I don't pity them. In a nation with free access to public libraries ignorance is a choice. And it's difficult to pity holier-than-thou malignant people who actively work to harm others.